From under to 50 in 2015 to high 70's in 2022

[NoSoup4U]

Surely to be taken with a grain of salt as to how the methodology works (and been debated here ad nauseum) but Barron's leadership seems to leave quite a stain

tied with the likes of Baylor , Clemson, Loyola Marymount, Mich State, Stoney Brook(suny) so 77-82 range









Note FSU at End of his tenure in 2014-- 112 now

 

[NittPicker]

I've never met Barron but he never struck me as being a decisive leader. Few people who spend their entire life in academia are. He spent too much time doing things like posing for pictures with his hands up and advocating for a museum which nobody needs/asked for. He always talked about tuition affordability but never did much in that area although I realize much of it was out of his control. Spanier would speak publicly as an advocate for the university even if it pissed of some people in Harrisburg. Barron was more of a "thank you sir, may I have another" kind of guy.

 

[Bison13]

Surely to be taken with a grain of salt as to how the methodology works (and been debated here ad nauseum) but Barron's leadership seems to leave quite a stain

tied with the likes of Baylor , Clemson, Loyola Marymount, Mich State, Stoney Brook(suny) so 77-82 range
View attachment 232498








Note FSU at End of his tenure in 2014-- 112 now

View attachment 232497

are those tuition rates correct? I know room and board is not included in that total but I had some seniors telling me that it was a bit higher for out of state

 

[J.E.B]

Barron & Barber and their posse were bureaucrats and the university and area will pay for their ineptitude for years to come. The Athletic Department has dropped to unseen performance depths as well if the Learfield Cup is to be believed. The layers are unreal and poor Neeli and Krafty will spend most of her first year trying to untangle the mess. There are very few people at the University who can make decisions.

 

[GrimReaper]

are those tuition rates correct? I know room and board is not included in that total but I had some seniors telling me that it was a bit higher for out of state

Low if we're talking 2022-23 academic year. OOS tuition is $38,100 for freshmen and sophomores. For juniors and seniors, it ranges from $40k to $45k depending on the program. That does not include mandatory fees.

 

[Tri-Power65]

Ever since the Sandusky debacle, Penn State has done a very poor job managing the brand.

 

[Bison13]

Low if we're talking 2022-23 academic year. OOS tuition is $38,100 for freshmen and sophomores. For juniors and seniors, it ranges from $40k to $45k depending on the program. That does not include mandatory fees.

Penn State Tuition and Costs

admissions.psu.edu

SO it is a bit higher than in the link above

 

[PSUFTG]

Surely to be taken with a grain of salt as to how the methodology works (and been debated here ad nauseum) but Barron's leadership seems to leave quite a stain

tied with the likes of Baylor , Clemson, Loyola Marymount, Mich State, Stoney Brook(suny) so 77-82 range
View attachment 232498








Note FSU at End of his tenure in 2014-- 112 now

View attachment 232497

Down another couple spots in the Big Ten - from #9 last year, to tied for 11th this year (tied with MSU - ahead of only Iowa and Nebraska).
In the VALUE ratings, still at dead last - 14th (same as last year), and in the new SOCIAL MOBILITY rankings (basically, how you do getting lower-income kids enrolled and graduated) dead last - 14th - as well.

 

[lions1995]

From PSU's own website: https://admissions.psu.edu/costs-aid/tuition/

In-state is 19286 while out-of-state is twice at 38651. Room and Board is another 12984 regardless of in-state or out-of-state. When I went to PSU in the early 90's as an out-of-state student, I paid about 4K more than my in-state friends. There is no way I would have gone to PSU today without significant scholarship money. I am at the point right now with the cost of college that I have told both my kids that if they want to go out of state to go to school, they are on their own for the difference between the out-of-state cost and Maryland's in-state cost unless they get financial aid to cover the difference.

 

[BiochemPSU]

I know people care about the rankings, but it is pretty meaningless. After Yale, Harvard, Princeton and a few others, the order of the rest doesn't matter.

 

[Midnighter]

I know people care about the rankings, but it is pretty meaningless. After Yale, Harvard, Princeton and a few others, the order of the rest doesn't matter.

