Mark Stoop's "nadir moment"?

[Kampus Korner_rivals164031]

I have been a UK football fan since 1959. In my 66 years I've witnessed far too many embarrassing losses. Stoops' coaching in the Vanderbilt game yesterday was nothing short of malpracticing his profession. His painfully obvious coaching mistakes in a critical game against a team we should have beat has already been discussed in excruciating detail on the pages of this board. What made the Vandy debacle even worse, of course, is that the television analysts who called the game had to repeatedly point out each and every instance where the UK coaching staff made multiple bone headed decisions. Alas, sooner or later, it seems, every UK coach experiences his "nadir moment" as the Kentucky football coach. Yesterday was Mark Stoops' nadir moment. However, he is not the first UK coach to embarrass himself, the University and Big Blue Nation. Unfortunately, he probably won't be the last.

Granted, Stoops' inherited a program with few quality players Of course, every new football coach inherits a UK program with few quality players. However, the lack of team unity, too many or not enough players being on the field, disorganization, poor decision making during the game and the like are not due to a lack of quality players. Ugh! Stoops is the 11th UK coach since I became a UK fan. Blanton Collier coached the Cats' when I attended my first game. UK fired Collier in 1961. He is the last UK football coach to have won more games than he lost. Thus, it has been 54 years since any UK football coach achieved a winning record during their tenure.

While teams like TCU, Baylor, Oregon, West Virginia, Virginia Tech, Mississippi State, Northwestern and others have managed to pull themselves out of being totally irrelevant, UK has managed to maintain its status as every team's favorite school to schedule for homecoming.

I don't know what kind of insidious disease permeates the University of Kentucky's football program but it has been abundantly clear for more than half a century than changing coaches hasn't made one twit of a difference in UK just being able to achieve a winning record. I'm an optimistic person in every facet of my life except for my belief that before I depart this earth, UK football will ever regularly win more games than it loses.

 

[Mr Schwump]

I have been a UK football fan since 1959. In my 66 years I've witnessed far too many embarrassing losses. Stoops' coaching in the Vanderbilt game yesterday was nothing short of malpracticing his profession. His painfully obvious coaching mistakes in a critical game against a team we should have beat has already been discussed in excruciating detail on the pages of this board. What made the Vandy debacle even worse, of course, is that the television analysts who called the game had to repeatedly point out each and every instance where the UK coaching staff made multiple bone headed decisions. Alas, sooner or later, it seems, every UK coach experiences his "nadir moment" as the Kentucky football coach. Yesterday was Mark Stoops' nadir moment. However, he is not the first UK coach to embarrass himself, the University and Big Blue Nation. Unfortunately, he probably won't be the last.

Granted, Stoops' inherited a program with few quality players Of course, every new football coach inherits a UK program with few quality players. However, the lack of team unity, too many or not enough players being on the field, disorganization, poor decision making during the game and the like are not due to a lack of quality players. Ugh! Stoops is the 11th UK coach since I became a UK fan. Blanton Collier coached the Cats' when I attended my first game. UK fired Collier in 1961. He is the last UK football coach to have won more games than he lost. Thus, it has been 54 years since any UK football coach achieved a winning record during their tenure.

While teams like TCU, Baylor, Oregon, West Virginia, Virginia Tech, Mississippi State, Northwestern and others have managed to pull themselves out of being totally irrelevant, UK has managed to maintain its status as every team's favorite school to schedule for homecoming.

I don't know what kind of insidious disease permeates the University of Kentucky's football program but it has been abundantly clear for more than half a century than changing coaches hasn't made one twit of a difference in UK just being able to achieve a winning record. I'm an optimistic person in every facet of my life except for my belief that before I depart this earth, UK football will ever regularly win more games than it loses.

Brother I'm with you. I go back to the same era and I'm hoping against hope that before I go to the Great End Zone In The Sky UK has a good team. Unfortunately they're closer to Kansas, Wake Forest, Illinois types and no light on the horizon. Painful.

 

[docholiday51]

The three of us in this thread so far are from the same era and we all have the same hope(that we get to see one more good UK team before we are done) I will continue to watch and try to come up with reasons why we have a shot to pull out a win week after week.I have to say that it gets harder and harder to watch and enjoy any football because watching almost any other teams play is too much of a reminder of what we are not and apparently have little chance of being.

