Chuck Long podcast on QB play

uihawk82

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I have listened to the first 15 minutes out of 41 and in that time he said Heck has a low, looping windup and a low release and the low release usually leads to low trajectories like the big miss to Diaz running the deep post. Long suggested after a good start with maybe scripted plays that Heck started missing reads and making poor decisions. Long said it looked like on the goalline INT Heck had made up his mind to throw that quick slant pass rather than hand if off. He said on that type of play if the Lbkr doesnt charge the LOS you hand it off and if the Lbkr crashes to LOS you keep it and make the throw. Also there was the near Heck INT on our only scoring drive after the hawk INT where Heck did not see the safety or did but tried to force it in which was an INT that was dropped. Kakert said he was surprised they pulled Heck out before the first half was over but Long said Lester knew he wasnt making correct reads etc.

Long said Hank looked a little rusty, threw a low ball on an out pattern that was open but also made some really good throws. He and Kakert described the last pass missed to DJV as a little pressure in the pocket but he maybe didnt step into the throw which launched it a bit high and wide, a bad throw. But Long thinks it will be Hank starting against Wisky.
 

Hawk-A-Doodle-Doo

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We could have a lab-grown spawn made from the combined DNA of Chuck Long, Brad Banks, Chuck Hartlieb, Matt Rodgers, Drew Tate, Rick-6, CJ Beathard, Kenny Ploen and Randy Duncan and it wouldn't make a damn bit of difference if we only average 2-3 yards per carry on the ground AND continue to run into the brick wall anyway, just out of a sense of pride or outright stubbornness.
 

Hurricane88

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We could have a lab-grown spawn made from the combined DNA of Chuck Long, Brad Banks, Chuck Hartlieb, Matt Rodgers, Drew Tate, Rick-6, CJ Beathard, Kenny Ploen and Randy Duncan and it wouldn't make a damn bit of difference if we only average 2-3 yards per carry on the ground AND continue to run into the brick wall anyway, just out of a sense of pride or outright stubbornness.
I don't think that's true. Just need someone that's comfortable in the system and isn't afraid to pass the ball downfield. IF Tradon Bessinger sticks around, he might be that guy.
 

DuddyB

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I don't think that's true. Just need someone that's comfortable in the system and isn't afraid to pass the ball downfield. IF Tradon Bessinger sticks around, he might be that guy.
I don’t understand the Bessinger hype. I suppose hope is all we’ve got but I’m not getting excited about a single QB prospect until I see him produce on the field.
 

Max Rebo

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I have listened to the first 15 minutes out of 41 and in that time he said Heck has a low, looping windup and a low release and the low release usually leads to low trajectories like the big miss to Diaz running the deep post.
Do we agree with Chuck that Heck as a significant “windup” when he throws? Because I keep reading on this board about Heck’s quick release, and about how quickly he gets the ball out. Seems contradictory.

Chuck has also said we need to put in some wildcat plays to take advantage of Heck’s running ability. Despite that running ability having yet to show up in any games.

I love Chuck. He is among the greatest Hawkeye heroes of all-time. But I’m not entirely sure he actually watches the games. He spends most of the time on the podcast simply repeating whatever Kakert just said, then extrapolating on it with a lot of football jargon.

But I do enjoy the podcast.
 

Tommyhawk55

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Aug 15, 2023
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Do we agree with Chuck that Heck as a significant “windup” when he throws? Because I keep reading on this board about Heck’s quick release, and about how quickly he gets the ball out. Seems contradictory.

Chuck has also said we need to put in some wildcat plays to take advantage of Heck’s running ability. Despite that running ability having yet to show up in any games.

I love Chuck. He is among the greatest Hawkeye heroes of all-time. But I’m not entirely sure he actually watches the games. He spends most of the time on the podcast simply repeating whatever Kakert just said, then extrapolating on it with a lot of football jargon.

But I do enjoy the podcast.
Completely agree. Chuck was a below average coach and his analysis is not good at all. To your point it seems like he doesn't even watch the games and catches highlights before he does the podcast so he can repeat everything that Tom says. I find the podcast incredibly boring and Chucks analysis is unimpressive. Great all time Hawkeye but could do without his analysis as he sounds clueless
 

uihawk82

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Watch some film on him.
When you say watch some film on him , Bessinger, do you mean he looks really good?

Remember Petras broke all of Jared Goff's high school passing records and I am not someone who thought Petras was a bad qb but I feel Spencer was on a few teams that couldnt run the ball and had really poor pass protection. The 2020 hawks were a very good team and Petras looked plenty good with that team.

