FIT.Y.E.R.O. (Meathead, wellness, fitness, diet, exercise) Thread

[anthonys735]

I mean, you can do any of these lifts with kettlebells. Presses, flys, squats, deadlifts, rows. Some more awkward than others. But to build muscle it's progressive overload + calories + recovery. Pretty simple formula. HIIT style is a great functional and cardio workout but not efficient in straight up adding muscle, if that's your goal. Eat, lift heavy, rest between sets.

 

[Bonzo_Cat]

I have two basic workouts. One is a single kettlebell focused workout that is improve technique and conditioning. The other IS compound movements. I usually do 3 to 5 rounds of double presses and 3 to 5 rounds of double front squats. Follow that up with heavy and long loaded carries.

I know the weights for those compound lifts don't sound like much but when you are cleaning the bells every time and you are constantly fighting to control them, it produces enough stimulus for me at least to see consistent muscle growth that I am satisfied with.

From Thanksgiving to New Year, I'm planning on doing only 2 kettlebell workouts per week but going really heavy with double bells (especially the double 70 lbs, which is HEAVY for me) and couple that with eating a ton. Plan to try to sleep a ton, too, if possible.

This is not immediately pertinent but eventually I would like to work up to Olympic lifting 3 times per week in a couple of years. I'm considering whether I want to worry about pullup performance and spending some time on the Olympic rings for upper body at some point but that's just a thought for another time.

Hank, from reading your first three paragraphs, you seem to have a plan in place, and I say that with all sincerity. I'm not sure the three of us who've addressed this can provide better programing if the work is exclusively kettlebells. I'd echo Anth and say diet should be your #1 focus. No form of training is going to add mass and strength if your eating lapses for weeks at a time.

It's a b!tch, and something that took me more than 20 years of slogging away at this to realize - physical improvements are made in the kitchen. Doesn't matter how religious I was with moving metal, when that part wasn't dialed in and adhered to 85-90% of the week (the older we get, the higher that % needs to be), I was basically spinning my wheels. Programming for bulk/cut is secondary, by a long stretch. Like the old adage, you can't overcome a bad diet and that includes consistency.

re: Olympic rings - that's one of the hardest exercises by a mile. Anth's trainer has a pair hanging from the rafters and to start from the ground, jump up and merely pull yourself up to a hold position is beyond brutal. My advice, start with getting good at pullups. Rings would be the equivalent of trying to back squat with Ronnie Coleman after only using kettlebells

 

[pretzel__logic]

I cannot recommend against Oly lifting enough if you have never done it as an adult. I've been lifting a million years at this point but no clean and jerks/snatches ever, and I would absolutely f myself up if I tried to learn it at 36. Oly is HYPER technical, far more than squat/bench/dead, and requires daily or close to it training to stay proficient and avoid injury.

 

[UK-Chulo]

Thanks! If I may indulge your expertise, I am committed to kettlebells as my exclusive weightlifting modality for a while. The reasons are boring and complicated but that is the most we are capable of consistently doing, so it is what it is. Done is better than perfect.

That said, I think there is a chance I may already be doing at least somewhat of you are recommending. Thoughts?

I'm light in the *** and I am regularly doing compound lifts with heavy (for me) double kettlebells. Three times per week, I do a kettlebell workout. I have two basic workouts. One is a single kettlebell focused workout that is improve technique and conditioning. The other IS compound movements. I usually do 3 to 5 rounds of double presses and 3 to 5 rounds of double front squats. Follow that up with heavy and long loaded carries.

I know the weights for those compound lifts don't sound like much but when you are cleaning the bells every time and you are constantly fighting to control them, it produces enough stimulus for me at least to see consistent muscle growth that I am satisfied with.

From Thanksgiving to New Year, I'm planning on doing only 2 kettlebell workouts per week but going really heavy with double bells (especially the double 70 lbs, which is HEAVY for me) and couple that with eating a ton. Plan to try to sleep a ton, too, if possible.

This is not immediately pertinent but eventually I would like to work up to Olympic lifting 3 times per week in a couple of years. I'm considering whether I want to worry about pullup performance and spending some time on the Olympic rings for upper body at some point but that's just a thought for another time.

