A Likely Concern of Government I Haven’t Heard Mentioned

[The-Hack]

The average age of American farmers is 57. That age is at or near the tipping point of significant problems/mortality for the illness.

We may see/hear of special actions or exemptions for those engaged in Ag, as a 30 percent reduction in our Ag output would not kill America (we will keep all food we need) but would kill a lot of people in food importing places.

Expect a reduction in ethanol production, if there is any problem with the planting grains in the next 90 days.

 

[Bill Derington]

The average age of American farmers is 57. That age is at or near the tipping point of significant problems/mortality for the illness.

We may see/hear of special actions or exemptions for those engaged in Ag, as a 30 percent reduction in our Ag output would not kill America (we will keep all food we need) but would kill a lot of people in food importing places.

Expect a reduction in ethanol production, if there is any problem with the planting grains in the next 90 days.

You’re mixing farmer with farm worker. There’s a distinct difference.

 

[The-Hack]

You’re mixing farmer with farm worker. There’s a distinct difference.

I’ve farmed for my 57 years. I know the difference. Farm workers East of the Mississippi mirror farm owners in age, though not economic status.

I happen to be the exact median age, and have farm workers, partners and tenants into their 80’s.

Depending on circumstances, we may do a large public garden project in fields next to public highways.

 

[Bill Derington]

I’ve farmed for my 57 years. I know the difference. Farm workers East of the Mississippi mirror farm owners in age, though not economic status.

I happen to be the exact median age, and have farm workers, partners and tenants into their 80’s.

Depending on circumstances, we may do a large public garden project in fields next to public highways.

The guys doing the plowing, planting and harvesting of large corn fields aren’t an average age of 57.

 

[The-Hack]

The guys doing the plowing, planting and harvesting of large corn fields aren’t an average age of 57.

Please post a link. I am not aware of a study of the average age of farm labor.

 

[Punkin Puss]

The average age of American farmers is 57. That age is at or near the tipping point of significant problems/mortality for the illness.

We may see/hear of special actions or exemptions for those engaged in Ag, as a 30 percent reduction in our Ag output would not kill America (we will keep all food we need) but would kill a lot of people in food importing places.

Expect a reduction in ethanol production, if there is any problem with the planting grains in the next 90 days.

Today's farmers are beholding to agri-companies like Monsanto, Deere and their lawyers.
You have seeds that are trademarked and you can't save to replant as they did in the past.

Interesting story here about Deere.


Throw the world's largest pork producer is owned by the Chinese. No pork on the grocery shelves, cause it's been sent overseas.
https://www.rollingstone.com/politi...th-carolina-like-the-developing-world-122892/

 

[Bill Derington]

Please post a link. I am not aware of a study of the average age of farm labor.

https://www.ers.usda.gov/amber-waves/2019/may/us-hired-farm-workforce-is-aging/

I believe it says the average age is 38.8, US born is younger than that.

The problem with your assertion, and even my link is it doesn’t differentiate between type of farmer or worker. It lumps them all together.

 

[The-Hack]

The problem with your assertion, and even my link is it doesn’t differentiate between type of farmer or worker. It lumps them all together.

I can’t find them split out, either. I have lots of experience in general farming in the South East, and some experience in the Midwest; the farm laborers I’ve personally worked with have trended into the late middle-ages.

We’ve all seen films of West Coast truck (vegetable/produce) farms where young Hispanics labor. I assume their ages would drag the average down.

I have a gent cutting timber, now. He’s 82, and his younger partner just quit . . . he was 70.

Let’s just say this: we really, really don’t want farming effected: Wal Mart will be no salvation to a reduction in the actual production of food.

 

[LineSkiCat14]

That's kind of troubling to hear that the average age of farmers is that high. Pretty sure the average age of IT Professional is like 32.

 

[TurnipDaBeet]

Might i suggest: Ask Turnip

 

[Punkin Puss]

Might i suggest: Ask Turnip

Raw or cooked?

 

[UKnCincy_rivals]

I’ve farmed for my 57 years. I know the difference. Farm workers East of the Mississippi mirror farm owners in age, though not economic status.

