Defensive Line - 2016

[JPFisher]

Our line next season appears to be (as of right now):

DE: Miggins
NG: Elam
DT: Meant
----
Hybrid LB/DE: Ware

This assumes Hatcher keeps his hand out of the turf.

Who do you all see as being the best backups and how your starting 3 or 4 work?

Personally, I think that looks like a solid line. Even better if we get Kobe and Kongbo.

 

[Mr Schwump]

Our line next season appears to be (as of right now):

DE: Miggins
NG: Elam
DT: Meant
----
Hybrid LB/DE: Ware

This assumes Hatcher keeps his hand out of the turf.

Who do you all see as being the best backups and how your starting 3 or 4 work?

Personally, I think that looks like a solid line. Even better if we get Kobe and Kongbo.

It's probably too early since there's hopefully some JUCO additions but can figure Bonner, Daniel, Allen and Bell playing and unfortunately Cross and Looney forced to play. Apparently Dubose is rehabbing a knee but Middleton will play.

What's Pringle's status?

 

[3kidsandme]

It's probably too early since there's hopefully some JUCO additions but can figure Bonner, Daniel, Allen and Bell playing and unfortunately Cross and Looney forced to play. Apparently Dubose is rehabbing a knee but Middleton will play.

What's Pringle's status?

Kobie walker will play a ton if he's got his grades in order. Ideally walker plays the pass and we use hatcher as a pass rusher.

 

[JPFisher]

I think Walker and Hatcher look to be Linebackers. Same with Kash Daniel.

Bell should work well as a pass rusher. Heard good things about him from the practices.

 

[Mr Schwump]

Kobie walker will play a ton if he's got his grades in order. Ideally walker plays the pass and we use hatcher as a pass rusher.

If Walker can go he'll back Laster at an OLB I imagine.

 

[Beatle Bum]

I think Walker and Hatcher look to be Linebackers. Same with Kash Daniel.

Bell should work well as a pass rusher. Heard good things about him from the practices.

Seems he did well with his hand in the dirt and rushing the passer, but struggled if asked to drop out and cover. I think he will be Miggins backup.

 

[hmt5000]

I think he meant kengera

I think Walker and Hatcher look to be Linebackers. Same with Kash Daniel.

Bell should work well as a pass rusher. Heard good things about him from the practices.

I think he meant kengera. I think he'll back up miggins. I think meant, dubose, and middleton at the other side. If Pringle makes it in I could see him in the 2 deep.

 

[Glenn Fohr]

What if they go 4-3 or 4-2-5?

 

[Oldtrainer_rivals]

If Walker can go he'll back Laster at an OLB I imagine.

Fill me in on Laster please.

 

[billoliver40]

Right now sounds like CMS is sold on a 3-4 base due to experience and depth....could change
Hopefully this will be Mr Elams time to blossom and shine. NT is far from a glorious job, and often it's up to the coaches to let us know if the Nose man is fishing or cutting bait.

 

[K_TIME]

Our line next season appears to be (as of right now):

DE: Miggins
NG: Elam
DT: Meant
----
Hybrid LB/DE: Ware

This assumes Hatcher keeps his hand out of the turf.

Who do you all see as being the best backups and how your starting 3 or 4 work?

Personally, I think that looks like a solid line. Even better if we get Kobe and Kongbo.

If we upon up play with that Dline...we'll be flat out awful upfront. Really need Bonner to take Ware's spot and I'd love to see somebody knock out Miggins (he really showed me zilch last year).

 

[RV]

If we upon up play with that Dline...we'll be flat out awful upfront. Really need Bonner to take Ware's spot and I'd love to see somebody knock out Miggins (he really showed me zilch last year).

... because no one ever improves ... [eyeroll]

 

[JasonRDunn]

... because no one ever improves ... [eyeroll]

I think that Miggins will improve. Both Zadarius and CJ improved significantly in their second year. I am hoping for a somewhat similar jump for Miggins.

 

[K_TIME]

... because no one ever improves ... [eyeroll]

Go on somewhere big shot. You come on this board running down people's opinion and act like you're Nick Saban of some sort.

Coming into last year here is what I heard:
- Ware is a threat coming off of edge in pass rush
- Flannigan is going to breakout big time (after being totally lost his Jr year)
- Farrington is a going to be a solid replacement for Zadarius

UK lines up that DL and we are going to be toast next year with that group. Only Elam (who many hate on) showed me anything out of that bunch the past few years. But shoot off those gums of yours on how good that group will be and we'll finish our typical bottom of SEC in defense yet again.