This is probably mostly true. But, I'd extend it to the Top 25 National Universities. And kids going to top LA colleges are doing so intentionally; they're gearing up for grad school, living abroad, starting a career as a photographer/blogger with dad's money. Most of the folks I know in DC who went to the Ivies, Georgetown, Stanford, MIT, etc. are from wealthy families. This is why you see a bunch of Ivy educated State/Justice Department folks named Chip or Trip or whatever. My kids' school had a graduating class of about 100 last year; some of them went to:

Northwestern - 2
UChicago - 2
Georgetown - 3
Notre Dame - 2
Harvard - 2
Dartmouth - 3
Princeton - 3
Wake Forest - 6
Penn - 3
Brown - 2
Virginia - 5

Plus, Stanford, Michigan, Williams, Penn State, Ohio State, etc. Most of these kids' have parents who are senior partners/managing directors at big law firms or they run hedge funds or whatever.

 

[Still in State Colllege]

Penn State has been declining for quite a while. I had a few friends that were chaired professors that left Penn State for other institutions due to the things that were happing from an academic perspective.

 

[BobPSU92]

Down another couple spots in the Big Ten - from #9 last year, to tied for 11th this year (tied with MSU - ahead of only Iowa and Nebraska).
In the VALUE ratings, still at dead last - 14th (same as last year), and in the new SOCIAL MOBILITY rankings (basically, how you do getting lower-income kids enrolled and graduated) dead last - 14th - as well.

Penn State laughs at low income.

 

[marshall23]

The real credit goes to guys like Tsar Ira the Terrible and Clown Prince Dumbly

 

[Midnighter]

Penn State laughs at low income.

 

[OuiRPSU]

Surely to be taken with a grain of salt as to how the methodology works (and been debated here ad nauseum) but Barron's leadership seems to leave quite a stain

tied with the likes of Baylor , Clemson, Loyola Marymount, Mich State, Stoney Brook(suny) so 77-82 range
View attachment 232498








Note FSU at End of his tenure in 2014-- 112 now

View attachment 232497

Check out FSU’s in state tuition. It’s 1/3 of PSU’s.

 

[GrimReaper]

This is probably mostly true. But, I'd extend it to the Top 25 National Universities. And kids going to top LA colleges are doing so intentionally; they're gearing up for grad school, living abroad, starting a career as a photographer/blogger with dad's money. Most of the folks I know in DC who went to the Ivies, Georgetown, Stanford, MIT, etc. are from wealthy families. This is why you see a bunch of Ivy educated State/Justice Department folks named Chip or Trip or whatever. My kids' school had a graduating class of about 100 last year; some of them went to:

Northwestern - 2
UChicago - 2
Georgetown - 3
Notre Dame - 2
Harvard - 2
Dartmouth - 3
Princeton - 3
Wake Forest - 6
Penn - 3
Brown - 2
Virginia - 5

Plus, Stanford, Michigan, Williams, Penn State, Ohio State, etc. Most of these kids' have parents who are senior partners/managing directors at big law firms or they run hedge funds or whatever.

For quite a while now the high school has plotted GPA/test score combinations of students who applied, were accepted, and ultimately attended any given college or university. GPA is on the horizontal access, score on the vertical. PSU clusters around the center, with the trend toward the lower left quadrant. Observation of the guidance counselors is that a lot of kids with better credentials who previously would have gone to PSU are now going to places like Pitt and Maryland. Why? No one knows, but it's not money.

How good is the HS? Landing places are similar to those of the HS your kids attend. Roughly 10% of the recent senior class were National Merit semifinalists.

 

[razpsu]

So when we were the number one ranked party school and for years not ranked because “they didn’t rank professionals with mere amateurs” we were ranked in the top 40 for academics as well!

only one thing to do.
“Men, we have a lot of work to do”

 

[Midnighter]

For quite a while now the high school has plotted GPA/test score combinations of students who applied, were accepted, and ultimately attended any given college or university. GPA is on the horizontal access, score on the vertical. PSU clusters around the center, with the trend toward the lower left quadrant. Observation of the guidance counselors is that a lot of kids with better credentials who previously would have gone to PSU are now going to places like Pitt and Maryland. Why? No one knows, but it's not money.

How good is the HS? Landing places are similar to those of the HS your kids attend. Roughly 10% of the recent senior class were National Merit semifinalists.

