in their 1st game back after 20 day Covid break, MSU manages all of 37 points & loses by 30. Most would say MSU has better talent than NU. They may, like Nu a couple of years ago, lack an effective point guard but they certainly have highly touted guys there. While I think there are things that CCC might do better, for those who think he can't coach & should go, just wondered if you think Izzo, with a worse record than NU & having lost to NU, also can't coach.
MSU crushed by Rutgers
- Thread starter NVAcat
- Start date
Tell you what, if Collins goes to the NCAA Tournament 23 years in a row, goes to 8 Final Fours, wins a national championship, and wins 10 Big Ten regular season titles and 6 Big Ten Tournament titles, nobody here will complain at all or question his coaching ability if he follows that up with one bad season.
While you can say this with accuracy about Izzo, it takes away from the original point. Collins can coach. Players actually need to put the ball in the hoop and our guys do it with more inconsistency than most other teams. Simple as that right now, for Collins’ and for Izzo’s team. If Collins can somehow (despite our history) improve this with better players (of the sort Izzo has had over the decades), he’ll be doing a great job, not just a solid job as he is now.
Better players always helps, but I don't think it's fair to say the difference between Izzo and Collins is better players. Izzo is a hall of famer and one of the greatest college coaches ever. Collins is the subject of message board debates about whether he should be fired.
This is a poor criteria for judging whether someone is a good coach or not. If you want to go this route, than 95% of the coaches in America are terrible. Bekuz fanz alwayz wont MOAR!
Of course.... that was just a smart *** comment by me at the end. The whole premise is that Izzo is a way better coach than Collins at this stage and it's not just because his players are inherently better.
Sure, just like the 12 other schools in the conference with similar admission policies have done just as well on the court as Michigan State.
Wait a minute.
If anyone inside NU believed that, admissions would change tomorrow. Any trouble the bball program could get into would be far out weighed by the brand recognition it brought to the school.
Said another way - why has Izzo failed this year with players better than ours? He’s somehow become a bad coach? No - he has a system and those players are not adapting well to it, for whatever myriad of reasons. Variables and randomness enter in. Collins has a good system (enough to very unexpectedly take lower ranked players to the Dance) and has not yet gotten his players to the level of continued success we all want. It’s hard work and full of variables and uncertainty and can’t be judged on a straight line path.
A part of me wants to believe this. Watching our players miss open shots, blow layups, and not make clutch plays makes me think there is only so much a coach can do. Everybody has a plan (or system) until they get punched in the mouth. How they respond to pressure and adversity is on the players.
This is where I'm at right now. In the last three games, we're shooting 13-47 on open 3-pointers. 27.7%! On open shots! This is not on Collins, who has put the offense in place to get his players 16 open 3-pointers per game, and it is on the players, who have made very few of those open shots.
Not to put down CCC, but Izzo has a long record of success over many seasons. It's a mistake to compare them on the basis of this season alone.
Whether Collins system is good or not is largely dependent on his being able to recruit players to fit it in in depth to compete. Whether the system is good or not also is in part dependent on whether its design matches the demands of the B1G rather than the ACC. I think a good argument can be made that the B1G requires a 5 and 4 combination that an defend against lane penetration and get defensive rebounds; the only Collins team that had this combination was the Pardon Lumpkin tournament team (and he did not recruit Sanjay). I think the Collins’ offense design favors quick wings who shoot well and run uptempo. At this point, I don’t think Collins has demonstrated that his system will produce consistent competitive teams at NU, despite having one good year.
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Not a mistake. It's ridiculous.
All this shows me is that MSU is having a down year, and that NUs "big win" over #4 was fool's gold. Anyone who thinks Collins is as good a coach as Izzo needs help
You are what your record says you are.