Kaden Saunders puts the fans on notice.
- Thread starter NitneLiun
- Start date
Based on what we've seen this season I don't think there's any doubt Clifford was the best QB on the roster last season. Of course if you only read the boards, Allar was better and the coaches didn't know what the hell they were doing.
Sean Clifford revisionist history begins. Drew had a rough year, but exactly what did you want him to do with the coaching decisions:
It's impossible to say what was Drew's fault and what was the coaches fault unless you know all the play calls and QB reads/progressions. Despite his flaws, the passing game generally looked more effective under Clifford, but he also had better WRs. Of course his mechanics were bad at times and he turned the ball over much more, but he also seemed to make things happen more frequently, whereas Drew seemed more passive in only reacting to what the defense would allow him to do. Good QBs have the ability to dictate play on their terms and force the defense to adjust, Drew was the opposite.
I'd say Clifford's style was higher risk, higher reward, more energetic and motivating for those around him, whereas Drew is lower energy, calculating, and even-keeled, based on how things played out. At times you need a QB to make a high risk decisions and throws to try to build some momentum and turn to the tide of a game and we didn't see that at all with Drew. If I had to sum up his play in one word it would be "careful." Careful doesn't translate to championship football unless you are extremely consistent and Drew was not. I do think Drew has potential for a much higher ceiling that Clifford given his arm talent, but he still has a ways to go in his decision making and leadership. Even towards the end of the season I'd have little confidence in Drew taking the reins and conducting a game winning drive against a good defense in crunch time. The negatives we saw were not all that unexpected given he was a first year starter though but give me 2022 Clifford over 2023 Allar if I have to choose one. The good news is I think 2024 Allar will be better than both of those.
Excuse me, but how many times were wide receivers targeted in the first three quarters? Kind of inconceivable that none of them could create separation and get open. But then when the game was basically lost, Voila! Allar starts connecting multiple times and one reception ends in a TD to #6. So, was it a game plan to run the ball and use the tight ends primarily? It looked that way from my seat. But everyone uses the receivers as scapegoats. I’ve always thought that Franklin requires such perfection at the wide receiver position. But he doesn’t have perfection, so maybe a little flexibility/creativity to gain some sort of production from the WRs is in order. Maybe the new OC will actually be given the reins of the offense, and maybe that will turn things around. Honestly, I thought really good WR recruits would be flocking to Penn State with Allar at QB. But it’s been a struggle to get them. Someone said in this thread “Something is rotten in Denmark.” Doubtful it’s NIL. You have to have An offensive identity to attract skill players. We get runners because we run successfully. Whatever happened to the passing game this year is clearly not impressing anyone. Except tight ends.
Me, too. Glad you said that. Do analytics have a place when games are on the line and smart gut calls are needed.
Nope, he’s not the answer, either. Grunk may be but of course he’ll have to sit. Hopefully the new OC is a miracle worker.
Wow, what took you - and many others - so long. He may not have had Allar’s arm, but he was a much better quarterback overall. And by the way, what is Allar’s arm doing for him these days? Kid has talent but his hype so far is undeserved. Hope he Improves a ton next year.
hit some open receivers when they were open, for starters
Or throw them open with the back shoulder like Dart did to us a few times . Higher skill set , but if you’re saying you’re all that and a bag of chips let’s see it .
I'm not sure we disagree. I said in my post if it's not the WR room, then we have major problems somewhere. Personally, I think it is the WR room, first and foremost. They had 13 games to show what they could do. It didn't happen. Not once. That is not to exonerate the scheme or Allar but IMHO it starts with the WR room being very, very average.
I fail to believe that multiple 3 and 4-star WRs somehow can't play the game of football well enough to get open. I just simply can't believe that.
My personal belief is that the scheme all season didn't allow the WRs to continually get open, and Allar stopped trusting them. but that's purely uninformed observational
My personal belief is that the scheme all season didn't allow the WRs to continually get open, and Allar stopped trusting them. but that's purely uninformed observational
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Like all things, it is probably a confluence of issues....O-line not holding up, QB not trusting what he sees, receivers not getting open, but from a scheme perspective we did NOTHING to help establish our WR's. We've had some really poor WR play under franklin, minus a few transcendent guys(Dotson, KJ, Godwin) and it's such an indictment on Franklin who came up in the sport as a WR coach and OC. One thing I was thinking about after the Ole Miss game....where were those simple little WR toss out screens we ran successfully in the early part of the year and at points last year? I get that defenses started playing our receivers closer to the line, but we had no passing game deep or intermediate to the WR's at all. Just some quick crossers or quick screens to the wide side to stretch the defense, get Allar in rhythm, get the WR's some easy touches. Let them catch something short, make someone miss for a 4-5 yard gain. It just boggles the mind. Something was inherently wrong with our route trees where it took too long to break open or they were so limited in quantity that the defense knew where the WR's were going. Just nearly impossible to think that we couldn't scheme 5-10 plays that hit quickly and allowed a receiver to get some space and run after the catch.
Some WRs were open…a few times wide open…Allar missed them completely
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...and line Singleton up outside way more often, to get him the ball 'in the open' where he is absolutely devastating.
Analytics are to football as the Daily Racing Form is to Thoroughbred racing. Lots of data there, none of which the horses are aware and much of which goes out the window when the gates open...or when the ball is kicked. Note: Favorites only win 30% of the time. Takes lots more info and a bit o' personal insight to be successful 'at the windows'. Same with coaching football, baseball, etc. In all cases you must be a MOTO and 'feel', trust and react positively to what you sensed.
Meaning no insult to Drew but making him a successful running QB is like trying to win the KY Derby with a standardbred. (If you're from Mauch Chunk that's a trotter or pacer.) Now if what you're seeking is a QB who is a far more natural runner, well, I have a name to suggest: Beau Pribula.
Occam’s Razor: Our receivers this year just weren’t that good.
We had a better downfield passing game with Yurcich before this past season. Ditto for prior seasons under Franklin with other offensive coordinators. PSU has put good receivers in the NFL during Franklin’s tenure. And if we consider that “Franklin likes to meddle in the offense” (
), I doubt he just started meddling in the passing game in 2023 (to bad effect).
We had a better downfield passing game with Yurcich before this past season. Ditto for prior seasons under Franklin with other offensive coordinators. PSU has put good receivers in the NFL during Franklin’s tenure. And if we consider that “Franklin likes to meddle in the offense” (
), I doubt he just started meddling in the passing game in 2023 (to bad effect).
