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Caliknight

Caliknight

Hall of Famer
Sep 21, 2001
196,724
148,811
113
It's horrible. Any team that has as many penalties as we do has bad coaching. It's always been that way and that rule applies here. Schiano is not a modern day football coach. He's so accepting of wasting downs. Offensive football is about getting as many plays off as you can. 2 entire minutes and Schiano sits on the ball. I can't think of any other coach in the country that wouldn't try to score there being down 7. His reason? He didn't want to go down by more. That's a losers mentality not to mention the terrible message it sends to his team. I don't believe in you. I can't believe he actually did that. Even for him that's just coaching so scared.

MSU isn't even good, but the score makes it look that way. Just an embarrassing performance from the staff. Anyone holding out hope that some hot shot OC is going to come in here and work under this overly restrictive philosophy is fooling themselves. No accomplished OC is coming here with Schiano as HC.
 
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Scarlet_Monster

All-Conference
Jan 8, 2011
6,164
4,234
0
Entire offensive staff needs to go.

Nunzio was the stop gap between Ash and Greg.

OL is a disaster discipline wise, Augie needs to go.
 
P

Plum Street

Heisman
Jun 21, 2009
27,306
23,009
0
Caliknight said:
It's horrible. Any team that has as many penalties as we do has bad coaching. It's always been that way and that rule applies here. Schiano is not a modern day football coach. He's so accepting of wasting downs. Offensive football is about getting as many plays off as you can. 2 entire minutes and Schiano sits on the ball. I can't think of any other coach in the country that wouldn't try to score there being down 7. His reason? He didn't want to go down by more. That's a losers mentality not to mention the terrible message it sends to his team. I don't believe in you. I can't believe he actually did that. Even for him that's just coaching so scared.

MSU isn't even good, but the score makes it look that way. Just an embarrassing performance from the staff. Anyone holding out hope that some hot shot OC is going to come in here and work under this overly restrictive philosophy is fooling themselves. No accomplished OC is coming here with Schiano as HC.
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The way he handled the last minute of the first half was pathetic. But his team stinks and he knows it
 
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Caliknight

Caliknight

Hall of Famer
Sep 21, 2001
196,724
148,811
113
So does whomever runs special teams. And our red zone defense. It's horrible.

At some point we need to look at the HC. Turtle shelling with two minutes on the clock in a winnable game is the weakest move I've ever seen Schiano make. He's very afraid. I just don't understand how he thinks he can win football games by deliberately not trying to score. It's asinine.

And this was an opponent missing a bunch of guys. We weren't punching above our weight. Very winnable game. We just don't have the staff that knows how to do it. At some point, you are what your record says you are, and Schiano has a terrible record as a head coach.

84-98. Just not HC material.
 
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RUTGERS95

RUTGERS95

Heisman
Sep 28, 2005
32,381
47,073
113
RU848789 said:
We still have issues, especially with penalties; however, we outgained them 460 to 455 and Wimsatt played his best game, so that's clearly progress.
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agree with the op as coaching is bad but agree with you in that today isn't a total loss
Gav looked better, running game was better, pass protection was better, routes were better
Defense was missing the middle field assignments
 
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Caliknight

Caliknight

Hall of Famer
Sep 21, 2001
196,724
148,811
113
Plum Street said:
The way he handled the last minute of the first half was pathetic. But his team stinks and he knows it
Click to expand...

Disagree. MSU stinks too. Mutual stink. I bet if we had a real coach in this game it would have been a different result or at least much closer.

Schiano's philosphy of trying to not lose instead of playing to win will ensure that he never does. It's a losers mentality. That's why he has the record he has.
 
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RUTGERS95

RUTGERS95

Heisman
Sep 28, 2005
32,381
47,073
113
Jimpeg said:
you can say all you want about the rebuild...the reason this rebuild is taking longer
It's coaching, Greg is too conservative for the modern day of offense first ..
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it's not a rebuild, stop using that term. Talent isn't the issue, it's coaching and approach to managing games

that's not a rebuild issue
 
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sct1111

All-American
Nov 30, 2014
6,116
8,407
113
460 yards of offense, you have to score more than 21 points. 14 penalties, 14! 3 offsides penalties on kickoffs! What in Gods name is going on?

At least Gavin played decent. I guess we're not running him because his ankle is still bad? He's built like Cam Newton.
 
