Am I alone thinking Ingram needs another year?

[matthew1]

Don't get me wrong, fantastic player. Kid can hit the 3 and play multiple positions. He needs another development year. Needs to gain weight and play better defense. With his body type and position in the NBA probably being a 4, he will get destroyed. People say he compares to Durant but I dont see it. His shot isnt as good and frame is way to thin. Tyus surpised me last year so I know Ingram sees a pay day but with the incoming class, they can make a serious run if he returns with Allen. JMO

 

[timo0402]

Like every other year when this comes up, could he use another year, absolutely. He can also develop his body and game in the NBA. Comparisons to durant are fair in that they play the same type of way and have the same lanky skinny frame. Durant is still skinny and he's put on a ton of weight and muscle. Ingram is going to be a top 2 pick. He's gone, and he should be.

 

[BOOGIEMAN1914]

another year of development wont be the same as this year w/ tatum coming in, both would deserve more time to get that development....brandon can get all that in the league/on the job training...top2 is too much money to put off

 

[lyonhawk]

He's going to be a top 2 pick. Why do people think that a kid's game is going to develop more in a 40-game season against college kids than an 82-game season against pros?

 

[dukiejay]

I think players can always use another season in college, but it really makes zero sense for Brandon to come back. All the improvements he can make in college he can also make in the NBA. On top of that, he's going to be picked in the top three.

Brandon's Duke career is coming to an end soon. Enjoy him while he's here.

 

[HeLooks2MuchLikeDave]

The only way he should come back is if he really really wants to.

 

[skysdad]

He's as ready as any freshman I've seen. Wish they would allow high players to enter draft and if they went to school they would have to stay 3 years. Over a few years I it would improve both the college and NBA. IMO if this happened there would be a flood of high school declaring. Of course the D league would have to expanded simply because they aren't ready There may be an extra round or two for the draft. Those that aren't drafted could try out as free agents or try playing overseas . I'm not really in the know on how much the opportunity playing overseas would be but I know there all several leagues with different playing levels. During the summer at the lake I work with a guy that plays for a team in Sweden. His name is Peter Lucas Troutman. He played for Elon University and played high school ball with a couple of the Plumlees and guarded Mason when Elon came to Duke which has nothing to do with this post just a note of interest. He said European ball is actually pretty good and the money he makes is real good considering he doesn't pay taxes where he's at and his expenses including where he lives is paid for by the team. He's the second person I know that has played overseas. Back to my point. After a few years less and less high school players would declare after realizing the road to becoming a HOFamer is not easy and decide to take advantage of the talent, go to school and get that degree. IMO high school players would get better grades in high school also to insure they could get in. Then when would have that talent longer in college. I think that the talent would be spread out more and the great coaches would still be great coaches, the players would be competing still for that national title and we as fans would still be fans. It would still be a great game. All of this is just my opinion and it may sound like it's coming from a looney or one of those yahoo's that Hark-_The_ Sound _ 2010 seems to believe we have over here. Now I guess I need to stop because I'm getting about as long posting as Dsouth and you guys are going to make fun of me. Just want to get a least one like from DI on the post to make me feel good OFC

 

[gottagonow]

Of course he could use another year to improve his game just as pretty much all college players. I've never seen why anyone compares Ingram to Durant other they both play basketball but I think Ingram will be playing in the NBA next season.

 

[matthew1]

Who's a better player. Tatum or Ingram? I see Tatum as a more complete player but Ingram is better all around. Tatum will slide into his spot then right?

 

[timo0402]

Of course he could use another year to improve his game just as pretty much all college players. I've never seen why anyone compares Ingram to Durant other they both play basketball but I think Ingram will be playing in the NBA next season.

You can't see the comparisons? Really? They're both long, skinny, slashing wings that can shoot from deep, very good handles for players that size and have incredible wing spans. Both had/have incredibly high ceilings.

Now i'm not saying Brandon ends up being as good or even close to as good as KD, probably a long shot, but the similarities are undeniably there. If he sticks with it, ends up in the right situation and continues to fill out, he has a chance to be very special.