Starting Olympic lifting in your mid-forties? That’s a recipe for a major setback. Unless you are some genetic outlier it’s highly likely you injure yourself. CrossFit made every middle aged person think they can just start throwing weight around, but I’d recommend looking toward a much lower impact path.

Recovering from injuries takes longer with each year that passes.

 

[Hank Camacho]

I cannot recommend against Oly lifting enough if you have never done it as an adult. I've been lifting a million years at this point but no clean and jerks/snatches ever, and I would absolutely f myself up if I tried to learn it at 36. Oly is HYPER technical, far more than squat/bench/dead, and requires daily or close to it training to stay proficient and avoid injury.

I've dabbled before and it is something I am comfortable with. I'm already doing tons of cleans, presses, and (to a lesser extent) snatches with kettlebells and I have resources for high quality video form analysis if I go that route. Likewise, with olympics rings, I've had multiple pairs for going on two decades. I already keep a pair at chest height for static holds and such so it isn't like I'm a neophyte. At some point I'd like to build up the ability to easily knock out a muscle-up on rings before I get to old to try.

I always seek to avoid injury most of all. I ain't over trying to get hurt exercising like some sort of dork.

My point was that I am sticking with kettlebells for the foreseeable future and when I do change things up, I will do things differently than the typical bodybuilding methods. Those things are highly effective for you all. I'd honestly rather practice law than step foot in a commercial gym. That sounds like hell to me given my current schedule.

When my wife and I are retired, I am quite looking forward to joining the local Y and swimming laps most mornings and lifting weights with a bunch of other geezers in the weight room. But at current -- no thank you, even if it may promise better results for body composition than what I am currently doing.

 

[anthonys735]

I have a really good sports PT when you get injured. True Story.

 

[Anon1711055878]

Since when is progressive overload with barbell movements solely for “bodybuilders”?

 

[Hank Camacho]

Since when is progressive overload with barbell movements solely for “bodybuilders”?

It isn't. I'm just being contrary and giving the mindpump crew ****. In all seriousness, this discussion did cause me to plan to incorporate the one arm snatch to overhead squat into my workouts. That's about as much olympic lifting as I would really do without online coaching. One arm overhead squats with a kettlebell are the truth.

Is MyFitnessPal still the consensus best nutrition tracker? Claude ain't cutting it for serious work. I am going to really focus on diet until Thanksgiving. I will try the 2,500 cal / 200 gram protein recommendation from anth and see what results I get. Would love to keep muscle mass the same and drop a half a percent of bodyfat per month until I do a bulk when it is cold.

 

[Kooky Kats]

There’s more resources on YouTube than the MindPump dudes. Cull through and discern and do what works for you. Some is just too nerdy or weird.

There’s an equal amount of shít info too… rule of thumb is to not listen to dudes selling snake oil / products. Brian Johnson may win the metabolic age contest, but dude legit looks like a Martian.

Another guy lives in Costa Rica. surfs 5 hours a day, eats nothing but organ meat and desiccated beef testicles… I mean, that may work but I ain’t doing any of that.

 

[ROGUE_]

Nothing to add that hasn’t been said already, but there is a LOT of solid info on this page from people (not including myself) that have I’d guess at least 50-60 years experience, if not more, of doing this.

Not referring to you Hank, but just from going to a commercial gym like myself, it seems that most everyone is trying anything but the traditional lifts. It’s all social media bs that doesn’t seem to produce many positive results. That’s just my experience though.

Honestly, the lady works out at home and always thinks she should go to a gym but never does and I otoh can’t wait til we get our own place and I can blow cash on a home gym again. It’s nice to get out socially to a gym but doing whatever lift I want whenever I want in my own house/garage is way more valuable.

 

[anthonys735]

I use a combo of gpt and myfitnesspal when I'm really dialing in. I do like 19 of 21 meals the exact same every week though. I can see how that might drive a person nuts.

My 10 year old uses a barbell, hank. Just got him a junior one from rogue. Never too young to learn technique.

 

[Hank Camacho]

I do like 19 of 21 meals the exact same every week though.

Do you change it up week to week? I can get by with having a couple of breakfasts, lunches, and snacks that I alternate during a week to make the math and meal prep easy but I have to change up dinner every night or I'll go mad.

