Musings from Arledge: Historically Bad, Donte Williams' Future and Reader Questions
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Any head coach worth 2 cents is going to want to send a message to everyone. So....unless he is a loser he will demand and receive total control of the coaching staff.....which means everybody leaves. During the interview if Bohner so much as twitches when discussing assistant replacements and salaries......Thanks for the memory....my plane leaves at 4.
Are either Jackson, Tuli let alone Foreman
true DT or NT? we've talked about this before...
maybe but who knows
I see the same thing. I believe the key to fixing a bad situation is take inventory and be willing to make all changes necessary to reach your goal. The first thing you need to do is take out the feelings. How you feel about a guy should never factor in to whether or not he's part of the future. You can't allow yourself to be distracted. That was a bad characteristic of the Clay Helton's coaching tenure. That being said let's look at the facts. Nobody in the Pac 12 has recruited the DB position like USC over the last 3 seasons. Is there a single 3 star DB in their rotation? So we can agree its a group of 4 and 5 star guys and alot of them. Now to Donte. Fact
the Oregon Secondary is playing better since he left that would be Last year's team and this years team. USC's is worse since he got here. Coincidence? You decide. Has Donte Williams ever had a DB drafted in the first round? How is that possible when He's had a stable of 4 and 5 star guys at two schools over 4 years? Law of averages suggests it should have happened already. So this validates your point. Is he a good coach? History suggests he takes 4 and 5 star guys and they end up back of the draft bargains. Can he coach them up? Haven't see it yet. Hufanga was a 5 star he just played up to his own potential but even he didn't get drafted on the first day. This secondary has regressed since last year and last year was bad. Remember how many comeback Christmas Miracles they needed to win games?
Now recruiting. Fact Oregon has not skipped a beat in recruiting since Williams left currently sitting at #6 in the nation #1 in the Pac 12 .USC is sitting at #29 3rd in the Pac 12. USC' s current class again is loaded with CB/WR's when you need LB and DT's ? They have 1 3 star LB, 1 out of state DT who's taking his second visit to Georgia in 3 weeks this weekend (nothing to see here) and one 3 star OT. How exactly is Donte Williams killin it in recruiting? It's more of the same. USC and Oregon recruit themselves. If Donte left nothing would change there. Oregon proved it.
My opinion He can stay or Go. Get a good coach win and recruits with come either way.
If USC recruited it self then it would be doing better but it isn't and Donte is the only one that's doing anything, to keep the class going.
the problems on defense are a result of practicing against an air raid offense. it all comes down to Helton's decision to hire an inexperienced offensive coordinator and then Helton's inability to mentor Harrell, since Helton had no clue about the offense.
I watched a Youtube video on Orlando that explained that Orlando learned his defensive schemes at Utah State, after inheriting it from Dave Aranda. But the difference is that Dave Aranda is a brilliant schematics guy who created the system (and keeps creating new systems) and Orlando is a guy who just learned a bit about someone else's system. Aranda understands how any defensive strategy will work and he can therefore adjust it. Todd is just applying a system he has not created and doesnt really understand at the core level. Also, inheriting a system that is already in place from a previous coordinator (after they left) doesnt mean that you actually learned it from the creator, because you never got to study under him.
Football is a frickin' chess game and so many of the coaches out there are simply copying what they see someone else create. Helton just copied stuff without understanding how specific plays worked in terms of strategy/leverage. Just because I can attempt to copy a chess game strategy doesnt make me a chess game master. Let's get the guy who is the master - Dave Aranda. He is one of my favorites for USC HC. He isnt the best communicator, but he is also isnt a BS'er.
A good HC must be able to strategically manage 1) team roster/recruiting 2) player development 3) schematic set-ups and playbook and 4) game management. Helton failed in every single one of those areas, The team roster is full of talent holes and very uneven. Player development is possibly the worst in the Power 5. The air raid has destroyed schematics and also destroyed player development. And noone accused Helton of good game management. I wonder if Helton ever had a single grasp of what he was supposed to be doing with his time.
So it's kind of like Kliff and Harrell to a certain degree? Orlando is using a scheme that he doesn't truly understand and Aranda is the real brains behind the curtain. Or in the Kliff example, he was most likely the more brilliant mind in the room and was able to expand beyond his mentors ideas. Compared to Harrell who's stuck and far more limited in his ability to adapt.
