Protect College Sports Act Amendment - Salary Cap for Coaches

OG Goat Holder

Heisman
Sep 30, 2022
14,090
12,948
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It's just political BS. Democrats want to cap the earning potential of a certain group, Republicans won't to cap the earning potential of another group. I'll let you all figure out which groups those are.

We all need to back up from this thing and just realize there are rich mother 17ers out there that WANT to bankroll this stuff. Let them do it.
 

jethreauxdawg

Heisman
Dec 20, 2010
11,807
16,901
113
It's just political BS. Democrats want to cap the earning potential of a certain group, Republicans won't to cap the earning potential of another group. I'll let you all figure out which groups those are.

We all need to back up from this thing and just realize there are rich mother 17ers out there that WANT to bankroll this stuff. Let them do it.
Absolutely. Let it ride out, there is no need for the government to get involved. Do I hate it, absolutely. Will the government taking control make me like it better? Not a chance.
 

mstateglfr

All-American
Feb 24, 2008
16,861
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Let everyone earn whatever the 17 they can earn in the short time they play for or are employed by a college.

Let players play in college for as long as they are enrolled and are passing classes, since there is no justification for setting an eligibility limit- if a kid is in school then they should be able to play and get paid.

Let the costs surge and whatever comes of it in the end can be dealt with then.
- It may be a bunch of colleges say 'we are out' and step back from playing the game, so they drop to a lower division(and lose revenue $ by doing so).
- It may be that colleges stay for way longer than they responsibly should and hurt their athletics department in doing so.
- It may be that only a handful of colleges end up having a legit chance to dominate college football...which is how it is already.

We all then sit back and watch it burn to the ground from greed or watch it grow into something great that pretty much nobody right now can even envision.
 
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mstateglfr

All-American
Feb 24, 2008
16,861
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Or as a wildcard- the NCAA should create a division where participating football programs get to spend up to $50MM for the following costs...
Coaching and staff salary, player scholarships and direct pay, travel costs, medical costs, equipment costs, and facilities management costs(etc etc).
Players and coaches could still earn NIL $ from outside contracts.

All football programs would need to adhere to that spending cap and each could decide how to best allocate their budget.

It wouldnt matter if a program brought in $90MM...they can only spend up to $50MM on everything related to football.

We may see smaller scheduling footprints to reduce travel costs.
We may see smaller coaching salaries and smaller contract buyouts.
We may see fewer over the top luxury locker rooms.
We may see a surge in analytics surrounding the most effective ways to spend finite dollars.

Hell, it could create yet another thing to argue over- why the school is wasting precious budget money on name brand fountain beverages when they could instead buy less expensive Dr 38, Hee Haw, or Mountain Drive and sell it for the same cost!
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3407Dewey

Senior
Jun 4, 2014
364
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Absolutely. Let it ride out, there is no need for the government to get involved. Do I hate it, absolutely. Will the government taking control make me like it better? Not a chance.
If the judicial branch counts as "the government" then the government is already involved. The question is whether the NCAA has the clout and authority to enforce any kind of standards regarding eligibility, NIL, salary caps, etc., and the argument is that the NCAA (and/or conferences) will have a hard time enforcing "rules" unless they become law.
 
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jethreauxdawg

Heisman
Dec 20, 2010
11,807
16,901
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If the judicial branch counts as "the government" then the government is already involved. The question is whether the NCAA has the clout and authority to enforce any kind of standards regarding eligibility, NIL, salary caps, etc., and the argument is that the NCAA (and/or conferences) will have a hard time enforcing "rules" unless they become law.
The NCAA is a private club. They are in this mess because they didn’t enforce their own rules.
 

Perd Hapley

All-American
Sep 30, 2022
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Fundamentally, a cap on coaching salaries makes sense, if they are doing the same thing for the players.

But, I don’t know if $5 million is a sensible number there. Dan Mullen was making nearly that much at MSU almost 10 years ago, and didn’t even have a Top 15 salary.

