Adjustments

[xxxbobxxx]

We have had a few games now, some cupcakes, some real competition. Audidge is due back. And the other board is talking rotation. Let’s try something similar here. I would hope the staff has enough data to reset altogether and here is what I think:

start: boo, Berry, Simmons, nance and young until audidge gets his stamina and stroke back then substitute him for Simmons. Each serve as 6th man when not starting. And read the room - ride the hot hand of the night among boo, Berry, audidge and Simmons. Fit in Greer as needed.

on the larger side - run small when the other team gives it to you and pull / rest young. Then run Beran or Williams w young when nance needs a breather.

Regardless, reduce Beran minutes, pick his spots and try to rebuild his confidence by playing him in favorable matchups.

Be fluid, not stubborn - let the minutes run as the game dictates, not the game plan, seniority or coach plan wants.

I think this team might be able to surprise some people but I think the coaching decisions will loom large - especially in game coaching decisions.

 

[GatoLouco]

That is, IMO, a very good take. I'd add avoid zone for more than a very limited amount of time. Don't use it as a game plan. Use it as a disruption, to protect from foul trouble, but not as a game plan.

 

[PurpleWhiteBoy]

We have had a few games now, some cupcakes, some real competition. Audidge is due back. And the other board is talking rotation. Let’s try something similar here. I would hope the staff has enough data to reset altogether and here is what I think:

start: boo, Berry, Simmons, nance and young until audidge gets his stamina and stroke back then substitute him for Simmons. Each serve as 6th man when not starting. And read the room - ride the hot hand of the night among boo, Berry, audidge and Simmons. Fit in Greer as needed.

on the larger side - run small when the other team gives it to you and pull / rest young. Then run Beran or Williams w young when nance needs a breather.

Regardless, reduce Beran minutes, pick his spots and try to rebuild his confidence by playing him in favorable matchups.

Be fluid, not stubborn - let the minutes run as the game dictates, not the game plan, seniority or coach plan wants.

I think this team might be able to surprise some people but I think the coaching decisions will look large.

Very good points.
We can benefit by having one general lineup with Nance and guys who can run the floor.
Historically, the evidence against "Nance with Beran" is very strong.
Most of the time it should be "Nance with Young" and a grinding style.

It actually isn't complicated!!!

If/when Audige comes back, Collins has to be careful not to mess up the stuff that is working. I would assume Audige has less to offer than Buie (certainly), Berry (probably) and Greer (maybe).

 

[GatoLouco]

To some extent the Audige situation is similar to Buie. We have a guy who has a ton of talent, but has had trouble finding a role in the team that helps the group. Who tends to want to do too much, and not nearly enough of letting the game come to him.

So, here's to hoping he comes back more mature and playing less hero ball. Shot selection is the only real big problem with his game. In other facets, he's a good defender and helps on the boards.

 

[phatcat_rivals223240]

We have had a few games now, some cupcakes, some real competition. Audidge is due back. And the other board is talking rotation. Let’s try something similar here. I would hope the staff has enough data to reset altogether and here is what I think:

start: boo, Berry, Simmons, nance and young until audidge gets his stamina and stroke back then substitute him for Simmons. Each serve as 6th man when not starting. And read the room - ride the hot hand of the night among boo, Berry, audidge and Simmons. Fit in Greer as needed.

on the larger side - run small when the other team gives it to you and pull / rest young. Then run Beran or Williams w young when nance needs a breather.

Regardless, reduce Beran minutes, pick his spots and try to rebuild his confidence by playing him in favorable matchups.

Be fluid, not stubborn - let the minutes run as the game dictates, not the game plan, seniority or coach plan wants.

I think this team might be able to surprise some people but I think the coaching decisions will look large.

I think this team might be able to surprise some people but I think the coaching decisions will look large.

uh oh.

I still have low confidence in CCC. Maybe he grows up this year.

 

[Purple Pile Driver]

I think this team might be able to surprise some people but I think the coaching decisions will look large.

uh oh.