I hope Bessinger is a very good QB and he gets the chance to show it and lead Iowa to great seasons. But I cant say anything about how he looks as I havent looked at any of his highlights because the difference between Utah high school ball and the Big 10 is a vast chasm.
 

eyesofhawk

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We could have a lab-grown spawn made from the combined DNA of Chuck Long, Brad Banks, Chuck Hartlieb, Matt Rodgers, Drew Tate, Rick-6, CJ Beathard, Kenny Ploen and Randy Duncan and it wouldn't make a damn bit of difference if we only average 2-3 yards per carry on the ground AND continue to run into the brick wall anyway, just out of a sense of pride or outright stubbornness.
Pride and stubbornness are two of the most important aspects of the run game.

Welcome to football
 

uihawk82

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Do we agree with Chuck that Heck as a significant “windup” when he throws? Because I keep reading on this board about Heck’s quick release, and about how quickly he gets the ball out. Seems contradictory.

Chuck has also said we need to put in some wildcat plays to take advantage of Heck’s running ability. Despite that running ability having yet to show up in any games.

I love Chuck. He is among the greatest Hawkeye heroes of all-time. But I’m not entirely sure he actually watches the games. He spends most of the time on the podcast simply repeating whatever Kakert just said, then extrapolating on it with a lot of football jargon.

But I do enjoy the podcast.
Well, compare Heck vs a qb like Dan Marino. Heck has the ball chest level maybe patting it with two hands and when he starts to throw the ball drops like a baseball pitcher to thigh level and winds up behind him. And he has a low release level which I think most qb coaches would say causes some problems. It is a Deacon Hill slow windup and many qbs have it.

But look at Dan Marino holding the ball high chest level and when he throws it is the best, classic move of pulling the ball past his ear and boom gone. Same with Joe Namath.

All I am saying is Marino and Namath and many other top qbs were said to have the best quick windup and release in the game and I heard this mentioned by the expert football people going back many years.

So Long knows his stuff and his mechanics did not drop and loop the ball and he kept it above his shoulder but not as straight back and Marino and Namath who brought the ball up over the shoulder right past the earhole of their helmet.

search for "how does a sidearm release effect a quarterback's passes" and you will find the same somewhat negative consequenses of a side arm thrower
 

uihawk82

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Completely agree. Chuck was a below average coach and his analysis is not good at all. To your point it seems like he doesn't even watch the games and catches highlights before he does the podcast so he can repeat everything that Tom says. I find the podcast incredibly boring and Chucks analysis is unimpressive. Great all time Hawkeye but could do without his analysis as he sounds clueless
ahh, you know more about QB mechanics than chuck long, gimme a break as that is a bad take. Check out video of the classic QB passing motion of Marino and Namath where they bring the ball from chest high right past the earhole of their helmet and boom, gone and on target vs the drop the ball longer windup and sidearm throws of deacon hill and Heck. I wish Heck would improve his mechanics because: and notice how it makes it harder to throw the ball long

A sidearm release changes the trajectory, velocity, and release point of a quarterback's passes, altering how the ball travels and how defenders can react to it. While a traditional over-the-top motion is the standard for consistency, a sidearm throwing angle is a highly effective tool when used correctly.
Here is how a sidearm release directly impacts a quarterback's passes:

1. Trajectory and Flight Path
    • Flatter Trajectory: Sidearm passes tend to have a lower, more horizontal launch angle. The ball travels on a line-drive rope rather than a looping arc.
    • Harder to Layer: Because the ball stays low, it is much more difficult to "layer" the pass over an intermediate linebacker and underneath a deep safety.
    • Increased Lateral Movement: Depending on the spin and arm angle, sidearm throws can sometimes feature a slight horizontal tailing action, similar to a baseball pitch.

2. Passing Windows and Batted Balls
    • Navigating Around Linemen: The primary advantage of a sidearm release is the ability to throw around the outstretched arms of rushing defensive linemen rather than trying to throw over them.
    • Lower Release Point: Conversely, because the ball is released closer to the ground, it can occasionally be easier for interior defensive linemen to swat down if they anticipate the quick, low throwing lane.

3. Velocity and Spin
    • High Short-Distance Velocity: Quarterbacks can often whip a sidearm pass with extreme rotational speed, making it highly effective for quick screens, slants, and rpos where the ball needs to arrive instantly.
    • Loss of Deep Power: Generating deep-ball power requires vertical leverage from the hips and shoulder tilt. A pure sidearm release makes it harder to drive the ball downfield, often resulting in underthrown deep passes if used inappropriately.

4. Playmaking and Off-Platform Flexibility
    • Throwing on the Run: When rolling out or escaping a collapsing pocket, a quarterback's body is rarely perfectly upright. A sidearm release allows them to snap the ball off quickly without resetting their feet.
    • Disguising Intentions: Quarterbacks like Patrick Mahomes use sidearm and no-look variations because it prevents defenders from tracking the quarterback’s eyes and traditional shoulder lean, delaying their break on the ball.


