Everybody agrees
- Thread starter YesterdaysCat
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I'm done taking your bait after this, I've contributed enough to this poison. NU slows down the pace of games because that's their style so less shots are taken during the game so there's less boards to be available.Also watch pardon law and lumpkin play and tell me NU doesn't rebound well. So as I coach I really like says stats are for losers.
A thin skinned official with no sense of judgment blows an easy and obvious call right in front of him, at a critical stage of the game, and then compounds his game changing mistake with a soul crushing technical ... and you write this?
GOUNUII
I don't blame Coach Collins for the T and I don't blame the refs for giving Coach Collins a T. You're going to get one every time when you do that, especially since the refs had no idea that their call was 100 PERCENT WRONG because they had not seen or called the goaltending that had happened just a few seconds before. Once they've missed the call, all they know is that Coach Collins is running onto the court to confront them during game play and that's always a T.
Mystic is being petty, but the Coach Carmody trashing is petty, too. I'm proud of the way the guys fought to get back into the game. A few breaks and we could have won that game. Keep battling like we did in the second half and the next time we will. And maybe a few of our fans will class up by then, too.
and a soft (football) schedule.....
Well now there's a new twist we haven't seen before
Mike, everyone gets your point. But at that point they didn't KNOW they were wrong (yet). They couldn't review. If they'd have seen it they (presumeably) would have called it. So you're kind of arguing a hypothetical that doesn't exist, although your point itself is well taken (it just doesn't apply here).
If they knew they blew a few calls in the first half, maybe they cut cc some slack in the second. Etc. That's different. They had no idea at all what he was going bonkers about.
And whatever the case, the running across the floor during play to scream in a refs face with 4 and a half minutes to go in the biggest game in school history was just a meltdown. No two ways about it. That ended our run.
Grow up.
The guy became unhinged at the biggest moment of his career. Everyone saw it. It has nothing to do with hate, facts are facts.
Nope. An understandable human mistake by Coach Collins, but the kids still fought like hell. A turnover, some missed shots, and some clutch play by a #1 seed ended our run. And quite a run it was. Kudos to the team and Coach Collins.
Self-awareness is an important attribute, Mystic. You should show some.
Nah...that's what you saw because that's what you wanted to see. Most of the rest of the world saw something completely different...and that unfortunately burns you up inside. Northwestern basketball and football are starting to become pretty good and you're just going to have to learn to accept it.
What’s interesting, too, is the other prevalent sentiment on that site. Most comments saying it wasn’t Collins who blew the situation (and/or the game) but rather the refs, as they not only missed it but then T’d CC who had a 100% legit gripe that was stupendously obvious to virtually everyone except 3 guys in stripy shirts. The other prevalent sentiment was that throughout the game Gonzaga was getting calls and the Cats not so much. These obviously are not NU fans (we should HAVE so many!) and I don’t think there is a big clique of anti-Zag people. Probably a random sample of b’ball junkies responding.
There was a strand of “NCAA fix is in for the top seeds” which I discount when making the summarization above. Even if you leave out the conspiracy theorists, it’s still virtually ALL sticking up for NU being shortchanged overall. You gotta think that a team coming back from 22 down, and running up 53 points in a half against a strong favorite, mostly by being more aggressive and alert --- would get some favorable officiating, wouldn’t you? Not today, obviously.
If they didn't know they there was a strong possibility they were incorrect right away by a) the visual evidence, b) the crowd reaction or c) the reaction of a coach who has gotten very few technicals in a career (and believe me, refs know the reputation of each and every coach coming in) screaming at them that the player's had went through the basket, then they were even more clueless than I could even fathom.
Do me a favor, go back and watch Mark Turgeon in our BTT game. Watch a series of blown calls go against the Terps. Watch him go absolutely nuts, with more egregious conduct than Coach Collins had on that technical. Watch him NOT get a T. Why? Because it was a experienced BIG crew that was not going to decide a close game that way unless Turgeon literally tackled one of them. And that crew probably thought they got all of those calls 100% correct at the time.
To T a coach up that way at a critical point in the game when you know there is a possibility something went wrong that you did not see explains the swiftness of the NCAA mea culpa after the game (they almost always wait until the next day) and why I would be shocked if these officials ref another tourney game this season
10th in rebounding percentage too, pace adjusted.
Whoops.
Stats are just stats. Losers don't know how to read them.
