The Illini Board used to have a name for posters like you -- Merrymen, or something like that. Recruiting was in the tank under Weber, but a number of posters refused to believe that on-court results would suffer. Then your program fell apart, and poor Groce can't put it back together again.
Meanwhile, on the Illini Board ...
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The Illini Board used to have a name for posters like you -- Merrymen, or something like that. Recruiting was in the tank under Weber, but a number of posters refused to believe that on-court results would suffer. Then your program fell apart, and poor Groce can't put it back together again.
I'm no Merryman, friend. I want Groce gone NOW. However, Illinois basketball still has all the potential that it had before; a competent coach will win here, as past ones have. As for my NU comment, it was a little harsh, but most UI would be much, much better on all metrics a coach would use to judge a job (fan support, tradition, facilities, etc.) than NU, IMO. As a Chicagoan, I'll obviously give NU the clear edge on location, but coaches at this level are going somewhere to win basketball games, not get the best steak on the weekend. Not to mention, Champaign always ranks very highly on college town lists, like what on Earth are you expecting out of it?? LOL, of course it's not a world class city like Chicago, it has never tried to be ... it's a small college town, and a neat one. Not for everyone, but some people actively seek that environment from a college.
There's not too much here that I would disagree with. UI no doubt has some enormous advantages. But the athletic department squandered those assets with the last two hires, and I can imagine it happening again...
Wow, just take a deep breath. I am from Urbana, but went to NU and spent another 4 years in Evanston for work. I root for both teams but of course NU has had more to cheer for while the U of I has been a dumpster fire of late. No one said that the NU job is better than the U of I. However, we are thrilled that CC might take us to the promise land of the NCAA tourney for the first time EVER. Sure, we are going overboard and are dreaming that NU could be like Duke. Clearly a program like that takes decades to build. But let us have our fun. Illinois expects to go to the tourney every year. Let NU fans enjoy the ride and dream a little.
I don't know. I think traditionally, no question U of I has been the stronger program and the better job. But, Army used to be a national powerhouse in football in the same vein as Alabama is today.
I think for sure, if I had to pick one program's future over another today in the short and long term, I would bet on NU all the way.
North Carolina BBQ was developed as a joke and some how contaminating good beef or pork with vinegar has survived
I think history shows that after Bill Self left, Illinois has been a blatantly mediocre program that has struggled to find high-quality coaches. Top Illinois recruits are much more likely to go to Kentucky, Kansas or Duke than the state school. Frankly, once W-R is reconstructed, I don't see much that Illinois offers that NU doesn't. The only negative is NU's higher academic standards, but some coaches (I would include Collins and Fitz in this category) view that as a positive. It certainly limits the number of recruits who can be considered, but it gives NU academic distinction for those kids who care about such things. And when it comes to location, a lot of folks would find the North Shore much more amenable than the cornfields of C-U.
If I get you to join us at my barbecue place for the Duke game, I might change your mind. Found the place in 2008 when we were there, went back in 2015, about a dozen of us each time. Neat place, like an old converted farmhouse, sweet iced tea in Mason jars, three or four flavors of homemade cobbler . Made a believer of just about everyone like Turk, Glades and The Waterboy, although at first The Waterboy says there is something wrong with this barbecue, no dude, it's supposed to be that way, it's called North Carolina style, it has a vinegar base.I think he finally got used to it and liked it. Everyone did great except for GOUNUII who thought it was dreadful, don't think I can get him to go back, but if he shows up he might order a grilled cheese sandwich.
History shows they made it to the NCAA Final game in 2005 and lost to UNC with Weber as coach. After Self left.
This was with Bill Self recruits, once they left the program it wasn't very pretty
You act like the only time we've EVER won is with that one coach, dude. We have the highest all-time winning percentage of any program in the conference, it wasn't a flash in the pan. We also have a lot of built-in advantages, and a completely reconstructed Welsh-Ryan still falls far short of a completely reconstructed State Farm Center, IMO.
That's impressive. I'm more of a small picture guy right now...just hoping we finish out the season strong.
To piggyback off this, it can be interesting how perceptions can change from one season to another.
Usually around this time of year, I start breaking down the schedule in an attempt to find paths to the NIT (or occasionally the NCAAs). I begin to ponder how many wins and where those victories will need to come from in order for NU to make the postseason. This year, with the 'Cats safely in (for the time being), I'm just enjoying each game as they come.
It may turn out to be fleeting, but it's a wonderful new feeling.
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Although I agree if it is for the short-term to be a set up for Duke, Kansas, UCLA type of job then staying at NU for another couple of years is better than the Illinois job. that Illinois job is a rebuild it will take a few years, our roster here is better now. If it is long term than Illinois is better but Collins cannot be possibly looking at Illinois as a destination job, it a middle of the pack Big Ten job.that is where he is trying to get NU, makes no sense. Indiana, Michigan, Ohio State, MSU, and Maryland would be considered better jobs than Illinois by all accounts
When I wrote earlier that U of I was never a destination for Collins that was entirely based on my understanding of his lifestyle. For many coaches it is, for Collins it isn't, I believe.
