Did Hank Brown have a series in the 2nd half; I dont think so
- Thread starter uihawk82
- Start date
They both got 5 series. Honestly both were mediocre. Brown was slightly better. He benefitted from the run game being better to start the game. Brown made the easy throws (credit to him because they haven’t always been that way in recent memory at Iowa) in the first drive which added with the strong run game padded the appearance of his day. He got worse as the day went on. He didn’t officially have a pick but he had 2 that probably should’ve been. Bad drop in end zone hurt his numbers as well.
Heck was hurt from a couple of drops (actual drops that weren’t from bad throws which add a couple more) and he had the actual pick. I thought he looked better throwing deep and stretching the field. He got the PI call which is as good as a completion. But he struggled with timing on the throws which is ultimately why he performed worse than Brown.
Even though Brown performed slightly better and probably has the leg up in the competition, I think Heck should start next week in fairness of the competition. Let him get the first 3 drives when everyone is the freshest and see how he does. With both being average at best I think Heck does have the upside with his willingness to stretch the field, but that might cost us more in games where we shouldn’t have problems. Who knows. I posted it in another thread, but I hope next year it’s just Bessinger with no controversy.
Heck was hurt from a couple of drops (actual drops that weren’t from bad throws which add a couple more) and he had the actual pick. I thought he looked better throwing deep and stretching the field. He got the PI call which is as good as a completion. But he struggled with timing on the throws which is ultimately why he performed worse than Brown.
Even though Brown performed slightly better and probably has the leg up in the competition, I think Heck should start next week in fairness of the competition. Let him get the first 3 drives when everyone is the freshest and see how he does. With both being average at best I think Heck does have the upside with his willingness to stretch the field, but that might cost us more in games where we shouldn’t have problems. Who knows. I posted it in another thread, but I hope next year it’s just Bessinger with no controversy.
Well said. Both QBs benefited from EVERYTHING working early. As smooth as everything was going and Moulton was crushing the yardage, both looked pretty decent early. But when the offense started sputtering in the second half, they got shut out. This game was a special teams play away from being a completely scoreless half of football. That goes back to opening games like south Dakota State a couple years ago.
I think you have a very fair point about Hecklinski getting to lead off next game if this continues. It seemed like it was on his series the offense began stalling. Maybe that's on him, maybe it's on the other running back allowing the run game to halt, maybe it's the play calling, but it seems Brown got more opportunities to run the 'good' series.
I thought Heck looked awful, and don’t believe he deserves a single snap against ISU. He had that one pass along the sideline on his first drive I think. That was easily the best ball of the day. The potential is obvious, but he not nearly consistent enough. But he was behind on his completions, hitting guys on the back hip. Brown was on time and more confident. He also clearly has a much bigger arm.
I was pretty drunk though, gonna rewatch the game and make conclusions after.
I was pretty drunk though, gonna rewatch the game and make conclusions after.
Yes Brown was certainly mediocre, only 3 touchdowns in 3 possessions. We need to work on improving that!
It could be a couple different things. Generally you have a set of plays you use to open the game basically no matter what. Then you start adapting to what’s been working, what might work because we set the defense up a certain way, etc. Did Heck also have a set of plays to run when he came on simulating the start of the game or was he just in the adaptive play calling? I don’t know the answer. That’s another part of why I want to see him start the game next week and if he struggles after 2-3 series and Brown is still showing to be the better option then everyone has the data to say that. I also wonder if Brown benefitted from the set plays to begin the game. We came out pass heavy in the first possession which maybe caught NIU by surprise and helped his stats. But it was clear by the second set of possessions for both they were both struggling.
Moulton 50 yd TD run, Moulton 37 yd TD run. Please tell me how good Hank Brown is from these plays. Deacon Hill could’ve been qb for this.
Sound reasoning, but I don’t think we can afford to screw around for 2-3 series against Iowa State.
Because we came out throwing, and doing it successfully, NIU couldn’t just focus on stopping the run. As they could have done with Deacon Hill in the game.
Was he not close to perfect throwing and gaining around 10 yds per play? Deacon could barely muster 10 yds per game.
during the game particularly early i also had a bias for brown but over course of the game it became obvious the gap between the QBs is little if any. the run game effectiveness helped brown (keeping series going and scoring as well) which it did not for heck. both qbs threw decent balls (usually caught for brown, dropped for heck but this could be because brown's throws are on time with better touch but heck is so much better with screen throws) and both had one good run each. i am happy leaving the decision on whom to play to the coaches at this point.
that said if one of them is clearly better at picking up 3 or 4th down and short, i would go with that guy.
that said if one of them is clearly better at picking up 3 or 4th down and short, i would go with that guy.