I did some YT research last night on nutrition app to see if there is any competitor to MFP, which I've tried in the past and failed with. I'm going to try ScanCalorie and see how it works. It is AI-based and set up so you just upload pictures of your meals and can also give voice prompts for more detail (like "3 egg cheese omelet from Waffle House") and it is supposed to be able to give you approximations of macros that have an error rate similar to a trained dietician.

That sounds like what I was trying to get Claude to do for me, so I'm hopeful that a custom-designed AI app for that purpose allows easy tracking. Will report back after a few weeks.

It easily let me set up daily goals of 2500 calories and 200 grams of protein, so I'm going to play with it the rest of the week before starting in earnest on Sunday.

 

[Kooky Kats]

I use Lose It! App.

it’s fine.

amazing how after a year and a half, I can look at a piece of meat or glob of cottage cheese and know its weight within half an ounce.

first day of real jacket weather. My jackets are too big. Again. Damn.

Cottage cheese is the real cheat code to the diet. Bang for your buck…. I prefer Friendship whipped cottage cheese. High content of slow-burning protein, low calories good fat, satiety…. Then use for basis of baked stuff and breads and now ice cream bases with the Creami.

 

[UK-Chulo]

Do you change it up week to week? I can get by with having a couple of breakfasts, lunches, and snacks that I alternate during a week to make the math and meal prep easy but I have to change up dinner every night or I'll go mad.

I did some YT research last night on nutrition app to see if there is any competitor to MFP, which I've tried in the past and failed with. I'm going to try ScanCalorie and see how it works. It is AI-based and set up so you just upload pictures of your meals and can also give voice prompts for more detail (like "3 egg cheese omelet from Waffle House") and it is supposed to be able to give you approximations of macros that have an error rate similar to a trained dietician.

That sounds like what I was trying to get Claude to do for me, so I'm hopeful that a custom-designed AI app for that purpose allows easy tracking. Will report back after a few weeks.

It easily let me set up daily goals of 2500 calories and 200 grams of protein, so I'm going to play with it the rest of the week before starting in earnest on Sunday.

MacroFactor is a great app for tracking. They keep adding features too.

 

[Kooky Kats]

 

[pretzel__logic]

- Just want to point out I have never listened (watched? I don't even know if it's a podcast or a Youtube channel) a single episode of MindPump. Or any other fitness related podcast, ha.

- I haven't used an ammonia cap since last time I competed but since I'm going to be back on the platform, I got a couple cartons of them on Amazon. I used one for funsies deadlifting last night. DAMN. I missed that.

Might keep a couple in my room for when the baby wakes up at 3 am. Or in my office. haha.

 

[ROGUE_]

-I used to hit the Atomic Rhino often but just looked in my bag at the gym to remember the brand. Haven’t hit it in months and months but am going to again right now before this last set of chest.

I too, have stopped/don't listen to fitness podcasts anymore mostly due to the fact that nothing can be confirmed and must be disputed not long after being ordained as the “best” whatever. This is out of necessity because if they can no longer debate something they run out of material.

Every single podcast or social account discusses the same thing a study “finds” one week and one month later a study countering those same “findings” that were concrete and hand-to-God the end all be all.

Just get the basics down, tweaking **** is fine but at the end of the day non of us are competing with CBum or Kai Greene so it really doesn’t matter what time of day you take your creatine or if you take in the exact amount of carbs and protein post workout within 47 minutes of your last rep.

I promise you it really, really doesn’t matter. Make it easy and convenient. Touch the BCAAs, touch the EAAs mid-workout, touch the pre and post workout creatine (take it, just who gives a **** when, I prefer mornings), touch the fast/slow digesting timing of protein, etc etc. Eat healthy good macros, eat them at any time, eat them within the limits your body needs for your goals, drink lots of water, etc.

If you listen to these podcasts and you’re not very experienced in the field, and even then some people still do this, you’ll be changing or thinking you need to change up what you’re doing every other week.

Im not trying to belittle anything here, but for 99% of the population, even 99% of the gym population, the whole splitting of hairs on these things isn’t going to amount to a hill of beans. Eating healthy 5-6 days a week, resistance training 3-5 times a week, getting your heart rate up with any type of cardio 3-5 times a week, and doing this repeatedly without fail for months/years on end is the tried and true without fail way of accomplishing what 99.9999999% of people want to do, look good with minimal clothes on and be strong as ffffff compared to their contemporaries.

lastly, I get wanting to tinker with supps and whatnot, there are way worse habits and things to spend money on.

