Is there any reason to think the BBW won't be noticeably better than '22?

[gamecockcat]

Between the OT Cox who should be better than Horsey at LT, Horsey at LG should be better than Burton, Burton at C should be a wash with Eli (and, hopefully better), Eli at RG should be no worse than a wash (and, most likely, better) than Manning and whoever takes over at RT, should we the fans expect anything less than a much better OL than 2022? Granted, they may not be among the best editions of the BBW we've seen in recent years but it isn't ridiculous to expect much improvement, is it?

If so, I would expect Leary to be better than Will on short-to-intermediate routes with Will a better scrambler/run threat and deep ball. Running game should be better than last year even losing CRod if the BBW can perform up to snuff. I don't expect one guy to get the majority of snaps but the overall production should be better. Think we're deeper at RB with several guys capable of 400+ yards, given the opportunity. WRs and TEs should be better and better utilized with Coen calling/designing plays.

Or is this just wishful thinking in light of all the question marks we still have on the OL: is M. Cox > Horsey, is Burton >= Cox at C, can we find some answer at RT?

 

[docholiday51]

Between the OT Cox who should be better than Horsey at LT, Horsey at LG should be better than Burton, Burton at C should be a wash with Eli (and, hopefully better), Eli at RG should be no worse than a wash (and, most likely, better) than Manning and whoever takes over at RT, should we the fans expect anything less than a much better OL than 2022? Granted, they may not be among the best editions of the BBW we've seen in recent years but it isn't ridiculous to expect much improvement, is it?

If so, I would expect Leary to be better than Will on short-to-intermediate routes with Will a better scrambler/run threat and deep ball. Running game should be better than last year even losing CRod if the BBW can perform up to snuff. I don't expect one guy to get the majority of snaps but the overall production should be better. Think we're deeper at RB with several guys capable of 400+ yards, given the opportunity. WRs and TEs should be better and better utilized with Coen calling/designing plays.

Or is this just wishful thinking in light of all the question marks we still have on the OL: is M. Cox > Horsey, is Burton >= Cox at C, can we find some answer at RT?

Agree, moving on to the defense , it should be one of the top 2 in the Stoops era. Expecting a very good year for the Cats. Start 6-0 and go from there.

 

[Dead Cat Bounce]

I expect the OL will be greatly improved, and I believe that this improvement will be systemic:

Better players
Natural positions
Smarter OC
Deeper bench
Healthier QB

I’ll add this. I don’t expect Burton to be better than Cox, but I don’t think the Cats need him to be. Instead, I expect Horsey, Burton, Cox to be better than Cox, Burton, Manning

 

[Deeeefense]

They have all the pieces now to have a very productive offense, it's going to boil down to putting those pieces together into a well oil machine. That will not be an easy task with QB1, RB1, and 2 or 3 starting OL all coming from different teams through the portal not to mention a different OC from last year. Granted all of what I mentioned are upgrades but it's the jelling that will be a challenge. The D will be there and they have taken action to fix ST issues so on paper anyway they look to have a very strong team for 2023.

 

[Los Gatos]

A bit off topic of the BBW, but how do next years RBs compare to CRod as a pass protector?

 

[UKFirst]

Between the OT Cox who should be better than Horsey at LT, Horsey at LG should be better than Burton, Burton at C should be a wash with Eli (and, hopefully better), Eli at RG should be no worse than a wash (and, most likely, better) than Manning and whoever takes over at RT, should we the fans expect anything less than a much better OL than 2022? Granted, they may not be among the best editions of the BBW we've seen in recent years but it isn't ridiculous to expect much improvement, is it?

If so, I would expect Leary to be better than Will on short-to-intermediate routes with Will a better scrambler/run threat and deep ball. Running game should be better than last year even losing CRod if the BBW can perform up to snuff. I don't expect one guy to get the majority of snaps but the overall production should be better. Think we're deeper at RB with several guys capable of 400+ yards, given the opportunity. WRs and TEs should be better and better utilized with Coen calling/designing plays.

