Why are guards allowed to violently slap at the ball?

[SeussReturns]

Over our last three games we have seen multiple instances of guards hacking with multiple swats at our big men when they get the ball in the post. The most blatant case was the Ole Miss game when they showed a slow motion replay of the guard taking a good 4-5 windmill like swats at Dakari, only to hit his hand twice, arm once, and face another time.

Calipari and UK should have someone from editing put together a montage of these attacks and send them to the head of officiating for them to be on the look out. It happens in other games too, not just with UK. It's frustrating as a fan to watch guys get attacked by something that could be considered assault if it happened outside the basketball court. If you are going to let them play, that's fine but when it's affecting their ability to do move in a normal manner thats not okay.

 

[SilentsAreGolden]

Originally posted by JasonSpear:
they're allowed to slap and swat to their little hearts' content as long as they hit the ball. They slow motion replay you're referencing... dude hit all ball.

Want to fix that and make it not happen? Tell Dakari to stop bringing the ball down to his wait so little 6'0" guards can't knock it out of his hands. Every time he touches the ball in the post he immediately puts it on the floor to start making a move to the basket. Drives me nuts.

On the play where 32 slapped wildly at Dakari, he definitely hit Dakari in the fact at least once.

 

[LineSkiCat]

I brought that call up yesterday, with footage. It was awful, and about 4-5 slaps were thrown by Summers before Dakari ever lost the ball.

Putting aside any conspiracy in officiating, that was a foul. I don't know what other outcome you could possibly see from that play.

I mean, the dude wasn't even aiming his slaps, it looked like an 8 year old attempting to fight on the playground..

 

[LineSkiCat]

And again, I will pose this question (because I do think there are discrepancies) how is that NOT a foul, when Dakari is driving to the hoop, yet Tyus Jones draws a 3 point play driving into a Wake player (with a forearm shiver) and the defender kept his hands up the entire time?

At the very least, it's wildly inconsistent officiating. But I don't think that's all of it.

 

[richbrookstomato]

Originally posted by LineSkiCat:
And again, I will pose this question (because I do think there are discrepancies) how is that NOT a foul, when Dakari is driving to the hoop, yet Tyus Jones draws a 3 point play driving into a Wake player (with a forearm shiver) and the defender kept his hands up the entire time?

At the very least, it's wildly inconsistent officiating. But I don't think that's all of it.

Heck even in our game Summers, White and Moody would go up and lean into the defender(Ulis twice),initiate contact on their shot and the Ref would call the foul. Why does a guard get touch fouls and our Bigs get smacked and hacked hard with no call?!!!

 

[jlbeam3]

Originally posted by LineSkiCat:
I brought that call up yesterday, with footage. It was awful, and about 4-5 slaps were thrown by Summers before Dakari ever lost the ball.

Putting aside any conspiracy in officiating, that was a foul. I don't know what other outcome you could possibly see from that play.

I mean, the dude wasn't even aiming his slaps, it looked like an 8 year old attempting to fight on the playground..

Just watched the slow-mo again in even slower-mo. Summers' first swipe definitely hits Dakari as you can see Dakari's jersey recoil. Misses the ball completely.

Hits ball on the second swipe.

Misses everything with a third swipe.


It's most certainly a foul, and more than that it's obvious that it was just a violent melee of swings instead of a calculated basketball play. That playground stuff should be frowned upon.

This post was edited on 1/8 1:16 PM by beamer_at_uk

 

[LineSkiCat]

Originally posted by JasonSpear:
clearly, it's a conspiracy. Refs did everything they could to make sure UK lost. Dagnabbit.

I don't know what it is.. But what I'm more concerned with is if you even watched the play again, because you have three people now who just did and have very different thoughts than yours...

 

[dreadpirate_rivals241225]

Originally posted by JasonSpear:
they're allowed to slap and swat to their little hearts' content as long as they hit the ball. They slow motion replay you're referencing... dude hit all ball.

Want to fix that and make it not happen? Tell Dakari to stop bringing the ball down to his wait so little 6'0" guards can't knock it out of his hands. Every time he touches the ball in the post he immediately puts it on the floor to start making a move to the basket. Drives me nuts.

So when he hit him in the face, that was actually the ball?

 

[MWes11]

All guards slap at the ball, including ours. Aaron did it in the Ole Miss game towards the end of the game and got a steal. All guards do this, especially if a big brings the ball down.

 

[LineSkiCat]

The reason this call is being brought up is because it was blatantly obvious. Summers made it very easy to see as he hinged at the hips to go almost perpendicular (keeping a large viewing gap between his body and Dakari's) in his flailing attempt to hack the ball/player.

Obviously there are missed calls. And some things should go uncalled. Kentucky obviously gets away with some calls on offense and defense. I don't think anyone is arguing that.