 

[warrior-cat]

Starting Olympic lifting in your mid-forties? That’s a recipe for a major setback. Unless you are some genetic outlier it’s highly likely you injure yourself. CrossFit made every middle aged person think they can just start throwing weight around, but I’d recommend looking toward a much lower impact path.

Recovering from injuries takes longer with each year that passes.

Yep, take it from me, my injuries are taking much longer than before. Have to modify workouts to compensate. Still maintaining, but it gets harder.

 

[warrior-cat]

I've dabbled before and it is something I am comfortable with. I'm already doing tons of cleans, presses, and (to a lesser extent) snatches with kettlebells and I have resources for high quality video form analysis if I go that route. Likewise, with olympics rings, I've had multiple pairs for going on two decades. I already keep a pair at chest height for static holds and such so it isn't like I'm a neophyte. At some point I'd like to build up the ability to easily knock out a muscle-up on rings before I get to old to try.

I always seek to avoid injury most of all. I ain't over trying to get hurt exercising like some sort of dork.

My point was that I am sticking with kettlebells for the foreseeable future and when I do change things up, I will do things differently than the typical bodybuilding methods. Those things are highly effective for you all. I'd honestly rather practice law than step foot in a commercial gym. That sounds like hell to me given my current schedule.

When my wife and I are retired, I am quite looking forward to joining the local Y and swimming laps most mornings and lifting weights with a bunch of other geezers in the weight room. But at current -- no thank you, even if it may promise better results for body composition than what I am currently doing.

I have my own shop with two total gyms, chin up, pullup, and dip bars. Barbells, kettle balls, dialup weights, bands and tubes and other various workout items along with two Bob's, a Baz System, and a heavy hanging bag. I don't go to gyms.

 

[warrior-cat]

There’s more resources on YouTube than the MindPump dudes. Cull through and discern and do what works for you. Some is just too nerdy or weird.

There’s an equal amount of shít info too… rule of thumb is to not listen to dudes selling snake oil / products. Brian Johnson may win the metabolic age contest, but dude legit looks like a Martian.

Another guy lives in Costa Rica. surfs 5 hours a day, eats nothing but organ meat and desiccated beef testicles… I mean, that may work but I ain’t doing any of that.

Yep, anyone can get on YouTube and rattle off whatever workout/supplement routine and not really have a clue. Watched quite a few and see people push one thing only to have another say something totally opposite. Trial and error is the only way with YouTube.

 

[warrior-cat]

-I used to hit the Atomic Rhino often but just looked in my bag at the gym to remember the brand. Haven’t hit it in months and months but am going to again right now before this last set of chest.

I too, have stopped/don't listen to fitness podcasts anymore mostly due to the fact that nothing can be confirmed and must be disputed not long after being ordained as the “best” whatever. This is out of necessity because if they can no longer debate something they run out of material.

Every single podcast or social account discusses the same thing a study “finds” one week and one month later a study countering those same “findings” that were concrete and hand-to-God the end all be all.

Just get the basics down, tweaking **** is fine but at the end of the day non of us are competing with CBum or Kai Greene so it really doesn’t matter what time of day you take your creatine or if you take in the exact amount of carbs and protein post workout within 47 minutes of your last rep.

I promise you it really, really doesn’t matter. Make it easy and convenient. Touch the BCAAs, touch the EAAs mid-workout, touch the pre and post workout creatine (take it, just who gives a **** when, I prefer mornings), touch the fast/slow digesting timing of protein, etc etc. Eat healthy good macros, eat them at any time, eat them within the limits your body needs for your goals, drink lots of water, etc.

If you listen to these podcasts and you’re not very experienced in the field, and even then some people still do this, you’ll be changing or thinking you need to change up what you’re doing every other week.

Im not trying to belittle anything here, but for 99% of the population, even 99% of the gym population, the whole splitting of hairs on these things isn’t going to amount to a hill of beans. Eating healthy 5-6 days a week, resistance training 3-5 times a week, getting your heart rate up with any type of cardio 3-5 times a week, and doing this repeatedly without fail for months/years on end is the tried and true without fail way of accomplishing what 99.9999999% of people want to do, look good with minimal clothes on and be strong as ffffff compared to their contemporaries.

