I am sad.

[freewillie07]

I love Northwestern basketball. And I am sad.

This team just lost to 0-10 Penn State at home. Vic Law, the senior leader and the very first recruit of the Collins era, was absolutely awful, missing shots left and right and turning the ball over a stunning six times himself. Not only that, he looked disinterested for one of the first times in my memory.

Miller Kopp and Ryan Greer, aka the future of the program, were largely non-factors. Collins missed an opportunity to calm Anthony Gaines down, and as a result he was out for most of the second half. It's just not fun to watch this team. Will they win another conference game?

The worst part: What do we have to look forward to in the future? NU loses Law, Pardon and Taylor next year, and possibly Falzon and Ash. The projected starting lineup at this point:

Greer/Turner
Gaines
Kopp
Nance/Beran
Benson

That doesn't scream "contender" to me. I really wanted this Penn State win, if for no other reason then the program needs every win it can get to keep the momentum from the Tournament year and the new stadium from dying completely. What sorts of recruits can we expect in 2020. At least there will be lots of playing time up for grabs...

I don't know. I don't know. I will continue to love NU basketball, but it's really hard right now.

Go Cats.

 

[NUMBfan]

If I had been watching this game in Evanston, I'd be asking for a refund. Just a TERRIBLE performance by the Wildcats. UGH.

 

[Titanium999]

I love Northwestern basketball. And I am sad.

This team just lost to 0-10 Penn State at home. Vic Law, the senior leader and the very first recruit of the Collins era, was absolutely awful, missing shots left and right and turning the ball over a stunning six times himself. Not only that, he looked disinterested for one of the first times in my memory.

Miller Kopp and Ryan Greer, aka the future of the program, were largely non-factors. Collins missed an opportunity to calm Anthony Gaines down, and as a result he was out for most of the second half. It's just not fun to watch this team. Will they win another conference game?

The worst part: What do we have to look forward to in the future? NU loses Law, Pardon and Taylor next year, and possibly Falzon and Ash. The projected starting lineup at this point:

Greer/Turner
Gaines
Kopp
Nance/Beran
Benson

That doesn't scream "contender" to me. I really wanted this Penn State win, if for no other reason then the program needs every win it can get to keep the momentum from the Tournament year and the new stadium from dying completely. What sorts of recruits can we expect in 2020. At least there will be lots of playing time up for grabs...

I don't know. I don't know. I will continue to love NU basketball, but it's really hard right now.

Go Cats.

I don’t blame Law! I watched the game and saw him get hacked three times going to the basket. Just atrocious refs! No wonder no one was in the stands! Just shocking!

 

[mikewebb68]

I love Northwestern basketball. And I am sad.

This team just lost to 0-10 Penn State at home. Vic Law, the senior leader and the very first recruit of the Collins era, was absolutely awful, missing shots left and right and turning the ball over a stunning six times himself. Not only that, he looked disinterested for one of the first times in my memory.

Miller Kopp and Ryan Greer, aka the future of the program, were largely non-factors. Collins missed an opportunity to calm Anthony Gaines down, and as a result he was out for most of the second half. It's just not fun to watch this team. Will they win another conference game?

The worst part: What do we have to look forward to in the future? NU loses Law, Pardon and Taylor next year, and possibly Falzon and Ash. The projected starting lineup at this point:

Greer/Turner
Gaines
Kopp
Nance/Beran
Benson

That doesn't scream "contender" to me. I really wanted this Penn State win, if for no other reason then the program needs every win it can get to keep the momentum from the Tournament year and the new stadium from dying completely. What sorts of recruits can we expect in 2020. At least there will be lots of playing time up for grabs...

I don't know. I don't know. I will continue to love NU basketball, but it's really hard right now.

Go Cats.

I am going to assume that Vic is a lot more injured than he is letting on, and he is just trying to gut it out. Anyone know anything about knee tendinitis? Even Gaines is hurt now (dealing with a shoulder injury),

When your leading scorer can't score, it is very hard to win ballgames. Think about how Penn State would have done in this game is Lamar Stevens was as much of a nonfactor as Law.

