Discussion on Gran and Hinshaw

Nov 6, 2015
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What's up BBN? I've been a long time reader here, but never felt the need to throw in my two cents. I feel now is a great time with some big news coming out in the past 24 hours. After doing a good bit of research on both Gran and Hinshaw, it's obvious these two are home run hires and UC will miss them tremendously.

Gran is well respected throughout the country, something that caught my attention from the get go. Recruits and their parents rave about him, similar to the way Marrow has become known as a family-oriented recruiter. Adding another guy like that could never hurt. Coaching wise, the numbers are obviously there. As much as people want to look into the bowl game flop, it wasn't as worrisome as you'd think. The guy was already rumored to be headed to UK and was coaching without his starting QB. So many factors are involved in a situation like this, one game is meaningless in the scheme of things. The guy's offense put up over 500 yards of offense a game, running a balanced attack Stoops likes, and highlights UK's most valuable players.

Under Gran, TEs and RBs thrived, and UK has Conrad and Boom as the leaders in those categories. Dawson rarely used Conrad, whereas Gran will make him a priority in this offense. Obviously a good idea there. According to Freddie Maggard, Gran "has coached nearly 15 SEC and ACC RB's that went on to NFL success." Not bad at all, considering UK has one of the best up-and-coming RBs in America in Boom, along with Jojo Kemp, Mikel Horton, and Siheim King, among the other talented kids coming in. Gran develops players, has a comfortable system that young skill players can ease into, and above all else, puts up unbelievable numbers. With he and Stoops being familiar with one another at FSU, I'd imagine Stoops is much more comfortable to give the reins to Gran and let him control the offense, as opposed to micromanaging like he did with Dawson. Familiarity and trust is quite beneficial in football, especially with a new HC like Stoops. Gran is a hell of a get, one that I didn't expect UK to be in position to snag.

A note on Hinshaw: I read on some of the Cincinnati boards and some of UC's football fan twitter accounts, and they are all terrified of losing this guy. One guy on Twitter under the handle @cinbinbains stated, "If Eddie Gran goes to Kentucky, I'd hope Tuberville promotes Darin Hinshaw faster than Gran can say "I quit"." They love him there, and think he is a future HC somewhere. A ton of potential, players love him, and knows the game. Several schools were interested in offering him an OC job, so if Gran can figure out a way to bring him on board, I'd be ecstatic. Beyond this, he's a QB coach, something that UK needs now more than ever, so it's a match made in heaven. Sign him up at all costs.

The major schools across the country manage to rake in talent and develop said talent through elite position coaches. A head coach and both coordinators help, but the position coaches can't be average guys if you want to develop in the SEC. Stoops would be quite lucky to hire a great OC in Gran, but getting an elite position coach in Hinshaw to follow would be absolutely remarkable.
 
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jauk11

Heisman
Dec 6, 2006
60,631
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Nice post. I'm in total agreement with all of your points.

Agreed, about the only fault I can find with it is the improper use of reigns instead of reins, but those are improperly interchanged so often so often on here I wonder if maybe I am the one wrong about their use, maybe alternative definitions from what I was taught decades ago. Most spelling/typos/grammar mistakes don't bother me, but for some reason that one does.

I hope the OP comes back often, great post.
 
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May 6, 2002
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I have mixed feelings about this hire. I admit I have only watched one Cincinnati game this year and it was the bowl game. I was extremely disappointed in how their offense looked. Most of the plays they ran looked just like what we have been running here and it hasn't worked. I feel like this will just be like adding a bandaid to a wound that needs stitches and after a year or two more we will rip the bandaid off (fire Stoops) and start all over again. I hope I am wrong. I think we would have been better off going after someone to run the Baylor offense.
 
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Snowcats86

Heisman
Dec 17, 2010
5,648
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I have seen some of their games over the last few years and the offense has been fun to watch- their defense not so much. I'm a huge fan of the Gran hire especially is Hinshaw comes with. Gran was my top choice last year. He runs a balanced high powered attack which should translate to our current personel pretty easily. Between his experience especially in the SEC and his reputation as a strong recruiter I think this as home run hire as we could have realistically gotten!
 

frost1

All-Conference
Dec 21, 2001
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Nice Post OP. Home run hire in my opinion Hinshaw coming also, makes it out of the Park..
 

JPFisher

Heisman
Jul 24, 2013
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Backup QB, a vacation in Hawaii, and apparently it's been known for a while that Gran is coming to UK. So many factors that could contribute to a huge lack of focus and production even if Gran was staying there. It's not fair to judge him for the bowl game.

Dawson liked to throw down field. That was his thing before coming to UK and the first few games. Gran will know how to coach a possession offense relying on first downs and not scoring immediately instead of changing his philosophy. Plus, Gran loves his running backs and can hopefully figure out ways to set up the pass.