I know you are a miserable human being who has never played a team sport in his life. But you can't be this stupid. I have explained this to you several times. They are up 5 with the ball and a chance to extend to 7 without the technical free throws. They did not score after the free throws and Lindsey had a chance to cut it back down to 5. With 4 minutes to go, we were down 6. You can't argue that the missed call didn't cost us the game (which took 2 points away) and claim that the technical did. Stop being an ******* and go to bed. I feel great shame for having been drawn into this. It will take me days to wash your stench off me.
I was there and that game was one of worst officiated games I can remember...then tonight happened.
NU-MD game went both ways. Tonight? Not so much.
Why? Because it was a experienced BIG crew that was not going to decide a close game that way unless Turgeon literally tackled one ofthem.
Agreed. But Collins ran at the ref during play on the court!!! Are you nuts. That's a T at every level of basketball at all times.
The mea culpa had nothing whatsoever to do with the technical; it had to do with botching the goaltending. 2 separate points. They said they totally screwed the call, then said that 100 out of 100 times that behavior was a T.
You're kind of mixing and matching your argument- terrible call, so unjustifiable T. That holds no water. They thought they made the correct call, then Collins acted like a spoiled child having a tantrum.
And somehow we had a positive rebounding margin on the season while holding our opponents to a ridiculously low 40% shooting. Were there any Carmody years where we held our opponents to 40% shooting AND outrebounded them? Without looking it up, my guess would be no.
I've ref'd plenty of basketball games. All the ref had to do was race up the court. If Collins makes contact with him on the way up, then it's a T. There was nothing that I saw the ref do in that exchange that he should have done. Literally nothing.
The most recent example being our BTT game vs. Maryland, along with thousands of other examples. Basically, if time ans score dictates that the T would have any impact on the outcome the coach has to be such a jerk that he essentially T'd himself by say, making contact with an official or something along those lines. That's why the vast majority of technicals are issued a) early in games or b)when the outcome is not in doubt.
The failure for three refs to see an obvious basket interference call is regrettable, but human. The failure of one ref not to streak up the court afterward and avoid an obvious confrontation in a critical game situation and thus compound the error, not so much, and is the reason I believe that the NCAA came out so swiftly with their statement (can't recall a time that they did not wait until the next day) and why I believe this crew blew their chances to move on in the tourney.
Even if you believe this, what in the Sam Hill is your point? As a northwestern basketball fan did this season not exceed your expectations, are you not satisfied with what they accomplished this year, are you not excited for the future, much more than you would have ever been about NU basketball, is it not obvious that Chris Collins was the perfect choice to be head coach? What in the world are you pissing about in times like these for NU basketball?
The failure of one ref not to streak up the court afterward and avoid an obvious confrontation in a critical gamesituation and thus compound the error....
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Only problem is, the ref is supposed to be on the court. The coach is forbidden from being on the court.
But I guess if we reversed all the rules you could find a way to have some semblance of a point in some alternate universe.
"Yeah the coach was at center court screaming, but the problem was the ref, who could have run a few feet to get around him, didn't. He just gave him a T. for being on the court."
You know, like all the rules say you should do.
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Only problem is, the ref is supposed to be on the court. The coach is forbidden from being on the court.
But I guess if we reversed all the rules you could find a way to have some semblance of a point in some alternate universe.
"Yeah the coach was at center court screaming, but the problem was the ref, who could have run a few feet to get around him, didn't. He just gave him a T. for being on the court."
You know, like all the rules say you should do.
He did enter the court which is not that uncommon...if you've actually watched tightly contested basketball games. CC didn't touch the ref (as Mike said) and was trying to get his attention for an inexcusable error (see his hand signal). Given the situation, the official HAS to perform better. Period.
ALL of us want you to STOP your obnoxiously petty posting behavior...but you won't so I'll refrain from feeding the troll after this post. Hello ignore (you're the first one)!
On trolling...you're worse than the ones we get from other boards and you're supposedly a fan of the program (at least based on your screen name). That's gross.
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Well this thread isn't about "the season" or my "expectations". It's about the T Collins got. So you can have your feel good thread elsewhere.
On a side note, no, I wouldn't say he was the "perfect" choice because his first time on the big stage he whiffed for selfish, bratty, spoiled kid reasons.