Not to mention that its a poison pill if its getting over 50% of current P4 coaches to take a huge pay cut. Will never pass.
 

Dawgzilla2

All-Conference
Oct 9, 2022
2,667
3,006
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Booker's amendment has zero chance of passing, but it could cause some discussion on why players' earnings are being capped but no other expenses are. Athletic budgets have been out of control for decades, especially when you factor in the facilities race. But now that the previously free labor is making money, everyone wants to pump the brakes.

My problem with the current situation is it is based primarily on donations. These are not businesses using profits to improve their product. These are handouts from extremely wealthy people with egos, and if left unchecked it will make the Sports unfair and unwatchable.

My preference would be to somehow revert to the original intent of the House settlement, which only allowed NIL licenses for a legitimate business purpose (i.e., not collectives). No caps on potential earnings; just legit uses of NIL.

But I guess that ship has sailed...
 

8dog

All-American
Feb 23, 2008
15,057
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The NCAA is a private club. They are in this mess because they didn’t enforce their own rules.
That‘s not true for NIL. They could follow their rules all they wanted, they were still violating anti-trust laws. Now, the eligibility suits do boil down to consistently following their own rules.
 
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OG Goat Holder

Heisman
Sep 30, 2022
14,090
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Let players play in college for as long as they are enrolled and are passing classes, since there is no justification for setting an eligibility limit- if a kid is in school then they should be able to play and get paid.
I'm with you except for this. This limits opportunities for younger people.

They can get paid if they aren't playing, because therein lies the rub. This is fake NIL, boosters paying for wins, rather than a player/person actually having a brand. If they have a true brand, they'll still be able to monetize outside of playing the sport.

NCAA also seems willing to dig their heels in on this issue. It's the only one that has held up to any scrutiny, because all the schools and conferences stick together on it.
 
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dawgstudent

Heisman
Apr 15, 2003
40,460
21,959
113
Booker's amendment has zero chance of passing, but it could cause some discussion on why players' earnings are being capped but no other expenses are. Athletic budgets have been out of control for decades, especially when you factor in the facilities race. But now that the previously free labor is making money, everyone wants to pump the brakes.

My problem with the current situation is it is based primarily on donations. These are not businesses using profits to improve their product. These are handouts from extremely wealthy people with egos, and if left unchecked it will make the Sports unfair and unwatchable.

My preference would be to somehow revert to the original intent of the House settlement, which only allowed NIL licenses for a legitimate business purpose (i.e., not collectives). No caps on potential earnings; just legit uses of NIL.

But I guess that ship has sailed...
Put a salary cap on the players (whatever it takes to get there) and if a school is found to be giving money under the table - your program is shut down for 2 years. SMU this thing. You have to make the penalties so severe and actually follow through.

I certainly don't understand all the legalities of getting a salary cap but that's not for me to figure out.
 

jethreauxdawg

Heisman
Dec 20, 2010
11,807
16,901
113
Put a salary cap on the players (whatever it takes to get there) and if a school is found to be giving money under the table - your program is shut down for 2 years. SMU this thing. You have to make the penalties so severe and actually follow through.

I certainly don't understand all the legalities of getting a salary cap but that's not for me to figure out.
So the exact same situation we’ve been operating under for the 100 years prior to legalized NIL? Salary cap was $0. What’s the difference in saying salary cap of $10mil? You think boosters will all of a sudden follow rules?
 
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Called3rdstrikedawg

All-Conference
May 7, 2016
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Athletics used to send money into the University coffers. Now large universities are operating Athletics departments in the red and are having to take funds from the University operations side to help fund athletics. Very few athletics departments are operating in the black nowadays. It will catch up eventually. And then there will be a Super Division of so-called Haves! It is a lot closer to happening than we may even be thinking.
 

Called3rdstrikedawg

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May 7, 2016
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So the exact same situation we’ve been operating under for the 100 years prior to legalized NIL? Salary cap was $0. What’s the difference in saying salary cap of $10mil? You think boosters will all of a sudden follow rules?
Maybe the NCAA could regain its teeth if it places paid compliance officials on every college campus. I know I’m throwing stuff against the wall to see what sticks. But allowing the schools and conferences to police themselves is like having the Mexican Cartels guard the border!
 