 

[SilentsAreGolden]

I've heard someone say that if the player swipes down at the ball, they usually get away with it, but not if they swipe up. Don't know if that is a good rule of thumb or not, but it's what I heard.

 

[far_away_fan]

Originally posted by JasonSpear:
they're allowed to slap and swat to their little hearts' content as long as they hit the ball. They slow motion replay you're referencing... dude hit all ball.

Want to fix that and make it not happen? Tell Dakari to stop bringing the ball down to his wait so little 6'0" guards can't knock it out of his hands. Every time he touches the ball in the post he immediately puts it on the floor to start making a move to the basket. Drives me nuts.

Nice post. And to further emphasize your answer, the rules state that they can hit the hand of the offensive player without it being a foul as long as that hand is in contact with the ball. As long as you don't hit the arm (or face or body), it isn't a foul.

With that said, it's common to see a face or arm get grazed as well without it being called a foul. I think the main reason is that the play happens REALLY fast, and it usually happens in the middle of a crowd. We see it on TV because we are looking down over the heads of most of the traffic, but the refs often don't get a clear view - even when they are in perfect position.

The solution, as JasonSpear states is to keep the ball elevated. It's harder for smaller players to reach and if they do take a swipe, it's easier for the ref to see illegal contact (should it occur). But Dakari still has the bad habits typical of freshmen and sophomores. He knows he has an advantage over his man, but he doesn't make a play fast enough to seize that advantage leading to too many turnovers in the post. Most big men improve in this area with more experience, and I am sure he won't be different.

 

[jslash1]

Originally posted by LineSkiCat:
And again, I will pose this question (because I do think there are discrepancies) how is that NOT a foul, when Dakari is driving to the hoop, yet Tyus Jones draws a 3 point play driving into a Wake player (with a forearm shiver) and the defender kept his hands up the entire time?

At the very least, it's wildly inconsistent officiating. But I don't think that's all of it.

The swats on Dakari were obvious fouls, the Jones play you are talking about was also a foul though. While he did drive into him the defender brought one hand down and hit him. I hate when players obviously foul then hold their arms straight up like they had them there the entire time.

 

[UKCatNnc]

Originally posted by JasonSpear:

Originally posted by LineSkiCat:
The reason this call is being brought up is because it was blatantly obvious.

I don't think it was blatantly obvious in real time speed. On slow motion replay, maybe. But I can't recall seeing that play in live motion and thinking there was a foul. I do remember being pissed that Dakari kept bringing the ball down.

Agree with the rest of what you said.

It was obvious to my wife in real time speed. She jumped out of here chair. And I agreed with her. We did not have to see it in slow motion. Go Cats!!

 

[UKCatNnc]

Originally posted by JasonSpear:

Originally posted by UKCatnNC:

It was obvious to my wife in real time speed. She jumped out of here chair. And I agreed with her. We did not have to see it in slow motion. Go Cats!!

then the obvious course of action from this point is to apply for a job refereeing college basketball. Good luck in your quest.

Since you are offering such good advice to me, I will return the favor and suggest that you get your eyes checked or go support your team on their board. Go Cats!!

 

[macd79]

Watch a duke game and see how many times the guards get away with slapping oakafor.

 

[CRUCAT_rivals105646]

I re-watched that play several times, hell they should call a foul for intent alone, you should not be allowed to just come in swinging in the lane just because someone has the ball.... it was ridiculous, he brought the 1st slap as hard as he could down from well above his head, caught Dakari in the face with one and then slapped 3 more times in rapid succession, I don't understand how that should be allowed in basketball
This post was edited on 1/8 6:09 PM by CRUCAT

 

[LineSkiCat]

Can we get a GIF of this? It would be classic. "How to beat Kentucky? Flail haphazardly and hope they don't call it".

 

[KYFOSSIL]

Jason who whizzed in your wheaties?

 

[jwheat]

You just have to expect to not get all the calls when you have a physcially superior team. KAT gets killed every time he gets the ball, but he is a big boy and it doesn't look like a foul as much if it was Booker or Ulis.

 

[KyFaninNC]

1. it's really their only chance at beating us

2. They get away with it

3. they know are guys are easy to separate from the ball, we are too weak with the ball

4. Our bigs take way too long to make their move allowing double teams

 

[BluegrassBaron]

Originally posted by KYFOSSIL:
Jason who whizzed in your wheaties?

It's called: "Can't Admit When You're Wrong Syndrome."

Sadly, Jason has been afflicted with this disease for years.

 

[kentuckyrld]

The call the OP referenced was obviously a foul. There are many reasons why it was not called. All of them point to various problems with officiating that desperately need to be fixed. My greatest fear is that those kinds of calls are not made because the officials are trying to control the outcome of the game to either make money either betting directly on the game or by being paid large sums of money by people or groups who are also betting on the game. For us to think this does not happen would make us be the foolish ones.