It is of my opinion that Mark Stoops now has a starting line-up that can compete in the SEC. Not saying he has the depth but that is coming. Having said this, I believe if we are ever going to have a SEC quality football program then he should be given 4 more years on his contract and show potential recruits that he has the schools full support. He is recruiting better than any coach has done so in recent memory at UK and of course that is paramount. Of course wins and bowls are important but being able to replace a quality offensive lineman with one just as qualified is a luxury we have never enjoyed ?
Stoops, 4 more years ?
- Thread starter Trublupopeye
- Start date
Why don't we have depth? Was there some kind of probation with scholarship reductions?
Yes it's called Joker probation.
I prefer to call it mitch probation, I keep repeating, neither Brooks or Joker had a chance to win much at UK with the support they were given, and yes, Joker was not very good as a head coach, while I think Brooks did about as well as anyone could have with what he was given at UK. And yes, maybe unfair to blame it all on mitch MAYBE, but he was the one in charge and it is also unfair to blame it all on Joker, that had TWO four stars playing for him his first year as head coach while the seven SEC teams he played (not including Vandy, but including the two Misses) had AVERAGED 38 four star commits the previous four years------PLUS five stars.
Now it seems we are behind about 6,000 season ticket sales compared to Joker's first year as the head coach, and I think it is safe to say that almost all of that can be blamed on long time fans that followed UK through thick and thin giving up season tickets in the family for generations not just in protest of the dismal support but also because of his stupid remarks.
If not for the bad taste in fans mouth I think season ticket sales should be soaring when you look at the talent these coaches are bringing in, our best team in 07 had ONE 5.8 four star on offense (the starting 11 on Offense averaged less than a three star) and TWO (5.8 and 5.9) on D (all three from in state), while this team has enough four stars to start one at every position on offense and most positions on defense (maybe some out of position) IF that were all that mattered------and of course it isn't. But no longer do you have to watch the other team to see truly elite talent on the field except at a few positions, ie Cobb. You might note the difference in facilities AND coaching salaries that have had a lot to do with that recruiting. Even the widely criticized contract for the coaches has shown the recruits stability and that UK is now committed to football.
And yes I for one believe the unbelievable increase in raw talent coupled with more experience from both the players AND coaches (along with some changes) is going to pay off big on the field, if not this year then surely in 17.
Too much money involved not to be committed to football, too bad we wasted ten years with our penny wise pound foolish policies.
Joker probation is not a real thing. We don't have depth because of the coach fired 5 seasons ago?
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We have more depth than we've had at any point in my 28 years of living on this Earth. We don't have a lot of experience at QB, LB, and on the DL. We have some experience in the secondary but those guys are still very young with 3 starters being sophomores.
Stoops isn't going to need 4 more years to prove himself. The Cats will go bowling and win 3-4 SEC games this year. Next year the Cats will have enough talent, depth, AND experience to have a winning conference record for the first time since the 70's
Stoops isn't going to need 4 more years to prove himself. The Cats will go bowling and win 3-4 SEC games this year. Next year the Cats will have enough talent, depth, AND experience to have a winning conference record for the first time since the 70's
Offensively, we have begun to build a product that should score points but the turnover at OC has slowed the growth. Some consisetency there should help moving forward. Also, defensively our secondary has begun to take shape and look good, but the front 7 has had players with off the field issues and players who havent lived up to expectations so our defense hasnt begun to take shape fully either. I do think this staff (most of it anyway) does their job well. We just need consistency on both sides we just havent had and it starts with the staff and trickles down.
8-10....agreed. while we're at it lets go ahead and hang a 'we are great' banner on the stadium. we just don't need to see the performance first for any of these things.
His current contract gets him 2 more years but he will have to earn the other 2. [winking]
Peace
Peace
Thanks, I think I just figured out what SMH means.
I don't have a big problem with the first extension although I think a lot of money was thrown away, although that is about a million times better than making out DC (Brown) the "Co-DC" in order to save his buyout in the old days-------the miserable days that lasted over ten years.