Pretty good I think; in 2020, of a class of 100 they had seven National Merit Finalists and 26 National Merit Commended Students (one of these went to Harvard).

I can see Pitt over PSU for a lot of students; but Maryland? Yeesh.

 

[NoSoup4U]

Check out FSU’s in state tuition. It’s 1/3 of PSU’s.

Yes but these US NEWS rankings are more than just that-- and FSU tuition didnt magically go down..or maybe it did I have no idea

but how does FSU in 2014 ranked 112 go to 55 and
PSU ranked 48 in 2015 go to 77???

Is Barron the lynchpin in both scenarios? or was there a significant change on how student debt load is weighted in the rankings from then till now, If we are only talking financials?

 

[Midnighter]

Yes but these US NEWS rankings are more than just that-- and FSU tuition didnt magically go down..or maybe it did I have no idea

but how does FSU in 2014 ranked 112 go to 55 and
PSU ranked 48 in 2015 go to 77???

Is Barron the lynchpin in both scenarios? or was there a significant change on how student debt load is weighted in the rankings from then till now, If we are only talking financials?

I mean, the rankings are sort of a black box. Malcolm Gladwell did an interesting 'story' about the USN&WR rankings on his podcast, Revisionist History. It's worth a listen...

Lord of the Rankings | Revisionist History

For 30 years, US News & World Report has been using a secret formula to rank the best colleges and universities in the United States. As a public service to our listeners, we hack the algorithm and discover the dirty little secret of the rankings game.

www.pushkin.fm

 

[NoSoup4U]

Pretty good I think; in 2020, of a class of 100 they had seven National Merit Finalists and 26 National Merit Commended Students (one of these went to Harvard).

I can see Pitt over PSU for a lot of students; but Maryland? Yeesh.

well speaking of UMD did the Big Ten do the right thing bringing in the likes of UMD and Rutgers???

 

[NoSoup4U]

I mean, the rankings are sort of a black box. Malcolm Gladwell did an interesting 'story' about the USN&WR rankings on his podcast, Revisionist History. It's worth a listen...

Lord of the Rankings | Revisionist History

For 30 years, US News & World Report has been using a secret formula to rank the best colleges and universities in the United States. As a public service to our listeners, we hack the algorithm and discover the dirty little secret of the rankings game.

www.pushkin.fm

yes there has been much that has been debated on what if anything these lists show...maybe just to sell subscriptions to something who knows but dropping like a rock cant look good over a 7-8 years span thats 2 full cycles of graduates

 

[Midnighter]

well speaking of UMD did the Big Ten do the right thing bringing in the likes of UMD and Rutgers???





View attachment 232667

I don't know; I think if it's all about finances, then probably. Academics? Sure. Maryland is a solid school, but the campus is......not my favorite. Haven't been to Rutgers.

 

[Bwifan]

Surely to be taken with a grain of salt as to how the methodology works (and been debated here ad nauseum) but Barron's leadership seems to leave quite a stain

tied with the likes of Baylor , Clemson, Loyola Marymount, Mich State, Stoney Brook(suny) so 77-82 range
View attachment 232498








Note FSU at End of his tenure in 2014-- 112 now

View attachment 232497

Living in Florida it's amazing that all the state university's are $7,000 a year. Amazing to think you can get a 4 year degree in Florida as a resident for what you can get for almost the cost of 1 year at PSU. Nice to see the state runs in the black with no state income tax as well. Makes ya scratch your head why some places can do it right and other's can't.

 

[pamdlion]

I don't know; I think if it's all about finances, then probably. Academics? Sure. Maryland is a solid school, but the campus is......not my favorite. Haven't been to Rutgers.

The MD campus is kind of a dump. The “downtown” is two blocks of nothing in lovely Prince George’s county. If there is a worse setting in the B1G I haven’t seen it.

 

[Midnighter]

Living in Florida it's amazing that all the state university's are $7,000 a year. Amazing to think you can get a 4 year degree in Florida as a resident for what you can get for almost the cost of 1 year at PSU. Nice to see the state runs in the black with no state income tax as well. Makes ya scratch your head why some places can do it right and other's can't.