Great post
I fundamentally disagree that schematics are not the core of what a football coach needs to understand. Dave Aranda is basically the brilliant guy who understands how offense and defense works and he turns that intellectual knowledge into a program that is designed to win. Sure, he still has to create a culture and build the right player roster, but at the core, he is a general, managing pieces on a chessboard. If you dont understand the strategy or math behind the game, you will never consistently win.
The best football team doesnt always win the game. The best coached football team usually does win the game.
Not saying that schematics is the only thing that matters, but I am saying that true football genius is few and far between. Let's go out and hire the genius who understands the schematics of football at a level where the coach is not simply copying what he sees elsewhere, but fundamentally knows WHY they are teaching specific things to players is the core of how you win games.
The best football team doesnt always win the game. The best coached football team usually does win the game.
Not saying that schematics is the only thing that matters, but I am saying that true football genius is few and far between. Let's go out and hire the genius who understands the schematics of football at a level where the coach is not simply copying what he sees elsewhere, but fundamentally knows WHY they are teaching specific things to players is the core of how you win games.
Where did you get this info? Isn't our Scout Team running ND's offense this week and next week against our Defense?
Agree and Disagree. Helton was a distraction. Alot of guys we're nervous about committing to a HC who's been on the most likely to get fired list. Secondly the losing was a turn off and they hear the negative chatter about the coaching that didn't help. Go back and look at USC's last 10 classes. they've had top 15 recruiting classes in every year except 19/20 after two straight 5+ losing seasons.
Win and Hire a coach recruits believe in and they will come they always do.
People don't look deep enough. You wont believe this. according to 24/7 rankings. These are the past USC classes.
2012 #8
2013 #13
2014 #10
2015 #2
2016 #10
2017 #4
2018 #4 5-7 record
Losing Starts after the 5-7 season/Fire Helton heat picks up
2019 #20
2020 #64 After a 8-5 second straight 5+ loss season
Enter Donte Williams
2021 #7
2022 #29
Donte Williams is in the same spot as pass recruiting classes. He's even fallen off the pace by alot this year his class is at #29 and I'm predicting a decommit or two from that class. That's all I'm going to say. Stay tuned. Win and they will come. Donte or no Donte. The proof is right above.
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Co-sign.
We're witnessing Scam Harrell's iteration of the Air Raid, an inefficient bastardization that can't score and lacks all the excitement and utilization of space.
If I were Hal Mumme/Mike Leach I'd send a cease and desist over to Heritage Hall to prevent Graham from associating his frankenscheme with my name and disparaging my legacy.
You said pass rush. IMO all three of them are capable of rushing the passer, or at least they should be.
We need big bodies and it's something we don't have and so our pass rushing is lacking due to it.
Musings from Arledge: Historically Bad, Donte Williams' Future and Reader Questions
But what if you shoot for somewhat-above-average (as USC has been doing for the last seven years) and miss that?www.on3.com
I think a young George Foreman had the power to put Fury to sleep.
When a Saban coached team can't stop an A&M ...at all...something is wrong. Possibly all this buttinskee by the ncaa has hand cuffed football,from what you can name your mascot, to how many practice and types...micro managing has killed many an industry, and even sports programs, like the scholarship limitations of the 60's killed private univ track and field teams,etc...they still want mediocrity.
Running scount team for a week isnt the same as running Spring and Fall training camp against a proper offense. It takes time to prep a strong defense.
Keeping GH and TO in place while the ship sinks is a horrible idea. The players have just quit on the lame coaches now. Maybe Dart can re-energize this team, but should a kid his age really need to shoulder that burden?
If Bohn/Sosna were doing their jobs, they should have had a contingency plan for firing the coordinators if it all went off the rail.
Absolutely agree! I thought the whole thing was very strange.
The team is soft. I’m afraid you’re right that it will take years to recover the former USC greatness, if ever.
And do what? who was going to come in regardless of a possible "plan"? what other school has a plan for that? I'm curious.
Firing them at the time along with Helton was going to help in what sense? USC would be without an OC and a DC. Is the thinking that they were supposed to just plug and play position coaches?
So make Snyder the interim? put Naiver as the DC? who runs the offense? Soto would continue in his position but it's beefier and Donte would be AHC (i guess) but would be both the safeties and cornerbacks coach? or he splits that with Naiver.