This is a good hire.
 
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Levibooty

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Jun 29, 2005
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I'll say this about Gran, I don't think Kentucky has ever had a coach with the bowl game experience that Gran has. It is quite impressive. Here is a partial list: 1991 Cotton, 1992 Orange, 1997 Motor City, 2001 Florida Citrus, 2001 Peach, 2003 Capital One, 2003 Music City, 2005 Sugar, 2006 Capital One, 2007 Cotton, 2008 Chick-fil-A, 2009 Chick-fil-A, 2010 Chick-Fil-A, 2011 Citrus, 2012 Orange.
 
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rabidcatfan

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Jan 25, 2003
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I'm happy with the hire of Gran and Hinshaw. I think that the Coach Stoops made the right call here; it is the call he should've made last year, but I think he was looking for someone who ran the air raid to follow Neal Brown and that's where he made his mistake and I think he knew that after a few games.
 

WildCard

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May 29, 2001
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These are excellent hires. Not even I can find anything wrong with them! [roll]

Gran is a respected veteran coach who put together 3 ever improving offenses at Cincy in his first stint as an OC. Hinshaw gives UK a real QB coach on the staff. Realistically, I don't see how UK could have done better. The Bearcats put up some pretty gaudy offensive stats this past season against a schedule that included 7 teams ranked in the top half nationally in Total Defense. Against 5 of those 7 Cincy gained more than what their opponent allowed and on 3 occasions by more than 200 yards! On the year, only #4 SDSU, #33 BYU and #58 USF held Cincy under their 530 YPG average. IOW, this offense was gettin' it done against some pretty decent defenses.

As a football fan who believes Cincy (#47 nationally in all time wins with 599) deserves a seat at the P5 table the only downside to these hires is it deals a staggering blow to their program.

Peace
 

RV

Heisman
Jun 26, 2005
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I'm happy with the hire of Gran and Hinshaw. I think that the Coach Stoops made the right call here; it is the call he should've made last year, but I think he was looking for someone who ran the air raid to follow Neal Brown and that's where he made his mistake and I think he knew that after a few games.

Sorry, and this is not exclusively pointed at the quoted post but this has been repeated here and elsewhere ad nauseum.

THERE WAS NO OPENING AT RB COACH OR WR COACH LAST YEAR. THEREFORE GRAN WAS NOT A FIT AT THAT TIME.
 

djtackett2000

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Mar 8, 2006
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Sorry, and this is not exclusively pointed at the quoted post but this has been repeated here and elsewhere ad nauseum.

THERE WAS NO OPENING AT RB COACH OR WR COACH LAST YEAR. THEREFORE GRAN WAS NOT A FIT AT THAT TIME.

I've seen you post this so many times and I get what you are saying..BUT (theres the but) he is the Head Coach, if he wanted him, he could have made room last year. Tough decisions have to be made some times.

Either way, he is here now and I think everyone needs to support these coaches. These were great hires for the program IMO
 

vhcat70

Heisman
Feb 5, 2003
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I have mixed feelings about this hire. I admit I have only watched one Cincinnati game this year and it was the bowl game. I was extremely disappointed in how their offense looked.
Drawing a long-term decision on one event, & that event known to be compromised, is a terrible way to decide anything.
 

RackOps

Senior
Sep 13, 2006
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I have mixed feelings about this hire. I admit I have only watched one Cincinnati game this year and it was the bowl game. I was extremely disappointed in how their offense looked. Most of the plays they ran looked just like what we have been running here and it hasn't worked. I feel like this will just be like adding a bandaid to a wound that needs stitches and after a year or two more we will rip the bandaid off (fire Stoops) and start all over again. I hope I am wrong. I think we would have been better off going after someone to run the Baylor offense.

So you are going to throw away everything that Gran accomplished over this season and his career based on the result of one game?

Wow.
 
May 6, 2002
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I saw what I needed. The plays looked basically the same as ours. Cincy is probably more talented than most of their opponents in that conference. They had to play a young quarterback who had plenty of playing time this year and didn't just get thrown into the fire like Barker did. He will again have a young quarterback to deal with and will play against much better and more talented teams. I just don't think he will be successful here doing the same thing he did at Cincy. I hope he succeeds and proves me wrong, but I think this is just something that will take the heat off Stoops for a short time before he is inevitably fired..
 

