This is the 13th time that a Bob Huggins-coached team has been seeded fifth or higher in the Big Dance.
Those teams are 12-0 in first-round games.
Those teams are 12-0 in first-round games.
According to ESPN's Rece Davis ...
- Thread starter 43rd Parallel
- Start date
Dan Dakich doesn't much care for WVU, does he?
The gentleman essentially guaranteed a Buffalo win on Bracketology last night. He also mentioned that he was WVU's coach for 15 minutes. The guy seems to be carrying a grudge against a program that he walked away from. In his heart of hearts, maybe he thinks he should be coaching Michigan instead of John Beilein.
Indianapolis Star
The gentleman essentially guaranteed a Buffalo win on Bracketology last night. He also mentioned that he was WVU's coach for 15 minutes. The guy seems to be carrying a grudge against a program that he walked away from. In his heart of hearts, maybe he thinks he should be coaching Michigan instead of John Beilein.
Indianapolis Star
Dan Dakich NOT ending up here saved WVU Basketball
It was the beginning of a great turnaround.
HATED him as a hire for our hoops program and was SO happy when he backed out.
It was the beginning of a great turnaround.
HATED him as a hire for our hoops program and was SO happy when he backed out.
Re: Ding Ding Exactly!
I know Beilein is a dirty word around here. But he did a great job rescuing the program and I'll always be happy for that. That growth was an exciting time. Huggs took it to the next level.
I know Beilein is a dirty word around here. But he did a great job rescuing the program and I'll always be happy for that. That growth was an exciting time. Huggs took it to the next level.
Haha ol dan dakitch takes a shot at us any chance he gets. The one guy sitting next to him last night said wvu - ky would be a competitive game and staten and brown may be back hopefully. Danny says under his breath the only difference is instead of losing by 31 they would lose by 21. The guy looks at him and asks 'really'? Dan's hatred for us runs deep.
Re: Ding Ding Exactly!
......you know, I never really quite understood why that is the case. Hell, he did a good job while he was here and left the right way for a bigger and better financed program.
I suppose it's just that ole 'fer-us-or-agin'-us' thinking.
......you know, I never really quite understood why that is the case. Hell, he did a good job while he was here and left the right way for a bigger and better financed program.
I suppose it's just that ole 'fer-us-or-agin'-us' thinking.
Re: Ding Ding Exactly!
Oh it's because he left.
Leaving here automatically puts you in the dog house.
Oh it's because he left.
Leaving here automatically puts you in the dog house.
Re: Ding Ding Exactly!
"for a bigger and better financed program"
Actually...
http://www.bbstate.com/info/teams-hoopsbudget
"for a bigger and better financed program"
Actually...
http://www.bbstate.com/info/teams-hoopsbudget
Re: Dan Dakich doesn't much care for WVU, does he?
So is this guy a radio talk show host or what? Is he still coaching? Maybe he's looking to be the next Paul Finebaum and is looking for his "Phyliss", the "COWTURD SUCKS!!!" lady to call in.
Re: Ding Ding Exactly!
I was happy to see him leave. It opened the door for Huggins.
Beilein's son is a WVU grad.
I was happy to see him leave. It opened the door for Huggins.
Beilein's son is a WVU grad.
Huggs
Cincinnati 10-0
1992 #4 Cincy 85 #13 Delaware 47
1993 #2 Cincy 93 #15 Coppin St. 66
1996 #2 Cincy 66 #15 UNC Greensboro 61
1997 #3 Cincy 86 #14 Butler 69
1998 #2 Cincy 65 #15 Northern Arizona 62
1999 #3 Cincy 72 #14 George Mason 48
2000 #2 Cincy 64 #15 UNC Wilmington 47
2001 #5 Cincy 84 #12 BYU 59
2002 #1 Cincy 90 #16 Boston 52
2004 #4 Cincy 80 #13 East Tennessee State 77
WVU 2-0
2010 #2 WVU 77 #15 Morgan St. 50
2011 #5 WVU 84 #12 Clemson 76
I think most appreciate what Beilein did and enjoyed his time here...it was a lot of fun....but folks (myself included) get annoyed when some continually claim Huggs only success has been with Beileins players, how great we would be if he was still here....on and on. I loved it while he was here but love it even more with Huggs
Re: Ding Ding Exactly!
I don't know why you can't say you like Beilein and suddenly you must be anti-Huggs or vice versa.
