Back in the 80s, or 90s, or 2000s, or whenever, if you were a top athlete growing up in the US the only way to play in the NBA or NFL was to go to college unless you were someone like Kobe Bryant or Lebron and for a brief window you could go straight professional. The entire formation of the NCAA, however, was nonsense. You didn’t really have a “choice” as a HS kid of whether you could skip college or not in pursuit of being a professional athlete. There was a book I read one time called “The cartel: rise of the NCAA” that was really good. The whole thing was a sham. And all the Universities had to do was agree to give Ed Obannen and his peers 700 dollars each and they were so insanely greedy they said no and that’s when the lawsuits happened. It’s all garbage. That’s why the NCAA gets laughed out of court anytime a lawsuit pops up, even by conservative judges. Universities are one of the most corrupt, money hungry, shady institutions we have in this day. You know my history with universities, but they are so predatory and shady it’s ridiculous. They brought this all on themselves - and even now as they complain they’re still printing money.
Just destroy collegiate athletics, why don't ya?
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Back in the 80s, or 90s, or 2000s, or whenever, if you were a top athlete growing up in the US the only way to play in the NBA or NFL was to go to college unless you were someone like Kobe Bryant or Lebron and for a brief window you could go straight professional. The entire formation of the NCAA, however, was nonsense. You didn’t really have a “choice” as a HS kid of whether you could skip college or not in pursuit of being a professional athlete. There was a book I read one time called “The cartel: rise of the NCAA” that was really good. The whole thing was a sham. And all the Universities had to do was agree to give Ed Obannen and his peers 700 dollars each and they were so insanely greedy they said no and that’s when the lawsuits happened. It’s all garbage. That’s why the NCAA gets laughed out of court anytime a lawsuit pops up, even by conservative judges. Universities are one of the most corrupt, money hungry, shady institutions we have in this day. You know my history with universities, but they are so predatory and shady it’s ridiculous. They brought this all on themselves - and even now as they complain they’re still printing money.
I think like most things the truth is in the middle. The players would have never stopped at 700 dollars per week. That’s what they push but there’s no way. The ncaa made a judgement call to stick to amateurism instead of opening up the flood gates.
I agree with much of the book but again that was the starting point and the players and agents and handlers would have 100% went for their next move had the ncaa said okay. The notion that everything would be fine now and the players would be content at 700 per week is not true. That’s not how the American grievance lobby works. You give an inch they go for the mile, every time.
Will the lawyers have commercials that will replace the Camp Lejune drinking water ones?
Well obviously I trust your opinion on it. I don't have a clue what I'm talking about, lol. It just seems to me this train won't slow down and it won't end well for anyone.
The agreement was a scholarship in exchange for playing a sport. Nothing more, nothing less. Common sense would suggest that schools and the NCAA have to advertise somehow, and its memories that keep bringing fans back.
Agree. But also the fact that windfall TV revenue has increased dramatically plays into the problem( opportunity). It just wasn’t fair for the players not to share in that revenue when the coaches, administrators,and colleges were receiving all of the windfall . The schools in the fifties and sixties were just trying to find a way to finance college sports . Four year grant in aide as fair . Then came huge amounts of TV money .
I’m against the middle man crap that people are forced into and college is the biggest “forced middle man” there is.
The good news is that the NCAA is on their way out. May take 10 years but the super conferences are going to be the death of it. The NCAA saying yes to everything is really just them trying to keep their hold on things. The reality is they don’t do crap except put on a good basketball tournament every year.
Right, but 700 dollars is ridiculous anyway, but they still wouldn’t even give that up. When you write on a contract that a university will pay 70 million just to FIRE you as the A&M head coach, or 33 million for Cal, and then turn around and say they won’t pay John Wall 700 bucks it just shows how ridiculous the situation became. Universities as a whole are scum, and I have no sympathy for them. The second they started to receive guaranteed government loans for tuition they had no issue charging poor kids from rural towns 40k for a worthless degree they knew had no job prospects that would saddle them in debt. The whole adjunct professor scheme they’ve been running for 20 yrs now making it pretty much impossible to become a tenured professor with benefits is despicable. Universities are the worst of the worst they deserve anything they have coming to them.