 

[nets on nets on nets]

He was gone before he ever stepped foot on campus. Remember, this is a much weaker draft than the 2017 draft projects to be, he is basically a lock to be the #2 pick, some people like him more than Simmons it seems. The Durant comparisons are for real, I am unable to reference it, but someone did a Shot Chart comparing Ingram and KD from college, and the percentages from each spot on the floor are IDENTICAL.
Also remember, KD got knocked at the combine for being unable to bench 185 pounds, that turned out to not matter at all!

Ingram and Tatum play different styles so it's tough to compare, and Tatum will not be asked to do nearly as much as Ingram is currently being asked. But I'll attempt to compare them...
Tatum= more of a complete player, can do everything on offense. Guards well, rebounds great for his position.
Ingram= more raw than Tatum will be, but has a higher ceiling due to his height and wingspan. And with the NBA currently really valuing the 3 point shot, if Ingram can consistently make NBA 3's, will be an all star.

 

[dukiejay]

You can't see the comparisons? Really? They're both long, skinny, slashing wings that can shoot from deep, very good handles for players that size and have incredible wing spans. Both had/have incredibly high ceilings.

Most people can't get past a comparison to Kevin Durant. They don't understand what it means. At least that's the conclusion I've come to. You know he's not Kevin Durant, I know he's not, the vast majority of people with common sense know he's not....but, when they hear that they think that's what everyone is saying.

So I'll try to spell it out. He's not Kevin Durant. However, are their similarities to their games? Very much so. That's obvious. They're unique athletes with similar frames and similar styles. Of course Durant is more advanced. He's one of the top players in the world. No one is saying that about Brandon. They're saying his style is most similar to Durant's....and you'd have to be living under a rock not to see the similarities.

 

[DukeRulesBasketball]

I love the guy!! I would absolutely love it if he came back another year, but just don't see it. Unfortunately, He is as good as gone when Duke's season is over.

 

[jimlsumner]

Why would anyone think Ingram is going to be an NBA 4?

 

[Laettner]

He has to go & take care of his family. If it were my son he'd be gone.

 

[Buzzooka Joe]

Does he need another year?... YES!

Will any team risk NOT picking him as a Top 2 Pick?... NO!

Will/should Ingram turn down Top 2 Pick money?.. HELL NO!

Anybody that is a 100% Top 5 Pick should never stay another year... A player like Ingram, can be a lottery pick without averaging double figures at Duke.. So the fact that he averages 15+ makes him an easy top 5 pick, any year.. Where a Grayson Allen isn't a guaranteed Top 5 (or lottery) pick, even if he averages 25 points a game.

 

[Buzzooka Joe]

If someone says they don't see the Ingram / KD comparison at all, I'm curious who they would compare him to? Because there are a LOT of similarities with Ingram & KD..

If you don't want to compare Ingram to an "elite" player, then I would say he's similar to Nicolas Batum.. But Batum is basically a poor man's KD.. so he's still similar to KD, regardless.

And to compare 2 players doesn't mean you are saying they are at equal skill levels.. Seth Curry's game is very similar to Steph Curry.. But that doesn't mean they are anywhere near the same level.

 

[gottagonow]

I fully understand what everybody means when they compare BI to KD in game and frame comparison. I also realize BI will be a great player in the NBA so thats not what I mean. These are my eyes I see through and when I watch BI I see a very special tall lanky player but I have a hard time comparing players maybe.

 

[dukiejay]

If someone says they don't see the Ingram / KD comparison at all, I'm curious who they would compare him to? Because there are a LOT of similarities with Ingram & KD..

If you don't want to compare Ingram to an "elite" player, then I would say he's similar to Nicolas Batum.. But Batum is basically a poor man's KD.. so he's still similar to KD, regardless.

And to compare 2 players doesn't mean you are saying they are at equal skill levels.. Seth Curry's game is very similar to Steph Curry.. But that doesn't mean they are anywhere near the same level.

The Batum comparison is actually spot on, IMO. Good call....hadn't thought of that one.

 

[matthew1]

Why would anyone think Ingram is going to be an NBA 4?

What do you think he'll be? A 3? He can play 2, 3, or 4 but I see him as a stretch 4 but maybe you have another opinion?