If coaches received technicals ever time they were on the court, each game would have a tech. Collins was three feet onto the court, max, and his assistants were already pulling him back when the T was issued. All the ref had to do was run up the court, and things would have settled down. Instead, he actually moves toward Collins with the demonstrative, in your face T (which I absolutely hate) Just terrible officiating, and if you don't believe it, then I don't know what to tell you. None of the top BIG officials make that call at that time and score in the game. Not ever.
I think I agree with you, Mikewebb68. Personally, I would not have charged out onto the court -- but that’s because of my personality. I would have thrown the most outrageous sideline tantrum ever seen in modern times, because by that point in the game (2nd apparent blown goaltending call, huge FT differential for Zags, etc., etc.) even my very LONG but smoldering fuse would have hit the dynamite lode. So Coach did the wrong thing, but given HE is a more competitive and intense person than I am, the reaction was understandable even if not smart.
And I take you at your word that the ref coulda shoulda just run away in the circumstances. He wasn’t obligated to, obviously, but why not vamoose and let the bench coaches take care of Coach Collins’ fury?
Final thought. There were 3 refs. Would/should they all not be looking intently at the action around the rim at that moment? Or (and I don’t know), is it that one or two would have some kind of “other assignment” in terms of monitoring action elsewhere on the court? This question comes to me because while I can understand that one of them could have an untimely brain spasm (bad night, fight with wife, hung over, etc.), what about the other two sets of eyes? This is where the NCAA conspiracy theorists jump in with claims that they were under orders to give key breaks to the #1 seed,
This wasn't the only instance of an official being demonstrative with a call either. At the end of the game, one of them waited a good 3 second with hand in air (no conference) before signaling NU ball. There was definitely some showboating on their end.
I got the sense they dug in their heels after they realized how poorly they were doing.
He did run on to the court which is not that uncommon.
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Irrelevant if it's common, or uncommon. Per the rules it's a technical foul. Irrelevant whether he "touched" anyone. It's a technical foul.
Why are so many people trying to excuse and walk back this embarrassment?
For 48 hours there I was thinking the vandy gift was the biggest mental error of the tourney.
He acted like a child. And we lost. That's always been the knock on the duke guys. They're spoiled. I hope he'll apologize and learn from this. He seems like too good and smart of a guy to not collect himself and address it in the next few days, and man up for letting everyone down when all he had to do was control himself.
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Irrelevant if it's common, or uncommon. Per the rules it's a technical foul. Irrelevant whether he "touched" anyone. It's a technical foul.
Why are so many people trying to excuse and walk back this embarrassment?
For 48 hours there I was thinking the vandy gift was the biggest mental error of the tourney.
He acted like a child. And we lost. That's always been the knock on the duke guys. They're spoiled. I hope he'll apologize and learn from this. He seems like too good and smart of a guy to not collect himself and address it in the next few days, and man up for letting everyone down when all he had to do was control himself.
A little bit of Bobby Knight-ish confrontational style (and I did say “a little”) is a good thing. And I’ll take a dash of Coach K, Al McGuire, Jimmy V, etc., in my coaching cocktail, with a chaser of Rick Majerus on the side(line). If it’s a wart, so be it. Collins is way too classy to do anything that would disgrace the University (looking at you, Kevin O).
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Right. Does the rule say you can be three feet on the court?
No.
Right, two coaches pulling him back. So we have THREE different coaches three feet on the court, and you want the refs to ignore all that.
Rookie mistake.
Go to bed now.
Please cite the list of critical NCAA tournament game situations when a coach received a T for behavior equal to, or worse than Collins' behavior on that play this evening, I'll wait....
He's is not going to apologize. Coaches never do when they are correct and the NCAA has already weighed in. He didn't act like a child, you are projecting your Collins' hatred here, nothing more. Most every other coach at his level would have reacted the same way in the same situation, and most would not have been T's up for it, plain and simple. If you disagree, please give me examples of coaches who have been T'd up in similar critical situations and I will be happy to review.
Irrelevant.
This isn't relative to another game in another year. He broke the rules, got caught, we lost, he whined about it on national tv, and now you're whining that he didn't gat preferential treatment.
You like the rules when they help you, but don't like them when our coach fumbles the game/season away.
Who was that two years ago mike, posting about how Tom Crean is always 7 feet on the court barking out plays to yogi Farrell?
I don't seem to remember you posting celebratory stuff after our win again Michigan or Vanderbilt. That bitterness has really eaten you up these last four years, I'll bet.
What a great season! Did you see the NCAA patch on the jersey in my avatar?
