LSU loses recruit to Alabama allegedly because Bama offers better NIL deal -

[Eurocat]

I'm just posting this because this is the first flat out "going to school x because of more money" situation I have read about and that seems to be more or less confirmed.

And this is what I feared would happen.

https://deathvalleyvoice.com/2022/02/10/lsu-football-lost-state-recruit-alabama-nil-deal/amp/

 

[phatcat_rivals223240]

I will go to my grave stating that the players deserve compensation for risking life and limb for dear ole alma mater (shove your worthless "scholarship"). However, I was completely wrong to think that the NCAA, the conferences and the universities involved would actually have some control over this mess. Instead, it is a complete free-for-all and open bribery. No rules, no regulations, no limits, no sanctions, just million dollar handshakes. And the obscene amount of money available means that the market won't self regulate. if Joe B. Auburn gives a 7 figure NIL deal to some flop, you can bet that Billy Bob Auburn will be right behind him with a 7 figure deal to the next flavor of the month. What was supposed to be an fair compensation for Name, Image and Likeness (e.g, Jersey sales with name on the back) has mutated into a channel for boosters to legally give cash to players to attend their program.

Here at Poindexter U, where most alumni don't give a sh1te, we don't have such a pool of $. The closest we could come would be for Pat Ryan et al to endow some separate, non-university fund with, say, $50 million, have someone manage the fund and generate NIL deals worth about $5M a year.

Separately, I'm sure you can still get put on probation for buying a recruit a cheeseburger and giving him a ride to the airport. Sheesh

 

[Sheffielder]

This was happening well before NIL, it just wasn't above board. At some level, I appreciate the transparency. NU would be well served to stay on-brand and publish all the Goldman Sachs and other finance-based internships our players get, and how many of those are parlayed into FT jobs in that field (and maybe offer those as guarantees with a stipend for starters with a 3.0 GPA or higher?) But in general I do think NIL presents a host of new interesting issues:

1. How long before idiot boosters close their checkbooks when they realize they're not necessarily getting a good ROI? Like...we got the #1 recruiting class and signed 28 players...14 were ineligible and effectively DOA, and six of the other 14 didn't "pan out" but still cost us millions.
2. Does this lead to conditional NIL packages, like you get a signing bonus but everything else is performance-based? (after filtering this all through "legit" channels, of course)
3. Sounds to me like high school students might need agents to negotiate these deals with nefarious boosters...
4. Does anyone want to guess the date of the first lawsuit a kid files against a booster for broken NIL promises?

 

[Fanaticat98]

#3 is a great point. How can the NCAA allow this nonsense of (in some cases) 6 figure NIL deals while prohibiting kids to have an agent to navigate this? It is that rule out the window now too?

 

[NUCat320]

#3 is a great point. How can the NCAA allow this nonsense of (in some cases) 6 figure NIL deals while prohibiting kids to have an agent to navigate this? It is that rule out the window now too?

I’m pretty sure they have agents, or representation of some sort. You’ll see contact addresses in their social bios.

As for the ROI, I presume NIL ‘investment’ is similar in a way to direct marketing — you’ll close a certain number of leads sent, and it’s about finding the way to identify those right leads. Four- and five-star kids are likeliest to be high ROI. Even if your lead didn’t work out, fellow booster Jim Bob Auburn’s did. (In real life, it appears to be Aggie Bruce and Aggie Wayne.)

For what it’s worth, the initial reporting is based on “many people feel”, which is a construction in which, as we learned so well, “many people” is often a stand-in for “I”, and it’s usually an opinion, often demonstrably false or based on falsehoods.

 

[Koldfire]

The NCAA had the chance to do this right, but punted. The 4&5 star guys will get NIL deals. Unlike NU, the football factory schools will see this as another weapon in the arms race and will continue to throw crazy dollars in the game. Since we don't traditionally sign the high rated recruits, we must prepare for the cost of 3 star recruits.

 

[loyolacat]

Its a mess.......increases pressure across the board.....

 

[Sheffielder]

The NCAA had the chance to do this right, but punted. The 4&5 star guys will get NIL deals. Unlike NU, the football factory schools will see this as another weapon in the arms race and will continue to throw crazy dollars in the game. Since we don't traditionally sign the high rated recruits, we must prepare for the cost of 3 star recruits.