Oh well, can't cry about it. Have to try to right the ship somehow.

 

[Chuckster1973]

Collins may not be the right hire unfortunately.

 

[mikewebb68]

Collins may not be the right hire unfortunately.

Uh no, but thanks for playing! Collins didn't miss all those layups and other easy shots tonight. When a team simply cannot put the ball in the hoop with open looks, that's not on the coach...

 

[SimpsonElmwood]

This is the first bad loss of the season.

 

[freewillie07]

I am going to assume that Vic is a lot more injured than he is letting on, and he is just trying to gut it out. Anyone know anything about knee tendinitis? Even Gaines is hurt now (dealing with a shoulder injury),

When your leading scorer can't score, it is very hard to win ballgames. Think about how Penn State would have done in this game is Lamar Stevens was as much of a nonfactor as Law.

Oh well, can't cry about it. Have to try to right the ship somehow.

Vic is one of my favorite NU athletes of all time. That said, if he really is that injured, it is not helpful for him to tough it out. He was 3 for 16 with six turnovers. You just can't have that sort of liability on the floor. I'd rather give those minutes to Turner, Taylor, Falzon or Kopp.

However I'm not sure the injury is entirely to blame as he was able to grab 10 boards. I think it's a combination of him pressing and just general frustration with this season.

 

[TheC]

Uh no, but thanks for playing! Collins didn't miss all those layups and other easy shots tonight. When a team simply cannot put the ball in the hoop with open looks, that's not on the coach...

But Collins built this program that hasn't had a good guard recruit in five years now and has no backup centers that he trusts for more than 2 minutes in the game. Its a team full of 3's and 4's and little else. He might know basketball, but there is so much more to being a head coach. You have to be a CEO of a program and I really worry about that aspect right now.

 

[mikewebb68]

Vic is one of my favorite NU athletes of all time. That said, if he really is that injured, it is not helpful for him to tough it out. He was 3 for 16 with six turnovers. You just can't have that sort of liability on the floor. I'd rather give those minutes to Turner, Taylor, Falzon or Kopp.

However I'm not sure the injury is entirely to blame as he was able to grab 10 boards. I think it's a combination of him pressing and just general frustration with this season.

The lack of point production coincides precisely with his injury. I wasn't convinced, but he is just too good for that to be a coincidence, especially with a week of rest.

 

[cat inkansas]

Collins may not be the right hire unfortunately.

I am not sure how good this staff is in evaluating talent. The frosh they recruited this year had offers from others programs so they must have some potential. But, the transfers--Turner and Taylor----really aren't Big ten players. Someone really over evaluated their potential.

 

[Mr Wickerpark]

its a strange and terrible thing.

 

[TheC]

Its just so frustrating. 2016 was so damn fun. To have my team be relevant for the first time in my lifetime was so special. It just hurts that much more to watch it slipping away.

 

[mikewebb68]

But Collins built this program that hasn't had a good guard recruit in five years now and has no backup centers that he trusts for more than 2 minutes in the game. Its a team full of 3's and 4's and little else. He might know basketball, but there is so much more to being a head coach. You have to be a CEO of a program and I really worry about that aspect right now.

I think Gaines is and excellent guard recruit, and will be one of the best by the time he is done. I also I like what I've seen of Greer considering he was not even supposed to be playing until next year. We did not lose this game due to the lack of a backup center. We lost the game because we couldn't put the round object into the thingy with the net on it...

 

[mikewebb68]

I am not sure how good this staff is in evaluating talent. The frosh they recruited this year had offers from others programs so they must have some potential. But, the transfers--Turner and Taylor----really aren't Big ten players. Someone really over evaluated their potential.

Don't know about Turner, but EVERYBODY and his brother wanted Taylor. So it it was a Collins miss, it was a miss for half the coaches in the league...

