Media trying to break up BIG 12

[Buckaineer]

The media is working overtime to break up the conference. First they wrote a huge number of articles trying to shut down the BIG12 doing anything. Then they poo pooed the CCG. Then they attacked expansion.

Now that the conference is expanding, they are attacking the conference for exercising the deals that the conference agreed to WITH its media partners and suggesting FOX and ESPN are upset--all the while they pay HUGE revenues to the BIg Ten and give the ACC a network and more revenue.

Here's the latest:

Seeking clarity: The key questions in the Big 12 expansion movement

 

[steeleer]

The media is working overtime to break up the conference. First they wrote a huge number of articles trying to shut down the BIG12 doing anything. Then they poo pooed the CCG. Then they attacked expansion.

Now that the conference is expanding, they are attacking the conference for exercising the deals that the conference agreed to WITH its media partners and suggesting FOX and ESPN are upset--all the while they pay HUGE revenues to the BIg Ten and give the ACC a network and more revenue.

Here's the latest:

Seeking clarity: The key questions in the Big 12 expansion movement

Problems with this article....

1) It's not really well written (but welcome to the last 15 years of SI).
2) It assumes much on the side of ESPN/FOX without actually having any sources from either company.
3) It assumes much from the motivations of OK/UT without having any sources there either.

In short....it's a crappy opinion piece with very little real facts beyond the timing of the GORs and the LHN, which is common knowledge. If it was any poorer a product, I would have sworn Clay Travis wrote it.

 

[Buckaineer]

Several outlets are picking up the anti BIG 12 message board fodder that ESPN/FOX are unhappy--and as we see in the article Bowlsby has even responded to that claim--which the pundits are trying to spin as though the BIG 12 doesn't care because they are just making a short money grab.

Odd--the ACC isn't making a short term money grab by demanding a network in a time of cutting back, and the Big Ten isn't doing the same with their 6 year enormous deals at a time of supposed money issues for the networks? But the BIG 12 does what it must to ensure its financial and competitive success and its bad, goes against wishes of networks, etc.

Expansion will greatly enhance the BIG 12s footprint and those supporting the conference. It will infringe on territory that other conferences try to claim as theirs--and this is the real problem for the others and why they want to spin it as a problem. They also covet Texas and OU and want to dump everyone else in the dirt while paying the Dukes, Wake's, Pitt's, UL's, BC's SU's, Kentucky's, Vanderbilts, Indiana's, Purdue's, Illinois', Iowas', Minnesota's, Northwestern's, Marylands, Rutgers, Wazzou's, Oregon State's, etc. billions without question?

The BIG 12 has let themselves be smeared for a long time now. They need to nip this in the bud with a grant of rights extension along with expansion.

Absolutely--about the only thing the article had right--the conference needs to work extremely hard now to work with future alternative potential media partners.

 

[MikeRafone]

Give that man a cigar! They've been trying to do since the Big 12 got left out of the playoff two years ago. The Big 12 doesn't really need more teams, this driven by a bunch of nervous Nellies listening to a bunch no-nothings in the press who believe bigger is always better.

 

[Buckaineer]

Give that man a cigar! They've been trying to do since the Big 12 got left out of the playoff two years ago. The Big 12 doesn't really need more teams, this driven by a bunch of nervous Nellies listening to a bunch no-nothings in the press who believe bigger is always better.

The conference does need more teams and every other conference has more.

The problem isn't that the conference needs more teams, its that those on the outside don't want them to grow bigger or stronger because that means they can't poach the BIG 12.

The ACC poaching Texas from the BIG 12?? Absurd on its face.

 

[Pitt4Life34]

Several outlets are picking up the anti BIG 12 message board fodder that ESPN/FOX are unhappy--and as we see in the article Bowlsby has even responded to that claim--which the pundits are trying to spin as though the BIG 12 doesn't care because they are just making a short money grab.

Odd--the ACC isn't making a short term money grab by demanding a network in a time of cutting back, and the Big Ten isn't doing the same with their 6 year enormous deals at a time of supposed money issues for the networks? But the BIG 12 does what it must to ensure its financial and competitive success and its bad, goes against wishes of networks, etc.

Expansion will greatly enhance the BIG 12s footprint and those supporting the conference. It will infringe on territory that other conferences try to claim as theirs--and this is the real problem for the others and why they want to spin it as a problem. They also covet Texas and OU and want to dump everyone else in the dirt while paying the Dukes, Wake's, Pitt's, UL's, BC's SU's, Kentucky's, Vanderbilts, Indiana's, Purdue's, Illinois', Iowas', Minnesota's, Northwestern's, Marylands, Rutgers, Wazzou's, Oregon State's, etc. billions without question?


