50 year Duke follower here...prepared to be fried...

[Leo2Wes]

Just some innocent thoughts and not one to judge, but curious...I was really hoping Obi and Vrankovic would get some burn over last 5 mins or so today. I know Sean hasnt looked good, but you know the popular saying about "seeing the ball go thru the net," and creating some confidence for kids???

IDK, guys I am estatic w/our position rite now, but when I see Pagliuca get time at the end and not Vrank/Obi it concerns me...

The other thing is Grayson coming back in w/2 mins to go today...What if he had gotten hurt??? Been following Duke since my parents introduced me to Vic Bubas in 1965...

 

[Dad2ze]

Just some innocent thoughts and not one to judge, but curious...I was really hoping Obi and Vrankovic would get some burn over last 5 mins or so today. I know Sean hasnt looked good, but you know the popular saying about "seeing the ball go thru the net," and creating some confidence for kids???

IDK, guys I am estatic w/our position rite now, but when I see Pagliuca get time at the end and not Vrank/Obi it concerns me...

The other thing is Grayson coming back in w/2 mins to go today...What if he had gotten hurt??? Been following Duke since my parents introduced me to Vic Bubas in 1965...

You make a very valid point. I'm not sure what goes through Coaches head but he has 5 Nattys and I dont.

 

[Leo2Wes]

Good point Dad... Thx for understanding my perspective my friend...

 

[ScottB59]

I agree with both of you....I asked the same question last year when Grayson got almost no playing time and things worked out good for both Duke and Grayson. I have to continue to trust the GOAT.

 

[dukiejay]

I'm not a real big believer in the old "give them five minutes in a meaningless game goes a long ways" mantra. You're either able to play or you're not. From the sounds of it, and the little we've seen of Sean, it looks as though the staff might have misevaluated. It happens.

To the point about Grayson, I see what you're saying. K has done that before too. I don't understand it either....but it is what it is. Nothing I can do about it.

 

[Dattier]

I'm not a real big believer in the old "give them five minutes in a meaningless game goes a long ways" mantra. You're either able to play or you're not. From the sounds of it, and the little we've seen of Sean, it looks as though the staff might have misevaluated. It happens.

To the point about Grayson, I see what you're saying. K has done that before too. I don't understand it either....but it is what it is. Nothing I can do about it.

I don't think it's ridiculous that Obi might have been brought in to have a big body to throw at Jah for a year. He saw some surprising early minutes vs WF because we needed to find some other way to handle Thomas, and Chase isn't strong enough.

Let's keep in mind that Zoubs' PT was dependent on match-ups (and health) for most of his time at Duke. It wasn't until his senior year that he started to "control his own destiny. "

 

[pisgah101]

At the end of games we have to play a guard? So regardless of who we play one or 2 starting guards will be in.

 

[Get Nasty]

I remember reading something years ago about star players in late in the game. K said something along the line of he knows they will have to play big minutes each game in the acc and tourney time and he wants his players used to the game minutes. He said he'd rather rest their legs a little at practice since you can't truly simulate a game at practice.

 

[Leo2Wes]

Good stuff guys appreciate the candor. It was somewhat bizarre for me and the loyal Duke followers at the end we saw Pags get PT, yet Obi and Vrank never touched the floor...

 

[WI#1Dukie22]

Sean is a sophomore correct? I'm not so sure he won't be serviceable by the time he is done?

 

[Leo2Wes]

Lets all be really honest here guys...I mean K's the most honorable coach I know and everybody outside the program is envious of our sterling rep coupled with our lofty perch...

However I cannot help but think Pagliuca's dad lofty status w/the Celtics (co-owner) doesnt hurt his son's ability to get a spot on our roster...K really enjoys his interaction w/ the pro game, and his teansition to coaching our Olympic team is unparalleled...