Or is this just wishful thinking in light of all the question marks we still have on the OL: is M. Cox > Horsey, is Burton >= Cox at C, can we find some answer at RT?

It’s not wishful thinking. We will definitely be a better oline than last year. We have upgraded every position group and have definitive depth at guard and center with some depth at OT. This will provide DL more time to process things post snap to very good receiving/ TE corp and allow better rushing lanes for a good group of RBs. I also expect LW to have a much better season this year because of this. Fingers crossed. It can’t be overstated enough having LC back in the fold. He understands personnel and hopefully keeps us from laying a few customary mid season eggs as well as winning that elusive SEC west road game this year.

 

[MrKentucky]

Where are the BBW I was promised?

 

[EdgeHD]

Between the OT Cox who should be better than Horsey at LT, Horsey at LG should be better than Burton, Burton at C should be a wash with Eli (and, hopefully better), Eli at RG should be no worse than a wash (and, most likely, better) than Manning and whoever takes over at RT, should we the fans expect anything less than a much better OL than 2022? Granted, they may not be among the best editions of the BBW we've seen in recent years but it isn't ridiculous to expect much improvement, is it?

If so, I would expect Leary to be better than Will on short-to-intermediate routes with Will a better scrambler/run threat and deep ball. Running game should be better than last year even losing CRod if the BBW can perform up to snuff. I don't expect one guy to get the majority of snaps but the overall production should be better. Think we're deeper at RB with several guys capable of 400+ yards, given the opportunity. WRs and TEs should be better and better utilized with Coen calling/designing plays.

Or is this just wishful thinking in light of all the question marks we still have on the OL: is M. Cox > Horsey, is Burton >= Cox at C, can we find some answer at RT?

I believe the BBW will play better next fall, but still will not be as good as it was in 2021.

With 4 handpicked OL transfers coming in and 4 starters returning, how could we not get better? With Coach Scan gone and Coen back, how could we not be better?

 

[Bigbluebill]

Ya boy is back in town!!

You should write a song about it!

Sky’s the limit.

I believe the BBW will play better next fall, but still will not be as good as it was in 2021.

With 4 handpicked OL transfers coming in and 4 starters returning, how could we not get better? With Coach Scan gone and Coen back, how could we not be better?

 

[Cobb4uk_rivals287622]

Between the OT Cox who should be better than Horsey at LT, Horsey at LG should be better than Burton, Burton at C should be a wash with Eli (and, hopefully better), Eli at RG should be no worse than a wash (and, most likely, better) than Manning and whoever takes over at RT, should we the fans expect anything less than a much better OL than 2022? Granted, they may not be among the best editions of the BBW we've seen in recent years but it isn't ridiculous to expect much improvement, is it?

If so, I would expect Leary to be better than Will on short-to-intermediate routes with Will a better scrambler/run threat and deep ball. Running game should be better than last year even losing CRod if the BBW can perform up to snuff. I don't expect one guy to get the majority of snaps but the overall production should be better. Think we're deeper at RB with several guys capable of 400+ yards, given the opportunity. WRs and TEs should be better and better utilized with Coen calling/designing plays.

Or is this just wishful thinking in light of all the question marks we still have on the OL: is M. Cox > Horsey, is Burton >= Cox at C, can we find some answer at RT?

Honestly think that with Coen back that will be the greatest advantage, he's understands how to utilize the talent to fit his offense. Last year Scag was just lost on how to utilize the talent he had.

 

[1Blouman]

Hopefully we find a long snapper.

 

[CRZ4UK]

Cautious optimism. The staff has earned it. Handpicked transfers is accurate but one came from a G5 school. The other tackle was running 2nd string at USC. We are moving Jager to center who played woefully at guard this year. With all these changes it’s impossible to predict how the line will perform in the SEC. It’s just a guess but I think Stoops believes Scang scheme was to blame for some of the bad line play. Why else would he fire the OC and keep the line coach?? On the other hand, why completely revamp the line with transfers if it was a scheme problem and not a lack of talent?? We will see in about 120 days.