I still have low confidence in CCC. Maybe he grows up this year.

CCC has done most everything right so far this year! This team is playing hard and watch the team enthusiasm on the bench. That’s a good culture despite what others want to say. The talent is middle of the pack for the B1G AT BEST. Any fair evaluation can see the improvement of almost everyone that has been in the program 2-3 years. If this team makes the tourney, it will be a great coaching job.

 

[TheC]

CCC has done most everything right so far this year! This team is playing hard and watch the team enthusiasm on the bench. That’s a good culture despite what others want to say. The talent is middle of the pack for the B1G AT BEST. Any fair evaluation can see the improvement of almost everyone that has been in the program 2-3 years. If this team makes the tourney, it will be a great coaching job.

I love how we all know so much more about the team then the head coach who knows them personally and watches them in practices and games every day.

The bottom line is NU is an impossible place to win. Tough academics. Almost no history. No fan support. How on earth do you get enough high quality players here?

 

[PurpleWhiteBoy]

CCC has done most everything right so far this year! This team is playing hard and watch the team enthusiasm on the bench. That’s a good culture despite what others want to say. The talent is middle of the pack for the B1G AT BEST. Any fair evaluation can see the improvement of almost everyone that has been in the program 2-3 years. If this team makes the tourney, it will be a great coaching job.

Is there a Chris Collins fanclub that I don't know about?
When you play Robbie Beran more than Ryan Young, its almost like you are trying to lose.

As for the Big Ten - there are 3 teams in the Top 25. Our talent is certainly mid pack.
We have 2 starters who are "above average", one who is "good" and one who is average.
The bench players are decent.

 

[Purple Pile Driver]

Is there a Chris Collins fanclub that I don't know about?
When you play Robbie Beran more than Ryan Young, its almost like you are trying to lose.

As for the Big Ten - there are 3 teams in the Top 25. Our talent is certainly mid pack.
We have 2 starters who are "above average", one who is "good" and one who is average.
The bench players are decent.

There should be a CCC fan club for the first 5 games. Also, extend it to his Assistants. You oversimplify everything as usual. If we do have mid pack talent then you must agree that CCC and the staff have done a great job of developing it? Pretty sure you don’t feel that way, so what is the justification for your statement of mid-pack? Do you want me to rattle off the number of 4-5 stars on rosters of other B1G programs. I can assure you NU is lower than mid pack in players ratings. I can pretty much guarantee you that there won’t be more than 3-4 fan bases in the B1G that would say boy than NU has a bevy of talent, why can’t we get guys like that

Young doesn’t play more minutes because he is a liability on defense. Plain and simple. Young was the best player on the team in his second year. He is crafty and his old school offense game is effective. I love Ryan Young, he is being used perfectly. I could definitely see Beran earning a reduced role soon, but you won’t see Young suddenly getting a giant boost in minutes due to Beran.

NU will lose the B1G games where they don’t shoot well. Sure as the sun coming up, we’ll hear about Beran playing too much, Young not playing enough, MN could help with rebounds, we played too much zone, Boo is not a PG, and of course, CCC didn’t stick with the correct combo. Probably CBC will come back into the conversation. All will point to CCC as the culprit for the loss. How often does CCC receive credit from you or others that see him as someone who can do no right? Never. If it every smacked of a balance critique, I would likely never post in the subject.

Happy thanksgiving

 

[EvanstonCat]

I could see Audige taking Beran's spot. A little small, but it probably gets our best 5 on the floor at once.

