Improving the IHSA Football Semifinals

[DJrodey24]

So, I haven't been on here in awhile, and I've been watching from afar. Hope you all are doing well.

I always wondered what could be done to make it better. Neutral sites, more TV exposure, more chances to see games in person, more Friday night games. Here's what I came up with...

Stagger Saturday starts by 30 minutes. What this does is allow for a whip-around style broadcast on NBC Sports Chicago / IHSA web platforms. You dip in and out of games on the The Cube or IHSA.tv, even CN 100. Studio show based set up. Think NFL Redzone, but it would require cooperation from member schools and CPS facilities. Here's how it would look this year...

1A – 11am (1) Tuscola at (6) Athens,
1A – 11:30 (3) Forreston at (1) Lena-Winslow
2A – 12pm (4) Maroa-Forsyth at (6) Shelbyville
2A – 12:30 (1) Newman Central at (2) Gibson City
3A – 1pm (3) Anna-Jonesboro at (16) Pleasant Plains
3A – 1:30 (5) IC Catholic at (3) Byron
4A – 2pm (2) Highland at (1) Rochester
4A – 2:30 (2) Raby at (5) Morris
5A – 3pm (1) Dunlap at (3) Washington
5A – 3:30 (2) Sterling at (1) Phillips
6A – 4pm (2) Nazareth at (13) Providence
6A – 4:30 (1) Prairie Ridge at (7) Hoffman Estates
7A – 5pm (18) Mount Carmel at (3) Lake Zurich
7A – 5:30 (4) Batavia at (17) Benet
8A – 6pm (6) Loyola at (26) Edwardsville
8A – 6:30 (5) Maine South at (1) Lincoln-Way East

Split them up Friday / Saturday so that schools don't have the short week. Here's how this looks...

Friday
1A – 4pm (1) Tuscola at (6) Athens
1A – 4:30 (3) Forreston at (1) Lena-Winslow
2A – 5pm (4) Maroa-Forsyth at (6) Shelbyville
2A – 5:30 (1) Newman Central at (2) Gibson City
3A – 6pm (3) Anna-Jonesboro at (16) Pleasant Plains
3A – 6:30 (5) IC Catholic at (3) Byron
4A – 7pm (2) Highland at (1) Rochester
4A – 7:30 (5) Morris at (2) Raby

Saturday
5A – 1pm (1) Dunlap at (3) Washington
5A – 1:30 (1) Phillips at (2) Sterling
6A – 2pm (2) Nazareth at (13) Providence
6A – 2:30 (1) Prairie Ridge at (7) Hoffman Estates
7A – 3pm (18) Mount Carmel at (3) Lake Zurich
7A – 3:30 (4) Batavia at (17) Benet
8A – 4pm (6) Loyola at (26) Edwardsville
8A – 4:30 (5) Maine South at (1) Lincoln-Way East

Neutral sites would require turf, that's tougher to find south of I-80. Ideally you want 8 venues and doubleheader schedule. Mix and match classes. Ideally, you want a "small-big" DH if you could. You would want to stagger start times by about 5 hours to get a similar whip-around format.

Venue 1 - 11am, 4pm
Venue 2 - 11:30, 4:30
Venue 3 - 12pm, 5pm
Venue 4 - 12:30, 5:30
Venue 5 - 1pm, 6pm
Venue 6 - 1:30, 6:30
Venue 7 - 2pm, 7pm
Venue 8 - 2:30, 7:30

NBC Sports Chicago won't televise all 16 semifinal games, trust me, I'd love for them to throw 2 on Friday and 5 on Saturday on "plus" with multiple production crews, but it makes no business sense.

The whip-around idea however gives maximum exposure that makes this level bigger than the quarterfinals. That's the goal. Would love to hear what you all think.

 

[ramblinman_rivals165935]

So, I haven't been on here in awhile, and I've been watching from afar. Hope you all are doing well.

I always wondered what could be done to make it better. Neutral sites, more TV exposure, more chances to see games in person, more Friday night games. Here's what I came up with...

