Said they blew the call but at this point can't change the result
NCAA Oversight Committee rules refs screwed Western Michigan in the Michigan game
- Thread starter mdk02
- Start date
Duuuuuuuh! They also cheated to get a natty.
You gotta wonder how this would have all played out had the teams been switched and WM got the TD with the extra play to win.
What a shame for those kids, I hope they win out.
It will be interesting to see how this plays out for Michigan if they win out or only lose 1 mroe game
What a shame for those kids, I hope they win out.
It will be interesting to see how this plays out for Michigan if they win out or only lose 1 mroe game
They can vacate wins for everything else, why not this?
WMU got screwed!
WMU got screwed!
Watching their first 2 games, their D looks very good but their offense is bad. I don't see a world where they don't lose a couple more games.
I suspect (or at least hope) the voters continue ranking them as if WMU was a loss. They dropped out of the top 25 that week. They got back in after beating #11 OU, but only at #19, which is not what you'd expect of a 2-0 UM team that just beat #11. If they do somehow manage to run the table, I don't think you could keep them out of a playoff, but if they don't, the WMU loss will factor into tiebreakers.
So the original sync on the tv was in sync? And the replay used to overturn the timer was out of sync? Let that sink in.
Well pardon my ignorance and naivety. I realize a superior intellect like yours didn't need to be informed of the committee's decision, but us lesser human beings sometimes need a little help.
As somebody suggested, bowl committee should qualify WMU for a bowl with 5 wins
But given they are independent of the NCAA, they can weight the game as they see fit.
What’s interesting is that many retired referees and rules committee officials weighed in on this situation. All say it’s a travesty. Not one came out and supported the decision. Many bringing up that stadium clock is for all intents and purposes the official clock. Of it wasn’t and there is another clock somewhere else. Why does the ref always ask the timekeeper to update the clock. It’s one clock. Always has been.
Yeah but it is often reset after penalty and review decisions that reflect stoppage in play.
What it says is the call was correct but if they had followed proper protocols the game was over. So, technically Michigan should have lost even though there was one second left.
https://www.espn.com/college-footba...bs-oversight-committee-says-overturn-wmu-loss
https://www.espn.com/college-footba...bs-oversight-committee-says-overturn-wmu-loss
Why can't they reverse the results? It's really as simple as if that last play occurred or not.
Go back to the no replay days. If you can’t fix the thing that is in place to avoid these situations, why bother at all?
There was no penalty. And was discussed by rules officials real time. They didn’t understand why the play was reviewed in the first place. There was no grounds that should have or would have allowed for a review.
Yes sir. I'm just providing some input as to why the clock could b adjusted. Hence "often".
You will get no argument from me on that joke of a call.
I’ll ever understand that statement when the call happened literally on the last play of the game. If the right call ended the game then there’s no argument that the next play could’ve changed the outcome. Especially when they already altered the outcome once. It’s a simple change of 2 numbers. Add 1 win to WMU and take one away from UM.
I don't think the "second clock" part of it was fully understood (or covered correctly). It's not that there was a second clock...it's that the Big Ten Replay booth's video of the clock appeared to have been a few tenths of a second delayed vs. the video embedded in the game feed. The lack of precision caught them when they screwed up this play.
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Timing at the end of the half/game is definitely grounds for a review. The fact that it was reviewed wasn't the problem....it was the execution of that review.
Not according to the rules experts that weighed in. They said it’s only reviewable if there is/was a flag. The experts also said that they shouldn’t have used sub second timing if it is not reflected on the scoreboard or visible to the on field refs.
I don't know what rules expert you're referring to, but they were either wrong, or you misunderstood them. Timing at the end of the quarter/half/game is reviewable...both ways, adding or subtracting (to see if a snap occurred after the clock ran out, to see if the clock should have expired when time is still remaining on it, etc).
FYI...here is the rulebook definitions on this...It falls under 12.3.6(d) and 12.3.6(e)...
