Neither McKay nor Robinson had head coaching experience

zitorocks

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At this point I cannot support making a decision to hire Donte as the full time HC. What I will say is that we should try to avoid heuristics and biases based on past events. Just because something has happened in the past and "looks" the same, doesn't mean it "is" the same. Each decision should be made on its own merits. Donte is not Helton, we already know that. Hiring Helton and other coaches tied to the program and being unsuccessful does not mean Donte cannot be successful. Again, he is not Kiff, Sark, or Helton.
 

Georgetirebiter IV

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Williams is very talented but let's table that for a minute. He was not worked for any seasoned successful coach for any length of time. Cristobal is the closest and was still green at that time. He has been with Clay the last two years. What success model does Williams have to build a program. Not just coach a game, but act as they key administrator for SC football? the football requirements are so much more than they were back in the days of yore. Williams would best swerved to work under an experienced coach and help build the program back. That will give him the baes baseline for future HC gig. We don't have to go back to McKay. Let's look at the last guy we hired with no HC experience.
Neither did McKay.
 

HectorSpectre

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Nov 18, 2017
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Ridiculous argument.

For every McKay, there’s 50 Claydough’s.

It’s actually insulting to McKay and RoBo to assume just anyone, any old new coach can come in and do what they did.

It cheapens their accomplishments.

They are considered great because what they did rarely happens. And there’s reasons for that.

Ridiculous, pompous and arrogant response.

And the man’s name is Clay Helton.

Stop being so insulting and dismissive of others.

Do you know how to frame an argument without being insulting, marginalizing or ridiculing?
 

AZUSCfan

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Given the struggles we have faced over the last decade, the last thing we need to do is hire someone that is inexperienced in running a program....from recruiting to weight training, to the actual coaching of football (practice/game). I respect CDW a lot for his ability to connect with the players, his energy and his recruiting prowess. However, what USC needs is a proven leader that has had experience with all aspects of a FB program, which is why USC needs to target an experienced head football coach. We cannot keep making the same mistake.
 

GLYCERINE

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Ridiculous, pompous and arrogant response.

And the man’s name is Clay Helton.

Stop being so insulting and dismissive of others.

Do you know how to frame an argument without being insulting, marginalizing or ridiculing?

Hector — what’s the deal?

You have it out for August. His take was 100% football related. Didn’t attack anyone. Claudough? Is this the hill you wanna die on? Defending a below average football coach who was handsomely paid to be inept for over 5 years?
 

AZUSCfan

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What we need is a complete focused search that takes into account all of our requirements. Not the lazy hamstrung effort that Max and Haden gave us that turned into six years of Clay Dough's fraudulent effort,
Agree 1000%

Dumb and lazy decisions that led to years of damage to the program...including Swann's to extend the pain further.
 

TrojanFireHorse12

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Given the struggles we have faced over the last decade, the last thing we need to do is hire someone that is inexperienced in running a program....from recruiting to weight training, to the actual coaching of football (practice/game). I respect CDW a lot for his ability to connect with the players, his energy and his recruiting prowess. However, what USC needs is a proven leader that has had experience with all aspects of a FB program, which is why USC needs to target an experienced head football coach. We cannot keep making the same mistake.
This and ppl forget that McKay and Robinson learned from the best. I think Donte will be a great HC one day but he needs to stack those experience chips. USC can't be his grounds to learn. It needs a HC that can move the program forward.
 
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denali15

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Aug 28, 2017
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Robinson was a pretty clear heir-apparent to McKay. OC of two NC teams, then had a year with the Raiders. McKay was a different time. It had been a couple decades since USC was a NC contender, and. of course, McKay was on the staff at the time. I guess they decided not to go with the OL coach at the time, i.e. Al Davis.
 

Tod78

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It’s an interesting cognitive dissonance.

Reading this board some days you would think that the internet exists just so guys here could claim that they are smarter than the head coach making millions of dollars - it’s easy to go 13-0 every year. They could do it if they were in charge. Just ask them. They have all the answers.

Then the same guys turn around and tell you that the only head coach that could possibly get it done is their favorite flavor of the month because the job is so hard. Pick one story or the other.

Smith, Kiffin and Sark all had head coach experience. JRob 1 did not. JRob 2 did have head coach experience but he was a lot less successful than JRob 1. Pete Carroll had head coach experience, but he was not successful in that previous experience. Not much of a pattern in our little corner of the world.
 