 

[Levibooty]

Anybody saying our DL as it stands now will be really good is betting on the come. That is a losing strategy more times than not. Our DL is lacking any depth and significant contributors from this last season. Our DL was barely adequate this past year and we lost our best linemen.

People who are always betting on the come are always ignoring their losses.

We may be really good next year on the DL but that would be known as a longshot. Talent wins out.

 

[akaukswoosh]

Anybody saying our DL as it stands now will be really good is betting on the come. That is a losing strategy more times than not. Our DL is lacking any depth and significant contributors from this last season. Our DL was barely adequate this past year and we lost our best linemen.

People who are always betting on the come are always ignoring their losses.

We may be really good next year on the DL but that would be known as a longshot. Talent wins out.

Yep. DL looks like the weak link to me.

 

[3kidsandme]

If we upon up play with that Dline...we'll be flat out awful upfront. Really need Bonner to take Ware's spot and I'd love to see somebody knock out Miggins (he really showed me zilch last year).

I thought Miggins played fine as a late arriving juco. We will have Bell there as well with a redshirt year. Both guys are big and athletic in there second year I do not see them being awful at all. Plus we have kg moving to that spot full time. There is 3 6"5 270 pound athletes at one dt spot. We have Elam at nose tackle with Dubose and probably Pringle backing up. The other dt spot will have Meant who played well at a young age and Middleton who played quite a bit early on. I think it's safe to say Miggins Elam and Miggins are a Decent starting point.

 

[3kidsandme]

I thought Miggins played fine as a late arriving juco. We will have Bell there as well with a redshirt year. Both guys are big and athletic in there second year I do not see them being awful at all. Plus we have kg moving to that spot full time. There is 3 6"5 270 pound athletes at one dt spot. We have Elam at nose tackle with Dubose and probably Pringle backing up. The other dt spot will have Meant who played well at a young age and Middleton who played quite a bit early on. I think it's safe to say Miggins Elam and Miggins are a Decent starting point.

The biggest weakness on this Defense last year was lack of experience on the edges. Ware and Hatcher are solid we need Walker and Bonner to both pan out.

 

[Tskware]

We need pass rushers first and foremost, and in addition, some well coached front 7 players who can stop the opposing QB from running all over us. I am with K-Time, what I see on paper from our defensive front 7 is another edition in the SOK (Same Old Kentucky)

Hatcher has been vastly underutilized so far in his career, put him on the edge and tell him to go get the ball on every snap, that would do something for our defense right there.

 

[JPFisher]

I think Ware will make strides in the offseason. I don't remember Miggins' name much this past season, but his tape from JUCO is impressive and he has all the potential to show out like Z, Lewis, and Johnson did in their second year.

 

[K_TIME]

Lewis had 37 tackles and a few sacks in his Jr year. CJohnson had 3 sacks and showed some ability to rush the passer in his Jr year. Don't get me going on how much Zadarius showed in his Jr year. Miggins put up 12 tackles in 12 games and a half a sack. His production in Jr year was nowhere close to what we could potentially see out of Lewis/CJ/Zadarius. Maybe he'll show out next year but there is literally nothing to indicate he'll be a plus SEC DL for UK next year.

Ware looked way overarched last year...which I'll concede he was a RS Fr and he can improve. But I'd love to see him have less a role as he matures and a guy like Bonner take that OLB spot and allow Ware to be a backup. Does anyone still remember Ware's last game vs UL...he lost his QB keep assignment all day long and was awful. He wasn't much better at any point in 2015...he needs to mature and not play a bunch of snaps while getting outclassed on the field.

 

[Levibooty]

Ware needs to learn to play to his responsibilities.

 

[Beatle Bum]

If we upon up play with that Dline...we'll be flat out awful upfront. Really need Bonner to take Ware's spot and I'd love to see somebody knock out Miggins (he really showed me zilch last year).

Miggins got better as the year went on. He was a fall admit Juco. That is a hard transition. After a spring, summer and fall, he will be even better.

People talk about "basketball fan perspectives." The idea that this guy cannot get better is a OAD basketball fan perspective.

Elam also improved. If he continues to lose weight he will improve some more.

Ware was a freaking RS frosh.

