Covid eligibility / Redshirt rules

[NUCat320]

On yesterday’s tv broadcast, it was mentioned that *everybody* on NU is eligible to come back next season. They surmised that Nance would probably test the pro waters, but the rest would likely remain. But, Nance would eligible to return.

A few follow up questions:
Is that correct?
Does that apply to Williams as well?
For eligibility purposes, is Nicholson the same class as Simmons, Roper, Barnhizer?

Related, what are the specific redshirt rules in hoops? Football made things very clear: play four games or fewer, maintain that year. Is there a similar rule in hoops now?

I would *love* a scenario where Nicholson had four years after this year. Barnhizer also seems like a possible candidate to play a bit, but keep a year of eligibility.

 

[gradeck]

These are good questions. Note that NU has 2 signed players for next year with 12 current scholarships filled.

(In “normal” circumstances, Greer, Nance, and Williams would exhaust eligibility after this season).

 

[DaCat]

On yesterday’s tv broadcast, it was mentioned that *everybody* on NU is eligible to come back next season. They surmised that Nance would probably test the pro waters, but the rest would likely remain. But, Nance would eligible to return.

A few follow up questions:
Is that correct?
Does that apply to Williams as well?
For eligibility purposes, is Nicholson the same class as Simmons, Roper, Barnhizer?

Related, what are the specific redshirt rules in hoops? Football made things very clear: play four games or fewer, maintain that year. Is there a similar rule in hoops now?

I would *love* a scenario where Nicholson had four years after this year. Barnhizer also seems like a possible candidate to play a bit, but keep a year of eligibility.

The same commentators said everyone is eligible to come back EXCEPT Williams.

 

[NUCat320]

The same commentators said everyone is eligible to come back EXCEPT Williams.

Thanks for listening, bro.

 

[NUera]

A few follow up questions:
Is that correct?
Does that apply to Williams as well?
For eligibility purposes, is Nicholson the same class as Simmons, Roper, Barnhizer?

Related, what are the specific redshirt rules in hoops? Football made things very clear: play four games or fewer, maintain that year. Is there a similar rule in hoops now?

Everyone got a free year from Covid, whether they played or sat out. Williams is currently using his to get a fifth year of action. The others haven’t had to decide yet because they were all underclassmen.

The new kids are back on the normal clock and, after this season, programs are no longer able to carry extra players over the 15 limit to accommodate guys who stayed longer while not screwing over new recruits (we didn’t exercise this option because we didn’t have a full roster).

Nicholson is a freshman eligibility wise; he essentially redshirted last season. Whether he plays five seasons here remains to be seen.

Regarding redshirt rules, the NCAA was supposed to vote on exact issue coming into the season but I haven’t seen any such vote reported on.

 

[willycat]

On yesterday’s tv broadcast, it was mentioned that *everybody* on NU is eligible to come back next season. They surmised that Nance would probably test the pro waters, but the rest would likely remain. But, Nance would eligible to return.

A few follow up questions:
Is that correct?
Does that apply to Williams as well?
For eligibility purposes, is Nicholson the same class as Simmons, Roper, Barnhizer?

Related, what are the specific redshirt rules in hoops? Football made things very clear: play four games or fewer, maintain that year. Is there a similar rule in hoops now?

I would *love* a scenario where Nicholson had four years after this year. Barnhizer also seems like a possible candidate to play a bit, but keep a year of eligibility.

Why? I'd love his remaining be played somewhere else and likely will.

 

[SimpsonElmwood]

Nicholson has three years of eligibility remaining after this year. He and Berry are on the same clock.

 

[PurpleWhiteBoy]

Why? I'd love his remaining be played somewhere else and likely will.

Who is the he? Nicholson or Barnhizer?
And why the desire to see him leave?

 

[hdhntr1]

Who is the he? Nicholson or Barnhizer?
And why the desire to see him leave?

Sounded like he was talking Nance and I would love to see him return. My guess is currently he was just beginning to show the talent that would get him a shot at getting drafted and another year would solidify that. If deemed that he would need another year why would anyone want to see it anywhere else?

Bohanan of Iowa is playing an extra year this year because of the covid exemption so this is his 6th as a Hawkeye, I believe

 

[Catdude]

I could see Greer wanting to return next year. He graduated high school a year early so a 5th year puts him in his original class. He's a captain and has built himself a solid role. I guess the question is if he is satisfied with that role or may want to go to a program that he can start and play more minutes. It's been cool to watch him improve and gain confidence.

