Captain America: Civil War (Possible Spoilers!)

[Perrin75]

So, we are getting close to the release of what should be one of the better Marvel Universe Films. From the reviews I am reading, it may end up actually being the best of them. So, in addition to starting a discussion about the film I also wanted to get people's thoughts on where the Cap films rank in terms of best trilogies.

I personally think Winter Soldier is the best of the Marvel Universe Movies and First Avenger might be top five. It easily has the potential to be the greatest Super Hero movie trilogy since the only competition is really the Dark Knight and Dark Knight Rises is a drag on that franchise. But I'm wondering how folks think it might stack up against the likes of Star Wars, the Lord of the Rings, Toy Story and Indiana Jones.

 

[UK_Is_Good]

Even if Civil War is great (which I expect it to be), I don't think it will quite be viewed on the level of the other trilogies you mentioned. I think the first Captain America film holds it back. The Dark Knight Rises (not Returns) which you say is a drag on the trilogy (which I disagree with, but I respect your opinion) has a higher critical and audience score than the first Captain America film (although that's not a perfect way to compare films).

Winter Soldier is my favorite Marvel film though and I think Civil War has a legitimate chance to top it. If The First Avenger had been the quality of the first Iron Man, then I think you could make a case.

 

[UKwizard]

Rises isn't bad it just isn't as great as its predecessor. I also didn't like their treatment of Talia.

The early buzz on Civil War is that it is what Batman Superman should have been.

 

[Perrin75]

Thanks for the correction on the film title. I just saw the animated film Dark Knight Returns and it must have stuck in my head. Anyway, the First Avenger is limited by the fact that it is an origin story and because it is restricted by the fact the story is about an established character. But comparing it to the weakest films in the other great trilogies (Temple of Doom, Return of the Jedi, Back to the Future 3, etc.) it stands up pretty well. What we have yet to see is if the series can pull off that very rare thing where the third film is actually the best of the series. If that happens then I think you have to certainly start the argument of GOAT.

 

[UKwizard]

Return of the Jedi is great.

The last trilogy where the 3rd is the best I can think of is Bourne.

 

[UK_Is_Good]

Anyway, the First Avenger is limited by the fact that it is an origin story and because it is restricted by the fact the story is about an established character.

Same is true of Batman Begins and Iron Man, but those are both much better films IMO.

It's also a little different because it seems Civil War is more Avengers 2.5 than Captain America 3. What I wonder is, will this trilogy stand on it's own? Could you just watch those three films and feel you have a complete story or does Civil War require familiarity with the Avengers and Iron Man? I think if this could be seen as a true trilogy that stands on its own is an interesting debate. If the answer is no, that makes it tough to compare.

 

[DaBossIsBack]

Dheepan's US release date is also May 6. Just in case any of you are actually interested in good cinema.

 

[LineSkiCat14]

I don't know what it is about superhero movies, but for as entertaining and well-made as they are, they never seem to hold a candle to The Star Wars, LOTR, Indiana Jones' of yesteryear. Not sure why that is. Is it that they don't have much substance to them? Purely popcorn movies?

The ONLY superhero movie that I'd put on the level of those great trilogies was TDK, and that's it.

 

[KyCatFan_rivals45723]

So what team are you all for? Team Captain or Team Stark? I don't know if this follows the storyline from "in the comics" (that's for you JasonSpear), but i didn't read it and am just guessing about which team is the best. I like the make up of Ironman's team better and if Spiderman is on his side it is a no brainer that his team is the strongest in my opinion.

 

[UK_Is_Good]

So what team are you all for? Team Captain or Team Stark?

I'm Team Good Movie.

 

[jockstrap_mcgee]

The whole Team_____ or Team ________ gained steamed with Twilight. How about we leave that with Twilight. And not mention Twilight again.


Twilight.

 

[UKwizard]

Well Star Wars was so revolutionary that it struck a cord.

Indiana Jones was directed by one of the greatest directors of all time starring one of the most charismatic actors of alltime.

Lord of the Rings is a faithful movie to one of the greatest books ever written.

 

[jockstrap_mcgee]

As much as it's lambasted for beginning the downward spiral into the prequels, Return of the Jedi is still an extremely strong third act. It's definitely flawed, but it cements the most meaningful, and more importantly, profitable, arc of the entire trilogy: Darth Vader's Redemption.

If Darth Vader doesn't end up as Anakin Skywalker burning on a funeral pyre and becoming a blue ghost, then that's a lot of Halloween costumes Lucasfilms never gets to sell because nobody would want to be the pyscopath who kills children and air crucifies underlings. He HAS to end up being redeemed in order for the bad sides of him to be cool, and not just bad.