Beilein really did great things for our program for the few years he was here, and the teams were fun to watch (at least offensively). I've got no animosity towards him.
I don't know why you can't say you like Beilein and suddenly you must be anti-Huggs or vice versa.
Tourney Tidbits
"Fun facts/trends about the Big Dance (from Yahoo article):
[/I]
• No team has lost its opening round conference tournament game and gone on to win the national title.
• Excluding 2009, at least one No. 2 seed has been eliminated by Round 2 every year since 1997. Last year, Villanova and Kansas fell victim.
• Fifteen 8/9 seeds have upended a No. 1 since 1985. Kentucky bounced top seed Wichita St. last year.
• No. 5 seeds have lost 36.7 percent of their first-round matchups since '85.
• No. 3 and No. 6 seeds beware. Six No. 11 seeds have reached the Sweet Sixteen since 2010."
"Fun facts/trends about the Big Dance (from Yahoo article):
[/I]
• No team has lost its opening round conference tournament game and gone on to win the national title.
• Excluding 2009, at least one No. 2 seed has been eliminated by Round 2 every year since 1997. Last year, Villanova and Kansas fell victim.
• Fifteen 8/9 seeds have upended a No. 1 since 1985. Kentucky bounced top seed Wichita St. last year.
• No. 5 seeds have lost 36.7 percent of their first-round matchups since '85.
• No. 3 and No. 6 seeds beware. Six No. 11 seeds have reached the Sweet Sixteen since 2010."
Re: (More) Tourney Tidbits
"Fun facts/trends about the Big Dance:
[/I]
• At least one No. 12 seed has advanced beyond the opening round 13 of the past 14 years. Three of the four reached the Round of 32. In the second round No. 12s are 20-25 (44.4%) all-time.
• A No. 16 has never defeated a No. 1, though Alonzo Mourning still wakes up in cold sweats about Princeton.
• Since 2000, No. 13 seeds have survived the opening round in just 21.7 percent of its attempts; No. 14s 9.1 percent.
• No. 15 seeds are 4-56 in opening-round games since 2000; 7-113 all-time.
• First Four winners have had considerable success. In the four years of their existence, at least one has reached the Round of 32 each year. Three of those four years one has marched onto the Sweet Sixteen."
"Fun facts/trends about the Big Dance:
[/I]
• At least one No. 12 seed has advanced beyond the opening round 13 of the past 14 years. Three of the four reached the Round of 32. In the second round No. 12s are 20-25 (44.4%) all-time.
• A No. 16 has never defeated a No. 1, though Alonzo Mourning still wakes up in cold sweats about Princeton.
• Since 2000, No. 13 seeds have survived the opening round in just 21.7 percent of its attempts; No. 14s 9.1 percent.
• No. 15 seeds are 4-56 in opening-round games since 2000; 7-113 all-time.
• First Four winners have had considerable success. In the four years of their existence, at least one has reached the Round of 32 each year. Three of those four years one has marched onto the Sweet Sixteen."
beilein had more ncaa success overall at wvu than......
huggins has to this point, the final four bid nothwithstanding .....beilein's teams overachieved come ncaa time.....this is not meant to be against huggins, but for beilein.....i think your comment about huggins taking it to the next level is a bit of an overstatement in comparison to beilein, considering the final four was five years ago and wvu missed the ncaas the past two years......
beilein took wvu to an elite 8, two sweet 16s and an NIT title his last three years at wvu and left huggins with a nucleus that led to lots of success in huggin's first three-four years at wvu.....i do think wvu's immediate basketball future is bright, however, but to say huggins has taken it to the next level vis-a-vis beilein jumps the gun, imo......
huggins has to this point, the final four bid nothwithstanding .....beilein's teams overachieved come ncaa time.....this is not meant to be against huggins, but for beilein.....i think your comment about huggins taking it to the next level is a bit of an overstatement in comparison to beilein, considering the final four was five years ago and wvu missed the ncaas the past two years......
beilein took wvu to an elite 8, two sweet 16s and an NIT title his last three years at wvu and left huggins with a nucleus that led to lots of success in huggin's first three-four years at wvu.....i do think wvu's immediate basketball future is bright, however, but to say huggins has taken it to the next level vis-a-vis beilein jumps the gun, imo......