 

[Dattier]

I don't know... will one more year be enough for any NBA team to invest a bajillion dollars in him? He might want to graduate first, so he will probably be here for 3 years. This next part might be kinda controversial (please don't bite my head off!) but I have to say, I am 110% confident he will not be a 4-year guy. No way he stays all 4. No way! Repeat, Brandon Ingram will not be a 4-year college player. I don't claim any insider information! This is coming solely from me.

 

[Buzzooka Joe]

What do you think he'll be? A 3? He can play 2, 3, or 4 but I see him as a stretch 4 but maybe you have another opinion?

Ingram is way too skinny/light to be a stretch 4 in the NBA.. Stretch 4's are all about 6'9-7" and a minimum 240lbs.. So, he will be at the minimum height and 40+ pounds below the minimum weight.. He will not be effective at all on offense if he's having to exhaust all of his energy guarding guys his height or taller and 40+ pounds heavier than him every night..

Ingram has a big advantage right now of having a 7'3" wingspan.. Most of the D1 guys he plays against can't compete with that.. But in the NBA, Porzingis is a stretch 4 and he is 7'3" tall (and 45 pounds heavier).

He will be a SF/SG in the NBA.

 

[Anon1728003274]

Tomorrow we play NCSU in the ACCT. I would just love to see him win his next 10 games at Duke....

 

[Dad2ze]

This is third party info but a good friends dad works with BI's dad. Word is he is gone. I won't take anything official until he announces. I'd love to him another year and hopefully he is a member of this board and realizes it too.

 

[nets on nets on nets]

Ingram is way too skinny/light to be a stretch 4 in the NBA.. Stretch 4's are all about 6'9-7" and a minimum 240lbs.. So, he will be at the minimum height and 40+ pounds below the minimum weight.. He will not be effective at all on offense if he's having to exhaust all of his energy guarding guys his height or taller and 40+ pounds heavier than him every night..

Ingram has a big advantage right now of having a 7'3" wingspan.. Most of the D1 guys he plays against can't compete with that.. But in the NBA, Porzingis is a stretch 4 and he is 7'3" tall (and 45 pounds heavier).

He will be a SF/SG in the NBA.

I 100% disagree. The NBA is changing fast, this is not the NBA of 10, even 5 years ago. Teams now value shooting and spacing much more than power.
Ingram will NEVER EVER play 2 in the NBA. Sure, he will play "wing," but at 6'9 (prolly 6'10 in a year or 2) he will not be guarding opposing teams 2 guard.

In a traditional starting lineup (MOST NBA teams still start games with traditional lineups) Ingram will be a 3, just like Jabari.

But after the first round of subs come into the game, and definitely in "crunch time" when teams now put there 5 best players on the floor, Ingram will definitely be a 4 man, again just like Jabari.

Again, this is not the NBA that we have all watched our whole lives. Im telling you, Ingram will be a "4" 75% of the time in NBA games.

 

[Dattier]

Again, this is not the NBA that we have all watched our whole lives. Im telling you, Ingram will be a "4" 75% of the time in NBA games.

Time will tell, but I do not agree whatsoever.
ESPN lists Jabari as a PF. Durant, Melo, Lebron are all SFs. Corey Brewer, Nicolas Batum, Mike Dunleavy Jr, and Andrew Wiggins are all listed as SGs and are in the same size range as Brandon.

 

[nets on nets on nets]

Time will tell, but I do not agree whatsoever.
ESPN lists Jabari as a PF. Durant, Melo, Lebron are all SFs. Corey Brewer, Nicolas Batum, Mike Dunleavy Jr, and Andrew Wiggins are all listed as SGs and are in the same size range as Brandon.

Durant starts games at the 3 yes, but he plays the 4 well over half the game. Lebron's best position moving forward is definitely the 4, and he will be a full time 4 once Cleveland moves on from Love.

Dunleavy and Wiggins may be listed at 2. But they always play the 3, I do not understand that listing at all.

Regardless though, I was speaking more in terms of the future of the NBA. Where a 6'6 Draymond Green plays center. Or a 6'7 Trevor Ariza plays alot of 4. Demarre Carroll 4. Heck, Luol Deng now plays mainly 4 since Bosh is out.