People crap on the simplicity of the Star Wars trilogy, but the story works so well because it taps into such powerful archetypes.

The new Marvel movies? They're good, but because their themes are much more heavily rooted in current events, I don't think they will age as well as some of the trilogies mentioned in this thread.

 

[-LEK-]

Probably leave and watch the Friday opening.

 

[-LEK-]

Also, love the comparison someone made about superman and captain America being very bland characters, yet Marvel is accelerating in popularity, while DC is sucking **** through a tube.

I believe that's verbatim.

 

[bigblueinsanity_rivals250340]

Also, love the comparison someone made about superman and captain America being very bland characters, yet Marvel is accelerating in popularity, while DC is sucking **** through a tube.

I believe that's verbatim.

Along those same lines, I do find it interesting that Capt America is easily the most boring character, but had the best movies. Cant explain it.

 

[UnfrozenCatfanLawyer]

Evans has done a good job with the character, and the writers have done a good job playing up his strengths (i.e., his decency, his difficulty adjusting to modern times, etc.). Honestly, the more I think about it, the more I think Evans would have made for a perfect Superman.

 

[UK_Is_Good]

Robert Downey Jr. has been added to the cast for Homecoming.

 

[Perrin75]

I don't see Captain America as boring. The whole man out of time aspect of his character is very compelling. Plus he is like Batman in that he is always struggling with the concept of doing the right thing. For Batman, it involves whether or not to kill; while Captain America is struggling against whether or not to follow along with the establishment and do his duty. It makes for some great story-lines and character development, which they have done a great job of so far.

The better comparison for Superman is Thor. How do you make a God more compelling? Which is why the Thor movies are some of the worst of the bunch.

 

[catfan in loserville]

I personally think Winter Soldier is the best of the Marvel Universe Movies and First Avenger might be top five. It easily has the potential to be the greatest Super Hero movie trilogy since the only competition is really the Dark Knight and Dark Knight Rises is a drag on that franchise. But I'm wondering how folks think it might stack up against the likes of Star Wars, the Lord of the Rings, Toy Story and Indiana Jones.

Iron Man, Wolverine, Spider-Man, X Men, (Avengers and Thor will be trilogies by 2018) are all Marvel Super Hero Movie trilogies. Xmen and The Avengers being my favorites, especially with Infinity War coming next year and a new Xmen Apocalypse.

Btw, what are the sides in the civil war?

I know it's Capt America & The Winter Soldier against Iron Man and Patriot, but who else is on each side?

Also, comparable to Star Wars? No, not even close. Honestly give me my fantasy universes in this order...

GoT
Star Wars
Marvel
LOTR, Middle Earth
DC

 

[KyCatFan_rivals45723]

Team Captain America

Hawkeye, Agent 13 (not sure who that is), Captain America, Falcon, Winter Soldier, and Ant Man and Scarlett Witch (who aren't shown, but appear to be on this team).

Team Iron Man

War Machine, Black Widow, Iron Man, Black Panther, Vision, and Spider-Man (who isn't shown, but appears to be on this team).

I believe those are the teams but could be wrong. There might be others I forgot about. Definitely think Iron Man's team looks stronger than Captain America's team.

 

[UKwizard]

Agent 13 is the hot blond who was Cap's neighbor in Winter Soldier. She is Sharon Carter Peggy Carters niece and a love interest for Steve Rogers.

I'm team Iron Man for Black Panther alone. He looks dope.

 

[Free_Salato_Blue]

Sharon Carter Agent 13, she was in the control room for the heli-carriers.

 

[KyCatFan_rivals45723]

That's right forgot about her. I guess they wanted to put a non super powered woman on each team.

 

[CatFromDaHood]

Even if Civil War is great (which I expect it to be), I don't think it will quite be viewed on the level of the other trilogies you mentioned. I think the first Captain America film holds it back. The Dark Knight Rises (not Returns) which you say is a drag on the trilogy (which I disagree with, but I respect your opinion) has a higher critical and audience score than the first Captain America film (although that's not a perfect way to compare films).

Winter Soldier is my favorite Marvel film though and I think Civil War has a legitimate chance to top it. If The First Avenger had been the quality of the first Iron Man, then I think you could make a case.

Dark Knight Rises has the masturbatory fanboy thing going for it.

We need a Batman vs Wolverine movie so the kids (children and adults) can have all out warfare over it.