 

[jnewc2_rivals30628]

Don't forget North Carolina. They're looking really good right now. Fellas, it all comes down to your athletics director. He's the one who makes the hires and fires. If you're really interested in making a change then make your voices heard in getting a football-minded AD in there.

 

[Ajax10]

I have been a UK football fan since 1959. In my 66 years I've witnessed far too many embarrassing losses. Stoops' coaching in the Vanderbilt game yesterday was nothing short of malpracticing his profession. His painfully obvious coaching mistakes in a critical game against a team we should have beat has already been discussed in excruciating detail on the pages of this board. What made the Vandy debacle even worse, of course, is that the television analysts who called the game had to repeatedly point out each and every instance where the UK coaching staff made multiple bone headed decisions. Alas, sooner or later, it seems, every UK coach experiences his "nadir moment" as the Kentucky football coach. Yesterday was Mark Stoops' nadir moment. However, he is not the first UK coach to embarrass himself, the University and Big Blue Nation. Unfortunately, he probably won't be the last.

Granted, Stoops' inherited a program with few quality players Of course, every new football coach inherits a UK program with few quality players. However, the lack of team unity, too many or not enough players being on the field, disorganization, poor decision making during the game and the like are not due to a lack of quality players. Ugh! Stoops is the 11th UK coach since I became a UK fan. Blanton Collier coached the Cats' when I attended my first game. UK fired Collier in 1961. He is the last UK football coach to have won more games than he lost. Thus, it has been 54 years since any UK football coach achieved a winning record during their tenure.

While teams like TCU, Baylor, Oregon, West Virginia, Virginia Tech, Mississippi State, Northwestern and others have managed to pull themselves out of being totally irrelevant, UK has managed to maintain its status as every team's favorite school to schedule for homecoming.

I don't know what kind of insidious disease permeates the University of Kentucky's football program but it has been abundantly clear for more than half a century than changing coaches hasn't made one twit of a difference in UK just being able to achieve a winning record. I'm an optimistic person in every facet of my life except for my belief that before I depart this earth, UK football will ever regularly win more games than it loses.

Make that 4 from the same era. We have all seen the coaches come and go, all of them with their problems, BUT, Stoops has made the most astounding mistakes I have seen by ANY football coach EVER! That is what is concerning. We have competed is all but 3 games, with 3 games lost primarily due to unbelievably bad game management. Joker was not good at this either, but Stoops is beyond any head coach I have ever seen. The only way he will succeed, IMO, is to Hire a new OC (or someone to call plays), Hire a special teams coach (what a novel idea!!) AND hire someone who manages the game day decisions - it is clear he cannot.

 

[wildcatdon]

good post Kampus . count me in as number four from that era. Agree entirely.

 

[akaukswoosh]

Stoops' coaching in the Vanderbilt game yesterday was nothing short of malpracticing his profession.

Had to be hundreds of high school coaches watching the game thinking the same thing if not worse. Doubt many college coaches would have wasted their time watching.

 

[Hjack]

Don't forget North Carolina. They're looking really good right now. Fellas, it all comes down to your athletics director. He's the one who makes the hires and fires. If you're really interested in making a change then make your voices heard in getting a football-minded AD in there.

I'm right there with you guys for 65 plus years. I do fail to see how Barnhart can be the one exclusively blamed for the UK football mess, as we've had several ADs in my lifetime and it still is the same old continuing story of frustration.

 

[Mr Schwump]

I'm right there with you guys for 65 plus years. I do fail to see how Barnhart can be the one exclusively blamed for the UK football mess, as we've had several ADs in my lifetime and it still is the same old continuing story of frustration.

MB, for his faults, has done more for UK football than most other UK ADs in my lifetime. Maybe that's a pity. But I'll tell you this....upgrades to CWS and the program in general would NOT have been done under Hagan, Newton, Ivy et al.

 

[docholiday51]

Us oldtimers have been there,done that and seen that when it comes to UK football(and a bunch of other stuff that we probably shouldn't talk about) but some of the stuff we have seen from Stoops lately is new to me (at least) How about some of you other guys do you remember this level of seeming disorganization across the board?