 

[Dattier]

Durant starts games at the 3 yes, but he plays the 4 well over half the game. Lebron's best position moving forward is definitely the 4, and he will be a full time 4 once Cleveland moves on from Love.

Dunleavy and Wiggins may be listed at 2. But they always play the 3, I do not understand that listing at all.

Regardless though, I was speaking more in terms of the future of the NBA. Where a 6'6 Draymond Green plays center. Or a 6'7 Trevor Ariza plays alot of 4. Demarre Carroll 4. Heck, Luol Deng now plays mainly 4 since Bosh is out.

Serge Ibaka plays 32.9 minutes per game at the 4 for OKC. They have 2 centers who split about 45 minutes at the 5. I don't know how you're claiming KD plays the 4 for well over half the game considering how many minutes are already accounted for at PF and C.

Lebron and KD also have a lot of weight on Brandon. Brandon is more a 3/2 than a 3/4.

But both his future and the NBA's future are just predictions at this point. Maybe you're onto something. I don't see it.

 

[LH24ND]

Don't get me wrong, fantastic player. Kid can hit the 3 and play multiple positions. He needs another development year. Needs to gain weight and play better defense. With his body type and position in the NBA probably being a 4, he will get destroyed. People say he compares to Durant but I dont see it. His shot isnt as good and frame is way to thin. Tyus surpised me last year so I know Ingram sees a pay day but with the incoming class, they can make a serious run if he returns with Allen. JMO

Of course he needs another year as does GA but you know how these guys are now.

 

[Buzzooka Joe]

I 100% disagree. The NBA is changing fast, this is not the NBA of 10, even 5 years ago. Teams now value shooting and spacing much more than power.
Ingram will NEVER EVER play 2 in the NBA. Sure, he will play "wing," but at 6'9 (prolly 6'10 in a year or 2) he will not be guarding opposing teams 2 guard.

In a traditional starting lineup (MOST NBA teams still start games with traditional lineups) Ingram will be a 3, just like Jabari.

But after the first round of subs come into the game, and definitely in "crunch time" when teams now put there 5 best players on the floor, Ingram will definitely be a 4 man, again just like Jabari.

Again, this is not the NBA that we have all watched our whole lives. Im telling you, Ingram will be a "4" 75% of the time in NBA games.

I'm going strictly off the current Stretch 4's in the NBA.. I don't even think there is one that weighs less than 230 pounds.. Even if Ingram bulks up in the off-season, he most likely won't get above 205 pounds.. Every player that is 205 pounds or less are SF/SG/PG's..

Nicolas Batum is probably the closest NBA comparison to Ingram, in size and game style.. Batum is 6'8" with a 7'4" wingspan, and he plays SF/SG.. I'm sure in certain situations (fouls, injuries, etc.) Ingram will be put at the "4", but it won't be by choice.. And it goes back to the energy it will take out of Ingram to guard guys like Kevin Love, Chris Bosh, Ryan Anderson, LaMarcus Aldridge, Portzingis, etc., which are all guys that are taller and 40+ pounds heavier..

He will have a much more realistic chance of guarding guys like Nicolas Batum, Andrew Wiggins, Harrison Barnes, etc.

 

[Buzzooka Joe]

Durant starts games at the 3 yes, but he plays the 4 well over half the game. Lebron's best position moving forward is definitely the 4...

Heck, Luol Deng now plays mainly 4 since Bosh is out.

Durant = 6'9" 240lbs
Lebron = 6'8" 250lbs
Deng = 6'9" 220lbs

Ingram = 6'9" 190lbs ...

And if Ingram puts on the 30+ pounds needed to be a serviceable "4", imagine the negative effect that will have on his game/shot.. For as skinny as K.D. is/was, he was still 225 pounds on draft day.. Ingram is going to have to work his *** off to be 205 on draft day.. He will be a SF/SG like Batum & Wiggins.

 

[Dattier]

I don't know that 190# is still accurate. I suspect they fattened him up a little leading up to the season.

 

[HeLooks2MuchLikeDave]

Durant starts games at the 3 yes, but he plays the 4 well over half the game. Lebron's best position moving forward is definitely the 4, and he will be a full time 4 once Cleveland moves on from Love.

