Honest Question about Jordan Williams

Stick Kitty

All-Conference
Jul 7, 2025
510
1,340
93
IMO he isn't close to rock bottom yet. He might have been closer back in March when coach sat him. I am sure that got his attention and it seems he responded in the room and that paid off in freestyle results over the summer. But from the outside looking in, once he retained being back on the team status he forgot what rock bottom was for him.

I am not a professional but rock bottom is different for everyone. Could be as simple as being ashamed a kid watched you vomit or being kicked out of a bar or ramp up to just the first DUI. Other it may take multiple DUI's, Spouse leaving whatever. I believe taking wrestling away from him might be in order so he can finally sit in his own mess. Like Andrew Long though, if you are talented enough you can probably find a coach willing to enable that for the coaches own personal success but really its disguised as working their way back. Which is fine for a 1 or maybe 2 time offense depending, case by case scenarios.

I think we are past that and I trust Brands to help everyone. He is a great dude like that. But Tom needs to ask himself if he unintentionally might be enabling him to keep floating above rock bottom if he still keeps a carrot dangling. IMO he would be.

Also many students binge drink, esp. on football Saturdays in a college town. Lord knows I would crush a case back then. The difference is I didn't have the athlete behind the student title. Student athletes are expected to be above and beyond because of the privilege. That seems to be lost on some posters who act like its a right to be on the team and argue semantics of a case just because they are blinded by their own fandom. .

Bottom line is a kid can get the help he need without being able to still compete. It laughable when someone say keep him on the team and don't take that away or he could get worse. Maybe that's what has to happen and its not anyone fault but that individual.
 
Last edited:

Pathfinder1970

Redshirt
Jun 6, 2025
5
16
3
I don't care if he ever wrestles again if he can overcome his addiction. My opinion is Tom feels the same wa

A person absolutely can seek help, make meaningful changes, and recover without ever reaching what is commonly referred to as “rock bottom.” The concept of rock bottom is deeply personal and does not have a single clinical definition. What represents a turning point for one person may look very different for another.


Similarly, while family members, friends, or professionals may recognize concerning patterns associated with alcohol or substance use, lasting change ultimately requires the individual to recognize that something in their life is no longer working and that help may be needed. A person does not necessarily need to accept a particular label, such as “alcoholic” or “addict,” in order to acknowledge harmful behavior or pursue treatment.


One of the more difficult issues for families is distinguishing genuine support from enabling. Support encourages accountability, treatment, healthy boundaries, and personal responsibility. Enabling, often done out of love or fear, can unintentionally shield a person from the natural consequences of their behavior and may actually prolong the problem.


In my experience as a licensed clinical social worker working with substance-use treatment, the goal should never be to wait for someone to lose everything before they become “ready.” Ideally, intervention, honest feedback, appropriate boundaries, and access to treatment occur well before a person reaches that point. Recovery does not require devastation; it requires some degree of recognition, willingness, and engagement in change.
 
  • Like
Reactions: sdvike

Nashville_Hawk

All-Conference
Dec 31, 2015
802
2,130
93
Weren't we all like that in college? At least the part about not stopping until ****-faced
That's kind of where I'm at to a point. There are times when we talk about these kids like they're 30 somethings when in reality they're still just dumbsh*t kids...sometimes even the good ones. And then throw in some dumbsh*t friends to go with the good ones and they revert back to being dumbsh*t kids. I despise the fact that JW gave us nothing but pain last year, especially when we threw in the sub for NCAAs, but at the end of the day I agree with one of the other posters...let those closest to it deal with it and determine what's best for the kid and the program and let's us enjoy our wrestling. Sadly I was one of those who said JW would AA last year and maybe even contend for a title, and instead he quit a couple times and got benched for NCAAs. In the end, I'm good either way. Not a fan at all but trust that TNT know what they're doing..
 

Nashville_Hawk

All-Conference
Dec 31, 2015
802
2,130
93
A lot of newer cars are keyless (push button start) now, so that rule is antiquated. I would guess that sitting in a running car would suffice since, in the days when all ignitions had keys, the car couldn't be running if the key weren't in the ignition.
You hit the nail on the head. Doesn't matter where the fricking keys are if the car is running. Per the article, "According to court records, an officer made contact with Williams, who was in the driver’s seat of a parked car that had been running for at least two hours at 2:45 a.m. on Sept. 7. In the report, the officer noted that Williams was unconscious with an open container in his lap and in the center console."