I happen to be the exact median age, and have farm workers, partners and tenants into their 80’s.

Depending on circumstances, we may do a large public garden project in fields next to public highways.

Thank you for the work that you do. My grandfather and uncle both raised cattle, so I know how hard you guys in agriculture work.

Hope you’re able to stay safe since you’re in the rural areas. Alot of people depend on what you do.

 

[TurnipDaBeet]

So... what... yer sayin... is...

Nuke China AND Russia?

 

[Backer cutter]

I am 60 and have farmed my entire life. I’m also my entire work force. Was partners with my dad until he got unable to work a few years ago. I’m down to only beef cattle now, but used to have a dairy, tobacco and beef all. That was back when we could still get workers worth a dime. Nobody wants to work on farms anymore, the work is too hard and farmers can’t afford to compete with the pay those willing to work can get elsewhere. Small farmers are a dying breed.

 

[wildcatsboston1984_rivals]

Maternal great grandparents were farmers and also had a family orchard. Their children (my grandfather and his brothers) worked on the farm/orchard until they retired. Their children (my mother and uncles) worked on the farm until they graduated high school and moved on to better things. That was the last generation of the family to work on the farm. Everyone finally wised up and realized they can work in a different industry for likely more pay (or at worst the same pay) while not having to work nearly as hard and with less health risks.

The farm has since been sold but my grandfather’s brother’s son bought it so it’s still in the family. He manages the behind the scenes parts and the retail operation but doesn’t get out in the fields. He’s in his 50s and the only people that are willing and/or have the skills to do it are Mexicans. Just like most industries, it’s gotten a lot more complex than it was when my mom was working on the farm and orchard as a child in the 50s and 60s. A lot more than just digging holes to plant stuff then picking it once it’s ready to be picked.

He said most of the time if he gets anyone that has a lot of farming skills they will get out as soon as they can and get into a different industry that pays better with a better work environment and work-life balance.

I imagine the operation will die out once this relative of mine retires. It’s not a big enough operation for any corporation to be interested, not once has anyone come in looking to buy it from the family. They only produce crops to run their tiny family store and send some stuff to any mom & pop operations in the small town nearby.

Unfortunately all the property is going to be fall in the hands of me and my cousins when he dies because they still want to keep the operation in the family. Except no one wants to take on the burden of keeping it running, so my cousins and I get the lovely tax burden of having property that’s going to be extremely difficult to sell because it’s in the middle of *ucking nowhere and isn’t suitable for doing anything else on it without putting in a lot of expense to repurpose it. Told them I wanted nothing to do with the property once he dies but alas I still got put in the will for it.

 

[rbs]

For years, the number of farms has slowly declined while the average farm size has increased. In addition, the average age of farmers has slowly increased as well.

There is a similar trend for hunters, where the number of hunters has decreased while the average age has slowly increased.

This is a reflection of the changes in our culture and societal habits as more and more technological advances and the use of those advances have occurred.

One can argue the merits or the lack thereof of these trends ... and there are a lot of societal issues therein.

 

[Rebelfreedomeagle]

The only bright spots I see are it seems more people are willing to pay more for local so the farmer's markets are doing pretty well. I have a friend that raises sheep without antibiotics and he has actually accumulated a nice list of customers who will buy whole lambs.

I really feel for farmers still going. The ones I know get nothing from the farm bill.

 

[UKGrad93]

We all hope the farmers get a bailout. Ford needs to sell F350s.

 

[The-Hack]

I picked mustard greens, today in one of our old tobacco patches. Wild mustard is really coming on, and is a very mild green.

 

[Punkin Puss]

I picked mustard greens, today in one of our old tobacco patches. Wild mustard is really coming on, and is a very mild green.

You can come over a pick all the wild onions you want out my yard for wilted greens.

 

[TurnipDaBeet]

SWAMP

 

[KopiKat]

Please post a link. I am not aware of a study of the average age of farm labor.

A farm worker is a farmer, which is precisely why you just invalidated your initial post. Electrical workers are electricians. Not just the men who own the businesses who install electrical parts. There is no recognized industrial "standard" for the job title "farmer". If a man grows tomatoes in his back yard and sells them on the side of the road: farmer, tomato wholesaler.