Beatle Bum

Heisman
Sep 1, 2002
39,861
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I saw what I needed. The plays looked basically the same as ours. Cincy is probably more talented than most of their opponents in that conference. They had to play a young quarterback who had plenty of playing time this year and didn't just get thrown into the fire like Barker did. He will again have a young quarterback to deal with and will play against much better and more talented teams. I just don't think he will be successful here doing the same thing he did at Cincy. I hope he succeeds and proves me wrong, but I think this is just something that will take the heat off Stoops for a short time before he is inevitably fired..

Cincy more talented? Do you follow football? Memphis, Houston, Navy - come now. The AAC was better than the ACC.

I wonder how many Oregon fans poo-pooed Chil Kelly when he was hired as OC by Belloti. "Uh, that is not division 1 football!!!!"
 
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Nov 6, 2015
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These are excellent hires. Not even I can find anything wrong with them! [roll]

Gran is a respected veteran coach who put together 3 ever improving offenses at Cincy in his first stint as an OC. Hinshaw gives UK a real QB coach on the staff. Realistically, I don't see how UK could have done better. The Bearcats put up some pretty gaudy offensive stats this past season against a schedule that included 7 teams ranked in the top half nationally in Total Defense. Against 5 of those 7 Cincy gained more than what their opponent allowed and on 3 occasions by more than 200 yards! On the year, only #4 SDSU, #33 BYU and #58 USF held Cincy under their 530 YPG average. IOW, this offense was gettin' it done against some pretty decent defenses.

As a football fan who believes Cincy (#47 nationally in all time wins with 599) deserves a seat at the P5 table the only downside to these hires is it deals a staggering blow to their program.

Peace

Glad to see you feel the same way haha. Not only at Cincy, but every stop he's made has managed great success. His numbers this year were incredible, and it wasn't padded with major cupcakes like some seem to think playing in the AAC. Plus Hinshaw as QB coach, something we have needed for years now, is just icing on the take. I look forward to the future battles with you guys.
 
May 6, 2002
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The only thing that matters is what he does here. I hope he proves me wrong, but no offensive coordinator has been able to put up numbers like that at Kentucky under Stoops even though they performed well before getting here. The combination of lack of talent, misused talent, and poor coaching has kept our offenses looking pretty mediocre and our record has reflected that. Throw in a schedule that is getting tougher and I will be surprised if there is major improvement. I am just going to take a wait and see approach and not get my hopes up at all. I'm tired of being letdown.
 
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vhcat70

Heisman
Feb 5, 2003
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The only thing that matters is what he does here. I hope he proves me wrong, but no offensive coordinator has been able to put up numbers like that at Kentucky under Stoops even though they performed well before getting here. The combination of lack of talent, misused talent, and poor coaching has kept our offenses looking pretty mediocre and our record has reflected that. Throw in a schedule that is getting tougher and I will be surprised if there is major improvement. I am just going to take a wait and see approach and not get my hopes up at all. I'm tired of being letdown.
A tougher schedule & not much if any gain in wins doesn't mean the O performances won't be noticeably improved. TN was the best team in the East but it didn't show up in the record due to tough losses to tough teams.
 

DaBossIsBack

All-Conference
Jun 28, 2013
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The only thing that matters is what he does here. I hope he proves me wrong, but no offensive coordinator has been able to put up numbers like that at Kentucky under Stoops even though they performed well before getting here. The combination of lack of talent, misused talent, and poor coaching has kept our offenses looking pretty mediocre and our record has reflected that. Throw in a schedule that is getting tougher and I will be surprised if there is major improvement. I am just going to take a wait and see approach and not get my hopes up at all. I'm tired of being letdown.
Clearly you are waiting before you pass judgment and form an opinion.
 

CatsFanGG24

Heisman
Dec 22, 2003
22,267
27,137
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Sorry, and this is not exclusively pointed at the quoted post but this has been repeated here and elsewhere ad nauseum.

THERE WAS NO OPENING AT RB COACH OR WR COACH LAST YEAR. THEREFORE GRAN WAS NOT A FIT AT THAT TIME.

This is bad reasoning and just trying to cover for the failed Dawson hire. You do not hire an OC based on position coach openings...the OC is above all in importance. And this year, there was no opening at RBs - yet Gran will be coaching Rbs...
 
Dec 28, 2015
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I'm thinking that this time next year the fans will be stressing over the thought of losing Gran to a bigger program looking for an OC.
 

Tskware

Heisman
Jan 26, 2003
25,077
21,565
113
I'm thinking that this time next year the fans will be stressing over the thought of losing Gran to a bigger program looking for an OC.

Well, that would be a good problem to have. For me, these guys look good on paper, but I am taking a wait and see approach, have seen many many DCs and OCs come and go, most with good resumes. Lets see some wins before we throw a parade.
 
Dec 28, 2015
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Just saying it's a possibility if he performs how folks expect him to. 7-5 and a significant uptick in O production and that will be a very real possibility.