 

[RV]

I don't know of anyone saying we will have a gangbuster D-line or that there is no reason to have some concern but by the same token to discount out of hand that there will be no improvement in returning players based on small sample sizes is completely closed minded.

 

[Beatle Bum]

Lewis had 37 tackles and a few sacks in his Jr year. CJohnson had 3 sacks and showed some ability to rush the passer in his Jr year. Don't get me going on how much Zadarius showed in his Jr year. Miggins put up 12 tackles in 12 games and a half a sack. His production in Jr year was nowhere close to what we could potentially see out of Lewis/CJ/Zadarius. Maybe he'll show out next year but there is literally nothing to indicate he'll be a plus SEC DL for UK next year.

Ware looked way overarched last year...which I'll concede he was a RS Fr and he can improve. But I'd love to see him have less a role as he matures and a guy like Bonner take that OLB spot and allow Ware to be a backup. Does anyone still remember Ware's last game vs UL...he lost his QB keep assignment all day long and was awful. He wasn't much better at any point in 2015...he needs to mature and not play a bunch of snaps while getting outclassed on the field.

CJ was often awful his junior year. I think 2 of his 3 sacks came in one game. He was lost.

 

[hmt5000]

How soon we forget that cj was a pass rush specialist and horrible against the run in '14. Then a spring, summer and fall camp and we can't replace him. Miggins was injured part of the year and cj was playing great so it cut into miggins snaps.

I don't know if miggins will be as productive as cj but I'll bet as a group we are better against the run.

We need Pringle, kongbo, and or some other juco to come in to improve depth but overall we are better on Dline this year than half of brooks tenure and most of jokers.... I'm still worried about the OL.

 

[*Bleedingblue*]

Hmm we have several on this thread questioning Dline play and personell.
In HOB I was in an argument with a handful of posters about Brumbaugh. I was saying he has not recruited that well compared to the other coaches and DL play was not all that great. Think it was over 2 different threads like Brumbaugh being rumored for the SC DC job. I said no way was that true.
Then the thread on the hire of SC new DC. I think it was Buh that was the one was being talked too since he actually was a DC at Stanford I believe.
Those guys I was arguing with was saying how good our DL played and how much our guys improve on his coaching coupled with him being a top notch recruiter.

I simply stated it wasn't true and those guys Like Lewis and Johnson only had 4-5 games they were good in over the course of their career. We need guys to have 2 years of playing really good not just a couple of games. He has landed 0 recruits this year.
And why are you guys complaining about the play of the DL since they are so awesome?? Lol

 

[screwduke]

Lewis had 37 tackles and a few sacks in his Jr year. CJohnson had 3 sacks and showed some ability to rush the passer in his Jr year. Don't get me going on how much Zadarius showed in his Jr year. Miggins put up 12 tackles in 12 games and a half a sack. His production in Jr year was nowhere close to what we could potentially see out of Lewis/CJ/Zadarius. Maybe he'll show out next year but there is literally nothing to indicate he'll be a plus SEC DL for UK next year.

Ware looked way overarched last year...which I'll concede he was a RS Fr and he can improve. But I'd love to see him have less a role as he matures and a guy like Bonner take that OLB spot and allow Ware to be a backup. Does anyone still remember Ware's last game vs UL...he lost his QB keep assignment all day long and was awful. He wasn't much better at any point in 2015...he needs to mature and not play a bunch of snaps while getting outclassed on the field.

Miggins didn't play as much as Lewis and Z did in their junior years.

 

[screwduke]

Hmm we have several on this thread questioning Dline play and personell.
In HOB I was in an argument with a handful of posters about Brumbaugh. I was saying he has not recruited that well compared to the other coaches and DL play was not all that great. Think it was over 2 different threads like Brumbaugh being rumored for the SC DC job. I said no way was that true.
Then the thread on the hire of SC new DC. I think it was Buh that was the one was being talked too since he actually was a DC at Stanford I believe.
Those guys I was arguing with was saying how good our DL played and how much our guys improve on his coaching coupled with him being a top notch recruiter.

I simply stated it wasn't true and those guys Like Lewis and Johnson only had 4-5 games they were good in over the course of their career. We need guys to have 2 years of playing really good not just a couple of games. He has landed 0 recruits this year.
And why are you guys complaining about the play of the DL since they are so awesome?? Lol

Lewis and Johnson had more than just 4 or 5 good games, especially CJ. CJ had more good games than that this past year.