Couldn't agree more. The NCAA rested comfortably on the false narrative that they had absolute control...and they couldn't have been more wrong - perhaps catastrophically so. Any attempt to regulate at that this point would draw the attention of state legislatures, many of whom will be directly and deliberately invested in ensuring their State U's have every recruiting advantage possible over other states and schools. "Coach Saban, what do you think we should do here?"

Honestly, I don't see this as a death knell to programs like NU. For the most part, we were never competing for these kids in the first place (those who will go to the highest bidder, literally). We are still more likely to develop good talent from high-potential high schoolers - the bigger danger for us now is the portal and if top players see NU as a stepping stone to greater exposure at a football factory for their senior year. This, to me, is a very serious, looming danger.

 

[AdamOnFirst]

Couldn't agree more. The NCAA rested comfortably on the false narrative that they had absolute control...and they couldn't have been more wrong - perhaps catastrophically so. Any attempt to regulate at that this point would draw the attention of state legislatures, many of whom will be directly and deliberately invested in ensuring their State U's have every recruiting advantage possible over other states and schools. "Coach Saban, what do you think we should do here?"

Honestly, I don't see this as a death knell to programs like NU. For the most part, we were never competing for these kids in the first place (those who will go to the highest bidder, literally). We are still more likely to develop good talent from high-potential high schoolers - the bigger danger for us now is the portal and if top players see NU as a stepping stone to greater exposure at a football factory for their senior year. This, to me, is a very serious, looming danger.

Chaos is a ladder

 

[phatcat_rivals223240]

1. How long before idiot boosters close their checkbooks when they realize they're not necessarily getting a good ROI? Like...we got the #1 recruiting class and signed 28 players...14 were ineligible and effectively DOA, and six of the other 14 didn't "pan out" but still cost us millions.

I'll go with "never", or at least not in my lifetime. There is so much money available from so many fatcats (no relation) that want the notoriety of being associated with the (top) programs. There is "pent up demand" from not being able to openly do this. Used to be that had to, sort of, hide the $1000 handshakes or the free car leases, now they can shout them from the rooftops. Kid scores the winning TD "yep, he's driving my car!" or whatever.

I don't believe they care about ROI in this case. They want the notoriety.

 

[AdamOnFirst]

I'll go with "never", or at least not in my lifetime. There is so much money available from so many fatcats (no relation) that want the notoriety of being associated with the (top) programs. There is "pent up demand" from not being able to openly do this. Used to be that had to, sort of, hide the $1000 handshakes or the free car leases, now they can shout them from the rooftops. Kid scores the winning TD "yep, he's driving my car!" or whatever.

I don't believe they care about ROI in this case. They want the notoriety.

Boosters are already donating millions to the school for very very indirect results on the field, the ROI is WAY better now by just giving it to kids. Schools like Tennessee who have been pouring money down the drain with no success for two decades have to be frothing at the mouth for the chance to see real return.

 

[NUCat320]

Boosters are already donating millions to the school for very very indirect results on the field, the ROI is WAY better now by just giving it to kids. Schools like Tennessee who have been pouring money down the drain with no success for two decades have to be frothing at the mouth for the chance to see real return.

Right. The reason that NFL facilities pale in comparison to college facilities is because all the $$$ from people willing to give it had to go to indirect benefits.

 

[AdamOnFirst]

Right. The reason that NFL facilities pale in comparison to college facilities is because all the $$$ from people willing to give it had to go to indirect benefits.

The NFL has to actually pay their players, so when revenue goes up, half of it goes right there. In college, there’s been nothing else to spend it on but giving the coaches more and more and more money and building increasingly ridiculous practice facilities like our spot.

 

[Sheffielder]

I'll go with "never", or at least not in my lifetime. There is so much money available from so many fatcats (no relation) that want the notoriety of being associated with the (top) programs. There is "pent up demand" from not being able to openly do this. Used to be that had to, sort of, hide the $1000 handshakes or the free car leases, now they can shout them from the rooftops. Kid scores the winning TD "yep, he's driving my car!" or whatever.