 

[PurpleWhiteBoy]

There should be a CCC fan club for the first 5 games. Also, extend it to his Assistants. You oversimplify everything as usual. If we do have mid pack talent then you must agree that CCC and the staff have done a great job of developing it? Pretty sure you don’t feel that way, so what is the justification for your statement of mid-pack? Do you want me to rattle off the number of 4-5 stars on rosters of other B1G programs. I can assure you NU is lower than mid pack in players ratings. I can pretty much guarantee you that there won’t be more than 3-4 fan bases in the B1G that would say boy than NU has a bevy of talent, why can’t we get guys like that

Young doesn’t play more minutes because he is a liability on defense. Plain and simple. Young was the best player on the team in his second year. He is crafty and his old school offense game is effective. I love Ryan Young, he is being used perfectly. I could definitely see Beran earning a reduced role soon, but you won’t see Young suddenly getting a giant boost in minutes due to Beran.

NU will lose the B1G games where they don’t shoot well. Sure as the sun coming up, we’ll hear about Beran playing too much, Young not playing enough, MN could help with rebounds, we played too much zone, Boo is not a PG, and of course, CCC didn’t stick with the correct combo. Probably CBC will come back into the conversation. All will point to CCC as the culprit for the loss. How often does CCC receive credit from you or others that see him as someone who can do no right? Never. If it every smacked of a balance critique, I would likely never post in the subject.

Happy thanksgiving

I have made plenty of statements that Collins has been able to recruit talented players. I don't think he has done a great job of developing them. Beran is a good example of that. Kopp was another example. Gaines too. Not saying he is horrible at player development, but I know he isn't good at it. Most players develop naturally - there should be some improvement from one year to the next. My main concern about CCC is his lineups and use of his roster, as I have documented. Last year was pretty bad.

Young is one of our three best players. Apparently you agree with that assessment. If he isn't playing 26 minutes or more per night, he is being misused. You cannot sit one of your 3 best players on the bench for more than half of the game for no reason, as Collins did against Providence. At some point I really hope the coach realizes that.

Buie would be a better 2 guard than a point guard, but we don't seem to have a true point guard. Nothing against Buie. Too bad we don't have 2 of him.

Lastly, when it comes to zone defenses, I don't mind them at all. Three guys on the perimeter and Young and Nance guarding the basket. I rarely criticize tactics. If I had stats on our performance using specific defenses, then I might.

I let the results of our games dictate my opinions... (other than Matt Nicholson, of course - that opinion is just based on 40 years of basketball history - good coaches get physical young 7 footers "learning minutes" whenever possible)

Happy Thanksgiving to you as well.

 

[xxxbobxxx]

I love how we all know so much more about the team then the head coach who knows them personally and watches them in practices and games every day.

The bottom line is NU is an impossible place to win. Tough academics. Almost no history. No fan support. How on earth do you get enough high quality players here?

Then don’t waste millions on such a program. There are lots of other kids that work their *** off in non revenue sports. Redirect that budget to them and run MBB like a true bottom feeder program.

 

[PurpleWhiteBoy]

I love how we all know so much more about the team then the head coach who knows them personally and watches them in practices and games every day.

The bottom line is NU is an impossible place to win. Tough academics. Almost no history. No fan support. How on earth do you get enough high quality players here?

I love how some people think the coach is always right, despite the evidence!

NU is not an impossible place to win at basketball. You need 8 guys collected over a 3 year period.
The school's reputation (diploma-wise) is better than all but a few Power-5 teams.
The facilities are "okay" not "trash" anymore.
The campus is better than most.
Evanston is better than most.
Admittedly, winter quarter can shock kids who have never seen snow.

We should be seeing results. I'm confidently hoping that we'll put the the last couple of years behind us and never go back there.

It is true that fan support is awful, especially from the students... but they'll show up this year when we win a few. NU students don't want to associate with losing. Its weird and sad at the same time. Not a lot of school loyalty.