 

[Backer cutter]

A man grows tomatoes in his backyard is a farmer. Ok, if you say so.lol.

 

[The-Hack]

There is no recognized industrial "standard" for the job title "farmer".

OK, if it’s just guesswork, let me compare credentials with you to see who’s guesswork might be valid.

My family has farmed in Central Kentucky since April 12, 1816. We sit on 736 acres, primarily engaged in beef cattle production, today.

Along with farming, my Dad established an Agri-business in 1967, selling silos and farm equipment, which frequently through the decades required travel north, and brought us into contact with mid-western farmers and Agri-business (almost all silo companies and unloader companies were upper-Midwest).

I am a lifelong member of Farm Bureau, was a local and regional officer in the FFA, my father was recognized as our county’s Farmer of the Year in 2005, and he served on the Farm Bureau Board for more than 40 years.

With his death in 2008, I oversaw our transition from a tobacco and beef, to beef, and have attended over a thousand cattle auctions from London and Somerset to Glasgow and Owenton.

I know farmers. With less than 1 percent still calling it a profession, you’d be surprised by the closeness of the industry across state lines and regions. A few friends were planning a road trip to Central Nebraska, to see a 78 year old gent who “fattens” cattle for them. He phoned at the last second and advised them not to come . . . their operation went into a lockdown after contact with a positive case of Covid-19.

I am 57. I am a comparative youngster at cattle auctions and equipment sales.

Whether “farm workers” are comparatively younger means little. The old heads run the industry, carry the debts, make the business decisions, and tell the workers what, where, and when to plant, cultivate and harvest. Yes, some young workers are ready to fill those roles, but we’d be fools to suggest all are. I’ve known men by the dozens who could drive a tractor, dig a post hole, and follow directions to a “T” who could barely write their name.

 

[KopiKat]

OK, if it’s just guesswork, let me compare credentials with you to see who’s guesswork might be valid.

My family has farmed in Central Kentucky since April 12, 1816. We sit on 736 acres, primarily engaged in beef cattle production, today.

Along with farming, my Dad established an Agri-business in 1967, selling silos and farm equipment, which frequently through the decades required travel north, and brought us into contact with mid-western farmers and Agri-business (almost all silo companies and unloader companies were upper-Midwest).

I am a lifelong member of Farm Bureau, was a local and regional officer in the FFA, my father was recognized as our county’s Farmer of the Year in 2005, and he served on the Farm Bureau Board for more than 40 years.

With his death in 2008, I oversaw our transition from a tobacco and beef, to beef, and have attended over a thousand cattle auctions from London and Somerset to Glasgow and Owenton.

I know farmers. With less than 1 percent still calling it a profession, you’d be surprised by the closeness of the industry across state lines and regions. A few friends were planning a road trip to Central Nebraska, to see a 78 year old gent who “fattens” cattle for them. He phoned at the last second and advised them not to come . . . their operation went into a lockdown after contact with a positive case of Covid-19.

I am 57. I am a comparative youngster at cattle auctions and equipment sales.

Whether “farm workers” are comparatively younger means little. The old heads run the industry, carry the debts, make the business decisions, and tell the workers what, where, and when to plant, cultivate and harvest. Yes, some young workers are ready to fill those roles, but we’d be fools to suggest all are. I’ve known men by the dozens who could drive a tractor, dig a post hole, and follow directions to a “T” who could barely write their name.

Very nice. I'm concerned how in spite of your excellent achievements you've managed to take things so personally. I was merely posting to advocate the theme of a previous response, one which appeared to note your omission of all persons who do the "farming".

And no, nothing about these enterprises does, can or will ever surprise me. I have a long family background in agriculture with interests in Kentucky, Tennessee and Texas. I do not mind conceding that your family has mine beat on recognition awards. Again, very nice.

