PSU's final AP ranking 1967-2021. From greatness to pretty good to average...judge for yourself

[hapval8286]

Been a PSU fan since the early 80's. I was thinking about the slow but steady decline in football dominance that, in all honesty, has been happening for decades now. So, I looked up PSU's final season AP rankings to see how it has trended over the last 55 years. It's really sobering to see, by the numbers, how it has changed since 1987.

Up until 1667, PSU was hardly ever ranked in the final AP polls. Stats taken from site below.
Penn State Nittany Lions Football Record By Year | College Football at Sports-Reference.com

From 1967-1986 (20 seasons) Best time have been a PSU fan
-15 seasons ranked in top 10
-10 season ranked in top 5
- 3 seasons, 68,69,73 undefeated but not ranked #1 (2 seasons at #2 and 1 season at #5)
- 2 national championships (82 and 86)
- 3 seasons unranked

From 1987-1999 (13 seasons)
- 4 seasons ranked in top 10
- 2 seasons ranked in top 5
- 1 undefeated season 1994 (ranked #2)
- 0 national championships (I don't agree)
- 3 unranked seasons

From 2000-2011 (12 seasons)
- 3 seasons ranked top 10
- 1 season ranked top 5
- 7 unranked seasons

From 2012-2021 (10 seasons)
- 3 seasons ranked top 10
- 0 seasons ranked top 5
- 7 unranked seasons (I included 2021)

 

[Sharkies]

Up until 1667, PSU was hardly ever ranked in the final AP polls.

Spain, Portugal and the Ottoman Empire were incredible powers that kept us out.

 

[EddyS]

Thank you Joe.

 

[Bvillebaron]

Been a PSU fan since the early 80's. I was thinking about the slow but steady decline in football dominance that, in all honesty, has been happening for decades now. So, I looked up PSU's final season AP rankings to see how it has trended over the last 55 years. It's really sobering to see, by the numbers, how it has changed since 1987.

Up until 1667, PSU was hardly ever ranked in the final AP polls. Stats taken from site below.
Penn State Nittany Lions Football Record By Year | College Football at Sports-Reference.com

From 1967-1986 (20 seasons) Best time have been a PSU fan
-15 seasons ranked in top 10
-10 season ranked in top 5
- 3 seasons, 68,69,73 undefeated but not ranked #1 (2 seasons at #2 and 1 season at #5)
- 2 national championships (82 and 86)
- 3 seasons unranked

From 1987-1999 (13 seasons)
- 4 seasons ranked in top 10
- 2 seasons ranked in top 5
- 1 undefeated season 1994 (ranked #2)
- 0 national championships (I don't agree)
- 3 unranked seasons

From 2000-2011 (12 seasons)
- 3 seasons ranked top 10
- 1 season ranked top 5
- 7 unranked seasons

From 2012-2021 (10 seasons)
- 3 seasons ranked top 10
- 0 seasons ranked top 5
- 7 unranked seasons (I included 2021)

Interesting. I agree about 1994. Clearly the schedule ramped up when PSU joined the Big in 1990.

 

[hapval8286]

Spain, Portugal and the Ottoman Empire were incredible powers that kept us out.

too funny...1667. good catch

 

[bbb2021]

If we're being fair, the schedule now is a lot more difficult to get through and attain a top 5 or 10 ranking than it was a few decades ago

 

[Mufasa94]

Interesting. I agree about 1994. Clearly the schedule ramped up when PSU joined the Big in 1990.

Clearly you don’t know much of the 80s.

 

[NEPA Lion]

Clearly you don’t know much of the 80s.

PSU won the NC playing the toughest schedule in the nation that year. Something you won't see this year
or any time soon.

 

[PSU87]

Interesting. I agree about 1994. Clearly the schedule ramped up when PSU joined the Big in 1990.

Our record the three years prior to joining the Big Ten were worse than the three years after joining....so the data doesn't really support that. You're seeing the results of an aging JoePa that didn't quite have it anymore, and unfair sanctions.

