40,000+ Americans died.....

John Henry

Hall of Famer
Aug 18, 2007
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You cannot spread automobile accidents. Is this an overreaction? Probably, but comparing a pandemic to car crashes is comparing apples to oranges.
Let's compare it to what Obama did with the Swine flu. Apples to apples. Obama allowed 14,000 people to die and 60,000,000 to get infected based on the standards we are applying to Trump. So Trump has a long way to go to catch up with Obama but the press is hoping he gets there.
 

DaytonKat

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Apr 10, 2007
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Just as a follow-up to my prior post, Milan’s hospitals are now receiving 4-5 times more COVID-19 patients in one day than the average number of flu patients a US hospital treats in an entire year.

Trying to get a better understanding of the above statement:

"Milan's hospitals" = how many hospitals is that?

Avg # of flu patients a U.S. hospital (1 hospital) treats in an entire year = how many patients is that average and how was that average determined?

I would imagine that a hospital in Los Angeles would see more patients with the flu than say one in Winchester, KY.

Can you you provide some actual numbers, how they were determined, etc., to reduce the vagueness?
 

AustinTXCat

Hall of Famer
Jan 7, 2003
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Trying to get a better understanding of the above statement:

"Milan's hospitals" = how many hospitals is that?

Avg # of flu patients a U.S. hospital (1 hospital) treats in an entire year = how many patients is that average and how was that average determined?

I would imagine that a hospital in Los Angeles would see more patients with the flu than say one in Winchester, KY.

Can you you provide some actual numbers, how they were determined, etc., to reduce the vagueness?
+1

Data = garbage in, garbage out. Just saying.
 

DaytonKat

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Apr 10, 2007
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Let's compare it to what Obama did with the Swine flu. Apples to apples. Obama allowed 14,000 people to die and 60,000,000 to get infected based on the standards we are applying to Trump. So Trump has a long way to go to catch up with Obama but the press is hoping he gets there.

Hey there amigo. I'm gonna give folks the benefit of the doubt for now as to no election year politics. Gonna see what we learn as more data is collected. Time will reveal.
 

uk_bill

Junior
Sep 12, 2002
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Hey there amigo. I'm gonna give folks the benefit of the doubt for now as to no election year politics. Gonna see what we learn as more data is collected. Time will reveal.

Why make this political? Criticizing current situation doesn't have mean others did it better or worse. I hope we are learning from our mistakes and getting better at reacting in these events.
 

WildmanWilson_rivals

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1) I don't believe we have enough data at this time to say "not even close to this". Why not wait until we actually have sufficient data for the medical scientists to provide conclusions?

2) In re to seasonal flu being more deadly than swine flu: yet, we declared a national emergency on Oct. 24, 2009, when at the time there were a little over 1,000 deaths.

3) So why was a national emergency declared in re to Swine Flu when it's less deadly than the Seasonal Flu? Because we did not know what to expect, i.e., the same as now, we didn't have enough experience/data.

"The key difference between the novel coronavirus and influenza", said Melissa Nolan, an infectious disease epidemiologist at the University of South Carolina, "is this: We know what to expect from the flu."

--------------------------------------------

My point: Let's take the necessary precautions in an attempt to flatten the curve. Then let's let the infectious disease experts tell us what they learned from all the data, which won't be for quite some time.
https://prepforthat.com/il-coronavirus-state-of-emergency-may-ban-firearms/

So how about that for disruption and government control?
 

DaytonKat

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Why make this political? Criticizing current situation doesn't have mean others did it better or worse. I hope we are learning from our mistakes and getting better at reacting in these events.

I'll admit, I'm lost. Your question of: Why make this political? I presume it's a hypothetical and not to be taken that I've made something political when I mentioned to a friend that I'm giving folks the benefit of the doubt?

I agree with you, learn and improve...that can be applied to most anything we do in life. That said, history provides us many examples where something can be taken "too far" in an attempt to learn and improve (or under the guise). Especially when it comes to governing/governments/political leaders.
 

DaytonKat

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If that link is an article about a Mayor in Illinois wanting to use the declaration of an emergency to ban the sale/transfer of firearms and ammunition, then I have read a highlight of that elsewhere.

