Wow, what a bum.
- Thread starter BlueDevils725
- Start date
He wasn't graduating, he didn't like school and due to the rule was forced to go to college. I'm not sure not wanting to be in school makes him a punk or a bad person. Lots of good people drop out of school al the time. Does this affect the school somehow? I honestly don't know. If it does if have a problem with it. I do wish that kids would stay in college more but this kid is leaving to focus on his career and dreams and for him, school really wasn't part of that.
I see no problem with it - the NCAA/NBA can't agree to a direct from HS route, so this will happen.
I am more than a little fed up with the: The NBA forces these kids to go to college, the poor kids are exploited, etc. F that. If you do not want to go to college for free, get a ton of marketing/exposure for free, learn your "craft" from one of the best teachers in your field in the world for free then hire your own personal trainer on your dime. Rent out time in a gym at your cost. Pay your own flipping way to pursue your dream!
Honest question - have you ever lived in true poverty?
These schools are making tons of money off of these kids, way more than the amount of their scholarships. So if a kids wants to bail after his basketball obligation so be it. The NBA/NCAA created this mess, not the kids. For example, I think I read where ACC was getting 30 million dollars this yr, from the 6 teams in the NCAA tourney..
Crank, I am a social worker. I believe athletes are exploited in many ways. The biggest way they are exploited is the way our entire society coddles so many athletes and either turns them into unaccountable, entitled, human beings who piss away their shot at a free education from middle school on up or obsess on a statistically mythical dream of being the next Jordan with no real plan for their future. The true sin is that too many athletes do not get educated (see UNC), not that the NBA forces them to go to college for one year.
It just reinforces how STUPID the one year rule is. Let the kids go out of high school and if they don't than stipulate they have to stay 3 years. Works for baseball.
No one forced Simmons to go to college. He could have gone overseas and played out of high school. He certainly didn't go to LSU for any kind of education, as it turned out. Too bad his "godfather" didn't make sure he at least got some elementary education. He got what he wanted, publicity and a season long campaign from ESPN. Season ended and he didn't need college basketball anymore. Now he gets to be glorified by the green room experience.
No one forced Simmons to go to college. He could have gone overseas and played out of high school. He certainly didn't go to LSU for any kind of education, as it turned out. Too bad his "godfather" didn't make sure he at least got some elementary education. He got what he wanted, publicity and a season long campaign from ESPN. Season ended and he didn't need college basketball anymore. Now he gets to be glorified by the green room experience.
Last edited:
Until the 1 and done rule changes (will it ever??) this is going to be a common thing each year. Him not wanting to finish up classes does not make him a punk though, it just means he wants to focus all of his physical and mental energy on basketball, nothing wrong with a future PRO wanting to do that.
Don't hate the kid, HATE THE RULE.
Don't hate the kid, HATE THE RULE.
Certainly can't hate the kid for it. Although, if his school gets punished, there is a little thing called loyalty that might come into play. If the coach said, hey, come in for one semester and bolt if you want fine. That is on the coach/system. If he was supposed to finish out the year, than a man keeping his word, should enter into the equation somewhere.
Thx df; I respect your view and appreciate the reply. I grew up in poverty, and if I was in their shoes, I'd do the same thing if I had to. Is it right? I can't say, but I know what I'd do.
Does anyone believe that Johnny Jones/ LSU knew about this way before it actually happened??? Or that Simmons just publicly told his coach/school this the other day??
My sensors say this was agreed upon a while ago and a driving force towards him playing basketball at a football school.
My sensors say this was agreed upon a while ago and a driving force towards him playing basketball at a football school.
Why do you call him a punk? Is it because he will soon be a millionaire and will achieve his goal of being an NBA player. He never wanted to go to college in the first place so why fault him for leaving now that he has met the one year obligation.
It can actually hurt a school if it happens a couple times in a five year period.
Part of the one and done rule is every player is required to finish up classes for that one year. If not, that gives them a point against that team. After five years that point will be removed. I can't remember if it's two or four points in a five year period, but if you do reach that limit then you will lose some scholarships.
So yes, it can hurt them if a team ends up with a few kids in that time span that does what Simmons did.