To help narrow this down, are you analyzing this from a scouting/coaching perspective, trying to fix a mechanical habit in your own throw, or looking at specific NFL players who excel at it?
 
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Max Rebo

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ahh, you know more about QB mechanics than chuck long, gimme a break as that is a bad take. Check out video of the classic QB passing motion of Marino and Namath where they bring the ball from chest high right past the earhole of their helmet and boom, gone and on target vs the drop the ball longer windup and sidearm throws of deacon hill and Heck. I wish Heck would improve his mechanics because: and notice how it makes it harder to throw the ball long

A sidearm release changes the trajectory, velocity, and release point of a quarterback's passes, altering how the ball travels and how defenders can react to it. While a traditional over-the-top motion is the standard for consistency, a sidearm throwing angle is a highly effective tool when used correctly.
Here is how a sidearm release directly impacts a quarterback's passes:

1. Trajectory and Flight Path
    • Flatter Trajectory: Sidearm passes tend to have a lower, more horizontal launch angle. The ball travels on a line-drive rope rather than a looping arc.
    • Harder to Layer: Because the ball stays low, it is much more difficult to "layer" the pass over an intermediate linebacker and underneath a deep safety.
    • Increased Lateral Movement: Depending on the spin and arm angle, sidearm throws can sometimes feature a slight horizontal tailing action, similar to a baseball pitch.

2. Passing Windows and Batted Balls
    • Navigating Around Linemen: The primary advantage of a sidearm release is the ability to throw around the outstretched arms of rushing defensive linemen rather than trying to throw over them.
    • Lower Release Point: Conversely, because the ball is released closer to the ground, it can occasionally be easier for interior defensive linemen to swat down if they anticipate the quick, low throwing lane.

3. Velocity and Spin
    • High Short-Distance Velocity: Quarterbacks can often whip a sidearm pass with extreme rotational speed, making it highly effective for quick screens, slants, and rpos where the ball needs to arrive instantly.
    • Loss of Deep Power: Generating deep-ball power requires vertical leverage from the hips and shoulder tilt. A pure sidearm release makes it harder to drive the ball downfield, often resulting in underthrown deep passes if used inappropriately.

4. Playmaking and Off-Platform Flexibility
    • Throwing on the Run: When rolling out or escaping a collapsing pocket, a quarterback's body is rarely perfectly upright. A sidearm release allows them to snap the ball off quickly without resetting their feet.
    • Disguising Intentions: Quarterbacks like Patrick Mahomes use sidearm and no-look variations because it prevents defenders from tracking the quarterback’s eyes and traditional shoulder lean, delaying their break on the ball.


To help narrow this down, are you analyzing this from a scouting/coaching perspective, trying to fix a mechanical habit in your own throw, or looking at specific NFL players who excel at it?
Holy ChatGPT, Batman.
 

Hawk1988

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I have listened to the first 15 minutes out of 41 and in that time he said Heck has a low, looping windup and a low release and the low release usually leads to low trajectories like the big miss to Diaz running the deep post. Long suggested after a good start with maybe scripted plays that Heck started missing reads and making poor decisions. Long said it looked like on the goalline INT Heck had made up his mind to throw that quick slant pass rather than hand if off. He said on that type of play if the Lbkr doesnt charge the LOS you hand it off and if the Lbkr crashes to LOS you keep it and make the throw. Also there was the near Heck INT on our only scoring drive after the hawk INT where Heck did not see the safety or did but tried to force it in which was an INT that was dropped. Kakert said he was surprised they pulled Heck out before the first half was over but Long said Lester knew he wasnt making correct reads etc.

Long said Hank looked a little rusty, threw a low ball on an out pattern that was open but also made some really good throws. He and Kakert described the last pass missed to DJV as a little pressure in the pocket but he maybe didnt step into the throw which launched it a bit high and wide, a bad throw. But Long thinks it will be Hank starting against Wisky.
This pod has the energy of a sloth
 
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Palmerhawk

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I read Leistikow's analysis of the qb play at minny that used pro football focus #s.

Good breakdown.
Hecks interception near goal in 1st qtr started his demise in game. He had 4 more shots but missed them.

Hank had best throw of day to rvz but overall was not much better.
For season vs power 4 comp.hecks numbers are better than hanks...but like me he thinks kf goes with hank vs wis.
 

doughuddl2_rivals

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Do we agree with Chuck that Heck as a significant “windup” when he throws? Because I keep reading on this board about Heck’s quick release, and about how quickly he gets the ball out. Seems contradictory.