If so, then I think we are going to be in agreement; I cite what I just responded to UK-Bill where I said: "history provides us many examples where something can be taken "too far" in an attempt to learn and improve (or under the guise). Especially when it comes to governing/governments/political leaders."

I'm not big on politicians taking things too far, even if they think they are trying to do something good. I also don't kid myself.....they will, if we let them. Even with that, they'll chip away, and chip away.
 
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Crums Bald Spot

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Aug 22, 2001
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As bad as this will sound, thinning the herd on this overpopulated planet isn't the worst thing. Yep - if it were my loved ones I may think overwise but from a holistic point of view less old and sick people on this planet is what we need.
 
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kl40504_rivals

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Oct 5, 2018
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There are three basic flaws baked into this assertion which you pick up on the first day of epidemiology 101, but I don't expect you to pick up on them, based on your last dozen thoughtless and dismissive posts. God help your PCP. I know your exact type, and it's impossible to help you with anything because you already know it all based on a hunch. Why does anybody bother to learn anything? You should be your own doctor, lawyer, dentist, vet...

At least Fossil is putting some thought into the discussion. You're just all "nope. stop panicking."

I'll help you out. Look up "n" in the context of statistics, look up the taxonomy of ebola, and look up ed diversion.

I have nightmares about the guy with an A1C of 11 who sees no good reason why he should change his diet because diabetes runs in his family, so eating differently wouldn't change anything. Google told him that.

Ebola will never hurt us if every individual episode that makes it over here is dealt with what you would doubtlessly describe as "panic", immediately isolated, and it doesn't take place in a dense walking city. That's a lot of "ifs", and you would certainly still ***** about it.

As for what would happen if it went undetected with a week's head start in a dense metro, I recommend you do better than google, jim bob.


A bunch of the HIV public health moves in the late 80s and early 90s certainly caused a bunch of the same red-blooded macho dudes to wretch at the "pussiness" of it all. There was plenty of what could be described as "panic" back then, and now they spend $30 billion a year on it. 40 years after it broke. And that's with a disease that is way harder to spread than a droplet-based contagion.

And even still, every single advancement we made was met with opposition from people who just have a contrarian personality.

Like I said before, if the measures work, the thoughtless idiots will say "it was never a big deal anyways".

If many people die, they will say "they didn't help regardless".

We will never make everyone happy, and we shouldn't try to, because most people know absolutely nothing about disease.

What possesses you to think that the H1N1 from a decade ago is a good comparison? Even if we assume that half of the cases of covid 19 are going unreported, the mortality rate would still be literally 100 times higher than 2009.

I think now you're arguing just to argue.

I'm absolutely not claiming that you should stay in your house. If that's directed towards me, that's a complete strawman.

The advice about the large gatherings is a completely separate conversation.

If you still don't understand the "don't gather with 100+ people" principle, then this is never going to work, dude. The network epidemiology framework ain't that hard to grasp, and I believe that you're a thoughtful guy, so apparently you're just too stubborn to try.
Are you finished with your book? Maybe you should put it in paperback and sell it on Amazon.
 

It'saDoneDeal

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Jul 24, 2007
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As bad as this will sound, thinning the herd on this overpopulated planet isn't the worst thing. Yep - if it were my loved ones I may think overwise but from a holistic point of view less old and sick people on this planet is what we need.

As long as it's mostly the yellows and browns, right?

BTW, "overwise" lol.
 

joeyrupption

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Jun 5, 2007
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You must be new here. Every 2-3 years, they make a renewed effort to cull threads that end up delving into politics. And we have re-explain why everything gets moved to the political thread. Otherwise the entire board turns into essentially a fragmented political thread.
 

WildcatofNati

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Mar 31, 2009
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I'm now hearing that the first sign of the Corona is diarrhea.

Diarrhea, cha cha cha, diarrhea cha cha cha!!

We're all gonna get it, and we all gonna die! Just ask Joey or Levi! I was feeling fairly confident until last weekend, when I start sneezing up a hurricane! I think I've got it already!