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Match Notes for Rutgers ...
- Thread starter Tom McAndrew
- Start date
Any chance we keep the winning streak alive?
Oliveri at 141 is their best chance of getting a win. A lot will depend on who we put out there.
141 - I know Olivier is ranked #5, but I would not consider him a top five type. More of just an indication of the fact that there is a huge drop off after the top four and Olivier hasn’t lost yet this season, thus ascending in the rankings. He’s as likely 15 as he is 5. Actually, more likely. There are a few guys ranked lower than him like Vombauer and Cornella that he’s not beating. He will be interesting test for Desmond if he goes as a fifth year guy who has been at 41 for the last four. Kind of guy Desmond would need to beat in R16 or R12, and he just may be too big for him.
184 - SCW is pretty stingy and will likely give Rocco a 1TD match. I would bet there will be teeth gnashing after Rocco’s 4-2 win.
133 - something is up with Shawver this year, he hasn’t looked good. I expect Marcus to trounce him. TF. Shawver has wrestled more like a borderline NQ than an AA this year. Mougalian and Seidel beat him up, he lost to Waterman, and has three OT wins over guys who probably won’t qualify. HEW. Marcus should put him out of his misery.
285 - Cole should handle Catka. I would like to see him win by multiple TDs but this year Cole hasn’t seemed to do much scoring late unless his opponent is overmatched.
184 - SCW is pretty stingy and will likely give Rocco a 1TD match. I would bet there will be teeth gnashing after Rocco’s 4-2 win.
133 - something is up with Shawver this year, he hasn’t looked good. I expect Marcus to trounce him. TF. Shawver has wrestled more like a borderline NQ than an AA this year. Mougalian and Seidel beat him up, he lost to Waterman, and has three OT wins over guys who probably won’t qualify. HEW. Marcus should put him out of his misery.
285 - Cole should handle Catka. I would like to see him win by multiple TDs but this year Cole hasn’t seemed to do much scoring late unless his opponent is overmatched.
From another thread…
Flipping over to the Rutgers side of things, fifth-ranked 141-pound Joseph Olivieriis not listed on the Scarlet Knights’ projected lineup sheet for Saturday. He’s missed multiple events since not competing against Oklahoma and Drexel in mid-December due to a violation of team rules, the Ashbury Park Press reported. If Olivieri is out again Saturday, which is likely, Rutgers will send either Tahir Parkins (5-6) -OR- Mason Gibson (8-3) to face whoever Penn State sends out at 141.
Flipping over to the Rutgers side of things, fifth-ranked 141-pound Joseph Olivieriis not listed on the Scarlet Knights’ projected lineup sheet for Saturday. He’s missed multiple events since not competing against Oklahoma and Drexel in mid-December due to a violation of team rules, the Ashbury Park Press reported. If Olivieri is out again Saturday, which is likely, Rutgers will send either Tahir Parkins (5-6) -OR- Mason Gibson (8-3) to face whoever Penn State sends out at 141.
He (Olivieriis) is not listed in the Rutgers' Match Notes, @ 141.
@pawrstlersinpa, how do you want to handle this in the KYPSW?
Parkins is a true freshman and not having a good year. He has used 4 of his 5 competition dates. Can't imagine they'd send him out for his 5th against Davis. Against Desmond, maybe, but still doubt it.
Gibson is feasting on sub-.500 guys. By far his best opponent this year is Cornell's grayshirting freshman Elijah Cortez, who beat him 6-1. Desmond probably beats him, Davis gets bonus.
Yeah, there's something off with Shawver. Losing to true freshman Seidel is one thing given Seidel's talent. A returning B10 champ getting teched by a true freshman 17-0 is pretty bad. But then the effort ... down 13-0 after the 1st, took neutral in the 2nd and got dinged for stalling, obviously didn't score.
IDK if Blaze techs him or cradles him up, but either way:
Just seeing this now. 1/3 of KYPSW have already submitted picks. At this point it is what it is, unfortunately.He (Olivieriis) is not listed in the Rutgers' Match Notes, @ 141.
@pawrstlersinpa, how do you want to handle this in the KYPSW?
Unfortunately, Rutger Tears smell like New Jersey.
Burning Tires, garbage, and pork roll.
Keep an eye on the F&M Open tomorrow. Anybody going there is unlikely for Rutger the next day. (The converse is less clear.)
It's probably fine since PSU's most likely starter is not one of the three guys listed in the PSU match notes, either, so that's one that's just going to get thrown out.
No PSU wrestlers as pre-seeds at F&M tomorrow.
If that is the case, I'll be surprised if Davis is not in the lineup against Rutgers.
Davis needs matches; it would make no sense to go zero for the weekend. The only caveat would be if Cael is keeping the seat warm for Nagao. That just seems unlikely at this point.
Here we are wringing our hands with anticipation and Davis is probably out on his scooter!
Ono ducking!
Tahir Parkins is listed in the preseeds at this tournament so it seems likely to be Mason Gibson.
Even if holding out hope for Nagao, Davis still needs to get matches. Even more important if Davis does not wrestle against Rutgers.
Davis going means his RS is burned. I don’t think we’re there yet.