I get annoyed with people who defend a guy who hated it here. Whether fans like him or not, Huggs loves it here. And we could not do any better. There is NO debate about that. Any other rising coach would use WVU as a stepping stone if they had any type of success. That's not Huggs. He's one of us.
Re: Ding Ding Exactly!
Huggins is a good coach. No debate there. Beilein is just better. It's a shame Beilein didn't love it here. His style of coaching and recruiting is a better fit at Wvu than Huggins. Huggins relies on big, strong, physical NBA type players we have trouble recruiting. It's why Huggins has struggle recruiting here imo. He would probably be more suited at a Kentucky, Memphis, type program. Beilein was able to get lesser known recruits to excell in an old fashioned offense designed for ball control, back door passing, and gunning 3 pointers to make up for smaller players unable to work the boards. He was a perfect fit here.
Huggins is a good coach. No debate there. Beilein is just better. It's a shame Beilein didn't love it here. His style of coaching and recruiting is a better fit at Wvu than Huggins. Huggins relies on big, strong, physical NBA type players we have trouble recruiting. It's why Huggins has struggle recruiting here imo. He would probably be more suited at a Kentucky, Memphis, type program. Beilein was able to get lesser known recruits to excell in an old fashioned offense designed for ball control, back door passing, and gunning 3 pointers to make up for smaller players unable to work the boards. He was a perfect fit here.
Re: Ding Ding Exactly!
As for Huggs not being a good fit... I'd say going to the NCAA tourney 6 out of 8 years (something that hasn't happened since the 80's) & our first Final Four in over 50 years is pretty good. But maybe I'm wrong. Maybe that's just terrible & we should fire everyone including Gordon Gee. Thanks Obama!
This post was edited on 3/17 10:44 AM by bobhertzel'ssweatpants
How is Beilein better? What proof do you have for that? Different yes. Better? That's extremely debatable. Both are great coaches. They just have a different approach.
As for Huggs not being a good fit... I'd say going to the NCAA tourney 6 out of 8 years (something that hasn't happened since the 80's) & our first Final Four in over 50 years is pretty good. But maybe I'm wrong. Maybe that's just terrible & we should fire everyone including Gordon Gee. Thanks Obama!
This post was edited on 3/17 10:44 AM by bobhertzel'ssweatpants
Re: Ding Ding Exactly!
Just saying.....it's that simple....
"Better" coaches don't struggle at places like Michigan....
Just saying.....it's that simple....
Re: Ding Ding Exactly!
Reading comprehension; try it. Nowhere did I say Huggins was terrible. Nowhere did I say we should fire anyone and everyone including Gordon Gee. Nowhere did I say anything about Obama. Get a clue. You have failed.
Re: Ding Ding Exactly!
This post was edited on 3/17 12:57 PM by ThePunish-EER
Who only knows? I guess he/she is trying to take a jab at Rich Rodriguez and insinuate the Michigan basketball program is also a blue blood? While the football program is a blue blood, the Michigan basketball program is not. In fact, I don't believe Michigan basketball has been good since the Fab 4 prior to Beilein. The years between the Fab 4 and Beilein were dreadful if my memory is correct. I guess others do in fact struggle there despite the OP opinion. Beilein hasn't struggled at Michigan, so I'm not sure what the OP is referring to if I'm wrong on that assumption.
This post was edited on 3/17 12:57 PM by ThePunish-EER
Re: Ding Ding Exactly!
"Beilein is just better"
Their overall winning percentages, winning percentages, and post season achievements beg to differ....
JB:
winning % = 62.5
WVU winning % = 63.4
WVU Conference winning % = 50.0
CoY awards = 3
Average number of wins per season for career = 19.5
Average number of wins per season at WVU = 20.2
Average number of wins per season at Michigan = 20.75
Number of losing seasons as a HC = 5 in 33 years
Huggins:
winning % = 71.1
WVU winning % = 63.6
WVU Conference winning % = 56.0
CoY awards = 11
Average number of wins per season for career = 23
Average number of wins per season at WVU = 21.6
Number of losing seasons as a HC = 3 in 33 years
The "idea" that Huggins' recruiting and coaching style is better suited for a "higher-profile" job because he prefers to pursue high-ranking prospects and focuses on athleticism, defense, and rebounding................. is pretty funny though. Way to perpetuate that "We're just little ole WVU" mentality.....
Lastly, John Beilein has failed to go .500 in his own conference 5 times in the last 13 years (when he took over WVU)
Huggins has done such a thing only twice.................. in his entire career.