 

[HalHR2500]

Us oldtimers have been there,done that and seen that when it comes to UK football(and a bunch of other stuff that we probably shouldn't talk about) but some of the stuff we have seen from Stoops lately is new to me (at least) How about some of you other guys do you remember this level of seeming disorganization across the board?

I absolutely believe it can be done at UK, but it will take a charismatic coach that can recruit with great assistants who can teach the game. UK has never had either......How bad does the university want to win. It takes an All In mentality. It has never existed, it doesn't mean enough to the right people...

 

[KyCatFan_rivals45723]

I wonder if location is the ultimate problem. We are kinda in the middle of no man's land. To our north is Big Ten Country. To the south is the SEC. You have the ACC to our east and the Big 12 to our west. We are probably most suited geographically to be in the Big 10 and lately we are recruiting a lot of players from a Big 10 state and trying to play them against southern schools. The players we do get from the south are mostly leftovers after the big SEC programs take their pick first. I just don't think the majority of the best southern players want to go so far north to play here.

It also doesn't help to have a poorly coached team. We have to get a coach who is a great teacher first and foremost. That is the only way to possibly get around the talent disparity we will always face. We have to have a coach who can get players to run through a wall if told to because they believe in him. So far Bear Bryant is probably the only coach that we have had who was like that. I doubt we will ever find another coach of that caliber to coach here again. Ultimately, that probably means most of our fans will likely go to the grave having never seen winning football at Kentucky.

 

[shutzhund]

I have been a UK football fan since 1959. In my 66 years I've witnessed far too many embarrassing losses. Stoops' coaching in the Vanderbilt game yesterday was nothing short of malpracticing his profession. His painfully obvious coaching mistakes in a critical game against a team we should have beat has already been discussed in excruciating detail on the pages of this board. What made the Vandy debacle even worse, of course, is that the television analysts who called the game had to repeatedly point out each and every instance where the UK coaching staff made multiple bone headed decisions. Alas, sooner or later, it seems, every UK coach experiences his "nadir moment" as the Kentucky football coach. Yesterday was Mark Stoops' nadir moment. However, he is not the first UK coach to embarrass himself, the University and Big Blue Nation. Unfortunately, he probably won't be the last.

Granted, Stoops' inherited a program with few quality players Of course, every new football coach inherits a UK program with few quality players. However, the lack of team unity, too many or not enough players being on the field, disorganization, poor decision making during the game and the like are not due to a lack of quality players. Ugh! Stoops is the 11th UK coach since I became a UK fan. Blanton Collier coached the Cats' when I attended my first game. UK fired Collier in 1961. He is the last UK football coach to have won more games than he lost. Thus, it has been 54 years since any UK football coach achieved a winning record during their tenure.

While teams like TCU, Baylor, Oregon, West Virginia, Virginia Tech, Mississippi State, Northwestern and others have managed to pull themselves out of being totally irrelevant, UK has managed to maintain its status as every team's favorite school to schedule for homecoming.

I don't know what kind of insidious disease permeates the University of Kentucky's football program but it has been abundantly clear for more than half a century than changing coaches hasn't made one twit of a difference in UK just being able to achieve a winning record. I'm an optimistic person in every facet of my life except for my belief that before I depart this earth, UK football will ever regularly win more games than it loses.

Your last paragraph sums up the UK problem and should divert blame away from Stoops and most of the other coaches through the years. We have nice boys on the team but they would be more at home playing for WKU. We have some who could play for Auburn, Georgia and Miss State sprinkled sparingly throughout the roster. Many fans have convinced themselves that is enough to play SEC or ACC football. Silly fans.

So what happens on an internet board? Stoops and many of those other coaches get blamed. Some even go so far as to say they could do better based on their very own high school career experience. An internet phenomena.

Lexington isn't the greatest city, UK isn't the greatest University, the weather isn't the greatest and Kentucky doesn't produce the greatest football players. Now you and I like it but sell it to a four or five star boy from anywhere else. That's what all those "bad coaches" have been trying to do for a whole lot longer than most of us have been fans.

Forget the fan phrases like "coaching up" and "Kentucky boys play harder". None of them would bet an Ellis Park claimer in the Derby but they expect coaches to win in the SEC without a roster of SEC talent. I take that back. A number of them would and blame the trainer or a UK basketball fan because they lost money. A coach needs a decent base to "coach up" from. Don't expect to start from the basement and end up in the penthouse.