Stagger Saturday starts by 30 minutes. What this does is allow for a whip-around style broadcast on NBC Sports Chicago / IHSA web platforms. You dip in and out of games on the The Cube or IHSA.tv, even CN 100. Studio show based set up. Think NFL Redzone, but it would require cooperation from member schools and CPS facilities. Here's how it would look this year...

1A – 11am (1) Tuscola at (6) Athens,
1A – 11:30 (3) Forreston at (1) Lena-Winslow
2A – 12pm (4) Maroa-Forsyth at (6) Shelbyville
2A – 12:30 (1) Newman Central at (2) Gibson City
3A – 1pm (3) Anna-Jonesboro at (16) Pleasant Plains
3A – 1:30 (5) IC Catholic at (3) Byron
4A – 2pm (2) Highland at (1) Rochester
4A – 2:30 (2) Raby at (5) Morris
5A – 3pm (1) Dunlap at (3) Washington
5A – 3:30 (2) Sterling at (1) Phillips
6A – 4pm (2) Nazareth at (13) Providence
6A – 4:30 (1) Prairie Ridge at (7) Hoffman Estates
7A – 5pm (18) Mount Carmel at (3) Lake Zurich
7A – 5:30 (4) Batavia at (17) Benet
8A – 6pm (6) Loyola at (26) Edwardsville
8A – 6:30 (5) Maine South at (1) Lincoln-Way East

Split them up Friday / Saturday so that schools don't have the short week. Here's how this looks...

Friday
1A – 4pm (1) Tuscola at (6) Athens
1A – 4:30 (3) Forreston at (1) Lena-Winslow
2A – 5pm (4) Maroa-Forsyth at (6) Shelbyville
2A – 5:30 (1) Newman Central at (2) Gibson City
3A – 6pm (3) Anna-Jonesboro at (16) Pleasant Plains
3A – 6:30 (5) IC Catholic at (3) Byron
4A – 7pm (2) Highland at (1) Rochester
4A – 7:30 (5) Morris at (2) Raby

Saturday
5A – 1pm (1) Dunlap at (3) Washington
5A – 1:30 (1) Phillips at (2) Sterling
6A – 2pm (2) Nazareth at (13) Providence
6A – 2:30 (1) Prairie Ridge at (7) Hoffman Estates
7A – 3pm (18) Mount Carmel at (3) Lake Zurich
7A – 3:30 (4) Batavia at (17) Benet
8A – 4pm (6) Loyola at (26) Edwardsville
8A – 4:30 (5) Maine South at (1) Lincoln-Way East

Neutral sites would require turf, that's tougher to find south of I-80. Ideally you want 8 venues and doubleheader schedule. Mix and match classes. Ideally, you want a "small-big" DH if you could. You would want to stagger start times by about 5 hours to get a similar whip-around format.

Venue 1 - 11am, 4pm
Venue 2 - 11:30, 4:30
Venue 3 - 12pm, 5pm
Venue 4 - 12:30, 5:30
Venue 5 - 1pm, 6pm
Venue 6 - 1:30, 6:30
Venue 7 - 2pm, 7pm
Venue 8 - 2:30, 7:30

NBC Sports Chicago won't televise all 16 semifinal games, trust me, I'd love for them to throw 2 on Friday and 5 on Saturday on "plus" with multiple production crews, but it makes no business sense.

The whip-around idea however gives maximum exposure that makes this level bigger than the quarterfinals. That's the goal. Would love to hear what you all think.

 

[crusader_of_90]

What are the viewership numbers - is that data available? How's that compare to other programming?

This is something you have to "sell first before it would ever be adopted.

As such, could some/more focus be placed on ad sales for those games - outside of selling one sponsorship to an insurance company?

The apparel companies? Regional or state-wide service providers, such as law offices, real estate groups, alarm companies, HVAC/mechanical service, et cetera. Universities looking to attract students, job services? Some PSAs that earn them some credit. Best yet, during election years, you could make a fortune on local political ads!

 

[Wassup13_rivals219252]

I like it but think you could get in 4 games at each venue and therefore only 4 venues. Would be great to watch 4 games at each neutral site.

Overall though I like the current system better where a team may get one more home game before possibly making the finals.