Not every state has the massive funding from tourism that Florida does. Or the weather that allows for year round tourist activities. And they’re stingy with social services. Get what you pay for I guess.

 

[J.E.B]

Rank	School (2021)	In State	Out State	Enroll
10	Northwestern	63,500	63,500	8,494
20	UCLA	13,804	44,830	32,119
25	Michigan	17,786	57,273	32,282
25	So California	64,726	64,726	20,790
38	Wisconsin	10,796	39,427	35,474
41	Illinois	17,138	35,110	34,779
49	Ohio State	11,936	35,019	47,106
51	Purdue	9,992	28,794	37,101
55	Rutgers	16,263	33,963	36,152
55	Maryland	11,233	39,469	30,922
62	Minnesota	15,859	35,099	36,209
72	Indiana	11,447	39,120	34,253
77	Michigan State	14,850	40,662	38,574
77	Penn State	18,898	36,476	40,600
83	Iowa	9,942	31,904	21,608
151	Nebraska	9,854	26,984	19,552

 

[Woodpecker]

So when we were the number one ranked party school and for years not ranked because “they didn’t rank professionals with mere amateurs”

You know that never happened, right? Dozens of colleges tell that legend about their school with no actual citation.

 

[GrimReaper]

Pretty good I think; in 2020, of a class of 100 they had seven National Merit Finalists and 26 National Merit Commended Students (one of these went to Harvard).

I can see Pitt over PSU for a lot of students; but Maryland? Yeesh.

The punchline around here to "what does Penn State look for?" is "your transcript and your zipcode." Accepts a lot of kids whoe best alternatives are places like Montclair State and Quinnipiac.

 

[BobPSU92]

The punchline around here to "what does Penn State look for?" is "your transcript and your zipcode." Accepts a lot of kids whoe best alternatives are places like Montclair State and Quinnipiac.

“I called to check my zip code!”

 

[BobPSU92]

I saw the thread title and thought it was about climate change.

 

[NoSoup4U]

I saw the thread title and thought it was about climate change.

Well I knew that would pull ya in Bob since it wasn't a midnighter poll

 

[lions1995]

Rank	School (2021)	In State	Out State	Enroll
10	Northwestern	63,500	63,500	8,494
20	UCLA	13,804	44,830	32,119
25	Michigan	17,786	57,273	32,282
25	So California	64,726	64,726	20,790
38	Wisconsin	10,796	39,427	35,474
41	Illinois	17,138	35,110	34,779
49	Ohio State	11,936	35,019	47,106
51	Purdue	9,992	28,794	37,101
55	Rutgers	16,263	33,963	36,152
55	Maryland	11,233	39,469	30,922
62	Minnesota	15,859	35,099	36,209
72	Indiana	11,447	39,120	34,253
77	Michigan State	14,850	40,662	38,574
77	Penn State	18,898	36,476	40,600
83	Iowa	9,942	31,904	21,608
151	Nebraska	9,854	26,984	19,552

And again, looking at this list, unless they give a lot of financial aid, there is no reason to leave your in state schools, not to double and even triple the cost of college.

 

[BobPSU92]

Neeli comments about #77:

"While we value rankings and other surveys, it also is true that a single rating or number cannot tell the full story of Penn State and its broad impact, created by an innovative 20-campus educational model recognized for preparing graduates who are sought after by employers, and the breadth and depth of a top-25 research university," said Penn State President Neeli Bendapudi.

"More than 381,000 Penn State alumni live and work in the state of Pennsylvania. The University contributes billions to the Pennsylvania economy each year and has helped to create more than 105,000 jobs across the commonwealth. Our brilliant faculty and students generate nearly $1 billion in annual research expenditures and each day are working to solve pressing problems that impact our world. With the support of our entire Penn State community we have achieved record fundraising success in support of our students and our mission," Bendapudi said. "We have 24 campuses and a World Campus that meet students where they live. And we offer more than 275 high-quality undergraduate majors, along with resources such as Complete Penn State, which are designed to help students finish their chosen degrees on time and with less debt. Numbers such as these also indicate the impact Penn State is having across Pennsylvania, across the nation and around the world."