 

[UK_Is_Good]

I saw it tonight and really enjoyed it. The fight sequences were great. I really liked Holland and look forward to seeing more of him. The fight with all of the characters including Spidey was my favorite. I'm a fan of the Russo brothers dating back to their work on tv. Amazing how they come from a television comedy background and handle action so well.

I think I'd still rank Winter Soldier (I love the spy thriller element of that fim) and Iron Man (it started off the whole series so well) ahead of Civil War, but I'd put this film third in the MCU.

 

[Captain Forehead]

Just saw the movie tonight. It was frickin awesome. Was worried about so many characters being in it that it would water down the story. Didn't happen.

 

[TruBluCatFan]

Just got back. Fantastic movie! Black Panther and Spidey were great!

Tony Stank! [roll]

 

[Captain Forehead]

Just got back. Fantastic movie! Black Panther and Spidey were great!

Tony Stank! [roll]

To me, that was the biggest surprise. Can't wait to see a new spidey flick with the new guy. Black panther was a stone cold badass.

 

[bradyjames]

Hell, I liked The Dark Knight Rises as much as any super hero movie I have seen the past ten years. What was bad about it?

 

[UKwizard]

It is on deck for this evening. Can't wait.

Meanwhile Agents of SHIELD keeps getting better and better. They just dropped one of their biggest twists yet and then follow that episode up with perhaps the best episode of the entire series.

 

[KyCatFan_rivals45723]

My son and I saw it this morning and enjoyed it. I liked the Black Panther character, but unsure of him in his own movie. Never really followed him "in the comics" and not sure what direction they would go with him. Big fan of Spiderman, but hope they don't reboot it a 3rd time. Just start off with him having powers already and maybe do a flashback to how he became the web slinger instead of retelling it again. I was hoping this would tie into the Thanos storyline in the credits like it has in previous Marvel movies, but I guess the Spiderman and Black Panther movies needed the build up more first.

 

[UKwizard]

Just saw it. Wow. That was amazing but it pained me to see Cap and Ironman splinter so bad.

Black Panther and Spiderman were dope. Marvel gets their hands back on Spiderman he is the wise cracking taunting kid he is in the comics. Outstanding.

I guess it will take an infinity war to put the Avengers back together again.

 

[Saguaro Cat]

GIANT MAN!!!

 

[-BBH-]

Plays more like Avengers 3, but it was a great time. Although I enjoyed Batman V Superman, Marvel continues to lead the way in the genre. Probably my favorite Marvel film since the original Avengers.

Loved the way they used Ant-Man and Spidey. Just perfect execution, funny, action packed with intrigue to spare.

 

[UKwizard]

1) Iron Man
2) Winter Soldier
3) Guardians of the Galaxy
4) Civil War
5) Avengers

Marvel has done exceptionally well when you consider they don't even have access to their best villains.

None of Spiderman's fantastic rogues gallery.
No Magneto and the many X-Men villains
No Dr Doom

Christ to this date the best villain they have had in their movies is friggen Loki who is portrayed exceptionally well but not one of the traditional heavy hitters.

 

[UK_Is_Good]

1) Iron Man
2) Winter Soldier
3) Guardians of the Galaxy
4) Civil War
5) Avengers

Marvel has done exceptionally well when you consider they don't even have access to their best villains.

I'd switch my order a bit and go.

1) Winter Soldier
2) Iron Man
3) Civil War
4) Guardians of the Galaxy
5) Avengers

I agree with you on the villains. Spidey's rogues gallery is my favorite in Marvel.

 

[LadyCaytIL]

saw it and loved it! its up there with Avengers, Winter Soldier, The Dark Knight, and Guardians of the galaxy as my favorite comic book movie.....

 

[Supreme Lord Z]

Saw it opening day with my son and we both enjoyed it. Decent acting thanks to RDJ and at least some passing semblance of a plot. Pretty good for a comic flick.

 

[Big_Blue79]

I thought it was okay, good but nowhere near great. Maybe this is a superhero movie criticism, but there are

Spoiler

no stakes to make me feel invested in the outcome of the "civil war": 2 groups of superheroes fight for ~ 20 minutes and... one guy gets hurt? So who cares? It's got all the oomph of "Boy Fights" but without the comedy. I get that superheroes need to be super, but when everyone's face/body become damn near indestructable without dropping literal buildings on them, then I just don't care if they're punched to oblivion. Superpower inflation is ruining the genre.

Aside from that, though, the general plot line and acting were very good.