80 years ago today... The big BOOM that changed the world

[EricStratton-RushChairman]

I've always loved the trivia question "what was name of first atomic bomb ever detonated?". Answer of course is, "gadget".

My wife's father worked on The Manhattan Project in Oakridge. He was in his early 20s and a newly degreed chemical engineer with his MS from MIT. My wife told me he didn't know what he was working on until after Hiroshima and was always highly conflicted about his work.

I think one could make a case that the development of atomic/nuclear weapons has actually saved lives as thus far countries no longer fight all out war. Last 80 years have seen only limited and/or proxy wars.

 

[LionJim]

A very fine and important read is “The Making of the Atomic Bomb,” by Richard Rhodes. Tells the complete story. It’s one of the two books I regularly gift. Highly recommended.

The opening paragraph describes how Leo Szilard became the first to realize how a nuclear chain reaction could work: (The “death into the world and all our woe” is from “Paradise Lost.”)

In London, where Southampton Row passes Russell Square, across from the British Museum in Bloomsbury, Leo Szilard waited one gray Depression morning for the stoplight to change. A trace of rain had fallen during the night; Tuesday, September 12, 1933, dawned cool, humid, and dull. Drizzling rain would begin again in early afternoon. When Szilard told the story later he never mentioned his destination that morning. He may have had none; he often walked to think. In any case another destination intervened. The stoplight changed to green. Szilard stepped off the curb. As he crossed the street time cracked open before him and he saw a way to the future, death into the world and all our woe, the shape of things to come.

 

[EricStratton-RushChairman]

A very fine and important read is “The Making of the Atomic Bomb,” by Richard Rhodes. Tells the complete story. It’s one of the two books I regularly gift. Highly recommended.

The opening paragraph describes how Leo Szilard became the first to realize how a nuclear chain reaction could work: (The “death into the world and all our woe” is from “Paradise Lost.”)

In London, where Southampton Row passes Russell Square, across from the British Museum in Bloomsbury, Leo Szilard waited one gray Depression morning for the stoplight to change. A trace of rain had fallen during the night; Tuesday, September 12, 1933, dawned cool, humid, and dull. Drizzling rain would begin again in early afternoon. When Szilard told the story later he never mentioned his destination that morning. He may have had none; he often walked to think. In any case another destination intervened. The stoplight changed to green. Szilard stepped off the curb. As he crossed the street time cracked open before him and he saw a way to the future, death into the world and all our woe, the shape of things to come.

For sure I need to put this on my list.

 

[BobPSU92]

A very fine and important read is “The Making of the Atomic Bomb,” by Richard Rhodes. Tells the complete story. It’s one of the two books I regularly gift. Highly recommended.

The opening paragraph describes how Leo Szilard became the first to realize how a nuclear chain reaction could work: (The “death into the world and all our woe” is from “Paradise Lost.”)

In London, where Southampton Row passes Russell Square, across from the British Museum in Bloomsbury, Leo Szilard waited one gray Depression morning for the stoplight to change. A trace of rain had fallen during the night; Tuesday, September 12, 1933, dawned cool, humid, and dull. Drizzling rain would begin again in early afternoon. When Szilard told the story later he never mentioned his destination that morning. He may have had none; he often walked to think. In any case another destination intervened. The stoplight changed to green. Szilard stepped off the curb. As he crossed the street time cracked open before him and he saw a way to the future, death into the world and all our woe, the shape of things to come.

He contributes this, and oh by the way, he’s a mathematician.

 

[LionJim]

He contributes this, and oh by the way, he’s a mathematician.

Yeah, I guess that might be a factor. I mean, the book describes how Rutherford discovered the atomic nucleus, I can completely geek out on that stuff. (It happened by accident, Rutherford’s discovery. They weren’t even looking for it.)

 

[SkiLion2]

A very fine and important read is “The Making of the Atomic Bomb,” by Richard Rhodes. Tells the complete story. It’s one of the two books I regularly gift. Highly recommended.

The opening paragraph describes how Leo Szilard became the first to realize how a nuclear chain reaction could work: (The “death into the world and all our woe” is from “Paradise Lost.”)