As someone else pointed out, our schedule in '82 was ranked #1.

 

[Nitt1300]

but..... I thought we never had seasons as bad as 8-4

am I remembering a history we never had?

 

[Bvillebaron]

Our record the three years prior to joining the Big Ten were worse than the three years after joining....so the data doesn't really support that. You're seeing the results of an aging JoePa that didn't quite have it anymore, and unfair sanctions.

As someone else pointed out, our schedule in '82 was ranked #1.

You are forming conclusions based on single or three year seasons? What you cite is correct but the schedule on balance is far more difficult since PSU joined the Big Ten.

 

[psu31trap]

Been a PSU fan since the early 80's. I was thinking about the slow but steady decline in football dominance that, in all honesty, has been happening for decades now. So, I looked up PSU's final season AP rankings to see how it has trended over the last 55 years. It's really sobering to see, by the numbers, how it has changed since 1987.

Up until 1667, PSU was hardly ever ranked in the final AP polls. Stats taken from site below.
Penn State Nittany Lions Football Record By Year | College Football at Sports-Reference.com

From 1967-1986 (20 seasons) Best time have been a PSU fan
-15 seasons ranked in top 10
-10 season ranked in top 5
- 3 seasons, 68,69,73 undefeated but not ranked #1 (2 seasons at #2 and 1 season at #5)
- 2 national championships (82 and 86)
- 3 seasons unranked

From 1987-1999 (13 seasons)
- 4 seasons ranked in top 10
- 2 seasons ranked in top 5
- 1 undefeated season 1994 (ranked #2)
- 0 national championships (I don't agree)
- 3 unranked seasons

From 2000-2011 (12 seasons)
- 3 seasons ranked top 10
- 1 season ranked top 5
- 7 unranked seasons

From 2012-2021 (10 seasons)
- 3 seasons ranked top 10
- 0 seasons ranked top 5
- 7 unranked seasons (I included 2021)

There’s one thing missing in my opinion. I believe Penn State played in a total of 4 NC. Even though they lost to Alabama and Oklahoma it’s a stats that illustrates their sheer dominance during that era.

 

[PSU87]

You are forming conclusions based on single or three year seasons? What you cite is correct but the schedule on balance is far more difficult since PSU joined the Big Ten.

Conclusions that look at longer time frames start to bring in other variables.

Was Joe as effective in 2009 as he was in 1989? No way.
Sanctions? Do you think increased strength of schedule was the sole contribution to poorer records during those sanction years?

I think to say our schedule is far more difficult since we joined the Big Ten is untrue.

We were playing the likes of Bama, Notre Dame, Nebraska and Pitt year in year out. West Virginia Syracuse BC > Indiana Illinois Purdue most years.

Is 2021 Illinois better than 1983 Boston College....I don't think so. I think we are worse....

 

[Mufasa94]

Interesting. I agree about 1994. Clearly the schedule ramped up when PSU joined the Big in 1990.

If we're being fair, the schedule now is a lot more difficult to get through and attain a top 5 or 10 ranking than it was a few decades ago

You are forming conclusions based on single or three year seasons? What you cite is correct but the schedule on balance is far more difficult since PSU joined the Big Ten.

At least the posters on the other side of the way of thinking provided something. I haven't seen one bit of evidence to support these quoted claims that initiated. I'll add some more counter facts: Looking at the top 9 seasons since PSU joined the Big 10 with the top 9 seasons in the preceding 20 years, we have the following cumulative statistics:

Overall Record:
< 1993: 99-10-0 .908
> 1993: 99-16-0 .861

Opp Cumulative Records:
< 1993: 698-526-21 .569
> 1993: 744-624-06 .546 (does not include any record for 3 non-1-A/FBS opponents)

Opp in Final Rankings: (Top 5 + Top 10 + Top 20 = Total)
< 1993: 8+7+18 = 33
> 1993: 7+6+19 = 32

These are based on the following seasons.
Pre: 1973, 1977, 1978, 1980, 1981, 1982, 1985, 1986, 1991
Post: 1993, 1994, 1996, 2005, 2008, 2009, 2016, 2017, 2019

 

[jimjim47]

That's what happens when you join the BIG 10 and stop playing Temple every year.