 

[Leo2Wes]

Transition

 

[pisgah101]

Lets all be really honest here guys...I mean K's the most honorable coach I know and everybody outside the program is envious of our sterling rep coupled with our lofty perch...

However I cannot help but think Pagliuca's dad lofty status w/the Celtics (co-owner) doesnt hurt his son's ability to get a spot on our roster...K really enjoys his interaction w/ the pro game, and his teansition to coaching our Olympic team is unparalleled...

Or he came to Duke tried out for a walk on spot and got one?

 

[timo0402]

Or he came to Duke tried out for a walk on spot and got one?

Uhhh no.

 

[Dattier]

Lets all be really honest here guys...I mean K's the most honorable coach I know and everybody outside the program is envious of our sterling rep coupled with our lofty perch...

However I cannot help but think Pagliuca's dad lofty status w/the Celtics (co-owner) doesnt hurt his son's ability to get a spot on our roster...K really enjoys his interaction w/ the pro game, and his teansition to coaching our Olympic team is unparalleled...

His dad played freshman basketball at Duke in the '70s and works in pro basketball, so there's at least that much athletic skill in his genes, and the lifelong interest and exposure to basketball is there. He was also a star player for a small, private high school. He's a walk-on. This is not like Jaden Smith getting into acting b/c his parents are stars; a lot of athletic accomplishments are the result of genetics, exposure, and opportunity. That his parents were able to help him develop into the caliber player he is isn't suspicious or conspiratorial or anything; why would it be either of those things that he has earned a walk-on spot at Duke?

 

[Dattier]

Uhhh no.

Why not?

 

[timo0402]

Let's not sensanstionalize it here. He is a nice kid and a good player, so was his brother. Having an influential parent helps his opportunity to be a member of the squad though and if you don't think that played a part well then I don't know what to tell you.

 

[Leo2Wes]

Sorry JMO...and am sure others share it who may not express it here. Its human nature...Look I just do not happen to believe Nick belonged on the floor over Vrank and Sean at the end yesterday...Despite all the criticisms hurled toward Sean I still think his ceiling and Vrank's represent a greater max than Pags.

Hey if we trotted out Sean in a crucial time at Wake (and who knows if that emergency won't arise again while AJ is out) wouldnt it AT THE VERY LEAST been beneficial to give him some burn at end yesterday?

I cannot feel Sean gained any CHANCE at some confidence from the pine yesterday watching Pags play while he sat-again, JMO

 

[WI#1Dukie22]

How does this matter what so ever again ?

 

[pisgah101]

Uhhh no.

Ohh ok

 

[Dattier]

If he were Nick Palooka, working class kid from Kinston, he'd be playing somewhere like ECU, on scholarship. I think it's a pretty safe bet that most scholarship players at humble schools like ECU probably have the chops on the court to be at least respectable walk-ons at Duke. It's the Pagliuca family, though, that can afford to turn down a scholarship elsewhere to walk-on at Duke (as if the academic rep and family legacy play no part). It is not, however, the Pagliuca name that K is trying to schmooze with. If anything, other people schmooze K.

Let's consider Justin Robinson. He's as good as he is b/c he's genetically related to David Robinson and has been exposed to basketball his whole life. He could have played elsewhere on a scholarship, but he can afford to walk-on at Duke and play for the GOAT. We wouldn't be redshirting him, though, if we didn't think he could develop later (like his dad did, and how) into a contributor. We weren't going to bet on that potential now if it meant giving him a scholarship now, but if he could pay his own way, why not?

 

[timo0402]

You

If he were Nick Palooka, working class kid from Kinston, he'd be playing somewhere like ECU, on scholarship. I think it's a pretty safe bet that most scholarship players at humble schools like ECU probably have the chops on the court to be at least respectable walk-ons at Duke. It's the Pagliuca family, though, that can afford to turn down a scholarship elsewhere to walk-on at Duke (as if the academic rep and family legacy play no part). It is not, however, the Pagliuca name that K is trying to schmooze with. If anything, other people schmooze K.