The match number is not that big of a deal. He could stop get 15 with a tourney but I don’t think that will matter to the staff. He likely needs to win two matches at B1Gs to qualify. If he can’t do that he’s not scoring any points at nationals anyway.
I expect getting Desmond his five is more valuable than setting things in stone with Braeden.
A close look at the notes points to them being written before the Scuffle as no Scuffle results are included in wrestlers' records. I would be shocked if we don't see Davis. That being said, it is nice that they finally updated the career winning percentage rankings. Mitch went from nowhere to top of the heap.
Whoever does these notes is overpaid.
Whoever does these notes is overpaid.
Doing the math:
- Davis is 4-0
- 9 duals remain (including tonight)
- B10s has 4 championship rounds (the top 2 seeds get byes, so they get min 3 matches if they make the finals)
--> If Davis wrestles tonight, he will get 16-17 matches minimum. More likely 17 than 16 (because Mendez and Hardy are the most likely top 2 seeds).
He can still reach the 15-match RPI floor without wrestling tonight.
Don’t me wrong, we could easily see Davis on Saturday, but I do not think it would have anything to do with getting him a certain number of matches. They have not operated that way in the past.
If they have decided that Davis going this year and forgoing the RS is in his best interests, then he’ll go.
If they want Nate to get matches at 141 and wait and see a week or two, he won’t. Nate still has matches to burn and that keeps options open.
Caels interview suggested they were invested in Nate’s RS and that Braeden was an option but was not definitive in my mind. But they may have already made the call. I don’t know, you don’t know.
I just know it won’t be decided because Braeden needs a minimum of matches. It will be decided because the staff and the wrestlers involved agree on a plan moving forward. Seeding and allocation stuff takes a backseat to that.
If they have decided that Davis going this year and forgoing the RS is in his best interests, then he’ll go.
If they want Nate to get matches at 141 and wait and see a week or two, he won’t. Nate still has matches to burn and that keeps options open.
Caels interview suggested they were invested in Nate’s RS and that Braeden was an option but was not definitive in my mind. But they may have already made the call. I don’t know, you don’t know.
I just know it won’t be decided because Braeden needs a minimum of matches. It will be decided because the staff and the wrestlers involved agree on a plan moving forward. Seeding and allocation stuff takes a backseat to that.
I am surprised this is still being discussed, especially amongst our smartest posters.
I think Desmond fielding yet another match or more at 141 (137.5 that is) really doesn't do that much for his gaining valuable experience. Heck if getting his 5 in is that important, toss him in some opens and wrestle attached or not at 133 or maybe even 125.
Wrestling undersized now that we are in the Big10 schedule will force him to into a more cautious and defensive style against better guys that might even be counter developmental. Any experience is not necessarily good experience.
Desmond despite his shock the world result against Lilledahl, plus a couple of wins at 141 vs relatively poor competition simply illustrates the kid has maybe even more talent than his thick resume already illustrates, but IMO I feel very strongly he is NOT a serious candidate for 141 this year.
Couple this with, I don't really see the long term value in Davis' shirt anyway. Certainly it's more of a nice to have than a must have.
Desmond's highest value this season is absolutely being a competitive and solid injury insurance backup for Blaze and Luke. I think his talent has illustrated he would have a real chance entering Big10s at either 133 or 125 unseeded, navigating a difficult bracket and coming out the other end Top 4 and gaining a trip to Nationals for the team, with again a real shot at generating a few points then at Nationals.
If we toy around with him at 141 much longer descent rules could kill that insurance. Honestly, what if either Luke or Marcus got injured later this month or worse early in February? Sure we still win Nationals but would have no answer for the Big10 tourney if we were so dumb to have Desmond unavailable due to giving him a late weight cert date up at 137.5 or higher for those suggesting more weight gain. I think the last time someone did the math, just the descent from 137.5 to 133 was 4-5 weeks.
Cael knows every angle. I am proved wrong often enough, but I will be very surprised if we see Nate go out there at 141 again this year. The smart play is to keep him off of any official scales anywhere north of 133 and ready for 133 or below if needed.
I also believe this is the correct answer. It depends on the severity of Nagao's injury and whether he is out for the season or not. Getting a minimum number of matches is not a real consideration because Davis will have no issue taking an allocation spot if he's the man for this season, so if Nagao is done for sure, it'll be Davis. Otherwise, it will not. Unfortunately, I think it will be Davis. I don't have any inside information on Nagao, but I'm not optimistic at this point.
Descent is absolutely a valid consideration in the plan and the need for backup at 125/133 is not to be dismissed. It is certainly more relevant than reaching a minimum number of matches.
And it only took you 8 paragraphs to get there, well done!
But they were short paragraphs.
I like spacing.
good job.
I like spacing.
good job.
I know this is off topic....but stop calling me! I'm not gonna answer
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Cael specifically mentioned qualifying a spot for the B10 is a part of the equation this week.
So yes, it IS a consideration, albeit much less than what is best for the wrestlers.
So here is my hot take .... If it is Desmond the rest of the year, because Braeden wants to RS, I think that would potentially signal Braeden's desire to transfer next year. Ignore this take (probably)