 

[GatoLouco]

There should be a CCC fan club for the first 5 games. Also, extend it to his Assistants. You oversimplify everything as usual. If we do have mid pack talent then you must agree that CCC and the staff have done a great job of developing it? Pretty sure you don’t feel that way, so what is the justification for your statement of mid-pack? Do you want me to rattle off the number of 4-5 stars on rosters of other B1G programs. I can assure you NU is lower than mid pack in players ratings. I can pretty much guarantee you that there won’t be more than 3-4 fan bases in the B1G that would say boy than NU has a bevy of talent, why can’t we get guys like that

Young doesn’t play more minutes because he is a liability on defense. Plain and simple. Young was the best player on the team in his second year. He is crafty and his old school offense game is effective. I love Ryan Young, he is being used perfectly. I could definitely see Beran earning a reduced role soon, but you won’t see Young suddenly getting a giant boost in minutes due to Beran.

NU will lose the B1G games where they don’t shoot well. Sure as the sun coming up, we’ll hear about Beran playing too much, Young not playing enough, MN could help with rebounds, we played too much zone, Boo is not a PG, and of course, CCC didn’t stick with the correct combo. Probably CBC will come back into the conversation. All will point to CCC as the culprit for the loss. How often does CCC receive credit from you or others that see him as someone who can do no right? Never. If it every smacked of a balance critique, I would likely never post in the subject.

Happy thanksgiving

Why is Young a liability on defense? And how is he a worst post defender than anyone else on the team?

Happy thanksgiving

 

[NUCat320]

NU student support can be absolutely great. It’s just that it’s great once per season, following two wins, and then nobody shows up again when NU loses that game that everybody showed up to. But every student at that game has fun.

Turn that into an edge: “We pound the rock so hard here that we earn our student support. Nothing’s given to us. We wouldn’t want it.”

(But for a few programs, I think most hoops programs are the same way. The problem is that 3% of NU undergrads who might regularly show up is a lot smaller than 3% of any other school.)

 

[PurpleWhiteBoy]

Why is Young a liability on defense? And how is he a worst post defender than anyone else on the team?

Happy thanksgiving

Ryan Young appears to be a liability on defense when the coach sends him out there with 4 guards and we get out-rebounded and outscored. Some people see that and conclude Young is a bad defender. People like me see the same things and draw a very different conclusion.

Or they watch him try to stop the best big guys in the league (last year Garza, Cockburn, Dickinson) and when Young can't handle them, they conclude he's a bad defender. By that standard, practically every post player in college basketball is a bad defender.

Here's reality from 20 games against Big Ten teams last year...
When Nance played with Beran, we averaged 63 points scored and 76 points allowed.
When Nance played with Young we averaged 63 points scored and 59 points allowed.

 

[ThatadultfromHolland]

Why is Young a liability on defense? And how is he a worst post defender than anyone else on the team?

Happy thanksgiving

Not athletic enough to get in position quickly enough on slashing guards. Not strong enough to defend against some bigs who can just post him up and get wherever they want. Doesn’t have the height to bother shots even when in position against a center who can back him down where they want. It’ll look like a good contest but he let the guy work him into the spot where he isn’t gonna miss.

 

[lunker35]

I love how we all know so much more about the team then the head coach who knows them personally and watches them in practices and games every day.

The bottom line is NU is an impossible place to win. Tough academics. Almost no history. No fan support. How on earth do you get enough high quality players here?

That’s such a bad take. We need to shed this mantra that nobody can win here. I’m sorry
but it’s BS.

 

[GatoLouco]

Not athletic enough to get in position quickly enough on slashing guards. Not strong enough to defend against some bigs who can just post him up and get wherever they want. Doesn’t have the height to bother shots even when in position against a center who can back him down where they want. It’ll look like a good contest but he let the guy work him into the spot where he isn’t gonna miss.

That really does not answer why he’s worse than others in the post. Other than the speed part compared to Nance, I see nothing in what you pointed out that makes him a worse option.

And points none of the things he’s better at defensively compared to our alternatives. Not strong enough? Sure, in a vacuum, against Cockburn, true. But stronger than our alternatives.

Confirmation bias attempts. The time I saw him being a liability was being placed in the back of the 1-3-1 zone 2 years ago. Miraculously working against Providence before being forever abandoned after teams killed us while we used it in the next couple of games.