I don't believe they care about ROI in this case. They want the notoriety.

It's an interesting question for sure...since recruiting class rank for some people is as important as on-the-field success, the swinging dicks among boosters could keep this going for a while.

But as per this year's Texas A&M case, I've seen estimates of $30M spent on this class. Is that sustainable, especially if over the next four years they don't experience a significantly higher level of success? I think programs and boosters will have no choice but to find ways of being more efficient/cost effective.

 

[NUCat320]

It's an interesting question for sure...since recruiting class rank for some people is as important as on-the-field success, the swinging dicks among boosters could keep this going for a while.

But as per this year's Texas A&M case, I've seen estimates of $30M spent on this class. Is that sustainable, especially if over the next four years they don't experience a significantly higher level of success? I think programs and boosters will have no choice but to find ways of being more efficient/cost effective.

Well, a $450 million Kyle Field expansion was announced in 2013, and completed in 2015…

Texas A&M Approves $450 Million Kyle Field Renovation Project

Texas A&M football is ready to bring its football stadium to the next level. According to the school's official athletics website , Kyle Field will go under massive renovations ...

syndication.bleacherreport.com

(For what it’s worth, as of 2017, the poverty rate in College Station was 32%, representing about 31k individuals.)

 

[hdhntr1]

I'm just posting this because this is the first flat out "going to school x because of more money" situation I have read about and that seems to be more or less confirmed.

And this is what I feared would happen.

https://deathvalleyvoice.com/2022/02/10/lsu-football-lost-state-recruit-alabama-nil-deal/amp/

This should surprise basically no one

 

[Zootcat]

I'll go with "never", or at least not in my lifetime. There is so much money available from so many fatcats (no relation) that want the notoriety of being associated with the (top) programs. There is "pent up demand" from not being able to openly do this. Used to be that had to, sort of, hide the $1000 handshakes or the free car leases, now they can shout them from the rooftops. Kid scores the winning TD "yep, he's driving my car!" or whatever.

I don't believe they care about ROI in this case. They want the notoriety.

I believe their interpretation of addressing ROI will be to fire the coach.

 

[FrancesSearleCat]

We are still more likely to develop good talent from high-potential high schoolers - the bigger danger for us now is the portal and if top players see NU as a stepping stone to greater exposure at a football factory for their senior year. This, to me, is a very serious, looming danger.

We're going to end up being Notre Dame's farm team aren't we?

It worked for Super Bowl champion, Ben Skowronek.

 

[Alaskawildkat]

We're going to end up being Notre Dame's farm team aren't we?

It worked for Super Bowl champion, Ben Skowronek.

Ouch.
Of course Ben almost cost his team losses in both of the last two games. It will be interesting to see if he stays with the team.

OK, I know it is way off topic, but if that attention seeking Bengals player had not run onto the field after Skowronek's batted to the Bengal's player interception, has anyone suggested that the following drive could likely have had a different outcome had Burrows not gotten backed up 10 yards from the penalty to start the drive that then fizzled?

 

[Sheffielder]

Ouch.
Of course Ben almost cost his team losses in both of the last two games. It will be interesting to see if he stays with the team.

OK, I know it is way off topic, but if that attention seeking Bengals player had not run onto the field after Skowronek's batted to the Bengal's player interception, has anyone suggested that the following drive could likely have had a different outcome had Burrows not gotten backed up 10 yards from the penalty to start the drive that then fizzled?

I have to be honest, it really made me cringe seeing NU releasing graphics on social media "claiming" Skowronek as ours all week. I bear absolutely no ill will towards the guy, but if he had been a starter are we under some deranged impression that he would have announced himself as being from "Northwestern and Notre Dame?" Just made me uncomfortable whenever I saw it...and then when he popped two boners in the game all I could think to myself was "that guy from Notre Dame keeps screwing up!"

 

[jimmyNU]

College football isn't college football any more. By the end of 2025 we have ten programs that get all of the 4-5 star recruits. The real schemers will sign with one school and then use the transfer portal to dip into the well a second time.