1969Trojan

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The only coaches with proven championship qualifications and winning percentage above 70% must be considered. The only coaches meeting these two criteria are Urban Meyer, Bob Stoops, and Luke Fickell in that order. Comparing the current extraordinary needs of the football program for a top-notch championship-level coach to the McKay and Robinson eras is silly. Selecting any offensive or defensive coordinator or interim head coach regardless of his records for this critical position is again repeating the horrible mistakes that had frequently happened since Pete Carroll left.
 
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UscTrojanglory

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The only coaches with proven championship qualifications and winning percentage above 70% must be considered. The only coaches meeting these two criteria are Urban Meyer, Bob Stoops, and Luke Fickell in that order. Comparing the current extraordinary needs of the football program for a top-notch championship-level coach to the McKay and Robinson eras is silly. Selecting any offensive or defensive coordinator or interim head coach regardless of his records for this critical position is again repeating the horrible mistakes that had frequently happened since Pete Carroll left.
Fickel has championship qualifications?
 

Tod78

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Agree that Larry Smith’s resume made sense at the time.

Agree that Kiffin and Sark had won/lost records about the same as Pete Carroll’s.

That is kind of my point.
 

Tod78

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Agree, Pete Carroll really turned the program around with his obsession with recruiting. I would put it at #1 on the list. Disparately seeking lineman, a few linebackers too

Somebody said that for other coaches football was the job and the hobby was golf or something else. For Pete football was the job and football was the hobby - he would just out-compete you on the field, game planning, recruiting, anything and everything. That a part of his magic.
 
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Tod78

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No, there are no guarantees on resumes. All you can do is increase your chances by finding the guy who has a history of recruiting well and coaching winners.
The problem with history is that by definition it is all in the past.

One reason it is so hard to stay on top is that circumstances and human nature conspire to bring teams back down closer to the mean. A successful year means players leave early and coaches leave for better jobs. A successful year makes players and coaches wonder if they can achieve the same success while only putting in 98% of the effort they put in to get to the top. I think one of the reasons Pete's Golden Years tailed off towards the end is the thinking that perhaps it wasn't necessary to butt heads with Norm Chow and instead it would be "good enough" to have an OC that was younger, not as set in his own ways, and therefore meant less drama in the office, as well as Norm's understandable desire to move up the ladder to a head coaching spot. Not saying that Pete ever stopped being super competitive - just that in subtle ways success makes you wonder if you can duplicate the result while only battling "almost as hard" as you did to get to the top in the first place.

Now back this up to the 1970s and 1080s. The history of success with JRob 1 did not carry over to JRob2. There are a lot of reasons for it including the budget for assistant coaches. Still, it makes me wonder if the Urban Meyer of 2022 would be the same as the Urban Meyer of 2008. Remember, it was 2009 when Meyer took a leave of absence from Florida due to chest pains. That's 12 years ago. Then he retired from Ohio State again for health reasons in 2018. Of course he ran up an impressive record, but I'm not at all sure we would be getting the same guy in 2022.
 

TrojanFireHorse12

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USC needs to hire a coach that can both groom, locate and replace his staff with equally talented minds year in and year out. But also be able to suss out bad apples on their staff and fire them if they don't preform to standard. USC needs someone that can build a 55ft recruiting wall around California. If we can get a Head Coach that is self-reflective and adaptable with legit confidence (not false) on and off the field. This program will be unstoppable. Whomever it is that gets the job must live up to their own expectations and never settle. Someone proactive and hungry in their pursuit to national prominence.

We have zero idea how Donte would handle hiring his own staff even with help and support from the AD office. It's too much of a hailmary.
 
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LDIABootney

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The only coaches with proven championship qualifications and winning percentage above 70% must be considered. The only coaches meeting these two criteria are Urban Meyer, Bob Stoops, and Luke Fickell in that order. Comparing the current extraordinary needs of the football program for a top-notch championship-level coach to the McKay and Robinson eras is silly. Selecting any offensive or defensive coordinator or interim head coach regardless of his records for this critical position is again repeating the horrible mistakes that had frequently happened since Pete Carroll left.
Fickell? Championship??
 

Socrates

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Three basic questions for head coaching candidates?

1. Are you qualified?
2. What makes you more qualified than the other dozen candidates?
3. Can we afford you?