 

[GatoLouco]

That’s such a bad take. We need to shed this mantra that nobody can win here. I’m sorry
but it’s BS.

Or the mantra of not questioning the coach. It’s a great way to justify accepting mediocrity. Widely used in authoritarian regimes or, more commonly, by bad leaders/managers to protect their own incompetency.

 

[ThatadultfromHolland]

That really does not answer why he’s worse than others in the post. Other than the speed part compared to Nance, I see nothing in what you pointed out that makes him a worse option.

And points none of the things he’s better at defensively compared to our alternatives. Not strong enough? Sure, in a vacuum, against Cockburn, true. But stronger than our alternatives.

Confirmation bias attempts. The time I saw him being a liability was being placed in the back of the 1-3-1 zone 2 years ago. Miraculously working against Providence before being forever abandoned after teams killed us while we used it in the next couple of games.

Nance is easily our best help defender and has the height and shot blocking ability to help make up for lack of strength in the post. Main issue is foul trouble.

Beran is a much better help and perimeter defender. Quick feet and can cover more ground with his length.

Look at any center young played against this season and you’ll see clips of them getting in excellent position against young with their back to the basket.

Im not a fan of zone either. It should be a change of pace not a main defense imo.

 

[Purple Pile Driver]

Why is Young a liability on defense? And how is he a worst post defender than anyone else on the team?

Happy thanksgiving

IMO is is not a good defender and is slow with help. Rebounding is not his strength either. However, his offense is reason to keep him seeing significant minutes. He is a good player and I agree with PWB that he should see plenty of minutes.

 

[hdhntr1]

To some extent the Audige situation is similar to Buie. We have a guy who has a ton of talent, but has had trouble finding a role in the team that helps the group. Who tends to want to do too much, and not nearly enough of letting the game come to him.

So, here's to hoping he comes back more mature and playing less hero ball. Shot selection is the only real big problem with his game. In other facets, he's a good defender and helps on the boards.

Last year he sort of had to try to do too much. That does not look like the situation he would be walking into this year.

 

[hdhntr1]

We have had a few games now, some cupcakes, some real competition. Audidge is due back. And the other board is talking rotation. Let’s try something similar here. I would hope the staff has enough data to reset altogether and here is what I think:

start: boo, Berry, Simmons, nance and young until audidge gets his stamina and stroke back then substitute him for Simmons. Each serve as 6th man when not starting. And read the room - ride the hot hand of the night among boo, Berry, audidge and Simmons. Fit in Greer as needed.

on the larger side - run small when the other team gives it to you and pull / rest young. Then run Beran or Williams w young when nance needs a breather.

Regardless, reduce Beran minutes, pick his spots and try to rebuild his confidence by playing him in favorable matchups.

Be fluid, not stubborn - let the minutes run as the game dictates, not the game plan, seniority or coach plan wants.

I think this team might be able to surprise some people but I think the coaching decisions will loom large - especially in game coaching decisions.

Please stop with this Nash and Young together. It will likely remain only an occasional thing. If we play them together we really don't have the personnel to spell either one of them (other than each other) Nicholson is not ready to get more than a couple minutes in bigger games and neither is best if they have to go 30 plus minutes which would be required in order to play them together more than a few minutes a game. Any more than that leaves too many holes. And their playing together is likely more a function of matchups.

 

[SDakaGordie]

Or the mantra of not questioning the coach. It’s a great way to justify accepting mediocrity. Widely used in authoritarian regimes or, more commonly, by bad leaders/managers to protect their own incompetency.

You think Collins himself is all of authoritarian, incompetent and accepts mediocrity? I guess you are a really thankful kind of guy these days. Thought we were getting somewhere.

 

[Purple Pile Driver]

That’s such a bad take. We need to shed this mantra that nobody can win here. I’m sorry
but it’s BS.