It should be almost precisely because you are 57 years old that you know precisely why you are at the lower end of the "ownership", farming age curve. fwiw, you and I are very similar ages. We both know full well why there are so many fewer (separately owned) farm operations today than when we came of age. We may both have a difficult time admitting that it would have been better had everything gone into receivership in the 1980s. Instead, the most lucrative bailout in our lifetimes happened. Never was poorer business decisions rewarded more magnificently. It should never have been the taxpayer's burden that so many growers borrowed heavily on the belief that soybeans would remain at $10. And when they could not pay for their land it was given to them on the condition that they pay the tax against the overall amount, but even then it was 10 years deferred. And at the same time, what? A smoke and mirrors welfare program, 65 dollars an acre for 10 years, the EXACT amount of money needed to pay that tax (against $2000 per acre). Fortunes given away for free.

How these programs contributed to the overall combining of ownership, fewer owners, fewer "farmers", fewer new farmers, is very well understood. None of it should have happened.

And now that we're even on diatribes, I'll just add that I know plenty of people who call themselves farmers and the ONLY thing they do is manage CRP . . . a program that was supposed to end in 1998 but did not and why not? Because the majority of those "farmers" who had their loans paid for them by the taxpayer 10 years earlier claimed they did not have the money to pay the tax, that it was unfair to expect that they should, because their land has been tied up in CRP . . . they couldn't farm. So the program that was supposed to be temporary became an entitlement, it continues to this day. Most of those taxes were never paid. Has the taxpayer EVER been ripped off more?

But who got ripped off the most? The people who knew there was no way beans would stay at $10 and did not roll that dice. And the people (farmers) who farmed and worked a full-time public job to pay off their loans so they wouldn't have to take a bail-out. The people who were productive enough that they would have been able to buy more ground for themselves after other farms entered receivership, and after the price of tillable ground recovered from those grossly over-inflated prices.

You are extraordinarily well qualified and should be proud of your family's accomplishments. Thank you for sharing.

 

[The-Hack]

Never was poorer business decisions rewarded more magnificently.

Savings and Loan Bailout . . . . ~~

I’ve told many friends that we Central Kentucky farmers enjoyed an amazing welfare program from 2005 ‘till 2014 with the tobacco buyout.

We’ve had some CRP payments, through 2017, but the were in the $350.00/500.00 range. . . . given the area of bean/corn production in the mid-west, that cost must have swamped the tobacco “buyout.”

I would have felt better about the tobacco “buyout” if they’d said we could no longer raise it whilst accepting the payments.

Instead it was straight welfare, but at least for the working.

I won’t be too surprised if the 2 trillion bailout doesn’t include more farm payments. If wisely administered, it should only be paid to those who owe debt, but not such a debt that they could not have come out, anyway.

And it will not be wisely administered.

Farm policy in this country is largely run out of Iowa. How many Ag chiefs have been from there?

Ethanol production should be halted or slowed until we are assured of a decent planting for 2020, but won’t be.

Iowa wouldn’t stand for it.

Since the 30’s in farm policy and in society, we’ve made some Faustian choices that leave us wondering where else we might have ended . . . and there are few easy answers.

Sorry if I sounded too argumentative, but I’m surrounded by friends and neighbors who farm in their 70’s and 80’s. It will be hard on us all if we lose them in mass.

 

[Blue63Madison]

Please post a link. I am not aware of a study of the average age of farm labor.

I drive by onion fields on a daily basis. There aren't any 57-year old white men out there in the fields. They're all Mexican and all appear to be in the 20-40 age range. The only 57-year old white men out there are driving tractors or monitoring the actual labor. If Covid-19 seriously hits these types of laborers, you can kiss a lot of the farms in the deep south goodbye.

 

[Kooky Kats]

The average age of farmer spiked when they factored Mike Bloomberg into the equation.

 

[shidler25]

I'm 52 and I farm with my Dad who is 78 and our hired hand who is 48. We farm soybeans and corn. I've already told my parents that unless something drastic changes I don't want them out of the house when we are there working as they live on the farm.

I've also made plans to, if we need, stay in our competition BBQ trailer while we are planting to lower risks of bringing it home to our families. Main reason is is our helps wife works at a nursing home and could be at a high risk. We normally run 2 planters and my Dad doesn't work full days just enough for me to spray with our sprayer for part of the day. This season we may just run 1 planter most of the time except when I get far enough ahead spraying to jump back on my planter.