 

[Styre]

Eligibility:

Senior
Williams (C19)

Junior
Greer (C19)
Nance (C19)

Sophomore
Audige (RS, C19)
Young (RS, C19)
Buie (C19)
Beran (C19)

Freshman
Berry (C19)
Nicholson (C19)
Barnhizer
Roper
Simmons

 

[DaCat]

We've entered the Evan Eschmeyer Age of 6 year eligibility.

 

[willycat]

Who is the he? Nicholson or Barnhizer?
And why the desire to see him leave?

it's obviously Nicholson since he's taking up a scholarship that could go to a Big Ten like player. Oh, and I think he will.

 

[NJCat]

We've entered the Evan Eschmeyer Age of 6 year eligibility.

I'd rather enter the Echmeyer Age of All American players......

 

[PurpleWhiteBoy]

it's obviously Nicholson since he's taking up a scholarship that could go to a Big Ten like player. Oh, and I think he will.

I think he is likely to leave too. So you think Collins recruited a bum, huh?
I think the kid has plenty of talent, just waiting for an opportunity.
He'll be a useful to good player somewhere. I really hope it is at NU.

 

[catcrazy]

No patience these days. Eschmeyer was a much more polished player out of high school and a top 50 recruit. He is clearly not as skilled as Nance and Young at this point and shouldn’t get minutes based on this at this point. Hopefully next year he grows into his body and becomes a rebound and defensive force. I think if he sticks it out you will see changes and more polished game next year.

 

[PurpleWhiteBoy]

No patience these days. Eschmeyer was a much more polished player out of high school and a top 50 recruit. He is clearly not as skilled as Nance and Young at this point and shouldn’t get minutes based on this at this point. Hopefully next year he grows into his body and becomes a rebound and defensive force. I think if he sticks it out you will see changes and more polished game next year.

Depends what you mean by skilled.
In most areas, obviously not. Both Nance and Young are skilled scorers.
I think Nicholson's sheer size around the basket gives us another dimension that can be quite valuable. Guy can rebound, dunk and block/alter shots. He will be harder to move out of the way than Young and obviously Nance. Thats right now.

I'm not saying he should be taking minutes from Young. They play the same position. Young and Nance should be playing together a lot, with Nicholson coming off the bench for Young as needed.

 

[CSCatFan1]

Depends what you mean by skilled.
In most areas, obviously not. Both Nance and Young are skilled scorers.
I think Nicholson's sheer size around the basket gives us another dimension that can be quite valuable. Guy can rebound, dunk and block/alter shots. He will be harder to move out of the way than Young and obviously Nance. Thats right now.

I'm not saying he should be taking minutes from Young. They play the same position. Young and Nance should be playing together a lot, with Nicholson coming off the bench for Young as needed.

Thanks for clarifying your position.

 

[willycat]

I think he is likely to leave too. So you think Collins recruited a bum, huh?
I think the kid has plenty of talent, just waiting for an opportunity.
He'll be a useful to good player somewhere. I really hope it is at NU.

Never inferred that Nicholson was a bum. Collins recruited size but still waiting for ability to come out.

 

[PurpleWhiteBoy]

Thanks for clarifying your position.

Thanks for continuing to be a jackass.
I know that you can't comprehend that when I respond to somebody else that I'm not addressing you.

 

[PurpleWhiteBoy]

Never inferred that Nicholson was a bum. Collins recruited size but still waiting for ability to come out.

You said you hoped he would transfer. That says enough.

 

[NUCat320]

Eligibility:

Senior
Williams (C19)

Junior
Greer (C19)
Nance (C19)

Sophomore
Audige (RS, C19)
Young (RS, C19)
Buie (C19)
Beran (C19)

Freshman
Berry (C19)
Nicholson (C19)
Barnhizer
Roper
Simmons

Because you are and have always been the smartest, what is the redshirt rule?

This is the closest I could find, but it does not clarify what was finalized.

https://www.si.com/college/tmg/mark-blaudschun/college-basketball-redshirt

I hope we have Nicholson for six.

 

[hdhntr1]

Never inferred that Nicholson was a bum. Collins recruited size but still waiting for ability to come out.

I think it will get there and I think you will start seeing him get about 10-15 mpg next year, Reality is that he is not going to get minutes from Nance or Young this year.

 

[PurpleWhiteBoy]

I think it will get there and I think you will start seeing him get about 10-15 mpg next year, Reality is that he is not going to get minutes from Nance or Young this year.

Just out of curiosity, what do you think Collins would do if Nance and Young both picked up 2 fouls in the first 15 minutes of the game?

Question #2... What happens if Collins realizes that his best chance of winning is to play Young and Nance together for 20 minutes a game? Who comes off the bench for Young when he gets tired? Does Nance just play 35 a night?

 

[Styre]

Because you are and have always been the smartest, what is the redshirt rule?