I'm concerned that we appear to have completely gotten away from a playbook that semi-frequently includes a QB-keeper of some sort. What'd we have...1 designed QB keeper per guy?
The OLIne had a couple starters out most of the 2nd half which didnt help the run game plus NIU was crowding the LOS more. I think if the first team OLIne played the whole 2nd half intact the run game would have been better.
Heck throwing off his back foot a lot bothers me
I agree, we have had some early leads and leads late in the game the last few losses against ISU so I say start the best QB that graded out from the game to get off to a great start. Need to score early and often to bury the clowns
Your scripted play point is a good one, and I agree. But personally, I expect Brown will get the start next week and play the whole game.
Yes I would recommend rewatching. I just did and would agree with the other poster that both were fairly mediocre with some bright spots sprinkled in. I thought it was pretty even overall. Brown surprised me at the start. Brown started better but then had some bad misses later on, including a terrible pass/decision that could have been a pick 6 if not for Diaz breaking it up. Heck also had some bad misses. If you account for a couple drops for Heck by Vonahme/RVZ and the near pick by Brown, the stats would have been near even and that's how it appeared when rewatching as well. I saw some in other threads overreacting to the pick by Hecklinski. I missed the play live. Rewatching I didn't realize it was 4th down, so really no harm/no foul. Better to give your guy a shot vs taking a sack there.
Overall I think they should continue giving both looks until one separates from the other. Neither QB faced much pressure today and QBs can turn into completely different players when faced with pressure. Some can handle much better than others. I have a hunch that Heck can handle pressure a little better than Brown, but time will tell if they both are given opportunities. I tend to lean Heck still. Brown scares me with the way he seems to lock on receivers, but I'm open to being wrong. I also think Heck is better suited for the offense Lester would like to run.
The good - Brown started out hitting the easy throws. We haven’t seen that in a very long time. He really benefited from the running game averaging about 70 yards per carry…NIU also seemed unprepared for everything. Heck showed some wiggle and moxie, but also had real bad mechanics and the drops also seemed to kill all momentum (like they do..)
the bad - both QBs regressed as game went on. Has Iowa ever had a QB go thru progressions that isn’t a check down ? We have multiple WR / TE on a given play, yet when was the last time the secondary or 3rd read was targeted ??
Stop the run and gameplan for Diaz and seems like the offense is going to struggle. Second half showed that….
See if any improvements going forward
the bad - both QBs regressed as game went on. Has Iowa ever had a QB go thru progressions that isn’t a check down ? We have multiple WR / TE on a given play, yet when was the last time the secondary or 3rd read was targeted ??
Stop the run and gameplan for Diaz and seems like the offense is going to struggle. Second half showed that….
See if any improvements going forward
Just rewatched. I said Heck was awful, I would upgrade that to bad. He had some drops, notably that Diaz one. TBF to Diaz though… that pass was awful. He was way behind Diaz. If he hit him in stride he could have walked into the end zone. He’s not accurate enough, and holds the ball too long. PFF had him at dangerously close to 3 seconds average time to throw, that is not fast enough. Also, he struggles to complete passes if he isn’t rolling right. We called a LOT of plays that had him roll right. Almost every non screen/quick game passsing play. If he has to be in the pocket he’s less accurate. Even if he completes the passes, his timing is off. He’s hitting the receivers at their back hip and not in stride. He seemed to struggle to throw left as well. I remember a screen pass and a drag route that he completed to his left, but every pass down the field to his left was very inaccurate. Only one game, I’m not sure if that’s an actual thing for him or if it’s just a small sample size thing. He seems to be very one dimensional in the type of throw he can complete (rolling right). He is elite at throwing on the run to his right though, changing arm angles and everything. But he is way too one dimensional. A better team game plans for that and brings the pass game to a screeching halt.
I stand by my statement that it wasn’t close and Hank is clearly a notch above. More decisive, more accurate, bigger arm, did have a nice scramble. He was willing to throw a 50/50 ball down the sideline (would have been sweet if Diaz could have landed in bounds there). There was one or 2 throws that probably should have been picked, that’s really the only knock against him after watching that game. I think his decision making will improve with game time though. Not saying that he is going to be a 1st round pick or anything crazy, but Hecklinski is not consistent enough. If I was Kirk I would declare Brown the starter.
Boyz, boys…..yesterday the qb was “solid” but not spectacular. Remember, Kirk doesn’t want his QBs to “win” games……Kirk‘s wants is his QBs not LOSE them. Kirk wants his QBs to get the ball into the hands of his playmakers…..and it appears there are several of those on this year’s team if folks stay healthy. Sooner or later this QB shuffle will settle itself out.
Try not to expect anything of Iowa football anymore other than 6-6 to 9-3 somewhere, but would be happy to make the playoffs.