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RUdude

Senior
Sep 2, 2014
1,036
679
113
RUTGERS95 said:
it's not a rebuild, stop using that term. Talent isn't the issue, it's coaching and approach to managing games

that's not a rebuild issue
Click to expand...

what verb are you calling the move to a .500 record and respectability after Ash left?

re·build
[rēˈbild]

VERB
  1. build (something) again after it has been damaged or destroyed:
    "we try to help them rebuild their lives" ·
    [more]
 
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ClassOf02v.2

Heisman
Sep 30, 2010
13,794
15,256
103
This is a perfectly fair take. GS’s conservative coaching style is sending a message to his current team and future recruits. Hard to get inspired by what we saw today out of Schiano.
 
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RUGuitarMan1

All-Conference
Apr 5, 2021
2,509
3,903
73
The thing at the end of the half didn’t bother me. They were deep in their own territory with a very inexperienced, young QB who has been turning the ball over. They were running the ball well and MSU had 1 TO left, didn’t mind running the clock and getting the 2nd half kick. They had too many penalties and the OL remains a problem. You can put the penalties on coaching, the strategy to pound the running game and protect the QB is sound. If people want the 50 pass per game offense go follow another school. This isn’t 2 hand touch.
 
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RU848789

Heisman
Jul 27, 2001
65,224
44,302
113
Caliknight said:
Yet still got handled easily. If we were moving the ball so well, why didn't he try to score with 2 minutes left?

I don't see progress. I see a hapless team and staff.
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Hated the penalties and didn't love the end of the first half decision, but I understand it. But if you don't see progress from Wimsatt and the running game, you're simply blind. That's real progress and the best play by Gavin was the TD that got called back on the hold, right before the 3rd TD, where he drifted left and fired up a perfect pass in the endzone, knowing he was going to take a hit.
 
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Knightmoves

Heisman
Jul 31, 2001
30,532
16,474
113
No question in my mind that Greg is the de facto OC. He micro managed the hell out of the offense today.

It looks like Nunzio will work with him as OC. But I doubt we can hire a good one from the outside because Greg will do the same to him.

Greg fired Gleeson because Gleeson wouldn’t do it Greg’s way imo.
 
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Caliknight

Caliknight

Hall of Famer
Sep 21, 2001
196,724
148,811
113
RU848789 said:
Hated the penalties and didn't love the end of the first half decision, but I understand it. But if you don't see progress from Wimsatt and the running game, you're simply blind. That's real progress and the best play by Gavin was the TD that got called back on the hold, right before the 3rd TD, where he drifted left and fired up a perfect pass in the endzone, knowing he was going to take a hit.
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There is no amount of progress that can beat your head coach's failed philosophy. We suck less bad isn't going to get it done.

It will never happen but the best thing that could be done is what TAMU is doing to their head coach. Completely taking the decision making and hiring of offensive coaches away from him.
 
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njknightj

Junior
Jul 12, 2012
106
253
63
Knightmoves said:
No question in my mind that Greg is the de facto OC. He micro managed the hell out of the offense today.

It looks like Nunzio will work with him as OC. But I doubt we can hire a good one from the outside because Greg will do the same to him.

Greg fired Gleeson because Gleeson wouldn’t do it Greg’s way imo.
Click to expand...
Gleeson was trash with or without Greg's involvement.
 
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brgRC90

Heisman
Apr 8, 2008
34,957
15,859
0
Points scored in Big Ten play

2021: 13, 13, 13, 7, 20, 3, 38, 0, 16.
14 pts/game. 12 pts/game excluding Indiana.
2022: 10, 10, 13, 24, 0, 17, 21.
14 pts/game. 12 pts/game excluding Indiana.

Indiana lets us say we are not the worst program in the Big Ten.
 
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RUskoolie

RUskoolie

Hall of Famer
Aug 1, 2007
221,512
112,428
63
So you can clearly see we have a very young QB with some really nice upside. We also have a really young RB and then Kyle M who can spell him.

As they grow they need weapons around them at WR and TE

Defense is fixed

My big concern is the way GS coaches games. He is stuck in 1995. He coaches to make less mistakes and hope the other team screws up. There is no killer instinct. The micromanaging of offense is inexcusable. All I was told was Gleeson this Gleeson that. Well Gleeson is gone and I still see Wildcat? I still see Run, run, pass, punt. See it under Nunzio, Gleeson, Kirck C, McNulty etc.

In 2022 and soon to be 2023 you need offensive firepower to win. Our defense wears down because we don't move the ball on O and just don't focus on it.

I just don't see how he is going to change at this stage of his career and hire an OC and let him run free. I am starting to question how this program gets off the ground under him.
 
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Shelby65

All-Conference
Apr 1, 2008
8,413
4,670
66
Caliknight said:
So does whomever runs special teams. And our red zone defense. It's horrible.