 

[hmt5000]

Hmm we have several on this thread questioning Dline play and personell.
In HOB I was in an argument with a handful of posters about Brumbaugh. I was saying he has not recruited that well compared to the other coaches and DL play was not all that great. Think it was over 2 different threads like Brumbaugh being rumored for the SC DC job. I said no way was that true.
Then the thread on the hire of SC new DC. I think it was Buh that was the one was being talked too since he actually was a DC at Stanford I believe.
Those guys I was arguing with was saying how good our DL played and how much our guys improve on his coaching coupled with him being a top notch recruiter.

I simply stated it wasn't true and those guys Like Lewis and Johnson only had 4-5 games they were good in over the course of their career. We need guys to have 2 years of playing really good not just a couple of games. He has landed 0 recruits this year.
And why are you guys complaining about the play of the DL since they are so awesome?? Lol

DL is hard to recruit for teams like us. We had to fill in with jucos to fill gaps. You typically get one good year from jucos. Miss st usually rs's all their dl guys so they have 2 5th year players almost every year on the Dline.

It would help if we produced a Dline group like our OL group this year. Brumbaugh recruits jucos for us and we are going to put our 3rd and 4th player in the nfl off our DL since Stoops arrived. We don't typically put 2 per 5 or 6 years.

 

[Poetax]

Hmm we have several on this thread questioning Dline play and personell.
In HOB I was in an argument with a handful of posters about Brumbaugh. I was saying he has not recruited that well compared to the other coaches and DL play was not all that great. Think it was over 2 different threads like Brumbaugh being rumored for the SC DC job. I said no way was that true.
Then the thread on the hire of SC new DC. I think it was Buh that was the one was being talked too since he actually was a DC at Stanford I believe.
Those guys I was arguing with was saying how good our DL played and how much our guys improve on his coaching coupled with him being a top notch recruiter.

I simply stated it wasn't true and those guys Like Lewis and Johnson only had 4-5 games they were good in over the course of their career. We need guys to have 2 years of playing really good not just a couple of games. He has landed 0 recruits this year.
And why are you guys complaining about the play of the DL since they are so awesome?? Lol

It may just be looking at it differently but if you ask what position is the hardest to recruit, I would bet they would say Defensive Tackle. I'm not taking up for Brumbaugh but he has had to play youth and juco there because we cannot afford to redshirt them. We know that these guys along with offensive linemen need the extra time with the weights to be able to stand against the SEC talent out there. And until we can redshirt them or Marrow starts finding some of those 6'6" 300 lb man eaters to come here and play, it will be a tough position for us to have quality depth at.

 

[Rhavic]

FWIW, the name "J.J. Holmes" is coming up as a potential DT target in this class. Played with Tate Leavitt at Hutchinson C.C. this past year.

Some of you all should check him out. Really like his athleticism a lot for a guy that's nearly 320 pounds.

 

[Poetax]

FWIW, the name "J.J. Holmes" is coming up as a potential DT target in this class. Played with Tate Leavitt at Hutchinson C.C. this past year.

Some of you all should check him out. Really like his athleticism a lot for a guy that's nearly 320 pounds.

Saw a little on him, do you know how many years he has left to play?

 

[Rhavic]

Saw a little on him, do you know how many years he has left to play?

He was a freshman this year, if I'm not mistaken.

 

[Poetax]

He was a freshman this year, if I'm not mistaken.

So would he have 3 years left or would he also have a redshirt year?

 

[K_TIME]

Personally to me...the DL has been OK under Brumbaugh. The role's of a DL in a 3-4 scheme is very different responsibility. I agree that CJ was very good in 2015. Lewis was solid in the run game before he got hurt. Farrington didn't show me much of anything in 2015. Ware was the worst of bunch...teams picked on him as a weak link.

Our run defense wasn't bad at all in 2015 to me. We struggled with QB runs (i.e. Ware had poor concept of playing assignment football)...but teams didn't hammer us with big days from the RB spot. The problem with the DL for was just an abysmal pass rushing year. Schematically is a 3-4 DL supposed to be main pass rushers...or should that be the LBers spots as well who rush the passer from multiple looks?