Totally agree on the criticism of Hecklinski, again I thought both were mediocre. I wasn't even counting that Diaz play as a drop for Heck as that was not a good throw. I'll have to watch for the left vs right side thing, but probably too small of a sample size right now to say one way or the other on that.
Brown started hot but then had a number of misses in his other series. Bad miss on 3rd and 4 out route. Miss to an open Diaz in back left of end zone (really not terrible on this one, but you'd like to see them convert when open). Bad miss to Vonahme on the right side that should have been a gimme TD. Bad miss behind James in the middle who was going into double coverage and potential interception (hit DB in chest). Bad miss and potential pick six that Diaz had to break up.
Again, not saying Heck was better yesterday or looked good. Thought they were both mediocre. I just don't think we can pick apart all of Heck's bad plays and misses without also acknowledging that Brown had a good number of those plays as well. I'd like to see more from both.
I would say that if you did that with most teams it would be pretty much spot on. But we have other weapons as well. Tight end to start with. Add in RVZ. The potential is there for a much more dynamic offense that we have seen for years. We are not there yet, but I believe on our way. My biggest concern is RB2 being hurt and maybe out for a few weeks or so. Puts a bunch on RB1 and can’t afford him to miss time. We went vanilla after being up 30-0 and I have no issue w that. Also some oline guys getting heat exhausted.
I know this. I have sat in Kinnick for many openers and have had SO much more to complain about when winning than this game. We all want more….me too…but the compass is pointing north.
Lolol. how often in the last 10 years have we been 6-6? Cmon on.......
I think one thing worth considering is the very nature of switching from one guy to the next every few series is part of the problem. Make a decision and let the guy play unless you need to pull him. I'd start Brown and leave him play unless you need the bull pen. Its going to have to happen after the next game anyway. You can't be doing this in a couple of weeks.
I'm ok with that in general. I think switching back and forth can impact the offensive rhythm, and can also impact the receivers with the ball coming in at a different timing / pace (exhibit A - some of the drops we saw on Saturday).
However, I don't think either guy is good enough to deserve a very long leash. At least they haven't proven it yet. I predict no matter who is the starter for ISU, we'll see multiple QB changes between the two as the year goes on. I'm fine with riding the hot hand, as long as it isn't a series by series thing.
I was happy with the approach to the NIU game, with both guys getting equal reps, both in the game and in preparation to it, because I think you needed the live-action data point to help make the decision. Now we have that.
Taking the coaches at their word (because why wouldn’t you?), the QB battle has been very even. What we saw on the field yesterday makes that very easy to believe. But last Wednesday, the coaches apparently decided Hank had the slight edge, and informed him that he would get the first 2-3 series. And again, the results seem to support that observation, with Hank being the better QB on the day.
Building on these results, I think you have to name Hank the starter, give him the majority of reps in practice, and build the gameplan around the knowledge that he’s going to be the guy. That said, I’d still give Heck plenty of reps — maybe a few more than the typical #2 gets. If things go poorly for Hank (which is certainly possible), we’ve got to be ready to pull Heck in from the bullpen. I can certainly envision a scenario in which Heck comes off the bench to rally the team to victory at some point in the season. But there are advantages to having a named starter, and I think it’s time to capitalize on those advantages. And Hank Brown has earned the opportunity to be that starter.
I’m not sure what giving them equal time would accomplish at this point. I mean, if Heck plays slightly better next Saturday, you’re right back where you started. If Hank plays better Saturday, you’ve wasted time by giving Heck extra reps. If Heck plays dramatically better on Saturday, do you even trust those results? (They didn’t after Kids Day.)
There’s a time to let the QBs battle it out, and I commend the coaches for giving both guys a shot. But at this point, based on what the coaches have said, and what we’ve seen on the field, we have enough data to make a decision.
Let the Hank Brown era begin.
#WhatCanBrownDoForYou?
I'm not saying a really long leash, but I wouldn't keep switching them in and out. Someone needs to get in a rythem as the guy by the end of the next game.
Nah.
Two of KM's long runs were on the 2nd and 4th plays of the game.
And Iowa threw it with Deacon way more than people realize
6-6? JFC, Iowa hasn't had a record that bad since 2012! They just won by 40 with a shutout and some fans are acting like we needed 2 Hail Mary's and made up time added to the clock to win the game.
Latest
-
01
Hawkeye Report Football
Game Preview: Iowa at Michigan
-
02
Hawkeye Report Football
The Friday Five
-
03
Hawkeye Report Olympics
Hawkeyes end the goal drought, earn a road draw with Penn State
-
04
Hawkeye Report Football Recruiting
Tracking where Iowa's recruits play this week
-
05
On3 Football
Joel Klatt explains why he thinks Iowa is 'a really bad matchup' for Michigan offense