It is not about THAT Beilein left WVU........... it is how that made me lose respect for him. HOW he looked at his seniors, Nichols and Smalligan, and lied right to their faces about not pursuing other jobs and then bailing the next day for Michigan....... or HOW he attempted to get hired at NC State (twice) after he achieved even a little success at WVU after the Elite Eight run....... the guy was constantly looking to move... not just suddenly afforded the option to move.
This post was edited on 3/17 1:21 PM by KeatonsCorner
"Beilein is just better"
Their overall winning percentages, winning percentages, and post season achievements beg to differ....
JB:
winning % = 62.5
WVU winning % = 63.4
WVU Conference winning % = 50.0
CoY awards = 3
Average number of wins per season for career = 19.5
Average number of wins per season at WVU = 20.2
Average number of wins per season at Michigan = 20.75
Number of losing seasons as a HC = 5 in 33 years
Huggins:
winning % = 71.1
WVU winning % = 63.6
WVU Conference winning % = 56.0
CoY awards = 11
Average number of wins per season for career = 23
Average number of wins per season at WVU = 21.6
Number of losing seasons as a HC = 3 in 33 years
The "idea" that Huggins' recruiting and coaching style is better suited for a "higher-profile" job because he prefers to pursue high-ranking prospects and focuses on athleticism, defense, and rebounding................. is pretty funny though. Way to perpetuate that "We're just little ole WVU" mentality.....
Lastly, John Beilein has failed to go .500 in his own conference 5 times in the last 13 years (when he took over WVU)
Huggins has done such a thing only twice.................. in his entire career.
It is not about THAT Beilein left WVU........... it is how that made me lose respect for him. HOW he looked at his seniors, Nichols and Smalligan, and lied right to their faces about not pursuing other jobs and then bailing the next day for Michigan....... or HOW he attempted to get hired at NC State (twice) after he achieved even a little success at WVU after the Elite Eight run....... the guy was constantly looking to move... not just suddenly afforded the option to move.
This post was edited on 3/17 1:21 PM by KeatonsCorner
Re: Dan Dakich NOT ending up here saved WVU Basketball
I'm just throwing this out there, but he did one of our games this year (or maybe it was a Michigan game) and I was surprised to hear him comment that the job that John Beilein did at rebuilding our program is, perhaps, the best coaching performance he has ever seen over a five year period. He didn't go into all the detail about his exit, but said that he was coach briefly and gave it up. He said that he knows he could not have had the success that Beilein had if he had stayed. Maybe more of a compliment to Beilein than to WVU.
I'm just throwing this out there, but he did one of our games this year (or maybe it was a Michigan game) and I was surprised to hear him comment that the job that John Beilein did at rebuilding our program is, perhaps, the best coaching performance he has ever seen over a five year period. He didn't go into all the detail about his exit, but said that he was coach briefly and gave it up. He said that he knows he could not have had the success that Beilein had if he had stayed. Maybe more of a compliment to Beilein than to WVU.
Re: Ding Ding Exactly!
Great analysis and breakdown Keaton. The WVU winning percentage is pretty much the same. To me, it's a matter of opinion, I would take Beilein over Huggins. Both are great coaches. I never said Huggins wasn't as the OP stated. One thing to consider with your numbers, Beilein took over a dreadful program when Catlett left. Combined with the Dakitch drama and allegations, the basketball program was in shambles. Huggins inherited a solid program from Beilein coming off an elite 8, 2 sweet 16's, and an NIT championship. He had a solid nucleus with Butler and others to add his own guys to like Ebanks and Jones for that final four run. Beilein rebuilt the program in a matter of 4 years. Secondly, it has nothing to do with "poor little ole WVU". As you know, I'm against that inferiority complex most WVians have here. It's just harder to recruit inner city NBA type talented players here. It always has been. It's easier to recruit lesser known players like Beilein got here. His system isn't a popular system utilized in most basketball programs at this level. My point is, in my opinion, he was a better fit for that reason. He was consistent here.
Re: Ding Ding Exactly!
If I had to choose between one or the other.....
That's tough. I guess my 'X' factor would be Huggins is a WVU guy.
Is that right or wrong? Matter of opinion. But I do appreciate what Beilein did while he was here.
If I had to choose between one or the other.....
That's tough. I guess my 'X' factor would be Huggins is a WVU guy.