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Awesome report, and so true on Donte, his secondary sucks beyond belief. He can't coach, so what if he can recruit, you need both from a coach?
I can't understand how so much talent (maybe hallucinating) can perform so poorly? Were these four stars really rated properly? Or does coaching impact them so negatively? Not sure, but my observation is they were never four stars, our recruiting staff just picked badly. When a Oregon State team with an average recruiting performance of 50+ can destroy a top ten recruiting class average team, is crazy. My most unbelievable stat is how so many very weak teams out recruit USC in both the offensive line and defensive line? And where in the world is our linebacker recruiting, which we used to dominate, has virtually no talent?
Our recruiting has missed so many marks, it is not comprehensible?
You have followed USC 50 years, my compliments, I have followed them 60 years. Been through thick and thin, can't believe this is happening again, maybe the worse? The current USC leadership have no clue, just like our current President and all the Democrats!
Fight on!
Cory
I can't understand how so much talent (maybe hallucinating) can perform so poorly? Were these four stars really rated properly? Or does coaching impact them so negatively? Not sure, but my observation is they were never four stars, our recruiting staff just picked badly. When a Oregon State team with an average recruiting performance of 50+ can destroy a top ten recruiting class average team, is crazy. My most unbelievable stat is how so many very weak teams out recruit USC in both the offensive line and defensive line? And where in the world is our linebacker recruiting, which we used to dominate, has virtually no talent?
Our recruiting has missed so many marks, it is not comprehensible?
You have followed USC 50 years, my compliments, I have followed them 60 years. Been through thick and thin, can't believe this is happening again, maybe the worse? The current USC leadership have no clue, just like our current President and all the Democrats!
Fight on!
Cory
Are you sure? If I were making the decisions, you could hear "fresh legs" and "warriors" without cringing, and Clay Helton would be just one more obscure former assistant coach who spent a year at Troy and whose name you can't remember.
I'm talking about hiring and firing ppl in a season that doesn't matter anyway, when they are already going to get fired or let go. lol
Not really talking about Helton and his inability to maintain or create a consistent program, let alone stick to a philosophy. I have no doubt most people with common sense would have tried to at least live up to their own words. Don't get me wrong, Arhedge.
Excellent post. When Helton was coach I roundly believed he was easily the worst head coach on any level that I'd ever seen. Almost any other person named HC, even if they got it the way Helton did, generally excelled or was at least well-respected in a given aspect of the game. Offense, defense, discipline, recruiting, player development, Xs and Os - usually they'd have something that defined their identity as a coach.
Helton had none of that besides being a nice person with an even-keeled personality on the heels of an a-hole and a drunkard.
As far as Williams' thus far disastrous stint as HC - I'm kind of wondering about the overall dynamic in the locker room, the coaches' room, etc. Helton got hired because the players loved him and pounded the social media platforms on his behalf. Do the players maybe dislike Donte? They came to USC when Gentleman Clay was coach- perhaps they dislike Williams' more drill sergeant-like approach.
Are his coordinators deliberately sabotaging him because they resent their former subordinate now being their boss?
The analogy of Williams being a great salesman with little technical knowledge of the product they're selling is apt. Hes selling the sizzle of USC, but doesn't know how the steak is cooked. He can't tell the difference between filet mignon and ground chuck, it seems.
Some one is going to have to point me in the direction of a interim that wasn't disastrous, after a HC was fired due to the poor performance of the team. And at least had the pieces in the right positions to succeed. The players loved Helton but still got beat down by Stanford, this is just the team.
Well, wasn't Ed Orgeron doing fairly well (up until the UCLA game) after Kiffin was tarmacked?
Orgeron had head coaching experience and a pretty good roster, but yeah, he did fine.
A lot of damage has been done to the program. I question whether a top flight coach can undo all that’s been done, starting with the mindset in three years, much less in one or two years after they are hired. It really is that bad.
Chris,
- Of all the primary HC search candidates, do you see any who would likely retain Donte, if for no other reason than to maintain recruiting momentum in their 1st year as HC? IMO, a potential Aranda/Donte pairing (with Donte not as a DC but as a position coach and possibly with the AHC title as before) would certainly go a long way to putting up a fence around the SoCal area for recruiting purposes. Recruits would eat up the prospect of Donte pitching them and Aranda and/or his DC then developing their talents so that they at least have a shot at playing on Sundays in 3-4 years' time.