 

[Davae9]

Cautious optimism. The staff has earned it. Handpicked transfers is accurate but one came from a G5 school. The other tackle was running 2nd string at USC. We are moving Jager to center who played woefully at guard this year. With all these changes it’s impossible to predict how the line will perform in the SEC. It’s just a guess but I think Stoops believes Scang scheme was to blame for some of the bad line play. Why else would he fire the OC and keep the line coach?? On the other hand, why completely revamp the line with transfers if it was a scheme problem and not a lack of talent?? We will see in about 120 days.

Saying that Courtland Ford was a second stringer at USC isn’t really accurate. He started for them at the beginning of 2022 at LT, got injured, and then became the starter for them again at LT by the bowl game against Tulane. Additionally, he also started for USC at LT for the majority of 2021. Calling him a second stringer is reductive when the one of the main reasons for him not starting was due to injuries.

 

[EdgeHD]

Stoops believes Scang scheme was to blame for some of the bad line play. Why else would he fire the OC and keep the line coach??

I imagine Stoops thinks the offensive line's problems were multifactorial, including losing the experience of Kinnard, Rosenthal, and Fortner. He fired Coach Scan because Scan did not do a good job as evidenced by the results. I think he kept Yenser because Coen wanted to keep him. If Coen wanted a new line coach, it would have happened that way. I heard somewhere that Stoops got great references on Yenser and looks at him as a developmental coaching talent who will stick around. The players like Yenser.

Yenser has not shown he can recruit. Before Yenser, Schlarman and Wolford were good recruiters. Yenser has to mesh with Coen and bring in some recruits. Developmental coaching talent with potential must turn into maturing coach with results.

 

[EdgeHD]

Saying that Courtland Ford was a second stringer at USC isn’t really accurate. He started for them at the beginning of 2022 at LT, got injured, and then became the starter for them again at LT by the bowl game against Tulane. Additionally, he also started for USC at LT for the majority of 2021. Calling him a second stringer is reductive when the one of the main reasons for him not starting was due to injuries.

As you say, Courtland Ford was not a second stringer. Ford was signed because he can do what Flax does well and he can also improve on what Flax does not do well. Flax is a senior but Ford can play in 24. Maybe Ford has a chance to be a two year starter. Reason enough. Then they got Christman who has less experience but maybe more talent. They compete in camp and the best man wins.

This is a better line than 2022 but not as good as 2021. There are no All Americans and no immediate NFL starters on this line, but there aren't 44 sacks either. Coen wants to use the good receivers and establish the passing game with Leary, as he did before with Robinson and Levis. Then run the ball when the defense has been loosened up by the passing game. This line is good enough to do that and deep enough to survive an injury or two. Burton must deliver in the middle, but I trust Coen there.

 

[cathouse_rivals216755]

I imagine Stoops thinks the offensive line's problems were multifactorial, including losing the experience of Kinnard, Rosenthal, and Fortner. He fired Coach Scan because Scan did not do a good job as evidenced by the results. I think he kept Yenser because Coen wanted to keep him. If Coen wanted a new line coach, it would have happened that way. I heard somewhere that Stoops got great references on Yenser and looks at him as a developmental coaching talent who will stick around. The players like Yenser.

Yenser has not shown he can recruit. Before Yenser, Schlarman and Wolford were good recruiters. Yenser has to mesh with Coen and bring in some recruits. Developmental coaching talent with potential must turn into maturing coach with results.

Bingo.
You answered the ops original question.

We have an unproven OLine coach. Easy to place all the blame on Scang and the players, but the O Line coach has shown us nothing to make us believe he can 1. Recruit
2. Develop.
3. Build room chemistry.
4. Game plan
5. Know how to scheme for a simple line stunt. Ugh!!