 

[TheC]

I think Gaines is and excellent guard recruit, and will be one of the best by the time he is done. I also I like what I've seen of Greer considering he was not even supposed to be playing until next year. We did not lose this game due to the lack of a backup center. We lost the game because we couldn't put the round object into the thingy with the net on it...

But we haven't put that round object into the thingy with the net all season! At least in conference play. Its because we have a totally unbalanced roster in my opinion. Gaines is fun to watch, but he's a totally incomplete player. He can't shoot like a guard and can only go right. I still don't see why people like Greer. I think its just wishful thinking, frankly. So, I stand by my comment. We have not recruited a decent guard since BMac.

 

[mikewebb68]

This is the first bad loss of the season.

And as bad as it was, it may be only a Quad 2 loss by season's end. Penn State was going to beat somebody the way we were playing, and, to be honest, the way we shot, it was amazing it was as close as it was.

 

[SimpsonElmwood]

Tonight the only guy who could consistently get the ball in to Pardon was Kopp. Unfortunately the two of them are going to play 10 or so more games together.

 

[freewillie07]

Its just so frustrating. 2016 was so damn fun. To have my team be relevant for the first time in my lifetime was so special. It just hurts that much more to watch it slipping away.

The sad reality is that aside from that year, NU has not had a single postseason appearance under Collins. I know a lot of people around here dismiss the NIT, but you know what? You can sell that to recruits: "We were right on the bubble of making the NCAA Tournament last year. We missed getting in, but with you I'm confident we'll be dancing easily."

The 2017 class (Gaines's year) is case in point. All those recruits were signed before NU broke through. At that point, it was multiple years of no postseason. And NU missed on Brad Davison and Jordan Goodwin. And who knows, maybe Justin Smith and Luka Garza and Nojel Eastern would have given NU a longer look. Now I worry we are in the exact same situation with 2020 recruits.

 

[ParisCat_rivals]

Man, that was tough to watch. I'm seriously thinking about not renewing my STs. With the hefty non-deductible donation, it's hard to justify sinking a ton of money to spend a miserable couple of hours at the gym. Maybe I'll go for the freebies next year.

 

[Jeffrey Cat]

I think Gaines is and excellent guard recruit, and will be one of the best by the time he is done. I also I like what I've seen of Greer considering he was not even supposed to be playing until next year. We did not lose this game due to the lack of a backup center. We lost the game because we couldn't put the round object into the thingy with the net on it...

In my mind we lost this game because we have no one who can distribute the ball to the open man and believe me when guys are getting double teamed and tripled down low there are people open. We won games like this in the last 4 years when McIntosh was healthy because he could get the ball to the open man. None of these guys are capable of getting the ball to the open man because they either dribble to much or they have spent there whole life being that open man. Let’s hope there is a point guard in our future, and folks it’s not Gaines, but he is a very good 2 guard or slasher.

 

[phatcat_rivals223240]

So glad I'm a football fan.

 

[Fitz51]

Its just so frustrating. 2016 was so damn fun. To have my team be relevant for the first time in my lifetime was so special. It just hurts that much more to watch it slipping away.

Yeah, unlike football, that appears to have just been a blip. Too bad we barely missed the Sweet 16!

 

[mikewebb68]

In my mind we lost this game because we have no one who can distribute the ball to the open man and believe me when guys are getting double teamed and tripled down low there are people open. We won games like this in the last 4 years when McIntosh was healthy because he could get the ball to the open man. None of these guys are capable of getting the ball to the open man because they either dribble to much or they have spent there whole life being that open man. Let’s hope there is a point guard in our future, and folks it’s not Gaines, but he is a very good 2 guard or slasher.

We has a LOT of open looks tonight; Pat Chambers acknowledged as much in the presser, If he's right, Vic makes a lot of those shots that he missed. And we missed 15 shots inside of five feet by my count, Can't win games that way; amazing it was a close as it was.