- Do you sense that the current dynamic between Donte and TO may be contributing in some way to the D's subpar play (especially at the Coli!) or the lack of heart they've shown in those losing efforts? Everyone gets that it's certainly an awkward situation to have the reporting lines on an org. chart suddenly flip-flop in the course of a single day but am wondering if that's been a contributing factor to this dismal season.
- Do you know, or have you ever met, Dan Lanning? Just wondering since you both played D-3 ball at William Jewell. Dawg's D just continues week after week to really impress. They held the UK Cats to only 1.9 YPC but UK still averages over 5 YPC on the whole season so far. New HC will likely bring his own DC but if there's any way USC can convince Lanning to entertain an interview for DC, they should absolutely go for it! He could mentor Donte for a couple years because I'm sure by the end of that time, Lanning would want to consider his own HC opportunities anyway (whether he's still at UGA or somewhere else).
- First season and especially the last 2 weeks is hardly a sufficient statistical sample but it looks so far like Sark is the terrible choice you wrote he was at the time of hire. It's not only that he always picks an average DC to tag along with him but I'm questioning his ability to even make H2 adjustments now. Last 2 weeks, he had both OU and OSU absolutely on the ropes and feeling drunk before halftime (ok, bad analogy--lol). He had Bijan Robinson (the reason Keontay came to USC via the portal) running amok over both defenses. But in the 2nd half, the offense (his side of the ball) suddenly sputters (including Robinson) and the D starts playing "O-Lay" ball, letting everyone and everything through en route to the end zone. Fact is that both Riley and Gundy made their proper adjustments at halftime but Sark couldn't react in real time to those adjustments. Sound familiar??? Like you, I think his career in Austin will eventually look eerily similar to that of both Charlie Strong and Herman. Still admittedly early days here but I suspect your prediction will ultimately be spot on!
- Of all the primary HC search candidates, do you see any who would likely retain Donte, if for no other reason than to maintain recruiting momentum in their 1st year as HC? IMO, a potential Aranda/Donte pairing (with Donte not as a DC but as a position coach and possibly with the AHC title as before) would certainly go a long way to putting up a fence around the SoCal area for recruiting purposes. Recruits would eat up the prospect of Donte pitching them and Aranda and/or his DC then developing their talents so that they at least have a shot at playing on Sundays in 3-4 years' time.
- Do you sense that the current dynamic between Donte and TO may be contributing in some way to the D's subpar play (especially at the Coli!) or the lack of heart they've shown in those losing efforts? Everyone gets that it's certainly an awkward situation to have the reporting lines on an org. chart suddenly flip-flop in the course of a single day but am wondering if that's been a contributing factor to this dismal season.
- Do you know, or have you ever met, Dan Lanning? Just wondering since you both played D-3 ball at William Jewell. Dawg's D just continues week after week to really impress. They held the UK Cats to only 1.9 YPC but UK still averages over 5 YPC on the whole season so far. New HC will likely bring his own DC but if there's any way USC can convince Lanning to entertain an interview for DC, they should absolutely go for it! He could mentor Donte for a couple years because I'm sure by the end of that time, Lanning would want to consider his own HC opportunities anyway (whether he's still at UGA or somewhere else).
- First season and especially the last 2 weeks is hardly a sufficient statistical sample but it looks so far like Sark is the terrible choice you wrote he was at the time of hire. It's not only that he always picks an average DC to tag along with him but I'm questioning his ability to even make H2 adjustments now. Last 2 weeks, he had both OU and OSU absolutely on the ropes and feeling drunk before halftime (ok, bad analogy--lol). He had Bijan Robinson (the reason Keontay came to USC via the portal) running amok over both defenses. But in the 2nd half, the offense (his side of the ball) suddenly sputters (including Robinson) and the D starts playing "O-Lay" ball, letting everyone and everything through en route to the end zone. Fact is that both Riley and Gundy made their proper adjustments at halftime but Sark couldn't react in real time to those adjustments. Sound familiar??? Like you, I think his career in Austin will eventually look eerily similar to that of both Charlie Strong and Herman. Still admittedly early days here but I suspect your prediction will ultimately be spot on!
This would be ideal. Both being from CA and could quickly put a wall around recruiting in the state.