School is still out on Yenser as far as I'm concerned. I would rather have Drake Jackson coaching the line.....

 

[dvillecatfan]

Topic is pointless without pics

 

[PoBilly]

Played both sides of the ball over 40 years ago. Loved Defense but was good at either. I played all 5 spots on offense during my days of playing and Guard is by far the easiest line position. Left tackle and Center are the hardest. Having the right guys in those spots is the difference in a great / good / bad line. Also RB makes a difference in pass blocking. Our guys were not good last year most of the year. I bet between now and August there will be plenty of competition for C position with everyone (including Freshmen) getting a shot to show what they have. The most intelligent with the meanest attitude will win out as guys will follow them. Need a leader there. Left Tackle will be interesting so will right but I think we will be greatly improved. The only thing you cannot teach is the mean nasty attitude needed to protect the guy behind them. Plow blocking is mostly strength and we know we get guys ready for SEC play. It is the RPO that is very hard for the OLINE.

 

[Magilla Gorillla]

The O line can be awful and would still be noticeably better than last year.

 

[Bluetick2100]

Entire thread and QB was mention only once I believe.

Surprised at the lack of QB conversation.

 

[EdgeHD]

We have an unproven OLine coach. Easy to place all the blame on Scang and the players, but the O Line coach has shown us nothing to make us believe he can 1. Recruit
2. Develop.
3. Build room chemistry.
4. Game plan
5. Know how to scheme for a simple line stunt. Ugh!!

School is still out on Yenser as far as I'm concerned. I would rather have Drake Jackson coaching the line.....

Yenser has shown he can build chemistry and run a positive room. His players like him and play hard for him. We are attracting transfers like Marques Cox, Courtland Ford, and Ben Christman because they want to play for Yenser. That is good. Aside from that, I cannot argue with what you said. He has not recruited yet, and his guys gave up 44 sacks to a certain degree because of nonexecution. Stoops is expecting more than that and Yenser has to deliver it this year. He has to recruit, and Burton and the other young guys need to be developed. I have not given up on Yenser because I can see Coen wants him around. Coen knows what he is doing. But it is time to deliver.

 

[gamecockcat]

One of the problems with Scan's strategy was, seemingly, the majority of passing downs we ran very slow-developing plays down the field. I can't tell you how many times I'd scream at the TV when it was 3rd-and-6 and we'd run 4 receivers 15 yards down the field. Coen/McVay system seems to have receivers at every level so the QB doesn't have to wait 3+ seconds for receivers to get down the field. There is almost always some outlet receiver in the flat, one in mid-range and one further down the field. It just seemed last year we'd be in obvious passing situations and every route was >10 yards down the field. Having to keep RBs in to help the OL meant there weren't many safety valve throws so Levis had to wait, and wait and wait for the play to develop. The scheme itself may have been logically sound but we didn't have the ability to execute it and Scan didn't make many adjustments to compensate.

 

[EdgeHD]

One of the problems with Scan's strategy was, seemingly, the majority of passing downs we ran very slow-developing plays down the field. I can't tell you how many times I'd scream at the TV when it was 3rd-and-6 and we'd run 4 receivers 15 yards down the field. Coen/McVay system seems to have receivers at every level so the QB doesn't have to wait 3+ seconds for receivers to get down the field. There is almost always some outlet receiver in the flat, one in mid-range and one further down the field. It just seemed last year we'd be in obvious passing situations and every route was >10 yards down the field. Having to keep RBs in to help the OL meant there weren't many safety valve throws so Levis had to wait, and wait and wait for the play to develop. The scheme itself may have been logically sound but we didn't have the ability to execute it and Scan didn't make many adjustments to compensate.

Maybe so. There was a certain amount of that for sure. But so many times, Levis just couldn't pick up his safety route because he was watching the pass rush develop, or because he was locked onto the primary. Not picking on Levis. He did some great things for us. But it is hard to be successful when you get sacked 44 times. That is a chicken and egg. The more you get sacked, the more you focus on the pass rush. And the more you focus on the pass rush, the more you get sacked. Coen will not allow that. Coen is a chess player, while Scan was playing checkers out there.