At some point we need to look at the HC. Turtle shelling with two minutes on the clock in a winnable game is the weakest move I've ever seen Schiano make. He's very afraid. I just don't understand how he thinks he can win football games by deliberately not trying to score. It's asinine.

And this was an opponent missing a bunch of guys. We weren't punching above our weight. Very winnable game. We just don't have the staff that knows how to do it. At some point, you are what your record says you are, and Schiano has a terrible record as a head coach.

84-98. Just not HC material.
Click to expand...
Yep he turtled the last minute of the half but so bravely called the TO with 1 sec left. Genius. Stealing salary.
 
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Caliknight

Caliknight

Hall of Famer
Sep 21, 2001
196,724
148,811
113
No real OC is going to come and work for him. They are going to go to HC who value offensive football and allow it flourish.

I don't know Greg. He seems thoughtful. But in football, he's a complete meathead. He thinks doing something the hardest way possible gets you extra points.

He's Paterno without the players and the child sex assistant coach.
 
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T

tico brown

Heisman
Oct 16, 2005
44,205
14,212
93
Caliknight said:
So does whomever runs special teams. And our red zone defense. It's horrible.

At some point we need to look at the HC. Turtle shelling with two minutes on the clock in a winnable game is the weakest move I've ever seen Schiano make. He's very afraid. I just don't understand how he thinks he can win football games by deliberately not trying to score. It's asinine.

And this was an opponent missing a bunch of guys. We weren't punching above our weight. Very winnable game. We just don't have the staff that knows how to do it. At some point, you are what your record says you are, and Schiano has a terrible record as a head coach.

84-98. Just not HC material.
Click to expand...
But Schiano understands Jersey Football by getting mostly Florida players.
 
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Shelby65

All-Conference
Apr 1, 2008
8,413
4,670
66
Caliknight said:
No real OC is going to come and work for him. They are going to go to HC who value offensive football and allow it flourish.

I don't know Greg. He seems thoughtful. But in football, he's a complete meathead. He thinks doing something the hardest way possible gets you extra points.

He's Paterno without the players and the child sex assistant coach.
Click to expand...
Paterno wasn’t a meathead.
 
R

Rokodesh

Heisman
Aug 30, 2007
16,014
13,158
73
sct1111 said:
460 yards of offense, you have to score more than 21 points. 14 penalties, 14! 3 offsides penalties on kickoffs! What in Gods name is going on?

At least Gavin played decent. I guess we're not running him because his ankle is still bad? He's built like Cam Newton.
Click to expand...
Gavin has a ton of talent but he's not anywhere near as big as cam lol. Cam was a TE playing QB
 
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Caliknight

Caliknight

Hall of Famer
Sep 21, 2001
196,724
148,811
113
tico brown said:
But Schiano understands Jersey Football by getting mostly Florida players.
Click to expand...

That whole Jersey thing needs to go away. NJ is a state in America. Is it different than say California? Sure. But it's not Afghanistan.

Good coaches succeed anywhere regardless of where they are from. Greg isn't getting the best players in NJ so that entire argument is just silly.

I don't know they answer but I'd be shocked if the majority of high schools in NJ play so conservatively.
 
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T2Kplus20

T2Kplus20

Heisman
May 1, 2007
31,973
19,932
113
Caliknight said:
It's horrible. Any team that has as many penalties as we do has bad coaching. It's always been that way and that rule applies here. Schiano is not a modern day football coach. He's so accepting of wasting downs. Offensive football is about getting as many plays off as you can. 2 entire minutes and Schiano sits on the ball. I can't think of any other coach in the country that wouldn't try to score there being down 7. His reason? He didn't want to go down by more. That's a losers mentality not to mention the terrible message it sends to his team. I don't believe in you. I can't believe he actually did that. Even for him that's just coaching so scared.

MSU isn't even good, but the score makes it look that way. Just an embarrassing performance from the staff. Anyone holding out hope that some hot shot OC is going to come in here and work under this overly restrictive philosophy is fooling themselves. No accomplished OC is coming here with Schiano as HC.
Click to expand...
Another loss due to coaching. Gotta feel bad for the players.
 
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Retired711

Heisman
Nov 20, 2001
19,971
10,151
58
BTW, the AP story notes that this was the first time in three games that we scored any points in the second half.
 
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Caliknight

Caliknight

Hall of Famer
Sep 21, 2001
196,724
148,811
113
T2Kplus20 said:
Another loss due to coaching. Gotta feel bad for the players.
Click to expand...

Agreed. I'll say this, they play hard. Their coach failed them today. If you expect your players to leave it all on the field, you need to as a coach too.

Frankly I am not sure how long he can keep this together. The players see what we do.
 
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