But, as WC said, he will have to earn his next extension, which I think he will with the talent and coaching staff we FINALLY have, bowl game minimum this year and a very good year in 17.
But some fans need to realize that every other SEC team is fully invested in the arms race (MONEY) AND they have about a ten year head start on us-------quite a few decades really.
Actually he was fired three seasons ago and while he was HC brought in a paltry total of 4 offensive lineman his last two years with only one coming in his final year. Add to that he oversaw an offense that did not red shirt Jordan Swindle and Darrian Miller during his tenure. How much different would our offense have been last year with Swindle at RT and Miller at LT?
But why let facts get in the way of a good rant?
silly argument. We actually have more depth this year than we have had in many years, and will have more next year. Depth is a function of recruiting and retention, both of which are at levels I have not witnessed in decades.
I'm confused. He is currently under contract through 2019. Are you wanting him to be here through his existing contract or are you asking him to be extended through 2023?
My thoughts are thus:
-with the current contract he is all but assured the next 2 yrs without being fired.
-he has checked every box as a HC with gusto.....funding, recruiting, media, staff decisions, etc.....except winning.
-with all the boxes he's checked so far, if he can't get us to a bowl game or two at the end of 5 yrs coaching I'm not sure I think he should continue as coach. At that point we should take whatever momentum and roster we have and shoot the moon on a prime candidate.
But, I think he'll figure it out this coming yr and we gain even more momentum. If we have a stellar yr in 2016.....like 8+ wins.....and/or we make 2 bowl games back/back in 2016-2017......then give him an extension.
My thoughts are thus:
-with the current contract he is all but assured the next 2 yrs without being fired.
-he has checked every box as a HC with gusto.....funding, recruiting, media, staff decisions, etc.....except winning.
-with all the boxes he's checked so far, if he can't get us to a bowl game or two at the end of 5 yrs coaching I'm not sure I think he should continue as coach. At that point we should take whatever momentum and roster we have and shoot the moon on a prime candidate.
But, I think he'll figure it out this coming yr and we gain even more momentum. If we have a stellar yr in 2016.....like 8+ wins.....and/or we make 2 bowl games back/back in 2016-2017......then give him an extension.
Your obvious optimism, and your probable expertise, certainly exceed mine. For all of us, I sincerely hope your are correct.
My only thing is I worry even going in the right direction, it will be too slowly to keep people happy. Even a slow climb is worth an extension instead of a regime change. Who are we going to get better? Unless there is just a total collapse over the next year I wold give him 3-4 year extension.
But this isn't really true, is it?
The most worrisome boxes that he did not check really didn't have much to do with "winning", but rather simply fielding a well-prepared, competitive team. And he also did not check the boxes about good in-game decision making or clock management, either. And locker room off-the-field issues did not get completely checked either, did they?
The truth is he did not check many of the boxes a HC should, which is a far cry from "every box except winning."
I really don't understand why this guy gets such a pass all of the time.
And you of course pointed this all out while Joker was here and were very critical of the UK football program while all the above occurred? I would like to see your response, and see if the facts get in your way of a good rant. If you have ever posted a critical comment of any current UK coach, AD, or player on any internet site, I am sure I have missed it. Now once they are gone, sure, it is easy to pile on, but while they are the HC, they are completely above all reproach.
-Donations and upgrades are way up
-Fan expectations are way up
-Fan support is doing great considering the lack of winning
-Recruiting (on paper) is WAAAAAAAAY better than it ever has been.
-His staffs is (on paper) to be better than UK's typically is......as far as recruiting and reputation.
-off-field issues are not any different than any other program.
-Locker room stuff really only has existed due to lack of winning
-The media tends to love him
-He's not controversial
-Thus far is ethical
-Fielding a well-prepared competitive team and showing good in-game (including clock) management is where the "winning" comes from..... If he figures out this part of it, he's checked every box.