I'm like everyone else, just let the kids go straight to the NBA.
But I do think they should honor that one year of class work.
Part of the one and done rule is every player is required to finish up classes for that one year. If not, that gives them a point against that team. After five years that point will be removed. I can't remember if it's two or four points in a five year period, but if you do reach that limit then you will lose some scholarships.
So yes, it can hurt them if a team ends up with a few kids in that time span that does what Simmons did.
I'm like everyone else, just let the kids go straight to the NBA.
But I do think they should honor that one year of class work.
Regardless of Simmons, the one and one rule is an NBA rule. I am guessing it was instituted as a reaction to so many teams getting burned by too many teams losing a No. 1 pick and wasting a ton of money on straight to the NBA kids who were a total bust. The NBA is protecting its interests. It has every right to do so. Heck, it is crazy not to. The NCAA should focus on real fairness, like they allude to in their commercials The NCAA should focus on academic integrity and basic ethics.
You're exactly right about the reason the NBA instituted the OAD rule.
What is interesting about integrity (and built into the very definition of ethics) is how often it can be warped by perspective/circumstances. I'm sure that on many level, the NCAA thinks it's doing the right thing w/ some of its anachronistic rules, but what might seem like the right thing in a vacuum starts missing the mark badly when we don't take reality into consideration. We can all lament the corruption of amateur athletics and pine for the days when guys stayed 4 years and got their degrees and got their hair cut regularly, but we're fooling ourselves if we overlook our own role in creating the big business that is college football and men's basketball, and then the NFL and NBA. It would be pretty disingenuous of us to want 3-4 more 24-hour sports channels and encourage it to become bigger and bigger while expecting the athletes to remain frozen in some 1950ish paradigm for our entertainment. And when we criticize the NCAA and call for reform, we should do so w/ a dose of humility that it is what we've all allowed it to be.
For every Ben Simmons there is 200 Obi or Tyler Thorntons. If you go to college, go to class, if not do the Brandon Jennings thing. But, The education that these guys are missing out on is way more valuable than the dreams that most will not realize.
Is it really fair for us to project our own experiences of what is valuable onto them, though? I wouldn't trade my college years for anything, but we can't assume that for everyone.
Dattier, I was a non-scholarship small school basketball player. Enjoyed the hell out of my experience. However, the facts are that those who have college degrees have exponentially higher earning capacity than those who dont. The exchange of a degree for their athletic ability is an opportunity that should not be slighted. Im not saying what their dreams should be, Im talking real money earning potential not related to basketball should be considered.
Doesn't this lend credence to the rumor that LSU turned down the NIT bid because they knew Simmons was leaving? That's so selfish if true - I'm sure some of the upperclassmen wanted to play and this shows such disrespect. Plus this hurts their APR.
Anyone who thinks this is no biggie just doesn't understand that true leadership comes from character, and people who only care about themselves are by definition poor leaders and have weak character. If the stories about friction between Simmons and his Australian teammates are to be believed, and now this, if you take someone like that with the first pick - injecting them into what most likely is a losing culture - you're crazy.
Anyone who thinks this is no biggie just doesn't understand that true leadership comes from character, and people who only care about themselves are by definition poor leaders and have weak character. If the stories about friction between Simmons and his Australian teammates are to be believed, and now this, if you take someone like that with the first pick - injecting them into what most likely is a losing culture - you're crazy.
It really isn't a big deal; he isn't leading a team or organization, he's going to get paid. He's done nothing wrong.
I see nothing classless about this, really he isn't keeping up the pretense of wanting to be at school
I don't really see any problem with this. People leave school early all the time, even in the middle of a semester. People leave jobs in the middle of a project or deal all the time. Don't know why we get so sanctimonious about a kid having to finish out the year if he plays college ball, it's not a crime against humanity if someone drops out of school. Obviously, while they are in school they should be required to maintain a certain GPA and be required to take real classes but if they want to leave school they should be able to do that whenever they want. And there are plenty of non-athletes in all universities that don't exactly take school as seriously as they should. Let's not pretend that all students at all universities everywhere are in college just for the coursework.