 

[cathouse_rivals216755]

I expect the OL will be greatly improved, and I believe that this improvement will be systemic:

Better players
Natural positions
Smarter OC
Deeper bench
Healthier QB

I’ll add this. I don’t expect Burton to be better than Cox, but I don’t think the Cats need him to be. Instead, I expect Horsey, Burton, Cox to be better than Cox, Burton, Manning

I am still not convinced that Burton will be starting Center by the start of the games.

There is a reason CMS went out and brought in additional O- linemen and I don't think it was all for depth reasons.

Still searching for starters IMO.

 

[EdgeHD]

I am still not convinced that Burton will be starting Center by the start of the games.

There is a reason CMS went out and brought in additional O- linemen and I don't think it was all for depth reasons.

Still searching for starters IMO.

Burton won the center job last month. Coen wanted him to move to center and Coen said he was pleased with the move. That answers it. If you do not think Burton is the starting center, then who? The second string center is a true freshman.

Four starters seem set. The right tackle could be Flax, Ford, or Christman. I would put my chips on Ford, but he has to lock down the job in preseason camp.

Hall, Rodriguez, Bingham, Bowles, and the losers of the right tackle battle seem like the first backups that will play. Keenum might be a redshirt.

 

[cathouse_rivals216755]

Burton won the center job last month. Coen wanted him to move to center and Coen said he was pleased with the move. That answers it. If you do not think Burton is the starting center, then who? The second string center is a true freshman.

Four starters seem set. The right tackle could be Flax, Ford, or Christman. I would put my chips on Ford, but he has to lock down the job in preseason camp.

Hall, Rodriguez, Bingham, Bowles, and the losers of the right tackle battle seem like the first backups that will play. Keenum might be a redshirt.

Cox moves back to center and one of the transfers takes his guard spot.

 

[cathouse_rivals216755]

Entire thread and QB was mention only once I believe.

Surprised at the lack of QB conversation.

If Leary can read the defense and complete a 5 yard safety dump off, QB play will be much improved... ...even with a mediocre O Line.

 

[KA4Prez_rivals78700]

Ray Davis is a DOG and will make the running game more explosive than it has been with Snell and Rodriguez. Hopefully Jefferson is good to go and the depth can handle some work. I expect the running game to be more effective.

 

[KA4Prez_rivals78700]

The pass pro, is still the major concern. Unlike Will Levis, Devin Leary will not survive the season if the OL looks anything close to what it was in 2022.

 

[Mr Schwump]

OL has to play as a unit to be really good. How quickly the new players fit in will be key.

 

[SECCountry75]

Dylan Ray transferring in from W Virginia.

 

[Mr Schwump]

Dylan Ray transferring in from W Virginia.

Walk on.

 

[SECCountry75]

Walk on.

Really? He was on scholarship at W Virginia.

 

[richbrookstomato]

Really? He was on scholarship at W Virginia.

No he wasn’t. But still has the body to put on weight and hopefully develop into a contributor.

 

[Mr Schwump]

Really? He was on scholarship at W Virginia.

Seems I read he had NEARLY earned a scholarship.

 

[MattTheCat]

Jager Burton will be our starting center,



(At 11:25)
(Reporter)“Liam, what position group has impressed you most this spring?”
(Coen)“Honestly, Jager Burton, the center.”

 

[cathouse_rivals216755]

Jager Burton will be our starting center,



(At 11:25)
(Reporter)“Liam, what position group has impressed you most this spring?”
(Coen)“Honestly, Jager Burton, the center.”

"Who's going to carry that torch and take it over?"

We hear what we want to hear.

"Who's going to take that next step?"

 

[MattTheCat]

"Who's going to carry that torch and take it over?"

We hear what we want to hear.

"Who's going to take that next step?"