I should have all of my seed and chemical for both pre and post deliver by the end of next week just in case it gets worse. I had plans to get them already this week but the river had the farm cut off at the present time.

If this thing drags into the fall it will be more interesting logistically as you may have trucking companies and elevators effected by the restrictions. I'm planting all soybeans this year now just in case I am forced to store all of my grain. I don't have enough storage if I plant my normal corn acres.

It's caused a lot of sleepless nights and trying to plan ahead and forsee what at this point is impossible to forsee. What will grain prices be? That was already an uncertainty with the trade war. What will prices of fertilize be this fall? There are a lot of unknowns right now. I know every person in our country feels a lot of uncertainty right now as well.

 

[KopiKat]

Savings and Loan Bailout . . . . ~~

I’ve told many friends that we Central Kentucky farmers enjoyed an amazing welfare program from 2005 ‘till 2014 with the tobacco buyout.

We’ve had some CRP payments, through 2017, but the were in the $350.00/500.00 range. . . . given the area of bean/corn production in the mid-west, that cost must have swamped the tobacco “buyout.”

I would have felt better about the tobacco “buyout” if they’d said we could no longer raise it whilst accepting the payments.

Instead it was straight welfare, but at least for the working.

I won’t be too surprised if the 2 trillion bailout doesn’t include more farm payments. If wisely administered, it should only be paid to those who owe debt, but not such a debt that they could not have come out, anyway.

And it will not be wisely administered.

Farm policy in this country is largely run out of Iowa. How many Ag chiefs have been from there?

Ethanol production should be halted or slowed until we are assured of a decent planting for 2020, but won’t be.

Iowa wouldn’t stand for it.

Since the 30’s in farm policy and in society, we’ve made some Faustian choices that leave us wondering where else we might have ended . . . and there are few easy answers.

Sorry if I sounded too argumentative, but I’m surrounded by friends and neighbors who farm in their 70’s and 80’s. It will be hard on us all if we lose them in mass.

Can't disagree with any of that. Had actually thought of how to share a personal saga with you from the S&L crisis. Seems almost ordinary in nature now but was significant to me then (late 20s). S&L is a good example. I can actually remember some comparisons between the S&L and the farm bill bail outs, that one was to protect the lending institutions from the failure of it's people and the other was exactly the opposite. Distinctions can be made but it won't change history nor will it alter any disappointing management going forward.

All birds come home to roost. I suspect you agree with that. The business, the industry, it has been sheltered at every level along the way for ever year of our life. Few exceptions to this rule. I liked the guy who a few years ago said he was going to break his farming operation down into dozens and dozens of "hobby farms", and each year only a third of them need show a profit all the others could lose as much as he needed them to. Why not? It was actually his plan to forgo subsistence farming which, as you understand, makes the farmer the farm worker to the taxpayer. Anyway, he died. Just like you're talking about. Both his daughters moved off long ago. Step children from later marriage doing something with it. All corn last year when I drove past.

 

[The-Hack]

What will prices of fertilize be this fall?

Surely prices will be down with the drop in oil prices?!? Producing Nitrogen is so energy dependent that I think the price has to fall.

 

[The-Hack]

Few exceptions to this rule.

“I made a killing last year by not growing corn. I’ll diversify next year by not growing hogs.”

In the 80’s with the PIK program, my Dad began worrying that the industry was being too heavily supported, especially in grains.

He was 82 when the ethanol requirements were implemented in 2006, correctly guesstimating that devoting 40 percent of our corn (by fiat) to ethanol would be a disaster to cattlemen. He refused to grow more corn to catch the increase in price.

Today, I lease out very mediocre land for commercial corn production that had not produced commercial (as opposed to silage corn) since the 1940’s when the Midwest became so dominant in grains. In other words, the ethanol mandates have converted decent southern grazing pasture for cattle into very mediocre crop land, and the lessee’s get very preferential insurance.

There have been many times I’ve scratched my head wondering if simple market mechanisms wouldn’t do us better.