Chuck has also said we need to put in some wildcat plays to take advantage of Heck’s running ability. Despite that running ability having yet to show up in any games.

I love Chuck. He is among the greatest Hawkeye heroes of all-time. But I’m not entirely sure he actually watches the games. He spends most of the time on the podcast simply repeating whatever Kakert just said, then extrapolating on it with a lot of football jargon.

But I do enjoy the podcast.
Heck's rushing stats from his 3 years...
11 yds in 3 attempts


😆 🤣 😂 😹
 
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Garzatough85

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Dec 28, 2022
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I don't think that's true. Just need someone that's comfortable in the system and isn't afraid to pass the ball downfield. IF Tradon Bessinger sticks around, he might be that guy.
If Chuck analyzed Bess mechanics from the warm ups we saw he’d see similar flaws to Heck release point.
why isn’t someone coaching mechanics with these guys?!?
 

uihawk82

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I read Leistikow's analysis of the qb play at minny that used pro football focus #s.

Good breakdown.
Hecks interception near goal in 1st qtr started his demise in game. He had 4 more shots but missed them.

Hank had best throw of day to rvz but overall was not much better.
For season vs power 4 comp.hecks numbers are better than hanks...but like me he thinks kf goes with hank vs wis.
I think when Heck nearly threw the INT at the Minny goalline when we were in FGoal range and only down 3-0 was the negative for Lester and Kirk. That was a 30 yard throw to a guy who was covered and there was a safety standing right there who hand an INT then dropped it. That was a bad read, he made a bad read on his INT and missed Diaz for 2 TDs. He probably didnt get graded very well for those throws
 
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Hurricane88

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How that work out for Jake Christenson in 2005? Wasn't he supposed to be a top ten guy who showed out at the elite 11th camps?
Despite going 6-6 the only season he was the main starter, he had better numbers than most. Ricky Stanzi and Drew Tate were hard competition to beat out and are definitely some of the best QB's KF has had in his tenure.


Team Record: 6–6
Stats: 198/370, 2,269 Yds, 17 TD, 6 INT
 

UIAlumFireFighter

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He is the best QB Kirk has had in 20 years.
And yet he can't get into the game when QB1 and QB2 absolutely stink it up. Yikes.

Iowa has sh*t for quarterback development skills so if he's not ready to take some snaps now, I have my doubts.

And don't give us any "I trust the coaches" word vomit either. They have proven time and again to recruit and play awful QB's
 

Hurricane88

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And yet he can't get into the game when QB1 and QB2 absolutely stink it up. Yikes.

Iowa has sh*t for quarterback development skills so if he's not ready to take snaps now, I have my doubts.
He is a True Freshman and hasn't travelled with the team until last game. He came in late and didn't have time to learn the system. If you know football, you would know the Shanahan system isn't easy to learn, for anyone.
 
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UIAlumFireFighter

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He is a True Freshman and hasn't travelled with the team until last game. He came in late and didn't have time to learn the system. If you know football, you would know the Shanahan system isn't easy to learn, for anyone.
I just absolutely love it: Our offense was already bottom of the barrel and we brought in an OC that runs a system that, according to you, "isn't easy to learn, for anyone."

Laughable. But, apparently that's what Iowa does - make things for the Offense extremely challenging.

And I don't care if he's a true freshman. True freshman can play college football too - Even at the quarterback position! I've heard of that happening before.
 
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83Hawk

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I just absolutely love it: Our offense was already bottom of the barrel and we brought in an OC that runs a system that, according to you, "isn't easy to learn, for anyone."

Laughable. But, apparently that's what Iowa does - make things for the Offense extremely challenging.
I have wondered why Iowa’s offense has been complicated for years, now.
 
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Jonesy5960

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Despite going 6-6 the only season he was the main starter, he had better numbers than most. Ricky Stanzi and Drew Tate were hard competition to beat out and are definitely some of the best QB's KF has had in his tenure.


Team Record: 6–6
Stats: 198/370, 2,269 Yds, 17 TD, 6 INT
Jake was facking terrible.
 

Grayhair1981

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Do we agree with Chuck that Heck as a significant “windup” when he throws? Because I keep reading on this board about Heck’s quick release, and about how quickly he gets the ball out. Seems contradictory.

Chuck has also said we need to put in some wildcat plays to take advantage of Heck’s running ability. Despite that running ability having yet to show up in any games.

I love Chuck. He is among the greatest Hawkeye heroes of all-time. But I’m not entirely sure he actually watches the games. He spends most of the time on the podcast simply repeating whatever Kakert just said, then extrapolating on it with a lot of football jargon.

But I do enjoy the podcast.
Heck absolutely has a bizarre wind-up and so does Hank
 
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