 

[Username Not Available]

It was close mostly because PSU shot maybe 50% of all of those free throws.

 

[mikewebb68]

But we haven't put that round object into the thingy with the net all season! At least in conference play. Its because we have a totally unbalanced roster in my opinion. Gaines is fun to watch, but he's a totally incomplete player. He can't shoot like a guard and can only go right. I still don't see why people like Greer. I think its just wishful thinking, frankly. So, I stand by my comment. We have not recruited a decent guard since BMac.

And I stand by mine, Gaines is a stud in the making. Greer should be playing in high school, this year, yet he has still contributed in spots. Agree to disagree I guess.

 

[mikewebb68]

It was close mostly because PSU shot maybe 50% of all of those free throws.

But they always do that. That's why they haven't been able to close out games, because people just foul them and they miss. But you have to be able to score yourself to capitalize on those opportunities.,

 

[Purple Pile Driver]

If I had been watching this game in Evanston, I'd be asking for a refund. Just a TERRIBLE performance by the Wildcats. UGH.

Don’t worry there was no one there.

 

[freewillie07]

We has a LOT of open looks tonight; Pat Chambers acknowledged as much in the presser, If he's right, Vic makes a lot of those shots that he missed. And we missed 15 shots inside of five feet by my count, Can't win games that way; amazing it was a close as it was.

Honest question: do you understand what NU is trying to do on offense? And do you think that they are executing whatever they’re supposed to be doing well? To me, it’s besides the point that NU “missed shots.” I just don’t sense any offensive flow whatsoever. NU kept it close with a few timely 3s and the occasional Pardon postup, but that’s about it.

 

[Purple Pile Driver]

Don't know about Turner, but EVERYBODY and his brother wanted Taylor. So it it was a Collins miss, it was a miss for half the coaches in the league...

He is playing the wrong position out of necessity,

 

[mikewebb68]

Honest question: do you understand what NU is trying to do on offense? And do you think that they are executing whatever they’re supposed to be doing well? To me, it’s besides the point that NU “missed shots.” I just don’t sense any offensive flow whatsoever. NU kept it close with a few timely 3s and the occasional Pardon postup, but that’s about it.

Yup, I do, They actually have a lot of well-crafted sets. It's really quite simple, when Law goes 3-17, we are not terribly likely to win. He is in a terrible funk due to injury or something, and the rest of our season depends on him coming out of it. Look at it this way-- ig Lamar Stevens suddenly forgot how to score, how many points do you think we would have beaten Penn St. by tonight? Double digits, easily. Law scoring even decently opens up so many things for other players.

 

[Purple Pile Driver]

The sad reality is that aside from that year, NU has not had a single postseason appearance under Collins. I know a lot of people around here dismiss the NIT, but you know what? You can sell that to recruits: "We were right on the bubble of making the NCAA Tournament last year. We missed getting in, but with you I'm confident we'll be dancing easily."

The 2017 class (Gaines's year) is case in point. All those recruits were signed before NU broke through. At that point, it was multiple years of no postseason. And NU missed on Brad Davison and Jordan Goodwin. And who knows, maybe Justin Smith and Luka Garza and Nojel Eastern would have given NU a longer look. Now I worry we are in the exact same situation with 2020 recruits.

You guys are going to have s field day with next years team. Can’t wait.

 

[lunker35]

I am not sure how good this staff is in evaluating talent. The frosh they recruited this year had offers from others programs so they must have some potential. But, the transfers--Turner and Taylor----really aren't Big ten players. Someone really over evaluated their potential.

Funny thing is Turner was a pretty decent ACC player. It’s really the coaching. Look at the offense we’ve been running, or lack thereof. We simply stand around the perimeter and don’t have any motion, rarely set picks, and then play hero ball when the shot clock runs down. I’m the last guy to ever back Carmody, but what he got out of his players was much better than what Collins is getting with far better talent.