Is that right or wrong? Matter of opinion. But I do appreciate what Beilein did while he was here.
Re: Ding Ding Exactly!
I don't get the love for Beilein. I take Huggs anyday over Beilein. I have no idea why any of our fans would feel differently. I don't care about style or recruiting (Huggs hasn't had a recruiting problem - he had an attrition problem - there is a difference). I just want to win. And 1 coach that wins wants to be here. The other didn't. So eff him.
Re: Ding Ding Exactly!
I would argue that Beilein was not nearly as "consistent" as history wants us remember......
02-03 - losing season during a full rebuild
03-04 - 15 wins in the regular season (15-12 record). 1st round loss in the BE Tournament. 2 wins in the NIT (17-14)
04-05 - 18-9 regulars season including a 5-game losing streak. Facing another NIT, WVU got hot in the BE Tournament and shot their way to the Elite Eight........ an absolutely great post season capping a disappointing regular season.
05-06 - 5 returning seniors + Frank Young. Preseason #14. 8-3 in the OOC. 11-5 in the BE. 1st round loss in the BE Tournament. Enter the Dance as a 6 seed, beat #11 and #14.......... lose to #2 Texas in the Sweet 16.
06-07 - What should have been a bad season and a rebuilding year after losing 5 seniors and playing so many underclassman in heavy rotation (1 returning starter in Young) turned out to be a pretty good season. HOWEVER, Beilein fails to schedule a full schedule........ opting for only 29 games instead of the available 30......... and following a 9-7 BE conference record and an early exit from the BE Tournament.... WVU is left outside the bubble as one of the "first 4 out". All he had to do was schedule another cupcake, and WVU makes the Dance.
I am thankful that John Beilein got WVU Basketball back to national recognition. He took a core group of recruits (2002 class) and rode them all 4 years into significance in the basketball world.
But what Huggins has done at WVU has been far more impressive. Top 25 classes. League championships. Consistent 20+ win regular seasons. Multiple seasons spent inside the top 25 for a majority of the year........
But look at what Beilein has "maintained" at Michigan. He was one Buckeye choke job from his 3rd losing season in 8 years in Ann Arbor............ his 2014 class was extremely underwhelming considering his 2012-2014 success, and he hasn't a single player signed for 2015.......
This post was edited on 3/17 3:19 PM by KeatonsCorner
I would argue that Beilein was not nearly as "consistent" as history wants us remember......
02-03 - losing season during a full rebuild
03-04 - 15 wins in the regular season (15-12 record). 1st round loss in the BE Tournament. 2 wins in the NIT (17-14)
04-05 - 18-9 regulars season including a 5-game losing streak. Facing another NIT, WVU got hot in the BE Tournament and shot their way to the Elite Eight........ an absolutely great post season capping a disappointing regular season.
05-06 - 5 returning seniors + Frank Young. Preseason #14. 8-3 in the OOC. 11-5 in the BE. 1st round loss in the BE Tournament. Enter the Dance as a 6 seed, beat #11 and #14.......... lose to #2 Texas in the Sweet 16.
06-07 - What should have been a bad season and a rebuilding year after losing 5 seniors and playing so many underclassman in heavy rotation (1 returning starter in Young) turned out to be a pretty good season. HOWEVER, Beilein fails to schedule a full schedule........ opting for only 29 games instead of the available 30......... and following a 9-7 BE conference record and an early exit from the BE Tournament.... WVU is left outside the bubble as one of the "first 4 out". All he had to do was schedule another cupcake, and WVU makes the Dance.
I am thankful that John Beilein got WVU Basketball back to national recognition. He took a core group of recruits (2002 class) and rode them all 4 years into significance in the basketball world.
But what Huggins has done at WVU has been far more impressive. Top 25 classes. League championships. Consistent 20+ win regular seasons. Multiple seasons spent inside the top 25 for a majority of the year........
But look at what Beilein has "maintained" at Michigan. He was one Buckeye choke job from his 3rd losing season in 8 years in Ann Arbor............ his 2014 class was extremely underwhelming considering his 2012-2014 success, and he hasn't a single player signed for 2015.......
This post was edited on 3/17 3:19 PM by KeatonsCorner
There's a reason Dan Dakich is still doing radio and tv.
Every time I listen to him talk about basketball I'm thankful he decided not to come here.
Every time I listen to him talk about basketball I'm thankful he decided not to come here.