Let's consider Justin Robinson. He's as good as he is b/c he's genetically related to David Robinson and has been exposed to basketball his whole life. He could have played elsewhere on a scholarship, but he can afford to walk-on at Duke and play for the GOAT. We wouldn't be redshirting him, though, if we didn't think he could develop later (like his dad did, and how) into a contributor. We weren't going to bet on that potential now if it meant giving him a scholarship now, but if he could pay his own way, why not?

Again you're missing the point and sensationalizing it. I'm not saying he is not worthy. I'm simply stating a fact- if you do not believe who his dad is has nothing to do with it you're flat out incorrect. I'm not saying K is trying to schmooze his dad or vice versa I'm simply pointing out it played a factor.

 

[Leo2Wes]

You


Again you're missing the point and sensationalizing it. I'm not saying he is not worthy. I'm simply stating a fact- if you do not believe who his dad is has nothing to do with it you're flat out incorrect. I'm not saying K is trying to schmooze his dad or vice versa I'm simply pointing out it played a factor.

Amen...

 

[dukiejay]

How does this matter what so ever again ?

Good....I though I might be the only one wondering that.

 

[Dattier]

Let's not sensanstionalize it here. He is a nice kid and a good player, so was his brother. Having an influential parent helps his opportunity to be a member of the squad though and if you don't think that played a part well then I don't know what to tell you.

Influential how? Influential in that he has raised two sons who were capable of fitting into their roles at Duke? Yeah. Influential in that K is doing him a favor in return for making sure Amile gets drafted? No. What influence does anyone have over K?

As far as sensationalizing anything goes, insinuating that there is anything compromised or unseemly in Pagliuca's getting any PT is far more sensational.

 

[Dattier]

You


Again you're missing the point and sensationalizing it. I'm not saying he is not worthy. I'm simply stating a fact- if you do not believe who his dad is has nothing to do with it you're flat out incorrect. I'm not saying K is trying to schmooze his dad or vice versa I'm simply pointing out it played a factor.

Played a factor in what, exactly? That he got PT ahead of Obi and Vrank vs VT b/c of who his dad is? That's what dev4ev absolutely implied.

I'm missing the point? You mean where I said his pedigree and family circumstances made him suitable for his role here as opposed to his dad's having curried favor somewhere? I missed something there?

 

[Leo2Wes]

I stand by my opinions...Look I love Duke as much as anyone....I met Vic Bubas at DUKE INDOOR STADIUM when I was six at his basketball school (precursor to naming it Cameron) but K is connected... He's an amazing treasure, but there is the human element at play in every facet of life...

 

[Dattier]

I just do not happen to believe Nick belonged on the floor over Vrank and Sean at the end yesterday...Despite all the criticisms hurled toward Sean I still think his ceiling and Vrank's represent a greater max than Pags.

Hey if we trotted out Sean in a crucial time at Wake (and who knows if that emergency won't arise again while AJ is out) wouldnt it AT THE VERY LEAST been beneficial to give him some burn at end yesterday?

I cannot feel Sean gained any CHANCE at some confidence from the pine yesterday watching Pags play while he sat-again, JMO

Nick didn't belong out there over them based on what? What do their higher ceilings have to do with it?

Did Sulaimon play zero minutes vs Michigan his soph year and get dismissed from the team last year b/c Pagliuca has a higher ceiling?

Do you recognize the difference between playing a 6-man rotation in a 50-point blowout in November and a 6-man rotation in a nailbiter NCAAT game in March? If so, you should recognize the difference between putting a little used 270# guy in during an undecided game vs WF and putting a walk-on in in a blowout vs VT.

If you've been a Duke fan as long as you claim, you should recognize by now that K doesn't award PT in every single game based on who has the higher ceiling. You want to ask the question of why Nick was out there? Cool. You want to insinuate making his dad happy had anything to do with it, or that it was a reflection of who has the greatest potential, not cool.