And nobody is forcing Ben Simmons to go to school. Brandon Jennings and Emmanuel Mudiay showed that is not the case. Simmons could have easily played ball in Australia this year (like Dante Exum), heck it probably would have protected his #1 status even more because he would have remained more of a mystery.
And nobody is forcing Ben Simmons to go to school. Brandon Jennings and Emmanuel Mudiay showed that is not the case. Simmons could have easily played ball in Australia this year (like Dante Exum), heck it probably would have protected his #1 status even more because he would have remained more of a mystery.
Last edited:
A relevant fact in this particular case is that Ben Simmons' happiness in life is not going to depend on whether he has a college degree or not. We're not talking about some kid who drops out in March of his freshman year, goes undrafted, floats around the NBDL for 2 seasons before blowing out his knee, and then ends up on Skid Row. No one is disputing that the latter case ought to stay in school or that having a college degree all but guarantees the average Joe higher earning potential. The crux of this is about high profile, instant millionaires who publically disregard school when their ship comes in. For those guys, preaching about college degrees really misses the mark.
It does not lend credence to that rumor. Guys in Simmons' position do this all the time. Now, if it happens to be connected and LSU turned down the NIT b/c Simmons was going to quit on the team beforehand, shame on LSU for putting PR for Simmons ahead of the team and shame on Simmons for quitting in the middle of the one thing he was really there for (let's not fool ourselves).
It would be nice if Simmons and guys in his position finished out the Spring semester, sure. But that's nice b/c it provides us an example to share with the boys in our lives w/ NBA aspirations whose dads are 5'7", not b/c it's so important for Simmons himself to do so.
It could very well be that Simmons is a poor leader and has questionable character, but this is not proof of it. Respectfully, I take exception to your proselytizing about "doesn't understand [ about ] true leadership [ and ] character." I think you assume to know the one and only "true leadership/character path," and that comes across as arrogant. I think it overlooks that none of us understands exactly what it's like to be someone else, and there are many paths, grasshopper. I don't mean "anything goes"; just that we should be careful judging what someone else should've done. Apologies if I'm misinterpreting. I hope I am, and if so, that you'll clarify as opposed to getting defensive.
I can care less if a kud drtops out of school like simmons but I highly doubt Ben knows what its like to live in poverty. im so sick of hearing that crap about all these kids the vast majority dont come from poverty
Actually a good percentage most likely come from poverty. It's easy to say it's "crap" when one has never been in that lifestyle.
I see no problem with what Simmons is doing. He is likely failing those two phys ed classes anyway. But, really, he's going to the NBA and trying to be the best player he can be - why on earth should he stay at LSU and finish two classes when he's trying to become the #1 pick in the draft? He'll have years to return if he needs to.
But there are so many problems with the current system it's hard to know where to begin. Players going straight to the NBA do generally hurt the game unless it's a Kobe or LeBron. But, then, they should have a right to work. At the same time players at the college level should be compensated for the money they bring in to the school. And, ensured that if they are injured their education and future will be taken care of. That's not even touching the hem ...
Books could be written on this subject and even then there is more that could be said.
Honestly, even though I find myself disagreeing with Jay Bilas here and there, I think someone like him should be the head of NCAA sports. I think that he'd transform college sports in a really positive direction.
But there are so many problems with the current system it's hard to know where to begin. Players going straight to the NBA do generally hurt the game unless it's a Kobe or LeBron. But, then, they should have a right to work. At the same time players at the college level should be compensated for the money they bring in to the school. And, ensured that if they are injured their education and future will be taken care of. That's not even touching the hem ...
Books could be written on this subject and even then there is more that could be said.
Honestly, even though I find myself disagreeing with Jay Bilas here and there, I think someone like him should be the head of NCAA sports. I think that he'd transform college sports in a really positive direction.
You know who else is tired of hearing crap? Those kids having to listen to people who don't know them judging their character and dismissing their personal circumstances.
I'm not dsmissing anyone's curcumstaces but Ben's father played and coached overseas for over 20 years. I think it's is pathetic evertime someone comes out early that people assume they come from poverty
Yes you're dismissing his circumstances, right after saying you're not dismissing his circumstances. And you didn't just say Simmons, you said "all these kids".
I wasn't directing my comments at Simmons, but players in general.