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What is one thing that makes you know that God is real.

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Supreme Lord Z

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We can say conclusively that some mechanism outside our understanding of creation exists. Some completely unknown process. The Big Bang, evolution, all the accepted ideas of creation and evolution are compelling but not in explaining an ultimate creation. The idea that something "swirled" and thus triggered an explosion from nothing is idiotic on its face. We simply do not possess the intellectual capability to fathom what that unknown process is so like humans have done throughout history, we make up magical stories to explain away what it is we do not understand. Your "God" is no different than ancient stories for why the sun rises or the oceans roil, you are giving a name to what you do not understand in order to comfort yourselves. The unknown is terrifying. All those endless years of nothingness awaiting you.

Why fear it? You've already done it. You have already been dead. You were dead for untold eons before you were born. You crossed an endless expanse of time to dance in fleeting moments of life. Why spend it so foolishly? Why fear what you are more experienced at than anything else? Are you afraid of 100 years ago? 1000? So why fear what comes after death... you are merely returning to that which you are most familiar. The sweet infinite comfort of an endless nothingness.
 
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Supreme Lord Z

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BlueThruAndThru said:
I'm going to regret this but here-a-goes:

"Some estimates peg the Milky Way's star mass as having 100 billion "solar masses," or 100 billion times the mass of the sun. Averaging out the types of stars within our galaxy, this would produce an answer of about 100 billion stars in the galaxy....

Kornreich used a very rough estimate of 10 trillion galaxies in the universe. Multiplying that by the Milky Way's estimated 100 billion stars results in a large number indeed: 1,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000 stars, or a "1" with 24 zeros after it."

That's a lot of stars. As you know, our solar system with one star has 8 or 9 planets. One of them has life.

So it's pretty reasonable to assume there are many planets that are in the "goldilocks" zone.

I'm not debating whether there is a God or not but to say:



well, it's not that amazing. In fact, it may just be commonplace.
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I'm sorry, but I've seen this argument and a thousand other iterations of it in one idiotic form or another. The idea being there are billions of other planets and thus life is out there yada, yada, yada...

But it ignores the central crushing factor of time. Of course life flickers into and out of being all over the universe. Your numbers are compelling to make that case. But in the endless expanse of time and distance, what are the chances that two separate life forms will come into being at the same moment in time and gain the ability to detect the other before blinking out of existence?

When you understand how slim are the chance of that happening then the explanation becomes clearer.

The moment life emerges on a planet then the clock starts ticking. The chances it will evolve far enough fast enough to detect other life around them in the universe when measured against the immense span of time and space are actually quite small.

People always forget the time factor. They always instinctively think in terms of everything starting from the same point. We are a fleeting blip that does not even register on our own geological earth scale, let alone that of the universe.
 
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BlueThruAndThru_rivals115784

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Supreme Lord Z said:
I'm sorry, but I've seen this argument and a thousand other iterations of it in one idiotic form or another. The idea being there are billions of other planets and thus life is out there yada, yada, yada...

But it ignores the central crushing factor of time. Of course life flickers into and out of being all over the universe. Your numbers are compelling to make that case. But in the endless expanse of time and distance, what are the chances that two separate life forms will come into being at the same moment in time and gain the ability to detect the other before blinking out of existence?

When you understand how slim are the chance of that happening then the explanation becomes clearer.

The moment life emerges on a planet then the clock starts ticking. The chances it will evolve far enough fast enough to detect other life around them in the universe when measured against the immense span of time and space are actually quite small.

People always forget the time factor. They always instinctively think in terms of everything starting from the same point. We are a fleeting blip that does not even register on our own geological earth scale, let alone that of the universe.
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Did you read my quote?

I was only disputing the statement of "amazingness" that the OP made for Earth being in a zone that could sustain life.

I don't think you can argue that with the sheer number of stars and planets out there, that there aren't MANY in the same zone.
 
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Supreme Lord Z

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BlueThruAndThru said:
Did you read my quote?

I was only disputing the statement of "amazingness" that the OP made for Earth being in a zone that could sustain life.

I don't think you can argue that with the sheer number of stars and planets out there, that there aren't MANY in the same zone.
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To what purpose? As I said, the odds are virtually nil of two lifeforms existing simultaneously in that moment in time in order for one to find the other. It's like trying to win two separate lotteries simultaneously. People think "he won the lottery, then that guy over there won the lottery" without ever realizing the fundamental point that neither did so at the same time.

Actually you'd need to win three lotteries simultaneously because the third would be one of the lifeforms advancing far enough to discover the other.

The odds are compelling that life exists elsewhere, but not necessarily in a fleeting moment in time when any other life does capable of finding it. It's probably like Christmas lights on a universal scale. Blinking in and out all the time but tragically never cognizant of the other.
 
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BlueThruAndThru_rivals115784

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Supreme Lord Z said:
To what purpose? As I said, the odds are virtually nil of two lifeforms existing simultaneously in that moment in time in order for one to find the other. It's like trying to win two separate lotteries simultaneously. People think "he won the lottery, then that guy over there won the lottery" without ever realizing the fundamental point that neither did so at the same time.

Actually you'd need to win three lotteries simultaneously because the third would be one of the lifeforms advancing far enough to discover the other.