 

[Purple Pile Driver]

Yup, I do, They actually have a lot of well-crafted sets. It's really quite simple, when Law goes 3-17, we are not terribly likely to win. He is in a terrible funk due to injury or something, and the rest of our season depends on him coming out of it. Look at it this way-- ig Lamar Stevens suddenly forgot how to score, how many points do you think we would have beaten Penn St. by tonight? Double digits, easily. Law scoring even decently opens up so many things for other players.

Actually, there were very few well crafted sets today. The problem is obvious. We are reduced to a screen and cut team that frankly doesn’t consistently cut hard. There is only one player that can effectively dribble and drive and he got frustration fouls that eliminated him from the game. Pardon works his *** off to get position and the ball is delivered too late where he gets doubled every single time. Whoever is the ballhandler dribbles and waved their arms until we get to 10 seconds on the clock, that ballhandler then proceeds to pass it backwards to a player at the deep top of the key. We then proceed to force up a tough 3 because there is nothing else going on. There were a bunch of terrible possessions today.

I was be very surprised if Boo Buie or some graduate transfer doesn’t start at PG next season. somebody has to be able to break down a defense. I like Kopp. You can see him being more assertive, I think we’ll get 10ppg from him next year. I think he will help Gaines as another option driving, but there is currently nobody on the roster that is going to be able to consistently run the offense. My hope is we can get about 15 strong minutes from Greer next year.

 

[Purple Pile Driver]

Funny thing is Turner was a pretty decent ACC player. It’s really the coaching. Look at the offense we’ve been running, or lack thereof. We simply stand around the perimeter and don’t have any motion, rarely set picks, and then play hero ball when the shot clock runs down. I’m the last guy to ever back Carmody, but what he got out of his players was much better than what Collins is getting with far better talent.

CCC doesn’t have a PG. Greer is the only one on the roster and he needs more time. Turner might be hurt too. Hs sure was grimacing plenty. He is forced into playing the wrong position. This was quite predictable. He should be much better when he is not a square peg in a round hole.

The lack of a PG is not a lot different than a football team without a QB. Please Hunter stay healthy.

 

[lunker35]

CCC doesn’t have a PG. Greer is the only one on the roster and he needs more time. Turner might be hurt too. Hs sure was grimacing plenty. He is forced into playing the wrong position. This was quite predictable. He should be much better when he is not a square peg in a round hole.

The lack of a PG is not a lot different than a football team without a QB. Please Hunter stay healthy.

Yeah but that’s on Collins and his recruiting. Agreed Turner will be much better when he’s playing the right position. I think the football team will still be OK if Hunter goes down because we’ve recruited well at QB. Lathon was something that is a compete rarity but the offense still has no creativity.

 

[stpaulcat]

Collins may not be the right hire unfortunately.

Predictable. It is NOT Collins. Carmody proved that, without question. It has something to do with the lack of history of NU basketball, which in spite of a long drought, is not true of NU Football. It will take a lot longer to bring basketball to a higher level than it has with football. Unless they abolish the Political Science Department, and divert the money. Take the long view, and stop the fricking whining.

 

[stpaulcat]

So glad I'm a football fan.

Time for some "Fitzcounselling".

 

[mikewebb68]

CCC doesn’t have a PG. Greer is the only one on the roster and he needs more time. Turner might be hurt too. Hs sure was grimacing plenty. He is forced into playing the wrong position. This was quite predictable. He should be much better when he is not a square peg in a round hole.

The lack of a PG is not a lot different than a football team without a QB. Please Hunter stay healthy.

Turner is definitely banged up, Was confirmed by CC.

 

[mikewebb68]

Yeah but that’s on Collins and his recruiting. Agreed Turner will be much better when he’s playing the right position. I think the football team will still be OK if Hunter goes down because we’ve recruited well at QB. Lathon was something that is a compete rarity but the offense still has no creativity.

There are several posts on the football board by posters far more knowledgeable than I indicating that, if we hadn't gotten Hunter, we would have been a a great deal of trouble...