I think that about says it all. 22 year old. Still a dumbs*it kid, but old enough to know better especially when he had already been arrested for the same offense.
 

Random4598375

All-Conference
Jan 10, 2020
659
1,911
93
You hit the nail on the head. Doesn't matter where the fricking keys are if the car is running. Per the article, "According to court records, an officer made contact with Williams, who was in the driver’s seat of a parked car that had been running for at least two hours at 2:45 a.m. on Sept. 7. In the report, the officer noted that Williams was unconscious with an open container in his lap and in the center console."

I think that about says it all. 22 year old. Still a dumbs*it kid, but old enough to know better especially when he had already been arrested for the same offense.
If he was there with the car running for hours, there is some irony in the fact that he could have wanted to avoid driving and sleep it off for a couple hours and turned on his car to turn on the AC to be more comfortable (although leaving an open container in his lap was pretty dumb). Does anyone know what the weather was on Sept 7 in Iowa City? If it was really hot, that could be a plausible explanation. Lesson learned, if you need to do this, go in the back seat.
 

Corby2

Heisman
Jul 14, 2025
4,902
10,726
113
If he was there with the car running for hours, there is some irony in the fact that he could have wanted to avoid driving and sleep it off for a couple hours and turned on his car to turn on the AC to be more comfortable (although leaving an open container in his lap was pretty dumb). Does anyone know what the weather was on Sept 7 in Iowa City? If it was really hot, that could be a plausible explanation. Lesson learned, if you need to do this, go in the back seat.
Quick google search says 72 with 78% humidity at 12:45 am
 

vhsalum

All-Conference
Nov 14, 2002
1,829
4,389
113
If he was there with the car running for hours, there is some irony in the fact that he could have wanted to avoid driving and sleep it off for a couple hours and turned on his car to turn on the AC to be more comfortable (although leaving an open container in his lap was pretty dumb). Does anyone know what the weather was on Sept 7 in Iowa City? If it was really hot, that could be a plausible explanation. Lesson learned, if you need to do this, go in the back seat.
He got caught, and while that's bad...

That he was THAT drunk is the bigger issue. Hope the kid figures this addiction out. He's going to end up hurting himself, or god forbid, someone else.
 

el dub

All-Conference
Nov 2, 2005
898
2,243
93
If he was there with the car running for hours, there is some irony in the fact that he could have wanted to avoid driving and sleep it off for a couple hours and turned on his car to turn on the AC to be more comfortable (although leaving an open container in his lap was pretty dumb). Does anyone know what the weather was on Sept 7 in Iowa City? If it was really hot, that could be a plausible explanation. Lesson learned, if you need to do this, go in the back seat.
Plausible explanation? He was one back spasm away from knocking the car in reverse and crashing into cars, walls… or people. There could have been. Fire. Fatalities.

Hello? The extreme alcohol consumption is the real problem. Not the car running, the beer in his lap and council, the failure to make it to the end of the season, or getting getting booted from OSU for….. wait for it…. alcohol related issues.
 

grapplefan

Senior
Oct 3, 2010
304
672
93
Just like in the real world if you're good at your job you can miss work more and get written up more then the person who's not good . Those damn win at all cost bosses🤷
Equating OUI infractions to missing days at work is stretching things. Competent bosses hire good people to begin with, train well, and can deal with occasional problems that arise.
 

Corby2

Heisman
Jul 14, 2025
4,902
10,726
113
Equating OUI infractions to missing days at work is stretching things. Competent bosses hire good people to begin with, train well, and can deal with occasional problems that arise.
Point was when you suck at something you don't get many chances and when your good at something you get more .
 
  • Like
Reactions: Bobhaywood

GLC1969

Junior
Jul 3, 2025
142
336
63
Corny you are talking about 2 different things . No way this kid deserved a 3rd chance he ACTS LIKE an entitled spoiled brat. He needs help more help then a college wrestling coach can give. If you keep treating him like he’s special nothing will change. The best thing for him is a little accountability. Jail, community service . But not in a elite wrestling room
 
  • Like
Reactions: vhsalum

Random4598375

All-Conference
Jan 10, 2020
659
1,911
93
Plausible explanation? He was one back spasm away from knocking the car in reverse and crashing into cars, walls… or people. There could have been. Fire. Fatalities.

