2023 - 2024 Champions League Thread
- Thread starter Tom McAndrew
- Start date
Yeah, but give the Dortmund keeper credit for the first one. An amazing save that he deflected into the crossbar. I counted four second half PSG shots that hit the post. Unreal.
PSG 0-2 Dortmund on aggregate.
4 hit the post and about 3 sitters wide or over the top. Last 20 minutes were wild. Good stuff. Madrid and Bayern tomorrow should be good.
The PSG keeper made a brilliant save on an equally brilliant Dortmund run into the box at about ‘40, that was the best play I’ve seen anywhere this season. Great match, well done everybody.
Dortmund bring down curtain on Kylian Mbappé’s lost years at PSG | Barney Ronay
What was the point of such a spectacular player spending seven seasons of his prime playing for Paris Saint-Germain?
www.theguardian.com
Madrid again, at 90’+2’, someone needs to tell me why this isn’t offsides.
Never mind, they showed a good simulation, it was onside.
yeah, a mistake by the GK that allowed Madrid to even have a chance to win the match. The shots that skip in like this one can handcuff the GK's just a bit, and it appears that's what happened here.
My thoughts on the offside:
The AR really was placed in a horrible situation. If you look at the YouTube video, there are two attackers going forward on the play, and they are side-by-side. The guy farthest from the AR looks to be offside, but only by inches. The guy closest to the AR appears to be onside, but if so it's only by a really small amount. That the two attackers were so close to each other makes it almost impossible to differentiate between the players. Plus, we're talking inches between being on or off.
I'm not certain, but it appears that it's actually the defender that played the pass out of the air. As such, you could argue that even if the attacker was in an offside position, the defender played the ball so you leave the flag down. However, there's also the issue of active involvement by the attacker that may be in an offside position (though it appears he wasn't), and you can flag offside for active involvement even if the player in the offside position didn't play the ball.
This was one of the top ref crews in the world, and I believe they reffed a World Cup final.
The instructions given to refs is that if you're in doubt on offsides, you don't raise the flag. Interestingly, in the last year or two, in the World Cup and in elite competitions where VAR is in place, they have been instructing the ARs to allow play to continue when things are really close (i.e., don't raise the flag), and raise it at the end of the play, and then let VAR sort things out. Unfortunately, that wasn't followed here. The AR raised the flag when the ball was headed, and the center ref, reacting to that signal, blew the play dead. That was critical here, in that if the center ref had not blown things dead before the shot, then everything could have been reviewed by VAR, and the correct call made. VAR review of offsides is not made when the play is blown dead before a shot.
As a ref, you never want to get any calls wrong. In added time in a Champions League semifinal, it's disappointing that the AR didn't hold the flag (even if he thought it was offsides), and let things play out. But it's a delicate balance, in that the refs that advance to that level don't do so by being indecisive.
The AR really was placed in a horrible situation. If you look at the YouTube video, there are two attackers going forward on the play, and they are side-by-side. The guy farthest from the AR looks to be offside, but only by inches. The guy closest to the AR appears to be onside, but if so it's only by a really small amount. That the two attackers were so close to each other makes it almost impossible to differentiate between the players. Plus, we're talking inches between being on or off.
I'm not certain, but it appears that it's actually the defender that played the pass out of the air. As such, you could argue that even if the attacker was in an offside position, the defender played the ball so you leave the flag down. However, there's also the issue of active involvement by the attacker that may be in an offside position (though it appears he wasn't), and you can flag offside for active involvement even if the player in the offside position didn't play the ball.
This was one of the top ref crews in the world, and I believe they reffed a World Cup final.
The instructions given to refs is that if you're in doubt on offsides, you don't raise the flag. Interestingly, in the last year or two, in the World Cup and in elite competitions where VAR is in place, they have been instructing the ARs to allow play to continue when things are really close (i.e., don't raise the flag), and raise it at the end of the play, and then let VAR sort things out. Unfortunately, that wasn't followed here. The AR raised the flag when the ball was headed, and the center ref, reacting to that signal, blew the play dead. That was critical here, in that if the center ref had not blown things dead before the shot, then everything could have been reviewed by VAR, and the correct call made. VAR review of offsides is not made when the play is blown dead before a shot.
As a ref, you never want to get any calls wrong. In added time in a Champions League semifinal, it's disappointing that the AR didn't hold the flag (even if he thought it was offsides), and let things play out. But it's a delicate balance, in that the refs that advance to that level don't do so by being indecisive.
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I saw that the defender had his arm extended towards the goal, that makes a difference, amirite?
Anyway, thanks for taking the time, Tom.
I don't believe it made a difference in this play, but it is a factor in offsides.
For offsides, with regards to the defender, you look at any part of their body. With regards to the attacker, you look for any part of their body that can legally play the ball. As such, an attacker's arm(s) could be past the defender, but if that's the only part of the player that is past the defender, then the offensive player is onside. In really close cases, it's often some toes, or a knee, or part of the head of the attacker that is past the defender, which makes the offensive player offside.
As a Madrid fan I am happy, as a fan of the game, flag should have stayed down no whistle. I also wanted to point out, it’s a goal scoring opportunity as one of Bayern players pointed out, Madrid stopped with whistle. With Rudiger you never know. The man IMO is the best 1:1 defender in world. Lacks pace, and tough as nails. I always thought he was under appreciated at Chelsea and on German national team. He and Kroos are my favorite players. Bayern board are insufferable, maybe we can pawn off NYCFC coach on them.