 

[DJrodey24]

I like it but think you could get in 4 games at each venue and therefore only 4 venues. Would be great to watch 4 games at each neutral site.

Overall though I like the current system better where a team may get one more home game before possibly making the finals.

And that is going to be the hang up by eliminating that home playoff game in the semifinals. Most schools love it. Particularly now that everyone in the Chicagoland area (80% at least) have turf or quality grass fields.

4 in a day? I hate the 10am start. You could go 11a, 2p, 5p, 8p, but OT will throw it off. The real issue is fans coming in and out at a high school venue. From there, you have to get a small college venue, and that might take the charm away, a slippery slope.

 

[DJrodey24]

What are the viewership numbers - is that data available? How's that compare to other programming?

This is something you have to "sell first before it would ever be adopted.

As such, could some/more focus be placed on ad sales for those games - outside of selling one sponsorship to an insurance company?

The apparel companies? Regional or state-wide service providers, such as law offices, real estate groups, alarm companies, HVAC/mechanical service, et cetera. Universities looking to attract students, job services? Some PSAs that earn them some credit. Best yet, during election years, you could make a fortune on local political ads!

Selling prep sports sounds easy, you gather up a bunch of "mom and pop" shops, the insurance guy, the HVAC guy, put them all together and it gives you the community bond of a high school sports telecast. Truth is, you need to get corporate guys on board for the money, and they don't want to invest because the eyeballs on a 7A title game aren't as much as a MAC game on a Tuesday night.

I started ESPN HS Gamenight, that format is still on WGN 720 and it's awesome. But I could never sell it to the Score guys because they didn't want to chase those sales, not as much money, not worth the time spent.

We did Prep Destination on NBC 5 and it worked because it tied in with news, our numbers were high, people would jump in, but any push to expand it was met with resistance because no one wanted to spend money they felt they couldn't bring in.

TV Ad sales is a nightmare business, be glad you aren't in it.

 

[godfthr53]

And that is going to be the hang up by eliminating that home playoff game in the semifinals. Most schools love it. Particularly now that everyone in the Chicagoland area (80% at least) have turf or quality grass fields.

What I don't love is being the #2 seed and having to play the quarterfinals and semis on the road.

 

[RockSoup]

What I don't love is being the #2 seed and having to play the quarterfinals and semis on the road.

But why does Nazareth deserve a higher seed than PC? It's because of a flawed and arbitrary seeding system. Nazareth played or won a forfeit v Dunbar and DLS, a decent enough program, but no powerhouse as seen by the performance of CCL Green teams in the playoffs. PC played ESL at ESL, former #1 Missouri team (current #8) Vianney. In conference play, both conferences ESCC and CCL Blue are always solid conferences but with LA's dismantling of Marist and 3 blue semi finalists (imagine if Benet had to play LZ and SR got LWC) the edge goes to the CCL blue this year for being a tougher conference. So Nazareth gets the higher seed, not because they are better than PC (they may be), they only get it because they did not have to play PC's schedule and PC did not get to play Nazareth's schedule.

I enjoy your posts Godfthr and I respect the ESCC and Nazareth football. So I hope no one misconstrues my post as an attack on the ESCC or Nazareth. The only thing I'm attacking is the perception that seeds mean anything. Because the system of seeding is flawed and cannot be perfected in any meaningful way, I cringe when I hear, the higher seed should always host, or the higher seed should always host QFs or SFs. It's a ridiculous ultimatum, or expectation, based on a ridiculous seeding system.

 

[MC63]

I don't speak for the administration of my school by any means, but I like road games. I've seen towns in NE Illinois that I'd probably never visit ... including McHenry, Woodstock, Batavia and many others. In every case but one -- Cary Grove -- I was treated as a guest by some very nice people.

Regarding seeding ... we'll never get realistic rankings, mainly because of IHSA politics, regional jealousy, and religious intolerance. Downstate and rural schools have way too much IHSA influence and power.

