Horse racing, is it cruel?

[Louis_Skunt]

After 2 horses were killed before todays Preakness, in different races, I had this discussion with my neighbor. Obviously she thinks its cruel. Why should I support horse racing when these animals are killed just for entertaining us and many lead a terrible risky life. That they're pushed too hard, etc etc.

I brought up the Iditarod and Nascar, that everything great comes with a risk.

Thoughts?

 

[Free_Salato_Blue]

Take her to Claiborne or other farms, their stud barns are worth more than her house.
It would have to suck to be groomed and fed everyday and bang different gals with no strings attached.

 

[JohnBlue]

There is a less than glamours side to everything I suppose. For as hard as it can be on them racing keeps horses relevant.

 

[roguemocha]

Take her to Claiborne or other farms, their stud barns are worth more than her house.
It would have to suck to be groomed and fed everyday and bang different gals with no strings attached.

It's not like that for all horses obviously, but either way most of them wouldn't exist if there was no horse racing. And it may be a terrible analogy but I think even the majority of any slaves would rather be alive as a slave than dead or never born at all.

 

[Get Buckets]

And it may be a terrible analogy but I think even the majority of any slaves would rather be alive as a than dead or never born at all.

:flushed:

 

[WayneDougan_rivals170043]

It's not like that for all horses obviously, but either way most of them wouldn't exist if there was no horse racing. And it may be a terrible analogy but I think even the majority of any slaves would rather be alive as a slave than dead or never born at all.

I have no problem with this analogy. If you're still alive at least you have a fighting chance.

 

[DaBossIsBack]

It's not like that for all horses obviously, but either way most of them wouldn't exist if there was no horse racing. And it may be a terrible analogy but I think even the majority of any slaves would rather be alive as a slave than dead or never born at all.

 

[We-Todd-Did]

As for cruelty, it has a range. High dollar horses live better than I do but the cheap ones live rough. Geldings especially used to run until they broke down or were worth more for slaughter.

I come from a family of horse racing fans but I can't watch it. I've seen horses die in front of the stands, try to walk on a shattered leg, and even have a section of rail sticking through them after a fall (at Ellis Park). I view it like I do a rodeo - unnecessary.

 

[Free_Salato_Blue]

Selective breeding has done much of the harm. You have to consider that most of the bloodline can trace it's roots back to one Arabian sire from the 1700's.
They are at the pinnacle for power and speed but fragile from interbreeding.
They may have to add some new blood into the small gene pool.

 

[MrLair]

Your neighbors and Peta can go ... well u know. American horse racing has come a long way. Tell her to visit Japan and their stables/killing houses.

 

[dgtatu01]

The problem is racing has left Pimlico behind. It's a dump and their facility sucks. They probably don't care for the track very well either and I guarantee on an off day it contributed. The racing world has needed to move the Preakness for years and maybe this will make it happen. Barbara should have been the wake up call, but it wasn't. Move on from Pimlico Triple Crown.

 

[dgtatu01]

Your neighbors and Peta can go ... well u know. American horse racing has come a long way. Tell her to visit Japan and their stables/killing houses.

This argument is disingenuous. Just because we treat our horses better than someone else doesn't mean we are treating them right. I don't have a problem with horse racing, but no one in this thread has made a decent argument to make people think it is good for horses. The main thing is, it isn't. If you enjoy horse racing you have to understand it is at the expense of the horses. Like I said I don't care and I enjoy horse racing, but those are the facts, the life of the vast majority of those horses sucks.

 

[Intern]

This argument is disingenuous. Just because we treat our horses better than someone else doesn't mean we are treating them right. I don't have a problem with horse racing, but no one in this thread has made a decent argument to make people think it is good for horses. The main thing is, it isn't. If you enjoy horse racing you have to understand it is at the expense of the horses. Like I said I don't care and I enjoy horse racing, but those are the facts, the life of the vast majority of those horses sucks.

Ok, so you ban horse racing. Now what? What would we do with the tens of thousands horses and humans who are left without a job? I can tell you what would happen to a good portion of the horses. Thoroughbreds are literally bred to gallop and compete. If they were never on a racetrack and only occupied pastures they would still race each other. It's innate. Anytime a horse exerts energy, they run a risk of getting hurt. Hell, they can hurt themselves laying in their stalls. Yes, there are far too many people in the industry who put the bottom line over the wellbeing of the horse, and that's unfortunate, but should not be an indictment of a good portion of stakeholders who do good, honest work day in and day out.