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dawgstudent

Heisman
Apr 15, 2003
40,460
21,959
113
So the exact same situation we’ve been operating under for the 100 years prior to legalized NIL? Salary cap was $0. What’s the difference in saying salary cap of $10mil? You think boosters will all of a sudden follow rules?
You see this? You have to make the penalties so severe and actually follow through.
 

John Deaux VII

All-Conference
Jun 7, 2024
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You see this? You have to make the penalties so severe and actually follow through.
Everyone saw what happened to the Clippers for trying to circumvent the salary cap. That is the type of teeth any association will need to get any control over all of this. I think you have to esentially become a professional league and have collective barganing for that to happen. The players will have to get the same opportunity to negotiate / advocate for themeslves as the coaches do.
 

dawgstudent

Heisman
Apr 15, 2003
40,460
21,959
113
Everyone saw what happened to the Clippers for trying to circumvent the salary cap. That is the type of teeth any association will need to get any control over all of this. I think you have to esentially become a professional league and have collective barganing for that to happen. The players will have to get the same opportunity to negotiate / advocate for themeslves as the coaches do.
How do you get around the time limits of college football (5 years) in a collective bargaining situation?
 

johnson86-1

All-American
Aug 22, 2012
15,142
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Booker's amendment has zero chance of passing, but it could cause some discussion on why players' earnings are being capped but no other expenses are.
The reason players' compensation is capped is that the value is brought by the university. Nobody wants to pay to watch minor league athletics outside of a university setting. So it is defensible to have a law capping compensation to allow public universities (and therefore private ones, as you can't really separate them even if you don't believe the positive externality arguments justify the same preferential treatment as being publicly owned). But if you cap player compensation, schools will compete on other measures. One way is by coaching compensation. The other way is by a facilities and amenities arms race. So if you cap player compensation, you should cap coaching salary and other expenses also. A reasonable solution would be to have a statute carving out an exception from antitrust for amateur athleticism, but require that it actually be enforced. Any violations of amateurism results in the school losing its tax exempt status for the year in which the violations occurred and for some period thereafter. The people that are invovled in the violations would be personally liable for the tax deficit for the year in which the violations occurred. That should come with some cap on athletics expenditures, with the excess going back to the school for educational purposes. That would be practically self enforcing, and the administrative headache would be figuring out how to set the cap on spending in a way that makes sense across areas with different costs of living and also probably making some recognition that schools sports generating a lot of money should get nicer things.

Athletic budgets have been out of control for decades, especially when you factor in the facilities race. But now that the previously free labor is making money, everyone wants to pump the brakes.

My problem with the current situation is it is based primarily on donations. These are not businesses using profits to improve their product. These are handouts from extremely wealthy people with egos, and if left unchecked it will make the Sports unfair and unwatchable.

My preference would be to somehow revert to the original intent of the House settlement, which only allowed NIL licenses for a legitimate business purpose (i.e., not collectives). No caps on potential earnings; just legit uses of NIL.
That would be great but it's pretty clear it's not enforceable as a practical matter. There's no reliable way to distinguish between when an athlete is getting paid for NIL because it makes business sense versus it just being a booster wanting to throw some money their way.

But I guess that ship has sailed...
 

MSUDAWGFAN

Senior
Apr 17, 2014
1,154
781
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I think several of the more high profile coaches were supportive of the act. Saban, Smart, etc.

I always said they want to limit what the players can get (because it helps them cheat more) but if it affected their salary they would change their tune.

Hopefully we find out.

I say let the players make as much as they can.
 

mstateglfr

All-American
Feb 24, 2008
16,861
6,677
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I'm with you except for this. This limits opportunities for younger people.

They can get paid if they aren't playing, because therein lies the rub. This is fake NIL, boosters paying for wins, rather than a player/person actually having a brand. If they have a true brand, they'll still be able to monetize outside of playing the sport.