Hello? The extreme alcohol consumption is the real problem. Not the car running, the beer in his lap and council, the failure to make it to the end of the season, or getting getting booted from OSU for….. wait for it…. alcohol related issues.
He got caught, and while that's bad...

That he was THAT drunk is the bigger issue. Hope the kid figures this addiction out. He's going to end up hurting himself, or god forbid, someone else.
I don't mean to downplay the underlying issues for him, just from a legal standpoint, if he was trying to sleep it off, if he had gone in the back seat, he wouldn't be in trouble. Obviously, he needs to address whatever problems he has with alcohol in general first and foremost.
 

vhsalum

All-Conference
Nov 14, 2002
1,829
4,389
113
I don't mean to downplay the underlying issues for him, just from a legal standpoint, if he was trying to sleep it off, if he had gone in the back seat, he wouldn't be in trouble. Obviously, he needs to address whatever problems he has with alcohol in general first and foremost.
IF and tits...

No one should be downplaying this. He's got a problem that is going to physically harm himself and/or others.
 

Corby2

Heisman
Jul 14, 2025
4,902
10,726
113
Corny you are talking about 2 different things . No way this kid deserved a 3rd chance he ACTS LIKE an entitled spoiled brat. He needs help more help then a college wrestling coach can give. If you keep treating him like he’s special nothing will change. The best thing for him is a little accountability. Jail, community service . But not in a elite wrestling room
It's Corby 😂 if you want to start the name calling I got one for you🤷 . How do you know he's not taking accountability?
 

dtripp26

Heisman
Oct 29, 2003
10,976
32,668
113
It's Corby 😂 if you want to start the name calling I got one for you🤷 . How do you know he's not taking accountability?
Will Sasso Seriously GIF by CBS
 
  • Like
Reactions: el dub

GLC1969

Junior
Jul 3, 2025
142
336
63
Well auto correct got me. If he was taking accountability i would not have happened for 3-4-5 time plus how many time he wasn’t caught. He not a kid anymore. The longer people keep covering for him and saying wresting will help the longer it will take him to get better. Ben involved with this thing my whole life. He has not had a so called come to Jesus moment. Get away from things that are the norm to him. That in my experience is the only way to make change. If that includes losing friends so be it.
 

Corby2

Heisman
Jul 14, 2025
4,902
10,726
113
Well auto correct got me. If he was taking accountability i would not have happened for 3-4-5 time plus how many time he wasn’t caught. He not a kid anymore. The longer people keep covering for him and saying wresting will help the longer it will take him to get better. Ben involved with this thing my whole life. He has not had a so called come to Jesus moment. Get away from things that are the norm to him. That in my experience is the only way to make change. If that includes losing friends so be it.
We all have opinions. Addicts don't stop until they decide to stop. That doesn't mean everyone has to give up on that person.
 

Crablegs1

Senior
Feb 27, 2009
228
713
93
Point was when you suck at something you don't get many chances and when you’re good at something you get more .

3 years as a division 1 starter and 0 time AA. That doesn’t scream out to be someone that is so good that you’d ignore a long history of issues. Especially a program like Iowa. Now AJ Ferrari is someone that is actually good and could see making exceptions for, but zero AAs in three tries?
 

Stick Kitty

All-Conference
Jul 7, 2025
510
1,340
93
Random thoughts...

Back in the 80's a cop would have called Gable late at night. He would have come down to the garage and knocked on the window and asked him if he was having fun. Then he would have said jump in my car and I will get you home but we are stopping by Carver first. You will run stairs, vomit and get sober before you go home. Then we talk later

I've gotten drunk enough one time I slept in the back of my car. But I was aware of the law. I threw the keys on the passenger mat in the front so they were an arms length away. JW must not be very intelligent to turn his car on with his keys on him and sounds like he had an empty in the cup holder and halfy between his legs. Thats screams out and tells me a lot. That minor detail tells you where his at mentally. Was he going to knock that drink off then drive but just passed out and avoided even worse charges to stick. CANT TRUST HIM! I found it hilarious some are arguing semantics as if a lesser charge is paint him in a better light.

IMO Brands cant trust this kid's judgment enough to keep him around. If true all it takes is one beer and he turns into frank the tank. Cant build a team around that and cant count on him to stay clean and eligible for NCAAs.

He came over with a probation stipulation due to his past. He keeps repeating it. I dont have to read anymore of this book.

As a lifelong diehard Iowa fan like all of us. Isn't it a tad embarrassing that the program is at the current level where we have to justify giving chances to guys that Oklahoma State has deemed to much trouble to help?