 

[Louis_Skunt]

The problem is racing has left Pimlico behind. It's a dump and their facility sucks. They probably don't care for the track very well either and I guarantee on an off day it contributed. The racing world has needed to move the Preakness for years and maybe this will make it happen. Barbara should have been the wake up call, but it wasn't. Move on from Pimlico Triple Crown.

I'm too lazy to get the quote, but what about the owner of California Chrome that said on live TV, something like--- Hey Kentucky, you need to pay attention on how Maryland does this, this is how you're supposed to run the business. He went on to speak really highly of Maryland.

 

[roguemocha]

I'm pretty sure that was because it was after the Derby when Chrome had won and Pimlico was kissing his *** and catering to him like he was the star. I can't be positive on that but pretty sure it has a lot to do with it. That guy was a jackass.

 

[KopiKat]

After 2 horses were killed before todays Preakness, in different races, I had this discussion with my neighbor. Obviously she thinks its cruel.

Was she wearing makeup while having this discussion with you and, if so, was she not aware of the tremendous amount of animal cruelty associated with the development of cosmetic products? Tell her to stop wearing makeup and you might listen to her stupid nonsense.

 

[Kooky Kats]

Could be worse. They could be veal cows.

 

[TortElvisII]

Big fan. Wished there was a way not to run in those conditions.

 

[80 Proof]

Obviously cruel as horses hate to run.

 

[dgtatu01]

Ok, so you ban horse racing. Now what? What would we do with the tens of thousands horses and humans who are left without a job? I can tell you what would happen to a good portion of the horses. Thoroughbreds are literally bred to gallop and compete. If they were never on a racetrack and only occupied pastures they would still race each other. It's innate. Anytime a horse exerts energy, they run a risk of getting hurt. Hell, they can hurt themselves laying in their stalls. Yes, there are far too many people in the industry who put the bottom line over the wellbeing of the horse, and that's unfortunate, but should not be an indictment of a good portion of stakeholders who do good, honest work day in and day out.

I'm not against horse racing, but I'm also not going to say we treat the horses all that great either. I eat chicken and will continue to eat chicken, but those things,are treated like garbage. Tough to make an argument about the horse racing being good for horses a day after running races at a crappy track under terrible conditions because it's tradition. Then after killing 2 horses trying to say we treat these horses great. I don't live in a black and white world. I don't have to fool myself into believing I really care about the horses to enjoy horse racing. I think animals are our domain to do what we want with them. I like horse racing so it's fine with me. It's just ludicrous to keep arguing with PETA type folks that we meat eating, horse race loving, hunting, whatevering people really care about the animals and want them to be comfortable. I think we should just tell PETA people this probably isn't the greatest environment for horses, but I like horse racing so I really don't care. Hasn't Donald Trump taught us anything? We live in a world that wants the truth, not a PC, culturally sensitive, safe zone version of reality.

 

[TexasTimCat]

Huge fan of racing, have been as long as I can remember.

Have you ever seen horses in the field - you know what they do - they run and bounce and play. They "race" each other. Sometimes they get hurt.

Have you ever seen a herd of wild horses, they run. Some of them get hurt.

I am less concerned with horses that get hurt during the race than I am how many are cared for, housed, etc. Especially after racing days are over.

 

[ALL IN YOUR FACE]

Are some of the deaths due to drugs that are given to the horses on race day? I could be wrong but don't states have different regulations on what can be given to a horse?
IIRC I think KY might have placed some additional restrictions a few years ago. I could be just imagining all this but would be nice to hear from someone knowledgeable.

 

[Deeeefense]

I don't know but I wonder how many of these people objecting to horse racing had bacon and eggs for breakfast, or chicken nuggets or big mac for lunch? Hog lives matter.

 

[ukfan03]

Today's society is soft as charmin. It's just horse racing.

 

[Strokin_Bandit]

Yes it's cruel, but no more than anything else that humans are in control of.

 

[JamesIII]

Couldn't they just amputate in some cases and have a bunch of 3-legged horses hobbling around?

 

[BlueBloodNDaVille]

Couldn't they just amputate in some cases and have a bunch of 3-legged horses hobbling around?

Horses cannot live on 3 legs. It leads to laminitis (what eventually necessitated Barbaro being put down).

 

[cat_in_the_hat]

I don't know but I wonder how many of these people objecting to horse racing had bacon and eggs for breakfast, or chicken nuggets or big mac for lunch? Hog lives matter.

I'm not arguing the point one way or the other, but are you really comparing killing an animal for food to an animal dying during the course of providing entertainment to humans?

 

[Deeeefense]

I'm not arguing the point one way or the other, but are you really comparing killing an animal for food to an animal dying during the course of providing entertainment to humans?