Can you explain why a 5 star recruit would select NU? You played baseball. If you were a top 50 baseball prospect would you select NU? If the answer is “no”, I bet most of the reasons are similar to why it is difficult to recruit elite studs to NU for basketball. Talent wins 90% of the time. I will never say it is impossible, but I will say it is damn difficult to to win at NU. You may catch lightning in the bottle, but consistent winning?

 

[Purple Pile Driver]

Nance is easily our best help defender and has the height and shot blocking ability to help make up for lack of strength in the post. Main issue is foul trouble.

Beran is a much better help and perimeter defender. Quick feet and can cover more ground with his length.

Look at any center young played against this season and you’ll see clips of them getting in excellent position against young with their back to the basket.

Im not a fan of zone either. It should be a change of pace not a main defense imo.

CCC plays a zone because 1) we have sub par individual defenders and 2) to protect the 2 primary Bigs that would be in foul trouble A LOT if they played straight up the entire game and 3) they have no Big that capable of giving them minutes as a defense first guy off the bench.

 

[Purple Pile Driver]

Or the mantra of not questioning the coach. It’s a great way to justify accepting mediocrity. Widely used in authoritarian regimes or, more commonly, by bad leaders/managers to protect their own incompetency.

Again, who says you can’t question the Coach? No Coach makes all the right moves. They deserve to be challenged for buffoonery. I don’t see anyone on here supporting all things CCC. OTOH, there sure seems to be a mantra of the Coach is to blame for everything that they disagree with. The same group of posters rip CCC when we are winning and playing well. What do you think will be the focus of this board when we lose a few in a row? Bet it don’t take more than 2 loses before we hear of the infamous losing streaks of the last 2 years.

This is a message board. Coaches are lightning rods. I didn’t care for CBC at all, others thought he was great. I am for the most part pro-CCC, you clearly are not. So what? It doesn’t make me smarter or dumber than you. It’s an opinion and it doesn’t make me part of an authoritarian regime that accepts mediocrity!

 

[GatoLouco]

You think Collins himself is all of authoritarian, incompetent and accepts mediocrity? I guess you are a really thankful kind of guy these days. Thought we were getting somewhere.

No. I do not think that. I was just laying out reasons why questioning anyone is just a normal thing to do in open societies. It was a comment directed at those who suggest criticizing the coach (or anyone for that matter) is silly.

 

[hdhntr1]

I love how we all know so much more about the team then the head coach who knows them personally and watches them in practices and games every day.

The bottom line is NU is an impossible place to win. Tough academics. Almost no history. No fan support. How on earth do you get enough high quality players here?

Hopefully not impossible but very, very difficult

 

[hdhntr1]

Is there a Chris Collins fanclub that I don't know about?
When you play Robbie Beran more than Ryan Young, its almost like you are trying to lose.

As for the Big Ten - there are 3 teams in the Top 25. Our talent is certainly mid pack.
We have 2 starters who are "above average", one who is "good" and one who is average.
The bench players are decent.

They play different positions. Beran is the starter at his position for now but Young #2 at his position.

 

[GatoLouco]

Again, who says you can’t question the Coach? No Coach makes all the right moves. They deserve to be challenged for buffoonery. I don’t see anyone on here supporting all things CCC. OTOH, there sure seems to be a mantra of the Coach is to blame for everything that they disagree with. The same group of posters rip CCC when we are winning and playing well. What do you think will be the focus of this board when we lose a few in a row? Bet it don’t take more than 2 loses before we hear of the infamous losing streaks of the last 2 years.

This is a message board. Coaches are lightning rods. I didn’t care for CBC at all, others thought he was great. I am for the most part pro-CCC, you clearly are not. So what? It doesn’t make me smarter or dumber than you. It’s an opinion and it doesn’t make me part of an authoritarian regime that accepts mediocrity!