Dunleavy and Wiggins may be listed at 2. But they always play the 3, I do not understand that listing at all.

Regardless though, I was speaking more in terms of the future of the NBA. Where a 6'6 Draymond Green plays center. Or a 6'7 Trevor Ariza plays alot of 4. Demarre Carroll 4. Heck, Luol Deng now plays mainly 4 since Bosh is out.

You are absolutely right. Ingram will be asked to play the 4 spot in the NBA on many occasions. However, you can play the 4 and still guard opposing 3s or vice versa. That is basically what happens when Justice and Luol are on the court together. Luol guards taller 4s (guys like Paul Gasol) but Justice will guard heavier 4s (Griffin, Horford types). On offense Justice will play a little more traditional 4 than Luol because he is better closer to the basket (post up and rebounding) whereas Luol has much better range. The same trade off happens when Luol and Joe Johnson (formerly a prototypical 2 guard) play together. By going small and putting Ingram at the 4, you are forcing their hand. You can't trot out a lineup with Marc Gasol and Zach Randolph anymore against 4 perimeter players.

Remember, this is the same league where Paul George plays the 4 almost full time. He is 6'9", 225. That's Ingram in a year or two.

 

[nets on nets on nets]

You are absolutely right. Ingram will be asked to play the 4 spot in the NBA on many occasions. However, you can play the 4 and still guard opposing 3s or vice versa. That is basically what happens when Justice and Luol are on the court together. Luol guards taller 4s (guys like Paul Gasol) but Justice will guard heavier 4s (Griffin, Horford types). On offense Justice will play a little more traditional 4 than Luol because he is better closer to the basket (post up and rebounding) whereas Luol has much better range. The same trade off happens when Luol and Joe Johnson (formerly a prototypical 2 guard) play together. By going small and putting Ingram at the 4, you are forcing their hand. You can't trot out a lineup with Marc Gasol and Zach Randolph anymore against 4 perimeter players.

Remember, this is the same league where Paul George plays the 4 almost full time. He is 6'9", 225. That's Ingram in a year or two.

I think you have given the most accurate statement on this thread yet. The NBA seems to be going towards "positionless" basketball. Of course, you must have a PG and a rim-protecting Center (centers that can only block shots, run the floor,and dunk are extremely valuable). That means positions 2-4 are interchangeable.

I have not worded my previous statements correctly. But what I mean is, I believe Ingram will be a Stretch 4 on offense. However, defensively (matchup dependant) he will guard the other teams 3 or 4 man. If the other team is rolling out Blake Griffin at the 4, Ingram will not be checking him, and hopefully his roster has a defensive minded 3 that could guard him ( think Luol Deng or Demarre Carroll.)

However, when teams go "small", which seems to happen 50% of the time in every NBA game (only teams that don't go small alot are Spurs and Grizzlies) than guarding a stretch 4 fits Ingram perfectly. His length is actually a perfect fit for guarding stretch 4's like Ryan Anderson.

 

[youngman42]

It def. would be good for him but hard to pass on the millions guaranteed as the #2 pick in the draft. It's just too risky.

 

[nets on nets on nets]

With the whole country hating on Simmons for being left out of the tourney. It sure would be awesome if Ingram takes his game to another level THESE NEXT THREE WEEKS and brings on the discussion of being the #1 pick. The time is here, seize the moment Brandon!!

 

[Willcampbell]

He doesn't need another year. For what? He can look forward to a league where no one guards him, he can travel as much as he wants, and he can bring home lots of bacon. Is that going to change in 2017? NBA=joke.
OFC

 

[nets on nets on nets]

He doesn't need another year. For what? He can look forward to a league where no one guards him, he can travel as much as he wants, and he can bring home lots of bacon. Is that going to change in 2017? NBA=joke.
OFC

You=joke
NBA has become beautiful basketball.

 

[dukiejay]

He doesn't need another year. For what? He can look forward to a league where no one guards him, he can travel as much as he wants, and he can bring home lots of bacon. Is that going to change in 2017? NBA=joke.
OFC

That's pretty ignorant. Obviously you don't watch the NBA....and that's fine, but don't pretend to know what you're talking about.

 

[Willcampbell]

Ouch.
OFC