In London, where Southampton Row passes Russell Square, across from the British Museum in Bloomsbury, Leo Szilard waited one gray Depression morning for the stoplight to change. A trace of rain had fallen during the night; Tuesday, September 12, 1933, dawned cool, humid, and dull. Drizzling rain would begin again in early afternoon. When Szilard told the story later he never mentioned his destination that morning. He may have had none; he often walked to think. In any case another destination intervened. The stoplight changed to green. Szilard stepped off the curb. As he crossed the street time cracked open before him and he saw a way to the future, death into the world and all our woe, the shape of things to come.

Agreed - this a great book/read - it does get into the science maybe a bit too much but a great look at the project.

 

[LionJim]

Agreed - this a great book/read - it does get into the science maybe a bit too much but a great look at the project.

And it humanizes the scientists in a way I really do appreciate.

Lol, on the morning of the Trinity shot there was a male-female connection that wouldn’t fit together and people were losing their minds. It fit back in the lab, WTF is going on???? I won’t ruin the story. It’s just another “of course this is what happened” bit.

Now off to the gym, ffs!

 

[SkiLion2]

And it humanizes the scientists in a way I really do appreciate.

Lol, on the morning of the Trinity shot there was a male-female connection that wouldn’t fit together and people were losing their minds. It fit back in the lab, WTF is going on???? I won’t ruin the story. It’s just another “of course this is what happened” bit.

Now off to the gym, ffs!

I actually may have picked up this book because of your recommendation - there was a thread on this site a while back that was about books people were reading or have read - I think that is where I first heard of this book - if I did read this because of you - I want to say thank you - it was well worth the time invested to read! Enjoy your workout.

 

[ApexLion]

Rewatched Oppenheimer again. I notice small details each time I watch it. The Trinity site is open one weekend per year btw. Too much radiation.

 

[manatree]

A very fine and important read is “The Making of the Atomic Bomb,” by Richard Rhodes. Tells the complete story. It’s one of the two books I regularly gift. Highly recommended.

What is the other book?

 

[LionJim]

What is the other book?

“Straight Man” by Richard Russo. Funniest novel ever.

 

[manatree]

“Straight Man” by Richard Russo. Funniest novel ever.

For me, two are:

The Sushi Economy by Sasha Issenberg: If I had read this book before my GenEd Econ class, I would have actually learned about economics. It does a great job at explaining the global sushi economy from sea to plate. Accessible & informative.

Between the Bridge and the River by Craig Ferguson: A great satire about life, religion, the news & entertainment industries, and ultimatel, redemption.

 

[ThePennsyOracle]

And it humanizes the scientists in a way I really do appreciate.

Lol, on the morning of the Trinity shot there was a male-female connection that wouldn’t fit together and people were losing their minds. It fit back in the lab, WTF is going on???? I won’t ruin the story. It’s just another “of course this is what happened” bit.

Now off to the gym, ffs!

You recommended a great book. It's hard for today's society to imagine that the people working on the Manhattan Project were people and not characters in movies. A lot of people alive today cannot comprehend the scale of the war effort at all, not to mention how every facet of society was oriented towards the war effort.

 

[MtNittany]

FAFO Japan.

 

[MtNittany]

When I first moved to FL I worked w/ a WW2 Vet (starter/ranger) at PGA National. At the time there were Japanese tourists everywhere. One comes up to Bob and asks directions to the range and got "You people didn't have any problem finding Pearl Harbor. You can find the damn driving range." as a response. I still chuckle.

 

[EricStratton-RushChairman]

I may have posted this before but here is certificate presented to my wife's father. Note the date....

 

[scocha409]

Just finished American Prometheus: Oppenheimer. So this book sounds like a great follow-up...

 

[olelion]

A very fine and important read is “The Making of the Atomic Bomb,” by Richard Rhodes. Tells the complete story. It’s one of the two books I regularly gift. Highly recommended.

The opening paragraph describes how Leo Szilard became the first to realize how a nuclear chain reaction could work: (The “death into the world and all our woe” is from “Paradise Lost.”)