Things CC, IMO, does well:
1) Recruiting
2) Creating team spirit and keeping the team together

Things I have made positive comments about:
1) Boo's decisions being better, despite so much complaining about it
2) Greer being better, even a decent off the bench guy, which I did not think it was possible
3) Berry's evolution
4) Nance's confidence
5) Williams being a good pickup in the portal, despite the questions that remain about his production

Even if some of what I pointed out could the player individually putting in the work, it is far more likely CC is a good influence and steered the boat in that direction.

I criticize and will continue to do so. What I will not do is call for his dismissal before he fails to deliver a 9 win season. Which I know you believe is not reasonable, but I think is the bare minimum with a, relative to the B1G this year, at least average roster.

 

[hoosboot]

The same group of posters rip CCC when we are winning and playing well.

The same group of posters was ripping CCC when the team went to the 2nd round of the NCAA tourney? I don't recall that, but maybe you have some examples.

 

[hdhntr1]

There should be a CCC fan club for the first 5 games. Also, extend it to his Assistants. You oversimplify everything as usual. If we do have mid pack talent then you must agree that CCC and the staff have done a great job of developing it? Pretty sure you don’t feel that way, so what is the justification for your statement of mid-pack? Do you want me to rattle off the number of 4-5 stars on rosters of other B1G programs. I can assure you NU is lower than mid pack in players ratings. I can pretty much guarantee you that there won’t be more than 3-4 fan bases in the B1G that would say boy than NU has a bevy of talent, why can’t we get guys like that

Young doesn’t play more minutes because he is a liability on defense. Plain and simple. Young was the best player on the team in his second year. He is crafty and his old school offense game is effective. I love Ryan Young, he is being used perfectly. I could definitely see Beran earning a reduced role soon, but you won’t see Young suddenly getting a giant boost in minutes due to Beran.

NU will lose the B1G games where they don’t shoot well. Sure as the sun coming up, we’ll hear about Beran playing too much, Young not playing enough, MN could help with rebounds, we played too much zone, Boo is not a PG, and of course, CCC didn’t stick with the correct combo. Probably CBC will come back into the conversation. All will point to CCC as the culprit for the loss. How often does CCC receive credit from you or others that see him as someone who can do no right? Never. If it every smacked of a balance critique, I would likely never post in the subject.

Happy thanksgiving

Well put. We have improved our level of talent but that still does not get us anywhere near the top of the conference. Basically the times we can make a splash is when a lot of that talent has at least a couple years in the program and has developed enough together to making an impact and like it or not that will not be every year no mater how much we would like it to be. This year appears to be one of the years where we have enough talent developed to potentially do something.

 

[hoosboot]

They play different positions. Beran is the starter at his position for now but Young #2 at his position.

I think the point that people like PWB is making is that Beran is actually #2 at his position...just that Nance isn't playing the position he should be playing. Nance certainly doesn't seem to have a Draymond kind of future, so I can certainly see the merit of the argument.

 

[hdhntr1]

I think the point that people like PWB is making is that Beran is actually #2 at his position...just that Nance isn't playing the position he should be playing. Nance certainly doesn't seem to have a Draymond kind of future, so I can certainly see the merit of the argument.

Nance and Young are currently the only two guys that CAN play the position (5). That is why they for the most part cannot be on the floor at the same time. There would be no one really ready to spell them and it would expose them to too much opportunity to get fouls at the position if on the floor at the same time. Occasionally matchups may get us to 5 minutes or so in a game when both would be on the floor but most of the time, not a good idea.

 

[hoosboot]

Well put. We have improved our level of talent but that still does not get us anywhere near the top of the conference. Basically the times we can make a splash is when a lot of that talent has at least a couple years in the program and has developed enough together to making an impact and like it or not that will not be every year no mater how much we would like it to be. This year appears to be one of the years where we have enough talent developed to potentially do something.

You mean NU needs to be a developmental program? YES! PRAISE THE LORD! I don't post a ton, but I've been saying the same the last couple of years. The biggest criticism I have is that NU doesn't seem to have a clear program that it develops towards. Watching the team the last four years, I couldn't really tell you the identity of this program or the way it intends to win basketball games. For a program like NU that has to win by developing its players and win with guys who have grown together over a couple of years in it, that's a problem.