Look in the mirror, Tom vetted this guy and it backfired. But the real bottom line is yes the portal is a form of recruiting nowadays but had Brands correctly vetted or recruited the right high school prospect, we all wouldn't have to be on this board debating if he should be mother Theresa or and how many times are going to let a kid tell you who he is. Toms lack of recruited painted himself into having to overuse the transfer portal on a larger scale than IMO Iowa wrestling should need. Bluebloods should grow from within. Ok St is now in that position and PSU needs no explanation.

Oh have I mentioned when college sports use to be a privilege to participate. Not a requirement for mental health or well being.
 
Last edited:
Jan 10, 2023
252
422
63
Not true. In order to effect an arrest all officers need is probable cause that the offense occurred, hence he was booked for OWI. It requires a "fair probability" that a crime occurred or that evidence exists in a specific spot. Dude passed out drunk in a car for several hours with engine running and nobody else around is certainly at least a “fair probability” that DUI occurred. There is certainly evidence to support that (Williams was intoxicated, in possession of alcohol, engine running etc). Difficult to prove beyond a reasonable doubt however. Very possible he pleads to a lesser charge.
Lesser charge is "not getting you" for OWI. Where is the evidence he was "passed out for serveral hours with enging running"? A cop can say the lights were on over a time span, but as to what was going on in the vehicle that won't happen. What if he parked it, then drank alcohol? Never heard of "fair probability" and I've been practicing law over 25 years. Weak case on OWI. Public Intox, good case.
 

Stick Kitty

All-Conference
Jul 7, 2025
510
1,340
93
Lesser charge is "not getting you" for OWI. Where is the evidence he was "passed out for serveral hours with enging running"? A cop can say the lights were on over a time span, but as to what was going on in the vehicle that won't happen. What if he parked it, then drank alcohol? Never heard of "fair probability" and I've been practicing law over 25 years. Weak case on OWI. Public Intox, good case.
From above- what are we arguing about here fella's

JW must not be very intelligent to turn his car on with his keys on him and sounds like he had an empty in the cup holder and halfy between his legs. That's screams out and tells me a lot. That minor detail tells you where his at mentally. Was he going to knock that drink off then drive but just passed out and avoided even worse charges to stick. ! I find it hilarious some are arguing semantics as if a lesser charge is paint him in a better light even though he has already been kicked off one team, benched for NCAA for us for trust issues and failed another test. The mental gymnastics in this thread.

Look to be a complete hypocrite, if this dude was Ed Ruth and good for 25 NCAA points and the difference in a team title. I could play stupid, say poor kid needs help and be a homer. But we really doing this for the team difference between 4th & 5th place?
 

bnicolls

All-Conference
Jun 4, 2005
300
2,131
93
IMO he isn't close to rock bottom yet. He might have been closer back in March when coach sat him. I am sure that got his attention and it seems he responded in the room and that paid off in freestyle results over the summer. But from the outside looking in, once he retained being back on the team status he forgot what rock bottom was for him.

I am not a professional but rock bottom is different for everyone. Could be as simple as being ashamed a kid watched you vomit or being kicked out of a bar or ramp up to just the first DUI. Other it may take multiple DUI's, Spouse leaving whatever. I believe taking wrestling away from him might be in order so he can finally sit in his own mess. Like Andrew Long though, if you are talented enough you can probably find a coach willing to enable that for the coaches own personal success but really its disguised as working their way back. Which is fine for a 1 or maybe 2 time offense depending, case by case scenarios.

I think we are past that and I trust Brands to help everyone. He is a great dude like that. But Tom needs to ask himself if he unintentionally might be enabling him to keep floating above rock bottom if he still keeps a carrot dangling. IMO he would be.

Also many students binge drink, esp. on football Saturdays in a college town. Lord knows I would crush a case back then. The difference is I didn't have the athlete behind the student title. Student athletes are expected to be above and beyond because of the privilege. That seems to be lost on some posters who act like its a right to be on the team and argue semantics of a case just because they are blinded by their own fandom. .

Bottom line is a kid can get the help he need without being able to still compete. It laughable when someone say keep him on the team and don't take that away or he could get worse. Maybe that's what has to happen and its not anyone fault but that individual.
good comments
 

Stick Kitty

All-Conference
Jul 7, 2025
510
1,340
93
If Brands kicked him out of the room. Can JW just drive to Colorado Springs and have a practice room with free room & board because he is the USA Rep at a weight?