True.

 

[Hank Camacho]

Im not trying to belittle anything here, but for 99% of the population, even 99% of the gym population, the whole splitting of hairs on these things isn’t going to amount to a hill of beans. Eating healthy 5-6 days a week, resistance training 3-5 times a week, getting your heart rate up with any type of cardio 3-5 times a week, and doing this repeatedly without fail for months/years on end is the tried and true without fail way of accomplishing what 99.9999999% of people want to do, look good with minimal clothes on and be strong as ffffff compared to their contemporaries.

@warrior-cat is there a good way to pick up one of the used BOB punching bag things? I'd like one for the garage but not paying retail or delivery on it.

 

[anthonys735]

-So, for meals they have the same formula but I change the protein and flavoring up. Right now, 10oz of BBQ chicken and 1 cup of rice. I'll stick with chicken for a few weeks to offset the last couple of off the rails eating weeks.

Breakfast is always the same,, though. Skyr, banana, cinnamon, honey, and few hard boiled eggs. Not all mixed together.

Then I'll snack on jerky, nuts, dark chocolate, beef sticks. Plus, intraworkout calories.

-I really enjoy the mp guys. Not too over the top with their sales ****, which i also don't mind because people have to make money. I've tried a lot of their products, most are solid. Some, I didn't reorder. They got me on the 8Sleep, which is the best product ever. The podcast is about as care free as it gets. They all have kids about my kids age so nice hearing outside advice on how they deal with their kid issues. I get why some wouldn't but their podcast is a nice listen when I'm not in the mood for heavy ****.

 

[warrior-cat]

@warrior-cat is there a good way to pick up one of the used BOB punching bag things? I'd like one for the garage but not paying retail or delivery on it.

Look to see if any local martial arts schools are closing down or for that matter boxing clubs. I have 4, 2 of which I got from Century Martial Arts warehouse in OKC out of their discount room for about $200.00 less. The other 2 I got for about $50.00 from a school that closed. I have 2 in my shop and 2 at a school where I help teach class.

 

[Hank Camacho]

8Sleep, which is the best product. The podcast is about as care free as it gets.

The 8Sleep comment cannot be racked enough. The sales pitch does not do the performance justice.

I totally get listening to a podcast to zone out. I do the same with Dan John. I tease about the Mindpump guys because they don't have any particular appeal for me but I get that my weirdo stuff has limited appeal, too. With Dan, I know i won't hear anything about politics, it will be positive, grandfatherly, and my wife won't object if I play it in the background. KSR is the only thing similar.

@Rogue Mocha I think you nailed it that the basics executed consistently is the most important thing. This thread is to geek out on details, bust balls, and get ideas. Coming here to peep what other people are doing helps me stay consistent with own peculiar routine.

I like hearing the exact details of the diet of those of you who do high protein long term. I can't do as much yogurt/skyr or eggs as others, so I have to modify, but your alls details help me figure out ways to hit 200 grams of protein consistently. Hitting that daily is easily my most consistent struggle at this stage. (Well that and stupid sleep consistency, per whoop.)

 

[Kooky Kats]

I like Mind Pump…on YT for planning

But also:

Will Tennyson: entertaining lifting
Thomas DeLauer: diet/supps/studies
Jesse James: bro culture
Rhonda Patrick: Chemistry

They all kinda cross-pollinate and have common guests. Eddie Hall is just awesome.

 

[anthonys735]

If you have issues hitting macros use a shake.

 

[warrior-cat]

I haven't at this point or ever really (other than tried the raw egg drink) put nutrition very high on my list but, am working on it (years of bad habits take time to reverse). I used to run and do cardio most of my years with less strength training (about 70-30 percentage) which is why I kept the weight off. Miles of running training and competing in 5-10-and 20 k races allowed me to eat whatever I wanted.

After retiring from the Army, I slowed that (running) down a lot and started to concentrate on more strength, karate, and playing ball. Eating did not change so, that is the reason I ballooned to a little over 230lbs. I have since cut down on what I eat even though it is still much of the bad food variety (Working on it, about a 50-50 split right now). I am hovering just above/below 200lbs now but will eventually get to my goal of 185.

I do enjoy reading what you folks are doing even though at 68 I will not be doing much of that stuff. Strength training at this age requires wisdom and restraint. I am not 65 anymore.