While I agree with her to an extent, the fact is that many people look no further than these rankings.

https://www.psu.edu/news/academics/story/penn-state-ranks-31st-among-national-public-universities-us-news-rankings/

 

[PSU12046]

Neeli comments about #77:

"While we value rankings and other surveys, it also is true that a single rating or number cannot tell the full story of Penn State and its broad impact, created by an innovative 20-campus educational model recognized for preparing graduates who are sought after by employers, and the breadth and depth of a top-25 research university," said Penn State President Neeli Bendapudi.

"More than 381,000 Penn State alumni live and work in the state of Pennsylvania. The University contributes billions to the Pennsylvania economy each year and has helped to create more than 105,000 jobs across the commonwealth. Our brilliant faculty and students generate nearly $1 billion in annual research expenditures and each day are working to solve pressing problems that impact our world. With the support of our entire Penn State community we have achieved record fundraising success in support of our students and our mission," Bendapudi said. "We have 24 campuses and a World Campus that meet students where they live. And we offer more than 275 high-quality undergraduate majors, along with resources such as Complete Penn State, which are designed to help students finish their chosen degrees on time and with less debt. Numbers such as these also indicate the impact Penn State is having across Pennsylvania, across the nation and around the world."

While I agree with her to an extent, the fact is that many people look no further than these rankings.

https://www.psu.edu/news/academics/story/penn-state-ranks-31st-among-national-public-universities-us-news-rankings/

If Penn State had not killed JVP and Sue from the university, they would have much more alumni donations, including myself

 

[TiogaLion]

For quite a while now the high school has plotted GPA/test score combinations of students who applied, were accepted, and ultimately attended any given college or university. GPA is on the horizontal access, score on the vertical. PSU clusters around the center, with the trend toward the lower left quadrant. Observation of the guidance counselors is that a lot of kids with better credentials who previously would have gone to PSU are now going to places like Pitt and Maryland. Why? No one knows, but it's not money.

How good is the HS? Landing places are similar to those of the HS your kids attend. Roughly 10% of the recent senior class were National Merit semifinalists.

Should read "How good are the parents?". High Schools could easily be measured by the percent of parents present at "back to school" night. Prep schools are so named because they "prep for the SAT" from 8th grade on.

 

[Midnighter]

Neeli comments about #77:

"While we value rankings and other surveys, it also is true that a single rating or number cannot tell the full story of Penn State and its broad impact, created by an innovative 20-campus educational model recognized for preparing graduates who are sought after by employers, and the breadth and depth of a top-25 research university," said Penn State President Neeli Bendapudi.

"More than 381,000 Penn State alumni live and work in the state of Pennsylvania. The University contributes billions to the Pennsylvania economy each year and has helped to create more than 105,000 jobs across the commonwealth. Our brilliant faculty and students generate nearly $1 billion in annual research expenditures and each day are working to solve pressing problems that impact our world. With the support of our entire Penn State community we have achieved record fundraising success in support of our students and our mission," Bendapudi said. "We have 24 campuses and a World Campus that meet students where they live. And we offer more than 275 high-quality undergraduate majors, along with resources such as Complete Penn State, which are designed to help students finish their chosen degrees on time and with less debt. Numbers such as these also indicate the impact Penn State is having across Pennsylvania, across the nation and around the world."

While I agree with her to an extent, the fact is that many people look no further than these rankings.

https://www.psu.edu/news/academics/story/penn-state-ranks-31st-among-national-public-universities-us-news-rankings/

This would sort of indicate PSU’s drop in rankings doesn’t have a lot to do with their academic programs, which are only part of the evaluation criteria USN&WR uses….

 

[BobPSU92]

This would sort of indicate PSU’s drop in rankings doesn’t have a lot to do with their academic programs, which are only part of the evaluation criteria USN&WR uses….

It‘s $$$$$ and perceived value as a result of $$$$$.

 

[bbrown]

Surely to be taken with a grain of salt as to how the methodology works (and been debated here ad nauseum) but Barron's leadership seems to leave quite a stain

tied with the likes of Baylor , Clemson, Loyola Marymount, Mich State, Stoney Brook(suny) so 77-82 range
View attachment 232498








Note FSU at End of his tenure in 2014-- 112 now

View attachment 232497

Yes, a giant skid mark.