 

[Purple Pile Driver]

T

College football isn't college football any more. By the end of 2025 we have ten programs that get all of the 4-5 star recruits. The real schemers will sign with one school and then use the transfer portal to dip into the well a second time.

The number one recruit in the Nation last year signed with Jackson State.

 

[phatcat_rivals223240]

T

The number one recruit in the Nation last year signed with Jackson State.

maybe that's one of the 10 programs to which he referred /s

 

[CatManTrue]

T

The number one recruit in the Nation last year signed with Jackson State.

Didn’t he get $1M guaranteed from BR for a documentary to decommit from FSU to go there or something?

 

[Purple Pile Driver]

Didn’t he get $1M guaranteed from BR for a documentary to decommit from FSU to go there or something?

That is what has been thrown out there.

 

[jimmyNU]

T

The number one recruit in the Nation last year signed with Jackson State.

The consolidation hasn't happened yet. The rich alums are still figuring out how to make it work.

 

[NUCat320]

College football isn't college football any more. By the end of 2025 we have ten programs that get all of the 4-5 star recruits. The real schemers will sign with one school and then use the transfer portal to dip into the well a second time.

1. Aren’t all the players clustered at the same handful of schools today? Sure, Tennessee might nab someone delusional, but mostly it’s Ohio State, Georgia, Alabama, maybe Texas (ha!) or Oklahoma or Clemson.

2. You call them schemers. Others would call them “capitalists”, right? For 100 years, or at least 30, these have brought in professional-level profits for programs across the country, but have not been allowed to participate in that market themselves. Now they can. Do you honestly think that Nick Saban drove $7 million in value for Alabama, while Mac Jones drove none?


I really don’t think this will make things so much more different. It’s a handful of teams competing for the title every year, and the rest that are hoping to do well in their conference.

What is interesting to me is if any fabulously rich alums will try to buy their programs into elite company. Does someone in Silicon Valley really love Stanford sports? Does the UA guy want to make Maryland great? Is the same dude who paid Mel Tucker $100 million prepared to pay Arch Manning $3 million?

It’s a shame Caleb Williams chose USC in favor of the bright lights and brighter paycheck of Ypsilanti.

 

[StreamCat]

I will go to my grave stating that the players deserve compensation for risking life and limb for dear ole alma mater (shove your worthless "scholarship").

So your last words will be: “Shove your worthless scholarships!“?
I plan to go with something more pithy.

 

[Gladeskat]

How long until the players start receiving negative feedback from fellow students about their gravy-train deal with the NCAA while 'regular' students struggle to pay tuition. If I heard it at NU over $3-4K tuition, I can imagine the response from students over $100K or more of free school and stuff.

I anticipate that I'll be losing interest in college football in the coming years.

This world is going down the crapper. It's starting to slowly spin in the bowl now.

 

[hdhntr1]

Ouch.
Of course Ben almost cost his team losses in both of the last two games. It will be interesting to see if he stays with the team.

OK, I know it is way off topic, but if that attention seeking Bengals player had not run onto the field after Skowronek's batted to the Bengal's player interception, has anyone suggested that the following drive could likely have had a different outcome had Burrows not gotten backed up 10 yards from the penalty to start the drive that then fizzled?

That would be an unsportsmanlike penalty which is 15

 

[Sheffielder]

The Athletic today is reporting that Tennessee is planning an annual $25M recruiting war chest, with no sign of concerns about funding it in perpetuity.

 

[Purple Pile Driver]

How long until the players start receiving negative feedback from fellow students about their gravy-train deal with the NCAA while 'regular' students struggle to pay tuition. If I heard it at NU over $3-4K tuition, I can imagine the response from students over $100K or more of free school and stuff.

I anticipate that I'll be losing interest in college football in the coming years.

This world is going down the crapper. It's starting to slowly spin in the bowl now.

Who cares what the other students think? It’s not like the good ole football players are some highly respected BMOC now. They are not a cultural fit to start with.

How many CEO’s REALLY care that their salary is 100 times their average worker? Bottom line is it is a capitalist world. If someone wants to pay for your services they pay for it. If they don’t, they won’t. Do the players ask for compensation from Joe classmate when he or she becomes CEO of a large corporation? Make it while you can. This isn’t a Socialist state.

