Operation Market Garden, 82 yrs ago today.
- Thread starter Catch1lion
- Start date
"A Bridge Too Far" is a great book.....and movie.
(copied from another source):
After the Battle of Arnhem, there was only one person who thought Market Garden was a success. Montgomery stated that Operation Market Garden was a 90 percent success. After all, the Allies had managed to conquer 90 percent of the road to Arnhem.
When Prince Bernhard heard this, he reportedly declared: “My country cannot afford another of Montgomery’s successes…”
(copied from another source):
After the Battle of Arnhem, there was only one person who thought Market Garden was a success. Montgomery stated that Operation Market Garden was a 90 percent success. After all, the Allies had managed to conquer 90 percent of the road to Arnhem.
When Prince Bernhard heard this, he reportedly declared: “My country cannot afford another of Montgomery’s successes…”
Great find! Thanks for posting!
I read “A Bridge Too Far” many times. The mistakes made were simple in the planning but catastrophic in their devastation.
The Brits at Arnhem were totally hosed, and the Poles who dropped with them several days later also suffered mightily. I was angered when I visited Arnhem when I learned just how much the limeys scapegoated the Poles for the failure of the final phase when Monty’s plan and the weather colluded.
One of the things that really was impressive to me was how narrow the Lower Rhine was at Arnhem and how amazingly wide the Waal/Rhine was at Nijmegen. The amphib assault there, the crossing led by Maj. Julian Cook (Redford on film), is really a feat of arms for the 82nd. The inability of the 82nd to capture the bridge at Nijmegen was a significant hindrance to the success of the operation. The heroism of those troopers that day is something that should be long-remembered. And to a man they believed that succeeding in their mission that day would enable the Brit armor to get to Arnhem to relieve their airborne brothers in arms. ‘Twas not to be.
I can talk all day about this stuff. For another great read, consider Antony Beevor’s “Battle of Arnhem.” It does not sugarcoat the failures by the Brits in planning.
I read “A Bridge Too Far” many times. The mistakes made were simple in the planning but catastrophic in their devastation.
The Brits at Arnhem were totally hosed, and the Poles who dropped with them several days later also suffered mightily. I was angered when I visited Arnhem when I learned just how much the limeys scapegoated the Poles for the failure of the final phase when Monty’s plan and the weather colluded.
One of the things that really was impressive to me was how narrow the Lower Rhine was at Arnhem and how amazingly wide the Waal/Rhine was at Nijmegen. The amphib assault there, the crossing led by Maj. Julian Cook (Redford on film), is really a feat of arms for the 82nd. The inability of the 82nd to capture the bridge at Nijmegen was a significant hindrance to the success of the operation. The heroism of those troopers that day is something that should be long-remembered. And to a man they believed that succeeding in their mission that day would enable the Brit armor to get to Arnhem to relieve their airborne brothers in arms. ‘Twas not to be.
I can talk all day about this stuff. For another great read, consider Antony Beevor’s “Battle of Arnhem.” It does not sugarcoat the failures by the Brits in planning.
General Gavin was adopted and raised by a couple from Mt. Carmel, PA. 
Eisenhower went along with Montgomery's idiocy, resulting in disaster and lengthening of the war.
.
Montgomery was Britain's most overrated flag officer. Halsey was probably ours.
I'm not sure that many rate him very highly anyway.
Lots of questionable occurrences in WW2. Why was the 28th Division sent into the Hurtgen as opposed to simply bypassing it and cutting off the Wermacht units dug in there? How could Germany amass 250,000 troops without being identified by allied intelligence during the build up to 12/16/44 and the Battle of the Bulge?
Omar Bradley’s chief of staff and best friend was Godwin Ordway II, Ordway’s daughter Claire married my mother’s brother Joe. Both of Claire’s brothers were West Pointers and I knew her brother Butch very well, as he stayed in DC. Butch got a Silver Star in Vietnam. Anyway, Butch would tell me that when his parents hosted dinner parties, Bradley would come upstairs to help him with his algebra. “The finest man I ever knew.”
My dad was an infantry Sgt., landed at Casablanca, took the tour of N Africa into Egypt and was in the invasion of Sicily. He finished up in Germany. I remember him saying that the grunts respected Patton, but loved Bradley.
Montgomert could not come to grips with the fact that Ike was running the show, not him.
Montgomery never admitted his folly. Instead he stated the operation was "90% successful".
An azz.
An azz.
I've heard Bradley was a hellava shortstop with pro potential.
My Dad served in the 28th Division and was caught up in the Bulge. The only thing wrong with this country is we've lost the wisdom of "the greatest generation. " We were blessed to be raised by heroes.
Another Montgomery success story. He won one battle, El Alamein. After that, ge followed Romel across North Africa to Tunisia. He finally broke through the Mareth Line when he got the bright idea to flank it and the Americans under Patton started to threaten the Axis rear. Monty than drew up the plans for the invasion of Sicily, but couldn't achieve his objective, even after taking a supply road away from the Americans. On D-Day, he assigned himself Caen as a day one objective. He finally took it over a month later. His ego was constantly writing checks he ability could not cash.
And Mrs. RoarMore's journey through BoB is continuing as I write this with episode four on Market-Garden.
And Mrs. RoarMore's journey through BoB is continuing as I write this with episode four on Market-Garden.
Had Eisenhower listened to Patton, a lot of waste and later Russian crap would not have happened.
1. Eisenhower wasn't President at that time.
2. Russia had a huge advantage in troop strength and armor by then and could have pushed us back to Britain. Patton was nuts.
It didn't matter that Eisenhower wasn't president, he was calling the shots. Patton knew how to deal with the Russians the same as the Germans.
Apparently Patton"s Intelligence officer was on to the build-up for several weeks before the Bulge commenced. This was the main reason, Patton was able to turn the Army 90 degrees north in such a short time because the staff work was done. This whole affair was referenced on a YouTube video that seemed legit; however, I have not found this info elsewhere. Its over six months since I've watched the video so my details may be foggy.
England and France declared war on Germany for invading Poland. Then we allowed Poland and Eastern Europe to be subjected to an equally oppressive Soviet regime. Lot's of young men lost their lives for what? We could have liberated France and negotiated a truce in July 1944. One thing to remember, USSR had a massive army in the field but we had nuclear weapons. In history much like football, hind sight is 20-20.
The Ukraine War could easily be attributed to Russian fears of Western intensions. For that reason and the massive losses the USSR suffered in WW2, IMO Ukraine should not be given NATO membership.
Actually Patton had great respect for the German military. He wanted to rearm them and turn east. Don't forget that the Soviet success was in no small part a by product of massive US supplies and equipment.
100%
Front line soldiers like my Dad kept reporting unusual noise and signs they observed for weeks. They were told that units were moving out? Take that for what it's worth. German patrols were walking thru allied lines for weeks before. The brass were preparing for Christmas.
Without the US supplies, Patton knew he could crush the Russians.
Here is a text story about the planning involved:
Patton’s impossible 90-degree turn that changed the Battle of the Bulge at Bastogne
What Patton knew was that America would disband it's military and the USSR would not. Democracy is therefore at peace time, always at a disadvantage to a totalitarian regime.
Patton called just about every wrong move Montgomery made. Patton was a tactical genius and realist while Montgomery was just a pompous jackass.
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