NCAA also seems willing to dig their heels in on this issue. It's the only one that has held up to any scrutiny, because all the schools and conferences stick together on it.
Allowing student athletes to compete in sports for as long as they are students would limit opportunities for younger people, but only those who arent good enough. That last part is important.
- Younger people who are good enough would still be welcomed into the land of milk and honey.
- Older people who are no longer good enough or impactful enough would be thanked and pushed out.

This is really no different from any professional sports league.


To be clear- I will be fine if student athletes have 6 years to play 5, or 5 to play 4, or 6 to play 4. I really dont care what is ultimately chosen because whatever is decided will largely be an arbitrarily chosen period of time.
My prior point was just an attempt to highlight the reality that placing a cap of any sort is unjustifiable. An eligibility cap is just saying 'please leave now so others can have what you have'. Student athletes should get to play for as long as they are students and good enough to play. Masters degree?...keep playing. Doctorate?...keep playing. Another Masters degree?...well ok Old Balls, keep playing.

One of the ultimate points of college is to get an education and make yourself marketable in life. Earning degrees while getting paid is the most spot on way to accomplish that point of going to college.
 

jethreauxdawg

Heisman
Dec 20, 2010
11,807
16,901
113
You see this? You have to make the penalties so severe and actually follow through.
Yes, you see this, “how is that any different that what we’ve had”. The severe penalty has always been an option. You proposed the exact same situation we’ve always had, albeit with a higher threshold for what’s considered “cheating”.
 

Dawgzilla2

All-Conference
Oct 9, 2022
2,667
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That would be great but it's pretty clear it's not enforceable as a practical matter. There's no reliable way to distinguish between when an athlete is getting paid for NIL because it makes business sense versus it just being a booster wanting to throw some money their way.
Depends upon how you define "reliable." No system is perfect, but examining every deal is necessary. The CSC is using Deloitte to determine FMV for the NIL licenses. Its the same system the pro leagues use, and its very effective.

Or we could just put Pablo Torres in charge.
 
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Dawgzilla2

All-Conference
Oct 9, 2022
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Yes, you see this, “how is that any different that what we’ve had”. The severe penalty has always been an option. You proposed the exact same situation we’ve always had, albeit with a higher threshold for what’s considered “cheating”.
The problem has always been that the schools don't actually want the rules strictly enforced. Probably to placate their donors.

People say the NCAA has no teeth. What they forget is the NCAA IS the schools. It is set up by the schools, and controlled by the Presidents. If the schools wanted the NCAA to have teeth, it would. The NCAA would say "no sixth year for this guy" and the school involved would accept that.

They can put teeth in any deal now...but as soon as the CSC flexed a little muscle on collectives, the schools backed down. The schools don't want to do this themselves, so they want Congress to bail them out of their own mess.
 

OG Goat Holder

Heisman
Sep 30, 2022
14,090
12,948
113
Student athletes should get to play for as long as they are students and good enough to play. Masters degree?...keep playing. Doctorate?...keep playing. Another Masters degree?...well ok Old Balls, keep playing.

One of the ultimate points of college is to get an education and make yourself marketable in life. Earning degrees while getting paid is the most spot on way to accomplish that point of going to college.
There probably is no justification for it, in theory. But like I said, the amateur thing is about the only thing the administrators and commissioners are united about. And I really do not think any of us want a professional league. While there hasn't really been a decline thus far, if they break the levee of amateurism/professionalism, I do believe a sharp decline in interest in college athletics will absolutely happen.
 
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Perd Hapley

All-American
Sep 30, 2022
6,533
7,851
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You see this? You have to make the penalties so severe and actually follow through.
Agreed. Player who has maxed out their cap and is getting $5 million per year or whatever.

If its discovered a rogue booster paid them another $500 under the table? Death penalty. No matter what school it is. That simple. Eventually, someone will test it. They’ll get caught. And they’d have to suffer the consequences. After one example is made, shít will get cleaned up quick.

But it will never happen.
 
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