The coaches win or lose very few games. The PLAYERS WIN OR LOSE MOST OF THEM.

 

[Maxwell41]

Well that was a nice rebuttal but most of it is total bull. Who determines what players are to be on the field? This team looks like a bunch of clowns at the circus. In fact the coaching should be in the circus. Stools has had 3 years other coaches has done better with less time and talent. CIndy,Houston,Memphis etc

 

[docholiday51]

Your last paragraph sums up the UK problem and should divert blame away from Stoops and most of the other coaches through the years. We have nice boys on the team but they would be more at home playing for WKU. We have some who could play for Auburn, Georgia and Miss State sprinkled sparingly throughout the roster. Many fans have convinced themselves that is enough to play SEC or ACC football. Silly fans.

So what happens on an internet board? Stoops and many of those other coaches get blamed. Some even go so far as to say they could do better based on their very own high school career experience. An internet phenomena.

Lexington isn't the greatest city, UK isn't the greatest University, the weather isn't the greatest and Kentucky doesn't produce the greatest football players. Now you and I like it but sell it to a four or five star boy from anywhere else. That's what all those "bad coaches" have been trying to do for a whole lot longer than most of us have been fans.

Forget the fan phrases like "coaching up" and "Kentucky boys play harder". None of them would bet an Ellis Park claimer in the Derby but they expect coaches to win in the SEC without a roster of SEC talent. I take that back. A number of them would and blame the trainer or a UK basketball fan because they lost money. A coach needs a decent base to "coach up" from. Don't expect to start from the basement and end up in the penthouse.

The coaches win or lose very few games. The PLAYERS WIN OR LOSE MOST OF THEM.

Yesterday was one of those few you mentioned and a very important one at that.

 

[Johnfarrel]

I've listened to/watched a lot of Kentucky football since 1949. There is no way Kentucky should have lost this game but they did. If yesterday was not the nadir, then God help us,

 

[Katwatcher]

[TE="docholiday51, post: 2728166, member: 362"]Us oldtimers have been there,done that and seen that when it comes to UK football(and a bunch of other stuff that we probably shouldn't talk about) but some of the stuff we have seen from Stoops lately is new to me (at least) How about some of you other guys do you remember this level of seeming disorganization across the board?[/QUOTE]
Doc, I agree this game was all about shooting ourselves in the foot. I've never witnessed a game that seemed this disorganized from every aspect of the game. It appeared we had not worked on any special plays to get ball in end zone from the 2 yard line in four tries. {happened twice]

Time management did not even exist. We wasted a time out to get punting team on the field instead of taking a delay of the game penalty.

We failed to call time out on field goal try when it was needed.
We managed to go entire game without OT moving before snap, but couldn't get him on field in time for field goal try. We never use any misdirection plays on kickoff returns

We had 6-7 coaches on sideline and probably 1 or 2 in press box, and no one spotted Vandy's sleeper play. That is a lot of coaches sleeping.

Two phrases of the day #1 "Not my Job"---#2 "we need to correct some things" was fitting.
jmho

 

[Calsarmy]

[TE="docholiday51, post: 2728166, member: 362"]Us oldtimers have been there,done that and seen that when it comes to UK football(and a bunch of other stuff that we probably shouldn't talk about) but some of the stuff we have seen from Stoops lately is new to me (at least) How about some of you other guys do you remember this level of seeming disorganization across the board?

Doc, I agree this game was all about shooting ourselves in the foot. I've never witnessed a game that seemed this disorganized from every aspect of the game. It appeared we had not worked on any special plays to get ball in end zone from the 2 yard line in four tries. {happened twice]

Time management did not even exist. We wasted a time out to get punting team on the field instead of taking a delay of the game penalty.

We failed to call time out on field goal try when it was needed.
We managed to go entire game without OT moving before snap, but couldn't get him on field in time for field goal try. We never use any misdirection plays on kickoff returns

We had 6-7 coaches on sideline and probably 1 or 2 in press box, and no one spotted Vandy's sleeper play. That is a lot of coaches sleeping.

Two phrases of the day #1 "Not my Job"---#2 "we need to correct some things" was fitting.
jmho[/QUOTE]
Ma