I agree. But what I'm essentially saying is that even when Paige went cold, he still provided a host of other skills to our team. I'm not sure you can say the same about Cook.
Hornets Draft Pick???
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I agree. But what I'm essentially saying is that even when Paige went cold, he still provided a host of other skills to our team. I'm not sure you can say the same about Cook.
Sure, but I generally refrain from calling people who disagree with me homers when I do so.
Are you kidding me?
Maybe in that neither are likely to play in crunch time as you say. But I think it's telling of a player's mental make up and emotional toughness.
I wasn't kidding. Maybe I'm misremembering but I don't recall Cook being much of a defender or playmaker. Was he either?
Yes, he was a playmaker. Also, I guess leadership means nothing.
Yeah, I definitely don't remember him exhibiting a high level of either of those. My biggest knock on him during his time at Duke was that I wouldn't have felt good about handing the keys to the team to a guy that was at times too emotional to be a "coach on the floor". He was volatile and didn't K even bench him at times because of it?
I believe in the eye test as well and as My eye saw it they remember Paige was extremely frustrated in their head to head matchups.
It's hard to detach myself from Cook as a big fan of his, but I think at the very least, it's a toss-up as to who I'd draft if you held my feet to the fire. Neither guy is a great NBA player, but I feel like Quinn is the better athlete in terms of holding up for 82 games. Shooting is a wash. Paige is a bit better on defense, but I'm not sure that would factor in heavily as to their real value. Quinn just runs the floor better and has quicker moves and dishes. Lastly, Paige is already at his athletic peak, while Quinn might be 3-4 years away. For these reasons, I stand by my OP.
It's abundantly clear that Paige played better in the head-to-head matches against Cook. Not by the stats, of course, but by the true analytic when evaluating players, the eye test.
Paige:
12.2 ppg, 2.7 reb, 3.5 ast, 3.3 TO's, 1.2 stl, 41.7 FG%
Cook:
16.7 ppg, 3.7 reb, 3.3 ast, 2.5 TO's, 1.3 stl, 46.6 FG%
Kids mature.
http://espn.go.com/blog/collegebasketballnation/post/_/id/103940/cooks-presence-allows-duke-to-shine
"It's hard for me to quantify just how much his leadership has meant. It is the key factor," Duke coach Mike Krzyzewski said. "He makes it OK for all those guys to be who they are."
"He's just been the prototype leader, the prototype captain," [Tyus] Jones said. "Anything and everything you would want your captain to do, he's done. He's the rock of this team. He really is."
"Quinn is an amazing leader both emotionally and the way he plays for us," junior forward Amile Jefferson said. "… when he's doing well, he inspires everyone."
That's fair. Of course I'm higher on Marcus than some because of his underrated athleticism (second best shuttle run at combine and 39" max vertical) and the leadership I've cited repeatedly. I just see him having value as a locker room guy if nothing else. We'll see tonight. I'm hoping the best for him.
That is what is killing me. He has called people homers multiple times in multiple threads, and he couldn't be any more of a homer. I don't know of he is smart enough to see that.
No, they're just right.
Oh, I'm smart enough to see that. I just don't care. This is a message board where we're discussing things that have little to no meaning in my life. So I'll be as logical or illogical as I want. I also realize that whatever I say isn't going to change y'all's opinion just like whatever you say isn't going to change mine.
But just for clarification, who did I call a homer and in what threads did I do that? TIA.
That is certainly your prerogative, but some people, even on an anonymous message board, prefer not to look dumb.
In this very thread you said someone choosing Paige over Cook is a "total homer pick." Later, in this very thread, you asked someone who was advocating for Cook over Paige to "acknowledge a little bit of homerism." No one is more of a homer than the guy claiming Barnes is about to be Jimmy Butler, or claiming that Paige is superior to Cook in every way, or that Cook wasn't a good leader (a guy Coach K said was "as good as any leader I ever coached"), or that Paige is a surefire NBA player. And honestly, is a perfectly reasonable for you to advocate for your guys. But when you, who is taking homer stances to an extreme, try to argue that opinions other than yours have to be bias you invalidate everything you say.