I get the legalities of this, but the agreement was lopsided. There were so many years where players pushed back on the NCAA and lost in court. Just because there was a signed deal doesn’t mean that it wasn’t incredibly unfair.
There wasn’t an alternate one.
Enslavement? L o freaking L. Yes, those poor slaves that were getting a free college education, with free room and board, adoration of hot women, landing potential lucrative deals, not having to attend classes (UNC), etc.
Yeah, real soul breaking human rights infringement there.
They have to attend classes. They are required to do so, at least at UK. Their life isn’t as glamorous as you’re describing.
Another example (have one above in another comment), I had a student who was on a UK team. He was either training, working out, going to class, eating, or sleeping. He was up at 5a and went to bed at close to 10p every day with the above schedule.
His free time was spent snoozing. Again, this life isn’t Blue Chips.
And how's that ANY different from having a job? I get up at 6, go to work, come home, do chores, try to have a hobby, and go to bed.
That's just part of life. Being a good athlete is hard work, just like being a good ANYTHING. Other college students had rough schedules too. My junior year I went from 7 to about 6 with MAYBE a 15 minute break. I didn't get a free ride or free room and board either.
Point being, sure, college athletes have to work hard, but they aren't slaves, not even close. And were compensated beyond what most college students got. I'm not against NIL either. However, this retroactive action and extending NIL past college sports is asinine.
Forgive me, but wasn’t that quote (which I think is extreme) in reference to them not being paid? If so, why are you comparing it to a job?
My point is that you shouldn’t discount how their day-to-day life is because the picture you painted isn’t true.
And the job comparison, i just don’t buy that comparison. I always think that college students basically have to juggle 3-4 different jobs per semester. Learning material isn’t the easiest thing.
Imagine if you had to go to work and your boss told you that you had to simultaneously learn math, science, English, and whatever the hell else while doing another job. You probably wouldn’t enjoy that too much. And you would probably demand a bit more for the effort. It ain’t easy and a job after college is far more easier than getting through college.
That is my opinion and how I view it. I get it if you don’t agree. I mean no offense and I take none.
They were getting compensation though in terms of free education, free meals, and free housing.
Now, if you want to argue they should've been getting a salary, that's a different argument.
We get up at 3:45am and are at work at 5am, and there until 5pm.
I work in IT and Cybersec. That's daily work man. We have to constantly be learning and in a way doing math. lol.
Again, I'm not against NIL per se. But there has to be some rules, guidelines, and limits. Or it's going to become even more like the Wild West than it already is. And I'm not saying college athletes had it completely easy; the strain they put on their bodies is enormous. But to say they were "slaves" is waaaay out of bounds and they very much benefit from athletic prestige. That's true even in pro sports. How often do we see pro athletes catch breaks you or I wouldn't never get?
I'm just bucking the notion that college athletes had it sooooo bad 20-30 years ago.
Again I don’t agree with the slave thing but slaves also received free meals, room and board, and even healthcare. But I also think that compensation model is disproportionately skewed towards the university. I say that because the cost TO THE UNIVERSITY of having an extra student sitting in on a class is minimal. If you already have 250 kids sitting in on an English 101 course having an extra student-athlete there and having 251 kids sitting in the class makes no difference to the university. Again, the universities were greedy.
THey have already been paid... NO one would know any of them if not for the universities that recruited them... How much did they get under the table to go to that school???? I would bet a bunch of money that most of them took a handout from inside the schools.... So as far as I am concerned they have been paid... If they made a pro team them the school should be paid for their time in development to get them there...
Cry me a river....
GBB
Cry me a river....
GBB
Just like corporations.
And no, you can't even compare it to slavery AT ALL. Slavery is against one's will. Nobody dragged an athlete into that environment against their will. It's not even close. If we're going to extend that argument then hell, society in itself is slavery to a degree (cultural norms, work or starve, etc.)
Again, I'm not arguing the system was not lopsided, but so are jobs. My ultimate boss is probably making 6 times what I make. It's not even remotely fair, but until we get a better system, it's what we got and we keep working to better it. What I can't due, is sue all my former employers because they got a better deal than I did. And that's exactly what this lawsuit is trying to do; make a new system retroactive. And that just can't work in any kind of existing framework. Imagine suing an old employer because you SHOULD have made 80k instead of 40k. You'd be laughed out of the court.