I agree with Jauk11. UK never had a chance until they agreed to pony up the money. I've said all along the football program crashed and burned not because of Joker but because of MB. Lack of funding never gave Joker a chance. Take a coach that's a 5 or 6 out of ten and he'll look like a 1 with no support. I'm not saying that's what Joker was, I'm saying we don't know because he never had a shot.
I don't disagree.
But that is a little bit like saying that the new chef hired at your restaurant has put together an exciting menu, great decor and friendly staff and "...if he ever figures out that whole turning on the stove and actually cooking something part of the job he will be one hell of a chef!"
But, that's only part of the story. The chef was given rotten vegatables and rancid meat to cook with.......and he's only been given fresh, young livestock and a seed garden that he has to grow and groom into usable ingredients.
It's difficult to judge actual performance with soooo many confounding variables.
Now, certainly, I think that he has had growing pains as far as his coaching prowess is concerned, but these are areas that can be corrected/improved. The questions now become:
1. Does he possess the ability to improve?
2. Will he have enough time (or will the talent allow him time) to improve?
My thoughts are that UK has had decent chef's here before, but they've never had good ingredients nor a stellar kitchen to prepare their goods. Now that we finally have a coach who has set up a kitchen and shopped for groceries, I'm more willing to be patient.
Us, UK fans, have suffered for decades upon decades. Another yr or two is not going to kill us.
I don't think some of you people understand how BIG OF A HOLE Joker Phillips left this program in.... You really don't.
He took 3 years and put us 8-10 years behind.
With what Stoops has done thus far with recruiting, THAT ALONE should give him 4+ years.
The winning on the field? Starts this season. This is now HIS full roster of players. It's going to happen.
He took 3 years and put us 8-10 years behind.
With what Stoops has done thus far with recruiting, THAT ALONE should give him 4+ years.
The winning on the field? Starts this season. This is now HIS full roster of players. It's going to happen.
Agree with most of this. The staff part is a bit of a head scratcher. We've had some pretty good staffs over the years. This staff is really light by UK standards and certainly by SEC standards. It's better this year than last but still probably the weakest in the SEC. Well ok, maybe USC and Missouri aren't better but still.
He's getting players now that some past HCs didn't even attempt to try and get but in the end, this year and next year, we have to win, we have to have a winning record, and we need a bowl game.
Hell, I would die for that kind of money.
Geez, I suspect I am going to die anyway.
I agree with most of your post but Joker took a team with TWO four stars playing (both JCs from California) with two walkons starting to offset them (Florida game) against a Florida team that AVERAGED over a 5.9 for the TWO DEEP starters and you expected him to be competitive with them on the road?
He also came within THREE points of the CAM led NCs that year, 39-36.
And if you think we have depth problems now depth was nonexistent then.
I repeat, neither Brooks or Joker had a chance to compete with the support they had, people criticize them for not going after the elite prospects that everyone wanted, but why should they have wasted their time after other coaches showed recruits pictures of our "recruiting room"?
AND we are being "led" (by our "leaders") into the same situation with the COA situation, while Bama corrected their inequity with Auburn in a day or two.
-Fan expectations are always high. - Fan support is waning, look at season ticket sales. - locker room stuff kept the team from winning. Kind of a chicken or egg argument. - team looks woefully unprepared most games. - Stars are great but very little player development once they are in Lexington.
Yep. The last few yrs we've come out of the gate well. They weren't as under prepared or poorly coached the first half of the yr. Sure, there were some coaching mistakes that you typically see from a rookie/novice HC, but they weren't grossly unprepared or poorly coached. Did the staff forget how to coach the last half of each of the last 2 yrs? Nope. Something else caused the collapse. It wasn't locker room issues....because this has been decent in the first half of the last few yrs. No, the problem has been lack of depth and lack of team maturity. We didn't field extreme takent across the board that could pull us along. We didn't have a large crop of upperclass leaders to pull everyone along. We had a shallow group of young players. Young players that makes it hard to adjust from scheme to scheme.