Tons of P envy from you. Would hilarious if not so sad. You need to hit up some other threads that actually have something to do with football. Oh sorry I forgot you know nothing about football and don't go to games because you don't really like football. I bet you sat in the front row on opening night od Concussion.

The BIG 12 has let themselves be smeared for a long time now. They need to nip this in the bud with a grant of rights extension along with expansion.

Absolutely--about the only thing the article had right--the conference needs to work extremely hard now to work with future alternative potential media partners.

 

[Pitt4Life34]

The conference does need more teams and every other conference has more.

The problem isn't that the conference needs more teams, its that those on the outside don't want them to grow bigger or stronger because that means they can't poach the BIG 12.

The ACC poaching Texas from the BIG 12?? Absurd on its face.

Wait where are the people saying Big12 was gonna poach the ACC? What camp were you in? The ACC does not need to expand moron! the Big12 needs to expand. BTW they should add South Florida and Central Florida first. And Cincinnati and UCONN if they go to 14. Any other footprint discussion would be only for the resident morons.

 

[Panthergrowl13]

Actually, I thought the article was fair and well written.

The author just hit the points that need to be answered but at this stage are unclear/unresolved.

The first thing to look at is will the Big 12 extend the GOR's when the expansion teams are announced.
If not, then teams such as Texas, Oklahoma and maybe Kansas (B1G?) are leaving their options open.
Even though the current contract and GOR's expire in 2024-2025 the rumor mill will intensify 2 to 3 years before the actual expiration date. Teams will actually announce that they will be leaving by then or before (give up one year of TV Revenue to leave in 2024). The only way to stop that would be an extension of the GOR's and will Texas and Oklahoma be amenable to that.

Have to wait and see how it plays out.

HAIL TO PITT!!!!

 

[skygusty_rivals]

Texas and Oklahoma are the only forces capable of breaking up the Big12. Reporters just react to blood in the water.

 

[Mountaineer Steve]

Wait where are the people saying Big12 was gonna poach the ACC? What camp were you in? The ACC does not need to expand moron! the Big12 needs to expand. BTW they should add South Florida and Central Florida first. And Cincinnati and UCONN if they go to 14. Any other footprint discussion would be only for the resident morons.

For the sake of football I would replace USF with BYU
For the travel and adding another bridge to WVU I MIGHT replace UNCON with Memphis

 

[michaelwalkerbr]

The governor of Texas declares there will be no expansion without Houston. UT president endorses UH for inclusion along with TTU president. UT hates UH, does not want to play them.

Outside of Texas members now have an ace in this backroom game of poker. Because of overwhelming political interference, UT is now demanding the inclusion of UH. "Into a temporary conference?" the other schools ask. Now Texas wants the B12 to be strong and profitable! (And big) Possible scenario:

"OK, Tex. You sign this little GOR extension and you can have UH along with the schools the rest of us choose. You keep your veto power." Deal?

Oh, but to be a fly on the wall!

 

[Mountaineer Steve]

The governor of Texas declares there will be no expansion without Houston. UT president endorses UH for inclusion along with TTU president. UT hates UH, does not want to play them.

Outside of Texas members now have an ace in this backroom game of poker. Because of overwhelming political interference, UT is now demanding the inclusion of UH. "Into a temporary conference?" the other schools ask. Now Texas wants the B12 to be strong and profitable! (And big) Possible scenario:

"OK, Tex. You sign this little GOR extension and you can have UH along with the schools the rest of us choose. You keep your veto power." Deal?

Oh, but to be a fly on the wall!

Michael, The media over exaggerated the support Texas President is giving UH. He and Texas are in political situation which forces them to appear they support UH.

This quote is his endorsement

As we look at opportunities for Big 12 expansion, I support considering @UHouston for the conference.

That statement does not say we want or demand UH, but would support considering them. Hell UT would support considering UC, UCONN, Memphis, BYU, and even Tulane. Does not mean they are going to vote for them.

Both TCU and Baylor are private school and don’t benefit by adding a 5th Texas program.

Iowa State president Steven Leath isn’t interested and told the Ames Tribune that Big 12 presidents "feel the league is Texas-heavy already" but that UH will "get a fair shake" when it comes to deciding whether to add two or four schools.

Remember you only need 3 votes to block a program. If ISU is saying no, then you only need 2 more of 9. Do you really think KSU, UK, OSU, OH want one as well?

The only way UH gets in, is if there is a quid pro quo for TexA$$. For example, approval of a TexA$$ satellite school in Houston. In that case I can see TexA$$, throwing their weight around to force the issue.

 

[43rd Parallel]

This notion of a monolithic media is sort of like believing in the tooth fairy, the Easter bunny, the bogeyman or Salem witches. It's amusing to hear grownups discuss it, presumably with knowing looks and solemn nods.