This is the closest I could find, but it does not clarify what was finalized.

https://www.si.com/college/tmg/mark-blaudschun/college-basketball-redshirt

I hope we have Nicholson for six.

Unfortunately I have no idea. I haven't seen anything recently either.

(And I only wish I was the smartest!)

 

[hdhntr1]

Just out of curiosity, what do you think Collins would do if Nance and Young both picked up 2 fouls in the first 15 minutes of the game?

Question #2... What happens if Collins realizes that his best chance of winning is to play Young and Nance together for 20 minutes a game? Who comes off the bench for Young when he gets tired? Does Nance just play 35 a night?

The reason you don't see them playing together that much is to avoid just such a scenario. And who would you have come off the bench for Nance when he gets tired? (I see the target for him at 25-30 mpg. It may go to 35 but that is not the plan)

Face it. Nicholson is on the Wisconsin Big Man (Center) development program.

 

[PurpleWhiteBoy]

The reason you don't see them playing together that much is to avoid just such a scenario. And who would you have come off the bench for Nance when he gets tired? (I see the target for him at 25-30 mpg. It may go to 35 but that is not the plan)

Face it. Nicholson is on the Wisconsin Big Man (Center) development program.

In my world Robbie Beran comes off the bench for Nance... but Nance plays 30.

Fwiw, Steven Crowl (sophomore) is starting at center for Wisconsin.

 

[hdhntr1]

In my world Robbie Beran comes off the bench for Nance... but Nance plays 30.

Fwiw, Steven Crowl (sophomore) is starting at center for Wisconsin.

Except Nance has averaged under 26 mpg (had 26 against NJIT). Sorry Beran is not a replacement for Nance. And Williams is Beran's replacement.

And last I looked, they (Wis) only have one other guy on the roster over 6'9" (Chris Vogt) that can even play the center position and he just transferred in this year and is averaging about 11.6 mpg. Quick, who is their 3rd string center?

 

[PurpleWhiteBoy]

Except Nance has averaged under 26 mpg (had 26 against NJIT). Sorry Beran is not a replacement for Nance. And Williams is Beran's replacement.

And last I looked, they (Wis) only have one other guy on the roster over 6'9" (Chris Vogt) that can even play the center position and he just transferred in this year and is averaging about 11.6 mpg. Quick, who is their 3rd string center?

You aren't looking very closely.
Nance is not a traditional center. He is a stretch 4. Way too thin and perimeter-oriented to be considered a true center.
Young is a traditional center. Nicholson is also a traditional center. They play in the post with their backs to the basket.
At Wisconsin, Crowl is more of a traditional center and Vogt is definitely a traditional center.

What Collins is doing is playing Nance at the 5 and Beran at the 4.
Beran and Nance are both stretch 4's but Beran might also be able to play the 3.
Williams is also a 4. Thus far he has also outplayed Beran at that position.

 

[GatoLouco]

Maybe this makes it a little more clear: if Young was a starter, he would not be replacing Beran. He would be replacing Nance. And, in turn, Nance would be replacing Beran.

Which is why the arguments of Beran being there for defense make little sense. Young would never guard the same guy Beran did. He would guard the guy Nance did. Is he better than Nance at it? In my opinion, yes, he stands his ground better and does not face 5's who penetrate anyway. In Turn Nance would guard the guy Beran did. Is Nance better at it than Beran? Again, yes. No loss in speed, 1 more inch, longer arms. The argument that could be made, that I've not seen anyone make, is that in switches (which we usually don't do anyway) and pick and rolls Young could be worse than Beran.

The argument that it's to protect from fouls makes even less sense. If Nance or Young have two fouls in the 1st, one goes to the bench and you end up with the same type of lineup as we use today. that's where the couple of minutes by MN come in handy to rest the not foul plagued player.

The reason Beran is out there is 100% about offense and nothing else. The arguments that it's not come from seeing that every single stat, and stats are almost entirely about offense, says Young is much better than Beran offensively. So, the ones who want to defend CC make up another argument.

I will give some arguments to justify Beran on offense, despite the stats pointing otherwise:
-There are advantages to the 5 out idea, creating space under the basket, easier penetration being one
-Playing Beran and Nance forces a big with mobility issues on the other side to guard one of them and, thus, creating a potential mismatch
-Young does not shoot 3's, Beran does. And 3's are better than 2's
-Transition can be faster with Beran than with Young
-Beran is somehow a dude with a huge ceiling if that's something you believe

Those are the arguments. Everything else is noise. Forgot about the argument of having a go to guy in the 2nd unit. Noise, easily solved by a substitution pattern of not replacing 4 guys at once. Which is, anyway, what most coaches do if they are not in the NBA (where even there the patterns change in the playoffs).