Naw, just saying if I had to be a barnyard animal of any kind I would rather be one that gets ridden then one that gets ate, even if there's a small chance I might get ridden to death.

 

[Free_Salato_Blue]

mmm 50 cents corndogs at Sonic today.

 

[Ukbrassowtipin]

Ok, so you ban horse racing. Now what? What would we do with the tens of thousands horses and humans who are left without a job? I can tell you what would happen to a good portion of the horses. Thoroughbreds are literally bred to gallop and compete. If they were never on a racetrack and only occupied pastures they would still race each other. It's innate. Anytime a horse exerts energy, they run a risk of getting hurt. Hell, they can hurt themselves laying in their stalls. Yes, there are far too many people in the industry who put the bottom line over the wellbeing of the horse, and that's unfortunate, but should not be an indictment of a good portion of stakeholders who do good, honest work day in and day out.

Lol..Im fine with horse racing, but I thought it was comical "oh no, what would those hard working folks do?" I dunno, find other careers...the milk man and the phone switchboard operator don't exist anymore among countless other professions...I'm not losing sleep over their hard work.

 

[Violent Cuts]

I feel it's cruel, particularly the inbreeding that causes a lot of the genetic problems. I basically refuse to watch horse racing any more, either in person or tv. I feel like it's an old barbaric sport that shouldn't exist any longer.

 

[thabigbluenation]

more humans get hurt in the NFL than horses from horse racing. #bantheNFL #banfootball #baneverythingthatsomepeopledon'tlike no more sports only tree hugging just don't hug too hard you might hurt the tree

 

[Deeeefense]

I have heard the thoroughbreds love to run the tracks. Anyway it's hard to be Kentuckian and not enjoy a day at the races.

 

[HossCat73_rivals]

Couldn't they just amputate in some cases and have a bunch of 3-legged horses hobbling around?

Laminitis is correct..Watch Go For Wand's breakdown in the '91 Distaff...one of the worst I EVER saw. That just don't work.

Actually, they prolonged putting down Ruffian because they were able to stabilize her briefly after surgery. She thrashed uncontrollably and re-broke her leg. She was put down afterwards. They buried her with her facing the finish line in the Belmont infield. Only horse buried on the ground. Ironically, her mother, Shenanigans, died in the same manner, but out at Claiborne.

 

[HossCat73_rivals]

I feel it's cruel, particularly the inbreeding that causes a lot of the genetic problems. I basically refuse to watch horse racing any more, either in person or tv. I feel like it's an old barbaric sport that shouldn't exist any longer.

Someone who thinks a horse that has Northern Dancer up close on both sides causes genetic problems is in fact a problem.

 

[HossCat73_rivals]

Are some of the deaths due to drugs that are given to the horses on race day? I could be wrong but don't states have different regulations on what can be given to a horse?
IIRC I think KY might have placed some additional restrictions a few years ago. I could be just imagining all this but would be nice to hear from someone knowledgeable.

Bingo..

 

[HossCat73_rivals]

Regarding the drug issue, here's a few names to Google:

Kirk Ziadie
Ramon Preciado
Karl Broberg
Jamie Ness
David Jacobson
Doug (Drug) O'Neill...yeah, that guy, but he hasn't had a positive in over three years now. opcorn:

And, Maria Borell..not necessarily for drugs, but for her "love" of the animals under her care. Some may remember her as trainer of BC Sprint champ Runhappy. She was fired after the race, and garnered a lot of attention for how the owner did her wrong. She got a small string from Drawing Away Stables in the winter, and I think got one in the winner's circle before being let go. DAS also employed David Jacobson. Nothing to see there...cough cough..

Here's a pretty eye opening look at part of the problem:

https://www.usracing.com/news/analysis/shocking-untold-story-maria-borell

I used to have a real savvy link/database for all the tbred and harness trainers who had any positives, and when I can find it again, i'll post it up. Damn shame these horses give their all, but for some of these **** sticks, it's just not enough. Until the NTRA issues and finances a nationwide drug testing panel--never happen--running the horses on meds that doesn't make them feel pain, will unfortunately continue the breakdown trend. And yes, I'm in the corner with those that think Lasix masks other drugs. May not be the case, but we'll probably never know.

 

[BlueRunner11]

Those horses are taken care of better than a lot of people. And I'm not sure what a horse's favorite thing to do is, but running has to be up there.

 

[MychalG]

Horse racing can be very cruel, just ask my wallet when the Spring/Fall meet is going on at Churchill.