In London, where Southampton Row passes Russell Square, across from the British Museum in Bloomsbury, Leo Szilard waited one gray Depression morning for the stoplight to change. A trace of rain had fallen during the night; Tuesday, September 12, 1933, dawned cool, humid, and dull. Drizzling rain would begin again in early afternoon. When Szilard told the story later he never mentioned his destination that morning. He may have had none; he often walked to think. In any case another destination intervened. The stoplight changed to green. Szilard stepped off the curb. As he crossed the street time cracked open before him and he saw a way to the future, death into the world and all our woe, the shape of things to come.

Another one is

I've always loved the trivia question "what was name of first atomic bomb ever detonated?". Answer of course is, "gadget".

My wife's father worked on The Manhattan Project in Oakridge. He was in his early 20s and a newly degreed chemical engineer with his MS from MIT. My wife told me he didn't know what he was working on until after Hiroshima and was always highly conflicted about his work.

I think one could make a case that the development of atomic/nuclear weapons has actually saved lives as thus far countries no longer fight all out war. Last 80 years have seen only limited and/or proxy wars.

I just reread a kindle Single book titled, "The Target Committee". It is marked Top Secret, Top Secret and lists the book as meeting number two of the target committee. The interesting part to me was the discussion of the joint chiefs regarding casualties in the event of an invasion. The numbers they put forth are nowhere near the numbers presented post war on the casualties averted by the atomic bombs. They are much lower

 

[LionJim]

Another one is

I just reread a kindle Single book titled, "The Target Committee". It is marked Top Secret, Top Secret and lists the book as meeting number two of the target committee. The interesting part to me was the discussion of the joint chiefs regarding casualties in the event of an invasion. The numbers they put forth are nowhere near the numbers presented post war on the casualties averted by the atomic bombs. They are much lower

Oh, that’s easy to believe. The Japanese soldiers would have held out to the bitter end, last man standing. Post-Nagasaki, the Japanese military attempted a last-stand coup against Hirohito, which easily could have succeeded.

Kyūjō incident - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

 

[LionJim]

Just saying that the scientific and technical portions of “Oppenheimer” are well done and can be take at historical face value.

 

[EricStratton-RushChairman]

Oh, that’s easy to believe. The Japanese soldiers would have held out to the bitter end, last man standing. Post-Nagasaki, the Japanese military attempted a last-stand coup against Hirohito, which easily could have succeeded.

Kyūjō incident - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

This book was written in 1945-46 to help guide to US government with post war management of Japan. Fascinating read on culture of Japan...

 

[bbrown]

I've always loved the trivia question "what was name of first atomic bomb ever detonated?". Answer of course is, "gadget".

My wife's father worked on The Manhattan Project in Oakridge. He was in his early 20s and a newly degreed chemical engineer with his MS from MIT. My wife told me he didn't know what he was working on until after Hiroshima and was always highly conflicted about his work.

I think one could make a case that the development of atomic/nuclear weapons has actually saved lives as thus far countries no longer fight all out war. Last 80 years have seen only limited and/or proxy wars.

This is on my to do list this October.
https://www.spacehalloffame.org/trinity-site-tour-reservation/

 

[bbrown]

Rewatched Oppenheimer again. I notice small details each time I watch it. The Trinity site is open one weekend per year btw. Too much radiation.

https://www.spacehalloffame.org/trinity-site-tour-reservation/

 

[RochLion]

I've always loved the trivia question "what was name of first atomic bomb ever detonated?". Answer of course is, "gadget".

My wife's father worked on The Manhattan Project in Oakridge. He was in his early 20s and a newly degreed chemical engineer with his MS from MIT. My wife told me he didn't know what he was working on until after Hiroshima and was always highly conflicted about his work.

I think one could make a case that the development of atomic/nuclear weapons has actually saved lives as thus far countries no longer fight all out war. Last 80 years have seen only limited and/or proxy wars.

Visited Knoxville TN a few years ago and one of the places we went to was the K-25 plant History Center museum in Oak Ridge. Wow, well worth it! Highly recommend it. Place was dead and the woman at the desk was very cordial and informative about the years of the other "Happy Valley".