 

[pisgah101]

I gotta a funny feeling this new guy don't last long

 

[Dattier]

I stand by my opinions...Look I love Duke as much as anyone....I met Vic Bubas at DUKE INDOOR STADIUM when I was six at his basketball school (precursor to naming it Cameron) but K is connected... He's an amazing treasure, but there is the human element at play in every facet of life...

Hey, timo! Got any recommendations about not sensationalizing anything left, or have you used them all up already?

Save your personal testimony to how rah-rah Duke you are, dev, and demonstrate it through good posts. You're not merely pointing out how human K is; you're claiming there was something compromised about K's decisions about PT, and that it had anything to do w/ how powerful the Pagliuca family is.

 

[Leo2Wes]

Pisgah, Dattier I am just as loyal...My mom ascended to heaven with an autographed Duke basketball by her side April 13, 2011. Her death was preceded two days by my dad's demise. We were a Duke family. I still point to heaven in major Blue Devil wins and forever will...I am sorry my opinions today registered with such venom, but they were just my feelings...I shall continue to post as an AVID FOLLOWER, and am certain in most cases we will find a common ground...

 

[pisgah101]

No venom just odd

 

[Leo2Wes]

No venom just odd

??

 

[timo0402]

Played a factor in what, exactly? That he got PT ahead of Obi and Vrank vs VT b/c of who his dad is? That's what dev4ev absolutely implied.

I'm missing the point? You mean where I said his pedigree and family circumstances made him suitable for his role here as opposed to his dad's having curried favor somewhere? I missed something there?

I said nothing about him getting PT yesterday. Not one word nor do I care if he played over obi or vrank. I'm simply stating that who his dad is does have some influence on nick being a part of the team. Nothing more nothing less.

This has become a completely dysfunctional thread and I'm sorry for even chiming in to begin with.

 

[pisgah101]

??

The stuff you've posted about Nick lol weird stuff to bring up on a message board. But it's cool welcome to the board

 

[smashmouth5]

I thought K was big on guys earning time based on work on the practice court.

 

[dukiejay]

No venom just odd

I agree....where was the venom? People are so sensitive nowadays if you don't agree with them.

 

[Leo2Wes]

I agree....where was the venom? People are so sensitive nowadays if you don't agree with them.

Dukiejay my love for Duke makes me quite "sensitive" about all things at Methodist Flats. I am sorry you disagree with my choice of words...

Now, regarding something else rather than starting another thread....Perhaps more of my fellow Duke fans will agree and Pusgah thx for the welcome...

Tim Brandt's snide remark yesterday while MP3 was on the way to his 2nd double-double in a row was totally out of place. "He doesnt make it look easy!" What a complete lefthanded swipe of a compliment of a young man who has overachieved....

 

[QC Dukie]

B

Dukiejay my love for Duke makes me quite "sensitive" about all things at Methodist Flats. I am sorry you disagree with my choice of words...

Now, regarding something else rather than starting another thread....Perhaps more of my fellow Duke fans will agree and Pusgah thx for the welcome...

Tim Brandt's snide remark yesterday while MP3 was on the way to his 2nd double-double in a row was totally out of place. "He doesnt make it look easy!" What a complete lefthanded swipe of a compliment of a young man who has overachieved....

Brandt is an idiot plain and simple. His dislike for Duke is so blatant. Can't stand him.

OFC

 

[Dattier]

I said nothing about him getting PT yesterday. Not one word nor do I care if he played over obi or vrank. I'm simply stating that who his dad is does have some influence on nick being a part of the team. Nothing more nothing less.

This has become a completely dysfunctional thread and I'm sorry for even chiming in to begin with.

I agree. Where you chimed in was responding to someone who was responding to someone who was implying or directly stating all that stuff you are clarifying that you didn't say. Sorry for my part in the dysfunction.