 

[Tom_PSU]

That's what happens when you join the BIG 10 and stop playing Temple every year.

Yeah since you guys haven’t won a non shared National Championship, and only one co shared since the 1940’s pretty much proves your point.

 

[Bvillebaron]

Conclusions that look at longer time frames start to bring in other variables.

Was Joe as effective in 2009 as he was in 1989? No way.
Sanctions? Do you think increased strength of schedule was the sole contribution to poorer records during those sanction years?

I think to say our schedule is far more difficult since we joined the Big Ten is untrue.

We were playing the likes of Bama, Notre Dame, Nebraska and Pitt year in year out. West Virginia Syracuse BC > Indiana Illinois Purdue most years.

Is 2021 Illinois better than 1983 Boston College....I don't think so. I think we are worse....

Well then we agree to disagree. What year did PSU play Bama, ND, Nebraska and Pitt in the same year? This year for example, we have or will play Wisconsin, Iowa, OSU, Michigan, MSU and Auburn in the same season.

 

[PSU87]

Well then we agree to disagree. What year did PSU play Bama, ND, Nebraska and Pitt in the same year? This year for example, we have or will play Wisconsin, Iowa, OSU, Michigan, MSU and Auburn in the same season.

1982 for sure....I'd have to look at some other years. WVU was ranked in 82 as well....

Iowa? No.
Wisky got curb stomped by ND so not sure I'd concede to that one either.

I'm not saying the schedule isn't tough this year at all.

But I don't agree that the schedule is year over year tougher in the Big Ten than it was pre Big Ten

 

[Alphalion75]

Interesting. I agree about 1994. Clearly the schedule ramped up when PSU joined the Big in 1990.

I'm not sure about that. Syracuse, Boston College and West Virginia had some very good teams during that period. We were also playing teams like Notre Dame, Miami, Nebraska (when they were good), Bama and Southern Cal. Lots of great competition.

 

[Mufasa94]

Well then we agree to disagree. What year did PSU play Bama, ND, Nebraska and Pitt in the same year? This year for example, we have or will play Wisconsin, Iowa, OSU, Michigan, MSU and Auburn in the same season.

First off, no doubt this years PSU schedule is difficult. 2019 also was, as were many others while they've been in the B1G. But, I'm not going to let you off as easy as the other poster, especially when you brushed off his example with "forming conclusions based on single or three year seasons" and then you provided an example of this single year. You initiated the comparison idea earlier with:

...Clearly the schedule ramped up when PSU joined the Big in 1990.

While you may ignore my prior post listing all the more successful type seasons that showed the pre-B1G edition performed better against better competition. I'll expand it to include the additional solid, blehhh, and even unsuccessful seasons. As a comparison of the complete 20 years before starting conference play with the 20 years after starting conference play (1973-1992 vs. 1993-2012):

Yrs--Games-Top 20 opponents
<93: 240 75
>93: 247 65

So before you go tripling down on a clearly ignorant opinion (your question solidifies that description), do a little website/book research about PSU history. Here's a start of what you should have already found out because multiple posters tried pointing it out to you:

In '82 PSU was the first MNC team with the NCAA's toughest rated schedule. Yes, they played Bama, ND, Nebraska, and Pitt. Not all of them were top notch that year. They also played a ranked WVU team who beat OU out in Norman while being led by a future SB winning QB. They also beat an unranked 8-3-1 BC team with an emerging cfb phenom named Flutie. They capped it by beating #1 at the time UGA in the Sugar Bowl. Their opponents had a cumulative record of 88-50-2 (.636) with 5 being ranked (only top 20 then), and two others at 8-3-1 and 8-4. The two years that bookended that season had 6 top 20 opponents each.