 

[Gladeskat]

Who cares what the other students think? It’s not like the good ole football players are some highly respected BMOC now. They are not a cultural fit to start with.

How many CEO’s REALLY care that their salary is 100 times their average worker? Bottom line is it is a capitalist world. If someone wants to pay for your services they pay for it. If they don’t, they won’t. Do the players ask for compensation from Joe classmate when he or she becomes CEO of a large corporation? Make it while you can. This isn’t a Socialist state.

I care.

This isn't an unbridled capitalist state, either.

Sad to see "Make what you can." as a life ethic.

 

[cattul]

How long until the players start receiving negative feedback from fellow students about their gravy-train deal with the NCAA while 'regular' students struggle to pay tuition. If I heard it at NU over $3-4K tuition, I can imagine the response from students over $100K or more of free school and stuff.

I anticipate that I'll be losing interest in college football in the coming years.

This world is going down the crapper. It's starting to slowly spin in the bowl now.

Wait a few years, until the payments get high enough. Then this farce will become epic.

I’m going to crack up the first time I hear someone tell the players, “Pay for your own d@mn stadium!”

 

[phatcat_rivals223240]

Wait a few years, until the payments get high enough. Then this farce will become epic.

I’m going to crack up the first time I hear someone tell the players, “Pay for your own d@mn stadium!”

Might take a while, considering the fans seem to be willing to overlook 8 figure/year head coaches and other such largesse.

 

[Zootcat]

1. Aren’t all the players clustered at the same handful of schools today? Sure, Tennessee might nab someone delusional, but mostly it’s Ohio State, Georgia, Alabama, maybe Texas (ha!) or Oklahoma or Clemson.

2. You call them schemers. Others would call them “capitalists”, right? For 100 years, or at least 30, these have brought in professional-level profits for programs across the country, but have not been allowed to participate in that market themselves. Now they can. Do you honestly think that Nick Saban drove $7 million in value for Alabama, while Mac Jones drove none?


I really don’t think this will make things so much more different. It’s a handful of teams competing for the title every year, and the rest that are hoping to do well in their conference.

What is interesting to me is if any fabulously rich alums will try to buy their programs into elite company. Does someone in Silicon Valley really love Stanford sports? Does the UA guy want to make Maryland great? Is the same dude who paid Mel Tucker $100 million prepared to pay Arch Manning $3 million?

It’s a shame Caleb Williams chose USC in favor of the bright lights and brighter paycheck of Ypsilanti.

Regarding your third paragraph, you may be right. I hope not, but you might be.

If so, that means there is no hope for “non-power” programs. And without hope, I am done with college athletics. Combine that with less and less attention on what should have been the mission, to provide an education, and I will have even less reason to be interested. If that happens, maybe we should adopt the nickname “Rocinantes” instead of Wildcats.

By the way, as a reminder, I’m in favor of some compensation for athletes.

 

[StreamCat]

Who cares what the other students think? It’s not like the good ole football players are some highly respected BMOC now. They are not a cultural fit to start with.

How many CEO’s REALLY care that their salary is 100 times their average worker? Bottom line is it is a capitalist world. If someone wants to pay for your services they pay for it. If they don’t, they won’t. Do the players ask for compensation from Joe classmate when he or she becomes CEO of a large corporation? Make it while you can. This isn’t a Socialist state.

Capitalist world?
College football?
I’m unaware of any other businesses that send out pleas for donations from former customers.

 

[StreamCat]

I care.

This isn't an unbridled capitalist state, either.

Sad to see "Make what you can." as a life ethic.

I care, too. Doesn’t anyone anymore ask themselves the question, “What is a good life?”

 

[NUCat320]

Capitalist world?
College football?
I’m unaware of any other businesses that send out pleas for donations from former customers.

I’m unaware of any non-profit collectives that have for-profit cable networks and streaming platforms devoted to activities unrelated to their stated missions.

 

[Purple Pile Driver]

I care, too. Doesn’t anyone anymore ask themselves the question, “What is a good life?”

Glades statement related negative feedback from the students. Whether you care, Glades cares, or I care is irrelevant to that statement.