Miscellaneous
ARTICLE 6. Situations that may be addressed by the replay official:
(d) Clock adjustment at the end of any quarter. If the game clock expires at the end of any quarter, either during a down in which it should be stopped by rule through play when the ball becomes dead or after the down upon a request for an available team timeout, the replay official may restore time only under these conditions:
1. The replay official has clear and obvious video evidence that time should have remained on the game clock when the ball became dead or when the team timeout was granted.
2. If time expires in a half, and the clock would start on the Referee’s signal after review, there must be at least 3 seconds remaining when the ball should have been declared dead to restore time to the clock. With 2 seconds or 1 second remaining on the clock, the half is over unless Team A has a time out remaining (This does not impact situations when the clock is stopped and will remain stopped until the snap such as an incomplete pass or a ball carrier out of bounds.).
3. In the fourth quarter only, to restore time, the score differential must be eight points or less (after a touchdown, all potential results of the try down must be considered)
4. The replay official’s video evidence includes the timeout signal by an official in the case where the game clock should have stopped for a requested team timeout
(e) If there is clear video evidence that time expired at the end of any quarter prior to the ball being put into play, the replay official will end the period regardless of the outcome of the play. Personal or unsportsmanlike fouls must be enforced.
Miscellaneous
ARTICLE 6. Situations that may be addressed by the replay official:
(d) Clock adjustment at the end of any quarter. If the game clock expires at the end of any quarter, either during a down in which it should be stopped by rule through play when the ball becomes dead or after the down upon a request for an available team timeout, the replay official may restore time only under these conditions:
1. The replay official has clear and obvious video evidence that time should have remained on the game clock when the ball became dead or when the team timeout was granted.
2. If time expires in a half, and the clock would start on the Referee’s signal after review, there must be at least 3 seconds remaining when the ball should have been declared dead to restore time to the clock. With 2 seconds or 1 second remaining on the clock, the half is over unless Team A has a time out remaining (This does not impact situations when the clock is stopped and will remain stopped until the snap such as an incomplete pass or a ball carrier out of bounds.).
3. In the fourth quarter only, to restore time, the score differential must be eight points or less (after a touchdown, all potential results of the try down must be considered)
4. The replay official’s video evidence includes the timeout signal by an official in the case where the game clock should have stopped for a requested team timeout
(e) If there is clear video evidence that time expired at the end of any quarter prior to the ball being put into play, the replay official will end the period regardless of the outcome of the play. Personal or unsportsmanlike fouls must be enforced.
The Fox/cbs/espn. They’ve all weighed in and chastised the personnel responsible. Shite they updated the rule and do not allow for the interpretation you claim.
From the source:
When a replay review requires time to be restored or adjusted, the replay official must base their decision on the embedded game clock within the program feed (or the on-screen broadcast graphic if the embedded feed is unavailable).
Can’t restore time to the clock because the clock read 00. There was no time to restore. And there was no flag for player interference. Defender re entering the field of play. On field refs didn’t see this interference. So that infraction was not reviewable. Thus ending the game.
You're bringing up a different issue. You said that the play itself (ie, timing at the end of a game) isn't reviewable. I was just correcting that and pointing out that it is (and should be) reviewable. The presence of a flag doesn't impact the ability to review this play.
The other issue was the "execution" of the review. That's where the problem kicked in...the replay booth's video of the game clock didn't appear to be synched with the TV embedded game clock (it was a few tenths of a second behind). That's where things went south...and why the NCAA head of officials issued the memo to standardize/clarify how the clock should be used for these end of quarter/half/game replays moving forward.
And there was no "infraction"/flag on the play...it was simply a player out of bounds touching the ball which kills the clock.
Maybe. But they had to clarify the rule and establish new guidelines to leave it less to interpretation and more to agree with what I posted above.
Why can't they change the result ? Haven't they changed the results of game well after they were over....sometimes years after they were over ?
BTW, those on here who continue to argue that what happened at the end of that game was correct need to read the title of this thread again.... slowly.
Definitely...the rulebook itself wasn't specific enough, but now it should be standardized moving forward to prevent another screwup like this one.
And not sure if everyone saw it, but here is the actual feed from that night (on the right) from the Video Review...
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