 

[throw2oj]

Rewatched Oppenheimer again. I notice small details each time I watch it. The Trinity site is open one weekend per year btw. Too much radiation.

Trinity used to be open twice, first Saturday in April and first in October. Is that no longer the case? It's significantly far into the middle of White Sands Missile range, so that's the reason for limited access. The radiation is not an issue:

wiki: The amount of radioactive exposure received during a one-hour visit to the site is about half of the total radiation exposure which a U.S. adult receives on an average day from natural and medical sources

I think I saw trinitite for sale in one of the shops outside the base boundary (the glass that was created from the sand when the gadget was detoned). It was marketed as jewelry at one point it seems.

 

[ApexLion]

Trinity used to be open twice, first Saturday in April and first in October. Is that no longer the case? It's significantly far into the middle of White Sands Missile range, so that's the reason for limited access. The radiation is not an issue:

wiki: The amount of radioactive exposure received during a one-hour visit to the site is about half of the total radiation exposure which a U.S. adult receives on an average day from natural and medical sources

I think I saw trinitite for sale in one of the shops outside the base boundary (the glass that was created from the sand when the gadget was detoned). It was marketed as jewelry at one point it seems.

When Oppenheimer came out, there was a massive surge in interest. In an article about the movie and the area, the author said he was told that the area cannot be fully opened as an every day park because frankly it's not a safe area. That author could be wrong and I have in fact read articles saying its safe.

From one of the web sites on getting a pass:

Trinity site will now only be open to the public on the third Saturday in October.​

We are building a house outside of Albuquerque, so I plan to go back down there soon.

 

[Steve JG]

Visited Knoxville TN a few years ago and one of the places we went to was the K-25 plant History Center museum in Oak Ridge. Wow, well worth it! Highly recommend it. Place was dead and the woman at the desk was very cordial and informative about the years of the other "Happy Valley".

another interesting place to visit is the national Atomic Testing Museum in Las Vegas. Was in Vegas a few years ago to see Dead and Co and we had time to kill not wanting to spend all day on casino floor so we went there. Was pretty darn interesting and entertaining. The hotels used to have roof top viewing parties for above ground tests in the 50's!!

 

[EricStratton-RushChairman]

another interesting place to visit is the national Atomic Testing Museum in Las Vegas. Was in Vegas a few years ago to see Dead and Co and we had time to kill not wanting to spend all day on casino floor so we went there. Was pretty darn interesting and entertaining. The hotels used to have roof top viewing parties for above ground tests in the 50's!!

Kind of an interesting range there... The Grateful Dead and atomic weapons

 

[SkiLion2]

Kind of an interesting range there... The Grateful Dead and atomic weapons

Not if you are drinking the kool aid

 

[Woodpecker]

The radiation is not an issue:

wiki: The amount of radioactive exposure received during a one-hour visit to the site is about half of the total radiation exposure which a U.S. adult receives on an average day from natural and medical sources

When Oppenheimer came out, there was a massive surge in interest. In an article about the movie and the area, the author said he was told that the area cannot be fully opened as an every day park because frankly it's not a safe area. That author could be wrong and I have in fact read articles saying its safe.

The radiation levels might not be problematic to visitors but, if it was open year-round, the rangers/guides might get unhealthy exposure

 

[Steve JG]

Kind of an interesting range there... The Grateful Dead and atomic weapons

I absolutely detest Las Vegas and so was looking for something that was 1) not gambling/ casino oriented and 2) indoors and air conditioned. And some of the pictures were amazing of these swank 1950s roof top parties while mushroom cloud just off in the distance. But had a lot of interesting technical information.

 

[PSU89er]

From the wikipedia page of the 1956 film "The Conqueror" filmed in St. George Utah

The Conqueror (1956 film) - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Dr. Robert Pendleton, then a professor of biology at the University of Utah, is reported to have stated in 1980, "With these numbers, this case could qualify as an epidemic. The connection between fallout radiation and cancer in individual cases has been practically impossible to prove conclusively. But in a group this size you'd expect only 30-some cancers to develop. With 91 cancer cases, I think the tie-in to their exposure on the set of The Conqueror would hold up in a court of law." Several cast and crew members, as well as relatives of those who died, considered suing the government for negligence, claiming it knew more about the hazards in the area than it let on.