Skepticism is your friend, and critical thinking is a life skill.

 

[michaelwalkerbr]

Michael, The media over exaggerated the support Texas President is giving UH. He and Texas are in political situation which forces them to appear they support UH.

This quote is his endorsement

As we look at opportunities for Big 12 expansion, I support considering @UHouston for the conference.

That statement does not say we want or demand UH, but would support considering them. Hell UT would support considering UC, UCONN, Memphis, BYU, and even Tulane. Does not mean they are going to vote for them.

Both TCU and Baylor are private school and don’t benefit by adding a 5th Texas program.

Iowa State president Steven Leath isn’t interested and told the Ames Tribune that Big 12 presidents "feel the league is Texas-heavy already" but that UH will "get a fair shake" when it comes to deciding whether to add two or four schools.

Remember you only need 3 votes to block a program. If ISU is saying no, then you only need 2 more of 9. Do you really think KSU, UK, OSU, OH want one as well?

The only way UH gets in, is if there is a quid pro quo for TexA$$. For example, approval of a TexA$$ satellite school in Houston. In that case I can see TexA$$, throwing their weight around to force the issue.

You surprise me. Take this into consideration from this article: http://newsok.com/article/5510713

'In a message posted on social media, Abbott said: "Big 12 expansion is a non-starter unless it includes University of Houston." Lt. Gov. Dan Patrick, Abbott's fellow Texas Republican and a former Houston radio talk show host, also messaged: "I join with GregAbbott_TX - any BIG 12 expansion must include UHouston or NO DEAL!"'

I rest my case

 

[michaelwalkerbr]

As we look at opportunities for Big 12 expansion, I support considering @UHouston for the conference.

That came from the president of TTU.

 

[michaelwalkerbr]

This notion of a monolithic media is sort of like believing in the tooth fairy, the Easter bunny, the bogeyman or Salem witches. It's amusing to hear grownups discuss it, presumably with knowing looks and solemn nods.

Skepticism is your friend, and critical thinking is a life skill.

I agree that the idea of a conspiracy by any number of media groups is absurd. However, news is more and more slanted to reflect the viewpoint of the owners of a media outlet. ESPN is not elated with the actions of the Big 12 since ESPN announced the ACC Network.

If you turn down one network with a BS reason such as 'market conditions' and approve another you are going to pay both ways. A simple "A broadcast network for nine schools primarily in one market is not feasible" would have been much more honest.

 

[Mountaineer Steve]

That came from the president of TTU.

No it came directly from directly from a Greg Fenves tweet the president of the University of Texas



The comment about UH being a huge assest to UT really means Houston is a great maret for our school to expand in

 

[michaelwalkerbr]

Steve, clearly the governor and legislators are pushing UH enough to make it palatable for UT. It's nearly like WVU lobbying for Marshall to get into the AAC, but there it is.

Do I really need to provide more links to statements by people neither one of us give a damn about to make my point? I will if you ask for them. I owe you that.

TTU president Lawrence Schovanec:
“As the Big 12 evaluates its options for expansion, Texas Tech welcomes the consideration of the University of Houston,” the statement from Schovanec said. “We have always valued our partnerships with UH.”

Link

 

[michaelwalkerbr]

Without Houston, UT loses veto power with the addition of even one school. With Houston they can maintain it even with the addition of four schools. That is the bottom line for them.

A friend I used to write with and still copy edit for asked me out of frustration, "Why doesn't Texas simply form their own conference?" My answer was that they already have. It's called the Big 12.

 

[43rd Parallel]

I agree that the idea of a conspiracy by any number of media groups is absurd. However, news is more and more slanted to reflect the viewpoint of the owners of a media outlet. ESPN is not elated with the actions of the Big 12 since ESPN announced the ACC Network.

If you turn down one network with a BS reason such as 'market conditions' and approve another you are going to pay both ways. A simple "A broadcast network for nine schools primarily in one market is not feasible" would have been much more honest.

Fair enough. Anyone who knows anything about the media knows how much they love to hate each other, and how they're driven by competition -- the scoop, the exclusive. You can't even corral them with professional standards since that's unconstitutional.

 

[Mountaineer Steve]

Without Houston, UT loses veto power with the addition of even one school. With Houston they can maintain it even with the addition of four schools. That is the bottom line for them.

A friend I used to write with and still copy edit for asked me out of frustration, "Why doesn't Texas simply form their own conference?" My answer was that they already have. It's called the Big 12.

Veto power? What are you saying just adding 1 team they lose it?