 

[PanthersWildcats86]

Seeding for true team strength is nearly impossible for a couple of reasons. The key, however, comes down to this in my opinion:

How do you know how good teams are from a 10 team conference that plays a round robin? Clearly, the 9-0 champion is the best, the 0-9 is the worst. But how do you compare with other conferences? 9-0 conference champs lose every year in the first round to teams from stronger conferences...You can't downgrade them for playing a round robin schedule...They know exactly what their playoff points are going to be (36 for 9-0, 40 for 5-4)...There is no good way to seed & pick home teams...

 

[go dogz]

So, I haven't been on here in awhile, and I've been watching from afar. Hope you all are doing well.

I always wondered what could be done to make it better. Neutral sites, more TV exposure, more chances to see games in person, more Friday night games. Here's what I came up with...

Stagger Saturday starts by 30 minutes. What this does is allow for a whip-around style broadcast on NBC Sports Chicago / IHSA web platforms. You dip in and out of games on the The Cube or IHSA.tv, even CN 100. Studio show based set up. Think NFL Redzone, but it would require cooperation from member schools and CPS facilities. Here's how it would look this year...

1A – 11am (1) Tuscola at (6) Athens,
1A – 11:30 (3) Forreston at (1) Lena-Winslow
2A – 12pm (4) Maroa-Forsyth at (6) Shelbyville
2A – 12:30 (1) Newman Central at (2) Gibson City
3A – 1pm (3) Anna-Jonesboro at (16) Pleasant Plains
3A – 1:30 (5) IC Catholic at (3) Byron
4A – 2pm (2) Highland at (1) Rochester
4A – 2:30 (2) Raby at (5) Morris
5A – 3pm (1) Dunlap at (3) Washington
5A – 3:30 (2) Sterling at (1) Phillips
6A – 4pm (2) Nazareth at (13) Providence
6A – 4:30 (1) Prairie Ridge at (7) Hoffman Estates
7A – 5pm (18) Mount Carmel at (3) Lake Zurich
7A – 5:30 (4) Batavia at (17) Benet
8A – 6pm (6) Loyola at (26) Edwardsville
8A – 6:30 (5) Maine South at (1) Lincoln-Way East

Split them up Friday / Saturday so that schools don't have the short week. Here's how this looks...

Friday
1A – 4pm (1) Tuscola at (6) Athens
1A – 4:30 (3) Forreston at (1) Lena-Winslow
2A – 5pm (4) Maroa-Forsyth at (6) Shelbyville
2A – 5:30 (1) Newman Central at (2) Gibson City
3A – 6pm (3) Anna-Jonesboro at (16) Pleasant Plains
3A – 6:30 (5) IC Catholic at (3) Byron
4A – 7pm (2) Highland at (1) Rochester
4A – 7:30 (5) Morris at (2) Raby

Saturday
5A – 1pm (1) Dunlap at (3) Washington
5A – 1:30 (1) Phillips at (2) Sterling
6A – 2pm (2) Nazareth at (13) Providence
6A – 2:30 (1) Prairie Ridge at (7) Hoffman Estates
7A – 3pm (18) Mount Carmel at (3) Lake Zurich
7A – 3:30 (4) Batavia at (17) Benet
8A – 4pm (6) Loyola at (26) Edwardsville
8A – 4:30 (5) Maine South at (1) Lincoln-Way East

Neutral sites would require turf, that's tougher to find south of I-80. Ideally you want 8 venues and doubleheader schedule. Mix and match classes. Ideally, you want a "small-big" DH if you could. You would want to stagger start times by about 5 hours to get a similar whip-around format.

Venue 1 - 11am, 4pm
Venue 2 - 11:30, 4:30
Venue 3 - 12pm, 5pm
Venue 4 - 12:30, 5:30
Venue 5 - 1pm, 6pm
Venue 6 - 1:30, 6:30
Venue 7 - 2pm, 7pm
Venue 8 - 2:30, 7:30

NBC Sports Chicago won't televise all 16 semifinal games, trust me, I'd love for them to throw 2 on Friday and 5 on Saturday on "plus" with multiple production crews, but it makes no business sense.

The whip-around idea however gives maximum exposure that makes this level bigger than the quarterfinals. That's the goal. Would love to hear what you all think.

I don't know why they would not. they do it for iowa every year. they run the playoffs up to the finals.