 

[LionJim]

The radiation levels might not be problematic to visitors but, if it was open year-round, the rangers/guides might get unhealthy exposure

Ah.

 

[bbrown]

When Oppenheimer came out, there was a massive surge in interest. In an article about the movie and the area, the author said he was told that the area cannot be fully opened as an every day park because frankly it's not a safe area. That author could be wrong and I have in fact read articles saying its safe.

From one of the web sites on getting a pass:

Trinity site will now only be open to the public on the third Saturday in October.​

We are building a house outside of Albuquerque, so I plan to go back down there soon.

I am in Las Cruces and it’s on my to do list this fall. I think the site is pretty far into the white sands missile range.

 

[Tgar]

Semi Unrelated, we watched Dr. Strangelove last night ( or, How I learned to Stop Worrying and Love the Bomb ). . The ability of Kubrick to present the serious and absurd regarding this reality simultaneously is incredible.

 

[ApexLion]

I am in Las Cruces and it’s on my to do list this fall. I think the site is pretty far into the white sands missile range.

Kids love it at White Sands - bring your sled. Plus, there is a Caliche's not too far from there so that may be a draw for them as well.

 

[bbrown]

Kids love it at White Sands - bring your sled. Plus, there is a Caliche's not too far from there so that may be a draw for them as well.

I have a sled and have done the dunes, once. It's not that fun trying to walk up those things. There are at least 2 Caliche's within 10 miles from me. It's pretty tasty stuff.
Currently I'm hanging in Truth or Consequences and "Taking the Waters".

 

[bbrown]

Kids love it at White Sands - bring your sled. Plus, there is a Caliche's not too far from there so that may be a draw for them as well.

I've done the Sunset hike, at White Sands, every time someone comes to visit and it never fails to impress. They also do a full moon hike that I want to try but it's tough getting tickets. There is/was talk of them adding a Night Time Astro photography tour that I would definitely be down with if and when they start it. But that talk was before a lot of the funding cuts so I don't know where that stands now.

 

[olelion]

Trinity used to be open twice, first Saturday in April and first in October. Is that no longer the case? It's significantly far into the middle of White Sands Missile range, so that's the reason for limited access. The radiation is not an issue:

wiki: The amount of radioactive exposure received during a one-hour visit to the site is about half of the total radiation exposure which a U.S. adult receives on an average day from natural and medical sources

I think I saw trinitite for sale in one of the shops outside the base boundary (the glass that was created from the sand when the gadget was detoned). It was marketed as jewelry at one point it seems.

The fact is the amount of "safe" exposure to radiation is unknown. The wiki citing never mentions elevation. People living at high elevations are exposed to a hell of a lot more radiation that gets through unfiltered. But the big thing is this. Being exposed to low levels of radiation or no radiation for that matter is good. Exposure to high levels is bad and there are data to support that , be it the victims of the bombings as well as those exposed in major nuclear accidents. Now, the government has taken these data and made a political finding called "Linear, non threshold". It's a straight line that basically says any exposure to any level of radiation is harmful. Many a health physicist have claimed that some radiation may in fact be helpful, such as hot springs some of which are heated by radioactive sources. Their feeling is that there is a zone where radiation is not harmful and perhaps beneficial at low levels between zero and what are known to be dangerous levels.

 

[slwlion01]

I've always loved the trivia question "what was name of first atomic bomb ever detonated?". Answer of course is, "gadget".

My wife's father worked on The Manhattan Project in Oakridge. He was in his early 20s and a newly degreed chemical engineer with his MS from MIT. My wife told me he didn't know what he was working on until after Hiroshima and was always highly conflicted about his work.

I think one could make a case that the development of atomic/nuclear weapons has actually saved lives as thus far countries no longer fight all out war. Last 80 years have seen only limited and/or proxy wars.

Soooo that's what I heard when I was 5 years old. Now you tell me.