I will say this...I don't see Miggins putting up very good games that CJ had. 67 tackles (27 solo), 8 tfl, 2 sacks (sort of weak) and 1 Int. We'll see it next year as he's the guy for that spot next year. My #1 issue with UK upfront next year...pass rush. We need Hatcher to blow up, Bonner to take a spot, Ware to mature some, etc..I jsut want our 3-4 guys to hold up vs. the run next year.

 

[TBCat]

If we upon up play with that Dline...we'll be flat out awful upfront. Really need Bonner to take Ware's spot and I'd love to see somebody knock out Miggins (he really showed me zilch last year).

Miggins was a 4 star juco. Bonner is a 3 star. Why do you have no confidence in Miggins and expect Bonner to make a difference.

To me Miggins was an improvement over Hueginin and should have got more PT than he did.

 

[Rhavic]

I agree that our defense against the run game was better this season. The QB run is what killed us, but as K_TIME mentioned, the RB didn't absolutely blast us like last season.

That said, I liked what I seen from Miggins overall. He didn't play nearly as much as many anticipated before the season, didn't put up big numbers by any stretch of the imagination, probably because he needed to ease himself in and adjust to the game in the SEC, but I really liked what I seen from him from time to time. Showed some solid athleticism, good hand fighting, just needs to become consistent up on our line. I think he'll do a much better job of that next season. If he going to turn into Za'Darius Smith? No, but he'll do well, I believe.

I think Ware needs to play the ILB position, next to Love next season. I believe our linebackers should be Bonner (or Laster) at the weak side OLB position, Ware at the ILB position on the weak side, Love at the ILB position on the strong side, and Hatcher at the strong side OLB position. Ware's youth shows against the read-option, having Bonner or Laster's speed to support him on his side of the defense should help to remedy that. Of course, having a season of on-field experience should help remedy that as well.

We really need to see who else we pick up in this recruiting class before anything becomes definite though. If we did manage to pick up the commitment from Kongbo, he would obviously start at the SDE position, replacing Miggins there. Miggins would either move to the opposite DT position, or back him up. Also want to see if Kentucky picks up J.J. Holmes at DT. Has a lot of athleticism, guy plays hard, and you would have no idea that he was nearly 320 pounds just by looking at him. Looks like that Alabama-type athlete that weighs around that much, but still has a relatively flat stomach (as opposed to many who are that weight).

 

[Mr Schwump]

I agree that our defense against the run game was better this season. The QB run is what killed us, but as K_TIME mentioned, the RB didn't absolutely blast us like last season.

That said, I liked what I seen from Miggins overall. He didn't play nearly as much as many anticipated before the season, didn't put up big numbers by any stretch of the imagination, probably because he needed to ease himself in and adjust to the game in the SEC, but I really liked what I seen from him from time to time. Showed some solid athleticism, good hand fighting, just needs to become consistent up on our line. I think he'll do a much better job of that next season. If he going to turn into Za'Darius Smith? No, but he'll do well, I believe.

I think Ware needs to play the ILB position, next to Love next season. I believe our linebackers should be Bonner (or Laster) at the weak side OLB position, Ware at the ILB position on the weak side, Love at the ILB position on the strong side, and Hatcher at the strong side OLB position. Ware's youth shows against the read-option, having Bonner or Laster's speed to support him on his side of the defense should help to remedy that. Of course, having a season of on-field experience should help remedy that as well.

We really need to see who else we pick up in this recruiting class before anything becomes definite though. If we did manage to pick up the commitment from Kongbo, he would obviously start at the SDE position, replacing Miggins there. Miggins would either move to the opposite DT position, or back him up. Also want to see if Kentucky picks up J.J. Holmes at DT. Has a lot of athleticism, guy plays hard, and you would have no idea that he was nearly 320 pounds just by looking at him. Looks like that Alabama-type athlete that weighs around that much, but still has a relatively flat stomach (as opposed to many who are that weight).

So would you take Holmes over Pringle? I really don't know, haven't seen either other than a few film clips. Not sure UK would/could take both.

 

[TBCat]

If we were to get Kongbo I believe moving Miggins inside would be a great move. He's plenty big enough and would add speed to the position.

Ware's situation was a little more curious. Based on his high school profile I was expecting him to be a great pass rusher that might be a bit of a liability on running plays. Turned out to be almost the exact opposite. Ware was excellent as a run defender but added nothing to our pass rush. After seeing him play for a season I'm starting to seem him more and more as pure linebacker instead of a DE that can play OLB. It's not all that crazy to suggest moving him to inside backer.