Just like corporations what? Corporations directly pay employees, I don’t get the comparison or think it’s a good one. In your analogy of your boss making more than you the boss is still equivalent to a student athlete. Look, I agree with you completely on the retroactive lawsuit and think it’s dumb, we’re on the same page. What I don’t agree with is the analogy of a job and being an NCAA player at all, until the last couple years.
Nah they are. This entire country has turned into one giant scheme. Im dealing with probate law right now, and I can say the country is even more corrupt than I imagined before. Its unreal how corrupt actually, just when you thought you understood it you find something else and it’s like wow, how?
Sad times we’re in. I know some guys that would kill for a 300 dollar college loan. We’re talking inane loan amounts that unless they hit it big they wouldn’t be able to pay. Just ruins your life early.
Not to get political but I always steer clear of politicians promising any kind of full loan forgiveness. It will never happen people might as well move on, they just use it to hoard votes and turn around and walk away. Don’t personally believe there’s a single politician who would actually eliminate it.
Why are we upset that college athletes are getting paid again?
People love to complain, but they hate change. Now that Calipari is no longer the coach, they want a new reason to get on their soap box and "stop goin' to the games and not watchin'".
It also doesn't help that it's July and there's not a lot of news on the UK basketball front.
Those of you who are going "Wait a minute, that is just like my job..." are starting to get it. Keep going.
Nah that’s not it at all. I just love to bash the hell out of that chump. It’s fun, I enjoy it. You’re reading too much into it.
Hmm..let's see: Free meals, much better housing than other students, better study services, tutors to help their grades, advisors devoted to their schedule to get easier classes, people to take notes for them in class....Need I go on?
There were a LOT of extra benefits athletes received well beyond that afforded to the rest of the student body. I went to college with a good number of athletes and they were treated like kings compared to the rest of us.
But fine, kill the NCAA and we will see what's left. My guess is not much, which will wipe out lots of athletic opportunities for kids who aren't going pro.
The guys who constantly want the NCAA disbanded don’t understand how bad things will then get. Most of them believe there’s a board of 12 collecting billions for themselves and their pockets. It’s not true, most of the NCAA revenue goes back to the colleges to fund all sports.
I want some change but if you start ruling the entire thing away this is going to get really bad in a hurry. Most of the people who want the destruction of the ncaa is the same group that didn’t realize how bad NIL was gonna be. Some people aren’t capable of learning.
Hmm, have to clarify what you’re saying. What I’m saying is
He’s a lightening rod coach who causes problems wherever he goes. He left for a rival. He took the team. He had a pitiful 5 years here and never admitted it once. He took shots at a blue blood fanbase. He literally left a few months ago and we compete against him this season.
Just trying to figure out in what world this isn’t going to get bashed and talked about on a sports forum. Maybe I’m missing something?
No. I completely agree with the criticism of Cal. That wasn't my point. I meant that since he's no longer associated with the program, there has to be something new to complain about.
Except jobs don't give you free room and food. Even pro athletes have to pay for their own housing and lifestyle. I'm perfectly fine with revoking scholarships and making athletes who get NIL pay their own way through school.
I said when the NIL was brought up that "They were opening a can of worms". It is only going to get worse because there were no rules put in place. I don't think we have seen anything yet. I have always said that there has to be a stopping point somewhere. The world is all about greed now.
Enslaving athletes? You are not a serious person and should just keep quiet. Bet you want reparations too. Am I right?
My absolute favorite were the grievance pushers that claimed this was about a bagel and money for some autographs. Some of them were just that stupid but many of them knew damn well that wasn’t what this was about and pushed that nonsense to get a foothold.
This was always about tearing down the system and creating professionalism in college athletics. And it’s largely not good for the kids either, many of them are going to be worse off because this took the power out of coaches hands and many times over it was the coaches and rules who protected the athletes from the scum bags and handlers. That’s gone now, and insert money (which usually makes things worse the younger you are) now so this isn’t gonna end well for many. It’s never going to be enough to pay out handlers, save, and spend.
Right now kids are being steered, before they’re ready, to the place best suited for handlers to make money. Most of these kids are going to create bad habits and be far worse off. But body cares about that because this is a feel good thing where people who don’t understand the system and know nothing about it are easily duped into believing it’s a virtuous play. It’s not