The odds are compelling that life exists elsewhere, but not necessarily in a fleeting moment in time when any other life does capable of finding it. It's probably like Christmas lights on a universal scale. Blinking in and out all the time but tragically never cognizant of the other.
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So you're agreeing with me that the probability is high that other life exists/has existed outside of our planet.

But you're not agreeing with me that life exists concurrently on Earth and other parts of the universe..... which I never said.
 
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cole854

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Supreme Lord Z said:
To what purpose? As I said, the odds are virtually nil of two lifeforms existing simultaneously in that moment in time in order for one to find the other. It's like trying to win two separate lotteries simultaneously. People think "he won the lottery, then that guy over there won the lottery" without ever realizing the fundamental point that neither did so at the same time.

Actually you'd need to win three lotteries simultaneously because the third would be one of the lifeforms advancing far enough to discover the other.

The odds are compelling that life exists elsewhere, but not necessarily in a fleeting moment in time when any other life does capable of finding it. It's probably like Christmas lights on a universal scale. Blinking in and out all the time but tragically never cognizant of the other.
Click to expand...


You are out there...way out there...and truly clueless.
 
Deeeefense

Deeeefense

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Supreme Lord Z said:
I'm sorry, but I've seen this argument and a thousand other iterations of it in one idiotic form or another. The idea being there are billions of other planets and thus life is out there yada, yada, yada...

But it ignores the central crushing factor of time. Of course life flickers into and out of being all over the universe. Your numbers are compelling to make that case. But in the endless expanse of time and distance, what are the chances that two separate life forms will come into being at the same moment in time and gain the ability to detect the other before blinking out of existence?

When you understand how slim are the chance of that happening then the explanation becomes clearer.

The moment life emerges on a planet then the clock starts ticking. The chances it will evolve far enough fast enough to detect other life around them in the universe when measured against the immense span of time and space are actually quite small.

People always forget the time factor. They always instinctively think in terms of everything starting from the same point. We are a fleeting blip that does not even register on our own geological earth scale, let alone that of the universe.
Click to expand...

I agree with you to an extent, the vast amount of time difference in comparing different evolution periods is compelling. However I would suggest to you that IF a hypothetical "civilization" on some earth like planet out there somewhere evolved to the point where colonization on another planet became a reality, then the likelihood of their continuation increases dramatically. Earth is near the threshold of that right now. Mars can theoretically made to be inhabitable by terraforming. Some theorize that earth itself was once a colony, though there isn't much evidence to support that notion, it is an interesting and viable possibility.
 
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Supreme Lord Z

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Deeeefense said:
I agree with you to an extent, the vast amount of time difference in comparing different evolution periods is compelling. However I would suggest to you that IF a hypothetical "civilization" on some earth like planet out there somewhere evolved to the point where colonization on another planet became a reality, then the likelihood of their continuation increases dramatically. Earth is near the threshold of that right now. Mars can theoretically made to be inhabitable by terraforming. Some theorize that earth itself was once a colony, though there isn't much evidence to support that notion, it is an interesting and viable possibility.
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The subject of terraforming Mars is very interesting. Fascinating in that it is something we have a basic understanding already of how to do it.
 
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TheEgyptianMagician

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Too many very basic unknowns to really speak intelligently on whether or not there is alien life, for instance we really have no idea how probable microbial life forming is given favorable circumstances. If we found evidence of life on Mars or Europa or somewhere else in our solar system, that would be major.

My opinion though is that life exists elsewhere, hell maybe even ubiquitous advanced civilizations; we just don't have the means to detect them and they take one look at us with our allahu akbar idiots running around and our other various forms of lunacy and just deem us not worthy of contact.
 
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IdaCat

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I've not heard of any god that I believe is real. The evidence shows they are all human creations that require faith. Religious faith is irrational, and for some, a kind of emotional, compartmentalized insanity. Don't know if it even makes sense to consider the existence of an entity that could be called a god. Humans are too damn ignorant about the ways of the cosmos to make any such judgement.

All I see is the natural world and what we've learned through science about nature. If something exists, it's part of nature. Firm belief in anything outside of nature is a delusion. I've not seen a shred of evidence for anything supernatural because there is none. It's absurd.

I strongly support the founding principle of separation of Church and State. As long as a religion respects this, doesn't push conversion or adversely affect my life, and isn't a front for terrorist organizations, I'm OK with it.

I realize that some good can be attributed to some religions, but I most appreciate and revere Enlightenment principles, without which, religion and society are primitive savagery.

My opinion.
 
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Ukbrassowtipin

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SomeDudeCRO said:
Too many very basic unknowns to really speak intelligently on whether or not there is alien life, for instance we really have no idea how probable microbial life forming is given favorable circumstances. If we found evidence of life on Mars or Europa or somewhere else in our solar system, that would be major.

My opinion though is that life exists elsewhere, hell maybe even ubiquitous advanced civilizations; we just don't have the means to detect them and they take one look at us with our allahu akbar idiots running around and our other various forms of lunacy and just deem us not worthy of contact.
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If other intelligent life exists and has the capability to reach us, them being able to reach us would mean they are smarter than us. Therefore they may have seen us and deemed there is no intelligent life here.
 
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Deeeefense

Deeeefense

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You guys should know by now where to post political ops.
 
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