 

[hoosboot]

Nance and Young are currently the only two guys that CAN play the position. That is why they for the most part cannot be on the floor at the same time. There would be no one really ready to spell them and it would expose them to too much opportunity to get fouls at the position if on the floor at the same time. Occasionally matchups may get us to 5 minutes or so in a game when both would be on the floor but most of the time, not a good idea.

That's the best argument I see against the idea. And it's certainly a problem if it's true. Is that a valid criticism of the recruiting? I can't imagine that Nance was recruited to play center. Regardless, I could see Beran losing some minutes to both Young and Simmons from different matchup standpoints. Will be interesting to see how CCC uses Audige as well.

 

[GatoLouco]

That's the best argument I see against the idea. And it's certainly a problem if it's true. Is that a valid criticism of the recruiting? I can't imagine that Nance was recruited to play center. Regardless, I could see Beran losing some minutes to both Young and Simmons from different matchup standpoints. Will be interesting to see how CCC uses Audige as well.

Is there data to support the argument? Probably not. And it surely does not explain Young having 9 at half time and being benched the entire second half.

Nance is a kid who grew up playing guard. Who still, today, shows he is much more comfortable facing the basket than with his back to the basket. You can see why CC likes him playing 5. You go back to any year of his tenure and you saw, for example, Pardon, over and over again, at the top of the key, often awkwardly waiting for a passing lane, a guy who can't shoot the 3, should be fed in the post more, but is stuck trying to create space, which ultimately he does not because his defender stays inside. Now you have a guy who teams actually have to come out to, creating space, can shoot the three... sounds like heaven. Except you still need to rebound, ideally it would be Nance with 4 guards, if said guards could rebound well, Baylor 2020 style. As they can't, you put Beran out there, which last year was not enough to rebound decently, and, to make things worse, is a stiff on offense who lost his confidence from 3.

So the conclusion is that RY does not fit the threatening 5 on the outside creating space mold, so he does not play as much as he should. It's an offense designed for 5 players comfortable playing facing the basket. One that Villanova or Baylor made very successful. Works with very athletic players, NBA for example is full of them, who rebound well despite not being post players, who are good slashing off the dribble. Players we usually don't have.

 

[Sec_112]

That’s such a bad take. We need to shed this mantra that nobody can win here. I’m sorry
but it’s BS.

I'm sorry, Lunker. But you've been around here long enough to know better. You're not some Johnny-come-lately who spouts this stuff without context or some endless campaign of the same yammering viewpoints.

At some point, the track record tells you what this truly is. I doubt anyone in the NCAA coaching profession would have disputed hiring Carmody, Collins and yes, even KO at the time. All of them walked in here with good reputations - at worst. And what's been the results?

That's 20+ YEARS! Twenty years of hoping - simply hoping - to make the NIT or reach .500 in conference. Three coaches HOPING to have back-to-back strong seasons. How much lower do the standards have to be? That's not something you can simply brush aside with a new mentality. It's 20+ years of fact.

Yes, it's a loser's mentality, and most of us hate it. I'm with you if you tell me the the psyche needs to totally change, and many use it as an excuse. But this isn't the same NU as 1990. They've actually put some money into the program and operated like an organization that generates the tens of millions that it does.

They've hired coaches on career upswings. And I don't believe for a second that BC, CC and KO walked in here thinking about the history, fan base and challenge to recruit. All of them probably thought they could be better than the NU history and get the program over the hump. All of us know the results.

If there's going to be an objective analysis - and more importantly, a fair and objective evaluation to find the right guy to turn this around, you can't ignore the grade restrictions ... the fan base ... the truth about recruiting ... and much more. Otherwise, you end up with KO. And God only knows how many out here still walk around with scars from the blip of his tenure.