No, I listened to it all & heard every word. I don’t have any bias or loyalty toward Jager Burton over any other player on the team. I want the best player at each position. I’m just saying it’s obvious the staff is planning for him to be the starting center in 2023, & to interpret otherwise it’s quite a reach.

I’ll add another that you conveniently left out. “it’s just about ‘hey can the kid handle it mentally’ which Luke could and Jager can”. He wasn’t even asked about Jager specifically, he was asked about the center position & named Jager (and only Jager) when speaking about the center position. Also, no where in there did he say “who’s going to take the next step” like it’s a wide open competition & he’s waiting for someone to emerge. After he said Jager can do it mentally he said “it’s about taking that next step in terms of accountability to all 11…”

I don’t know why people (or maybe just 1 or 2 people) are reaching & trying to say Jager won’t be the center when it’s obvious.

Are you/they using the fact that he didn’t play well at guard at times? Because that has nothing to do with playing center. It’s a totally different position that takes different mental & physical capabilities. We saw Eli play well at guard and not so well at center, because it’s a different position. Center is more mentally demanding. The best center that I ever saw play at Kentucky is on the sidelines with a clipboard in his hand because he couldn’t physically play guard (and I’m glad Drake is here). He could have played center, but with 53 man rosters not many teams draft O-Linemen that can only play 1 position…not when there are guys like Fortner out there that can play any interior OL position. Fortner was/is able to do it because he’s physically big & strong enough to play guard & also smart as **** (on & off the field).

 

[cathouse_rivals216755]

No, I listened to it all & heard every word. I don’t have any bias or loyalty toward Jager Burton over any other player on the team. I want the best player at each position. I’m just saying it’s obvious the staff is planning for him to be the starting center in 2023, & to interpret otherwise it’s quite a reach.

I’ll add another that you conveniently left out. “it’s just about ‘hey can the kid handle it mentally’ which Luke could and Jager can”. He wasn’t even asked about Jager specifically, he was asked about the center position & named Jager (and only Jager) when speaking about the center position. Also, no where in there did he say “who’s going to take the next step” like it’s a wide open competition & he’s waiting for someone to emerge. After he said Jager can do it mentally he said “it’s about taking that next step in terms of accountability to all 11…”

I don’t know why people (or maybe just 1 or 2 people) are reaching & trying to say Jager won’t be the center when it’s obvious.

Are you/they using the fact that he didn’t play well at guard at times? Because that has nothing to do with playing center. It’s a totally different position that takes different mental & physical capabilities. We saw Eli play well at guard and not so well at center, because it’s a different position. Center is more mentally demanding. The best center that I ever saw play at Kentucky is on the sidelines with a clipboard in his hand because he couldn’t physically play guard (and I’m glad Drake is here). He could have played center, but with 53 man rosters not many teams draft O-Linemen that can only play 1 position…not when there are guys like Fortner out there that can play any interior OL position. Fortner was/is able to do it because he’s physically big & strong enough to play guard & also smart as **** (on & off the field).

What Coen DIDN'T SAY was that Jager WILL BE our starting Center.

I am rooting for this young man to nail down that position and hoping he can play it well enough to not be a liability to the offense until he gets some game experience at that position.

We all know what it looks like when the staff gets that position wrong. It has cost us games in the past.

That being said, I believe that Jager will get the first chance to prove he can play that position. But I also know if he plays as poorly mentally as he did at Guard last year, he will not be the starting Center very long.

If he doesn't have a great fall, Cox will most likely slide back to center and one of the transfer guys will move into the Guard spot.

JMO. No need to get upset. I have no agenda and once again, I am pulling hard for this Kentucky Kid to grab the position IF he is the best Center available.

The good news is we have some easy early games for him to gain game experience at C if he is named the early starter.

 

[JHB4UK]

Entire thread and QB was mention only once I believe.

Surprised at the lack of QB conversation.

Yes, Leary will probably do a better job than Levis of recognizing rushes and adjusting pass protection presnap, good point