 

[michaelwalkerbr]

No, Steve. Major decisions take a super majority of 80%, right? If three Texas schools vote against it there is no 80%. If two schools outside of the governor's influence are added three no votes would still cover it, right? (I'm correcting my math from previous post)

But if four schools are added, UT needs one of them to be under the governor's thumb to maintain over 20% for a veto. Right now there is UT, TTU and TCU. You have to question TCU, but without the governor they would not be in. 80% of 14 is 11 as a whole number. If you add UH, Texas basically can control up to four votes, three without TCU.

Math is not my forte' since my head injury in 2014. Straighten me out here. It was my impression Texas needed another school receiving substantial state money to stop any super majority with even 12 schools. Now I think it would take 11 or more outside their influence for a super majority at 14 members. I admit when I'm wrong and I believe I may be. Be nice.

 

[michaelwalkerbr]

Out of 1,666 posts I've written, that was the toughest. TBI sucks no matter how recovered you are. There are a handful of readers who would like to pile on, have at it. There may be a fifteen yard penalty for unsportsmanlike conduct.

 

[Mountaineer Steve]

No, Steve. Major decisions take a super majority of 80%, right? If three Texas schools vote against it there is no 80%. If two schools outside of the governor's influence are added three no votes would still cover it, right? (I'm correcting my math from previous post)

But if four schools are added, UT needs one of them to be under the governor's thumb to maintain over 20% for a veto. Right now there is UT, TTU and TCU. You have to question TCU, but without the governor they would not be in. 80% of 14 is 11 as a whole number. If you add UH, Texas basically can control up to four votes, three without TCU.

Math is not my forte' since my head injury in 2014. Straighten me out here. It was my impression Texas needed another school receiving substantial state money to stop any super majority with even 12 schools. Now I think it would take 11 or more outside their influence for a super majority at 14 members. I admit when I'm wrong and I believe I may be. Be nice.

Michael, it was your math that was throwing me way off. Your right, If BIG12 expands to 12, UT still has veto power, that is assuming they can and do control other 4 Texas program. For that matter and mathematically 80% of 16 is 12.8. Rounding up means 13 votes are needed to pass so 4 votes is enough to veto. The question is will BIG12 make super majority 13 or 12

 

[Pitt4Life34]

For the sake of football I would replace USF with BYU
For the travel and adding another bridge to WVU I MIGHT replace UNCON with Memphis

Memphis is a total joke as a program, academic institution and footprint. Period! I get the brand name BYU brings but to me a serious footprint play would have Oklahoma and Texas playing in Florida, Ohio and the North East.

 

[steeleer]

Actually, I thought the article was fair and well written.

The author just hit the points that need to be answered but at this stage are unclear/unresolved.

The first thing to look at is will the Big 12 extend the GOR's when the expansion teams are announced.
If not, then teams such as Texas, Oklahoma and maybe Kansas (B1G?) are leaving their options open.
Even though the current contract and GOR's expire in 2024-2025 the rumor mill will intensify 2 to 3 years before the actual expiration date. Teams will actually announce that they will be leaving by then or before (give up one year of TV Revenue to leave in 2024). The only way to stop that would be an extension of the GOR's and will Texas and Oklahoma be amenable to that.

Have to wait and see how it plays out.

HAIL TO PITT!!!!

Well.... I assume you went to Pitt. I'm sure that kind of tripe would pass as good journalism there.

 

[Buckaineer]

The media isn't reporting the news about the BIG 12 they are trying to write it.

Drumming up message board fantasies of UT and OU leaving is irresponsible--the leaders of those schools are not saying that they are saying they are committed to strengthening the BIG 12--yet the media keeps talking about them going to other conferences.

Its because they WANT that to happen, not because UT and OU are tyring to make that happen. The media has been trying to interfere with BIG 12 moves ever since Boren came out and said the conference should expand, create a CCG and start a network.

Doesn't fit their 4 -16 agenda.

 

[VaultHunter]

Memphis is a total joke as a program, academic institution and footprint. Period! I get the brand name BYU brings but to me a serious footprint play would have Oklahoma and Texas playing in Florida, Ohio and the North East.

Since joining the ACC from Big East Pitt 21wins. Since joing the BIG East/AAC from Conference USA Memphis 22 wins.

 

[Pitt4Life34]

Since joining the ACC from Big East Pitt 21wins. Since joing the BIG East/AAC from Conference USA Memphis 22 wins.

I'll repeat as often as needed for the resident morons. You can put as much lipstick on Memphis as you like son. That is still one ugly date! Hey BTW how many games did your future prom date win in the Big East? I can't remember but did Menphis win the Big East in 2010? And who beat them up at the Big East tourney in 2012? Was it WVU or Gtown? Thanks in advance!!!

 

[BackpageNews]

I have no problem with Houston. I think that they would be a great fit.