 

[warrior-cat]

If you have issues hitting macros use a shake.

I tried a shake and my wife thought I was going through convulsion, so she was ready to dial 911.

Sorry, bad joke.

 

[UK-Chulo]

I tried a shake and my wife thought I was going through convulsion, so she was ready to dial 911.

Sorry, bad joke.

Believe that is called 'twerking' now.

 

[anthonys735]

223#
16.7 BF
108.2 MM

Not TOOOOOO bad considering I just had two weeks eating like **** and almost no cardio. This time Feb 223 was like 21 or 22% so we're way ahead of the game. Overall, I'm still pretty happy. Plus, a head cold the last week has been wrecking me. Tighten things up for a few weeks and see if we can't get that bf back below 16 without dropping any muscle. Regardless, winter arc is on and 18% WoW is my circuit break for real cut.

Happy Friday, Folks.

 

[warrior-cat]

Believe that is called 'twerking' now.

Nope, I convulse. Twerking is just... well... nasty.

 

[Kennedy_UK]

Friday Update (brought to you by Hume):

231.5lbs
21.7 BF
121.2 MM

Rest day following 70mi on the bike since Sunday. Probably doing a 40mi tomorrow.

Yesterday's ride:

20.24 miles
1:00 time
20.2 mph avg speed
219 W avg power (992 W high)
150 bpm avg (169 high)
91 rpm avg
42 degree peak phase L/R avg

**Thinking I'm rounding up to a 280 FTP. Puts this ride (219 W avg) slightly above Zone 2, which is consistent with a low Zone 3 HR effort. I'd like to get my FTP up to 300 in the off season. Zwift intervals, here I come (but absolutely despise indoor riding).

As the weather changes, need to get back to the weight training.

 

[anthonys735]

Hank, I've asked before but who's your shooting instructor?

 

[Hank Camacho]

Hank, I've asked before but who's your shooting instructor?

Depends on what you mean. In the past, I've gone to classes / instruction with Karl Erickson. He's a former green beret and you can catch him on Youtube at Tactical Rifleman. He used to do a lot of stuff at the armory in Louisville and the Rockcastle Shooting Range but now he's only doing stuff at a range in deep Western Kentucky. FANTASTIC INSTRUCTOR, just too far away now.

What are you looking for? If you're already competent with a pistol and looking to get scarily proficient fast, I would attend a Modern Samurai class. Dude is the truth. Not for beginners, though.

Now, I mainly just shoot at the Bluegrass Sportsmans League in Wilmore with a group of buddies. We are all competitive and capable of troubleshooting each other's form. We usually take video and diagnose each other if we are being serious. If you or someone else local (and cool) is just looking to learn the basics of pistol shooting, me and my buddies are capable of doing that. I keep a spare gun belt with a retention holster and a Glock 19 (the most basic handgun) because I usually end up introducing one or two people a year to shooting. In a couple of hours, we can have most people comfortable and shooting well enough to be confident at relevant ranges.

 

[anthonys735]

Beginner stuff with handgun and rifle.

 

[pretzel__logic]

For my max effort deadlift and bench days this week I did variations I haven’t done since the first week of July (deadlift one rep max off 2 blocks, bench max to a 2 board)…comfortably put up 15# PRs on both. Very, very happy with that. Progress isn’t always linear but with lifting, it often is. nice to see it in action.

 

[Kooky Kats]

CWell… it was a good run!

Gonna put a pin on this as I enter a week of debauchery(again).

30th year annny last night went to a primo NYC restaurant and drank flights of groovy wine, bubbles, 5-course tasting menus… amaro and cake finale.

Now, making pork & lasagnas & steaks…. It’s what I do (bye week)…. Loading up for my travels south to drink and conquer like a Viking with reckless abandon.

MY numbers will suffer - but - will hop right back on the bike after wounding both knees and whatnot. promise.

 

[Wodie sloot]

I was wondering if you all polished off all those bottles, kook. Probably better that it was a tasting!

 

[Johnnie Africa]

Ok, couple questions as I try my damndest to get more protein:

-is whey protein the best? What is your alls favorite protein powder or does it even matter?

-what is your favorite/best protein shake. I heard the fair life core powers are good quality but what are some of your alls favorites?