How does that work?
 

GLC1969

Junior
Jul 3, 2025
142
336
63
Give up on him? Hard to give up when he not even making an effort. Have you been around many people with these problems? I have too many to count. I have helped as many as i could. Including myself. Keeping him in an environment that makes him comfortable is a HUGE problem. Familiarity breeds complacency. I believe the best thing for him is to get him out of Iowa and get him in a great program to deal with his issues. He’s young get it now before its too late.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Stick Kitty

Random4598375

All-Conference
Jan 10, 2020
659
1,911
93
Lesser charge is "not getting you" for OWI. Where is the evidence he was "passed out for serveral hours with enging running"? A cop can say the lights were on over a time span, but as to what was going on in the vehicle that won't happen. What if he parked it, then drank alcohol? Never heard of "fair probability" and I've been practicing law over 25 years. Weak case on OWI. Public Intox, good case.
It's a slam dunk case for OWI. If you're intoxicated and sitting in the driver seat of a running car, that's enough to convict. Always has been. The car doesn't have to be moving.
 

PennState1985

All-Conference
Mar 14, 2016
2,140
4,993
113
yes.

It's just different for different people obviously. One of my high school coaches had a father that was an alcoholic. He told us when he was about 15, his dad got belligerently drunk, got aggressive with his wife and our coach had to get in between them.

Left the house and when he came back, sat the family down and said he would never drink again. Dude has been dry sober since that day. His "bottom" was realizing what he was doing to his family. Stories like this are few and far between, but much like everything else in life, addiction recovery is a spectrum.
I employ my BIL in my business because frankly he is unemployable but has kids. I guess that makes me an enabler and a hypocrite but you can’t punish the children. I have literally fired him six times. But he is my BIL mind you.

He is a lifelong alcoholic from an alcoholic dad. I can’t even describe the number of DUIs or wrapping his car around a tree or AA meetings. He understands perfectly who he is. His anxiety (mostly not even real - but to him it is) overcomes all reason. Alcohol is medication to cope with life’s struggles. He knows it’s killing him. He know it hurts his relationships. He literally can’t stop. He just celebrated 6 months sobriety and that is a milestone for him. It’s just one skirmish in a lifelong war.

I am just glad I wasn’t borne with addiction tendencies. Most who are addicts don’t want the price addiction exacts but cannot stop. I hope JW hits bottom without killing himself, and lives a productive life. I guarantee he is miserable, but all that leaves him when he sees a beer bottle.
 
Jun 5, 2012
43
204
33
Lesser charge is "not getting you" for OWI. Where is the evidence he was "passed out for serveral hours with enging running"? A cop can say the lights were on over a time span, but as to what was going on in the vehicle that won't happen. What if he parked it, then drank alcohol? Never heard of "fair probability" and I've been practicing law over 25 years. Weak case on OWI. Public Intox, good case.
28 year LE vet with over a hundred DUI arrests under my belt. Fair probability is the legal standard for probable cause. Again, I don’t think he’ll be convicted, very difficult to convince a jury beyond a reasonable doubt, but certainly probable cause exists.

The term "fair probability" is the official threshold used by the U.S. Supreme Court to define probable cause under the Fourth Amendment.
 

Stick Kitty

All-Conference
Jul 7, 2025
510
1,340
93
28 year LE vet with over a hundred DUI arrests under my belt. Fair probability is the legal standard for probable cause. Again, I don’t think he’ll be convicted, very difficult to convince a jury beyond a reasonable doubt, but certainly probable cause exists.

The term "fair probability" is the official threshold used by the U.S. Supreme Court to define probable cause under the Fourth Amendment.

I believe even if he gets lucky with just the public intox, in Iowa he will still lose his DL for at least 1 year for the breathalyzer refusal. That's probably enough retribution for the Johnson County AD's office to sign off on.
 
Last edited:
Hawkeye Report

Latest

  1. 01 Hawkeye Report Football Game Preview: Northern Iowa at Iowa
  2. 02 Hawkeye Report Football The Friday Five talking Iowa football
  3. 03 Hawkeye Report Basketball Ranking every Iowa men's basketball conference game
  4. 04 Hawkeye Report Olympics Realin granted medical redshirt, rejoins Iowa roster for 2026-27
  5. 05 Hawkeye Report Basketball Ranking every single Iowa Women's Basketball conference matchup