But no worries, you and your 19,000+ posts clearly don't care about message board banter.
Oh yeah. Now I remember. Yeah, in those two instances, those poasters were definitely being homers.
Plus, you butchered what I originally said in both circumstances. I never claimed Barnes is the next Jimmy Butler. I simply showed how Butler came from a similar situation and said it's entirely possible Barnes follows that path. And I certainly never said Paige was a sure fire NBA player.
And if you're gonna try to heckle me, get your **** straight. I have over 23k poasts. Don't shortchange me.
Maybe Paige can ask Cook to see his ring?
I suppose you could quibble over those semantics (you said "Barnes could be like Jimmy Butler" and "There is a place in the NBA for Paige"), but the validity of those opinions wasn't what I was taking issue with. My main issue is that having very homer-centric opinions, and then trying to dismiss others in disagreement as being homers is, rhetorically speaking, really f****** weak. I would just hope for more from someone with your high volume of posts (Which - for the record - that number on DI as of right now is 19,012. You might have the 23,000+ on THR, where you wouldn't need to quote your own UNC-everything-sunshine-and-rainbows "poast" to get an ovation. But not here. My s*** is together.) But I digress.
@gunslingerdick you are living up to your name. There's really no reason you can't stay off the UNC bashing threads and provide your usually decent insight on other topics. I'm proud of you for your martyrdom towards your boys, but there's really no point on an opposing teams board.
Thank you Hokie. But the whole reason I'm here is to participate in the UNC bashing threads. I don't think I'd care too much about any of the other threads. But I take your poast as a warning and I will mind my Ps and Qs.
DH, I don't mean to belabor this in an argumentative sense, just continuing a conversation that allows me to talk about Quinn Cook, one of K's great leaders and a National Champ.
I think the notion of collegiate career arc is largely immaterial to a GM. They want to know what kind of player they are getting right now. Paige averaging 2 more points a game for his career is not a big deal to them I wouldn't think Here are the most pertinent, senior stats between the two in question:
Cook - 15.3 ppg, 2.6 apg, 1.0 spg, 89% FT, 39% 3 pt., 45% FG
Paige - 12.6 pg, 3.7 apg, 1.1 spg, 77% FT, 35% 3 pt., 39% FG
I don't think there is a GM on planet Earth who could watch them both play, look at those numbers, and come to the conclusion that "Cook doesn't do anything better than Paige." The primary thing Cook does better, which is a very big deal for a smallish guard, is shoot the ball and put the ball in the basket. That was solidified last year by Cook. He didn't make an NBA roster and played in the NBDL (which is likely to be where Paige is next year), but he without question one of the top performers there. He was an All-Star and the NBDL Rookie of the Year. His NBDL stats, where he played exclusively as a lead guard:
19.6 ppg, 5.4 apg, 3.9 rpg, 47% 3 pt.
I admit having bias, but I think if a GM was given a choice between those two right now it would almost be a no-brainer. I would love to see Quinn on an NBA roster next year, and I think it is likely.
I've never been wrong in my life...except once, when I thought I was wrong. But I was really right.
10 of the first 16 picks are players from other countries. I would venture to say that is some kind of record.
As far as Ainge an the Celtics, they have four 1st-round picks and four 2nd-round picks. If they can't trade some of these picks away, I imagine they're going to do the ole draft and stash and have that player develop overseas for a couple of years and hope they get a nice return someday. 8 picks is too many picks for any organization outside of Philadelphia.
As far as Ainge an the Celtics, they have four 1st-round picks and four 2nd-round picks. If they can't trade some of these picks away, I imagine they're going to do the ole draft and stash and have that player develop overseas for a couple of years and hope they get a nice return someday. 8 picks is too many picks for any organization outside of Philadelphia.
The Clippers just threw their pick away, haha.