I really hope the Illini hang onto to Groce, but unfortunately I think they've hired a quality AD and his days are numbered.
Both NU and U of I are stepping stone jobs. Neither fan base should kid itself. What's the big deal?
Collins WANTED the NU job. He went after it as his first HC position, so that there tells you he might think a little differently than others.
The bolded ones are HIGHLY debatable. Illinois has similar traditions to both and better recruiting grounds than Michigan. Illinois would also have a heavier focus on basketball than Michigan and equal facilities to both now. It's a pick 'em. Illinois has lost coaches to two places in the modern era: the NBA (where even the Blue Bloods lose coaches to) and Kansas (Bill Self's dream job). Let's not act like we regularly send our successful coaches to Arizona and Syracuse. Any non-Blue Blood is at risk of losing its coach to a Blue Blood, but I don't think someone who gets a good thing going at Illinois (which, again, shouldn't be hard ... Henson, Kruger, Self and Weber each won at least one Big Ten title), I don't think he would leave for anything but a Duke or North Carolina type job, and he might even stay if you paid him enough money. I doubt Thad Matta would have left OSU after the 2007 Final Four for a Blue Blood, for example, because they would have paid to hang onto him.
If Collins is happy and he turns NU into a consistent winner, I think it's perfectly plausible he could stay. Gotta make that Tournament first, though.
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Maryland is considered a plumb job. Washington DC/Baltimore area is a great recruiting area. National Championship in their trophy case as well. It is a fun debate but I think coaches if they have their choice of illinois, Maryland and Michigan Illinois finishes in third. .
Well Michigan can and has recruited Nationally. they have a National Championship in their trophy case and have been to the Final 4 more times than Illinois. Its close but I think Michigan is better.The bolded ones are HIGHLY debatable. Illinois has similar traditions to both and better recruiting grounds than Michigan. Illinois would also have a heavier focus on basketball than Michigan and equal facilities to both now. It's a pick 'em. Illinois has lost coaches to two places in the modern era: the NBA (where even the Blue Bloods lose coaches to) and Kansas (Bill Self's dream job). Let's not act like we regularly send our successful coaches to Arizona and Syracuse. Any non-Blue Blood is at risk of losing its coach to a Blue Blood, but I don't think someone who gets a good thing going at Illinois (which, again, shouldn't be hard ... Henson, Kruger, Self and Weber each won at least one Big Ten title), I don't think he would leave for anything but a Duke or North Carolina type job, and he might even stay if you paid him enough money. I doubt Thad Matta would have left OSU after the 2007 Final Four for a Blue Blood, for example, because they would have paid to hang onto him.
If Collins is happy and he turns NU into a consistent winner, I think it's perfectly plausible he could stay. Gotta make that Tournament first, though.
Maryland is considered a plumb job. Washington DC/Baltimore area is a great recruiting area. National Championship in their trophy case as well. It is a fun debate but I think coaches if they have their choice of illinois, Maryland and Michigan Illinois finishes in third. .
You sure you aren't a Merryman ... using Weber's accomplishments with Self's recruits to support your cause?
I took a look at the Illini wiki page. UI went through a serious dry spell from 56-57 to 80-81 (one NCAA appearance and way below .500 in the conference during that time) and has been down again for 10½ years and counting (again way below .500 in the conference).
Stated another way, over the last 60 years, UI has been a strong program for about 25 years and a weak one for about 35 years. So let's not pretend that UI will inevitably revert to the big time.
If they win consistently for more than 20 years as Duke has, I'm sure the support will be a lot greater than it has been.
There is no reason Illinois, featuring a huge arena in a top basketball conference that draws the highest attendance in the country, shouldn't be able to recruit nationally. You've got to get a guy in there who can do it.
I agree with this. With basically every game for every major conference team being accessible from anywhere on tv or online, there really is no reason for johnny to go to state u so all his friends and family can come watch every game. Illinois basketball is a relic, what Indiana is threatening to become. There are 4 or 5 blue bloods and then everyone else. I really don't see what Illinois has to offer over any other school in the big ten and unless groce (or the next guy) can convince johnny 4 star from Texas or Georgia etc., etc, to come, they will continue the path they are on. That being said, Groce's 2017 class is very good, the question is will he survive and the kids stay with Illinois
The UNC team which most of the players should have been ruled ineligible? All the fraudulent no show classes that the athletic dept. had them enrolled in! The NCAA still investigating and can still strip them of that title.
Purdue and Wisconsin are better jobs too. A kid in high school doesn't give a crap that Illinois was really good in the 80's and 90's before they were born. There's also a reason only 2 coaches have left, Weber was canned and groce is about to - programs aren't looking to poach Illinois coaches for a reason.