NCAA Bracket Release Show Results/Thoughts
- Thread starter gimb14
- Start date
Completely agree. But the National duals give our competitors a punchers chance at a first place trophy. They all know once the real season starts, the thrashings commence and they’ll be fighting for second place.9 out of 10 number one seeds didn't wrestle in the National Duals. It's crowned champion went on to get absolutely destroyed by PSU in season. Cael was right yet again. The National Duals were meaningless and not needed to prepare his team...
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I was talking about rankings in general.
In this case, the most important one, the one that actually impacted a seed and moved 2 guys paths completely, it just used Feels. No data.
Data was Jax beating Larkin the way he did. Do I agree with it no but it's what Azevedo Ramos Snyder decided
The data didn't include a guy winning a bracket with a defending champ, a two time defending runner up, and the #1 ranked guy at the weight (and avenging his only loss).
Jax also teched that 2 time runner up. Jax was undefeated as well. Not saying I agree just stating facts
I've said that if they would have jumped Jax up after Ayala, I would have understood but jumping him after Conferences reeks of playing games for clicks/views
But that data (teching Ayala) was already part of last week's data set that they still had Blaze 1 Davino 2. Just stating facts as well.
Agree but after what he did to Larkin it showed Ayala wasn't a fluke. Jax beat 4 ,5 and 6. Davino best win outside blaze and Ayala was #11 Ferrera. Not saying I agree but that's probably how they got there
All and well, but not data driven.
No data driven outcome would have had Davino ahead of Jax last week, beats #1, and slips down at all. All Feels.
That's fine and well, too. Just not data driven. Feels driven.
Blaze is now the 3 so Davino beat 3,6 and 11. Jax beat 4,5 and 6 . I don't agree but many would. So to say it was driven might be far fetched. So you think they did it so Blaze has Davino on his side? Willie said he would've ranked Jax #1 and seeded him #1 I don't agree either but many think it was right
I think Jax deserved the #1 seed. Like you said, he beat 4, 5, and 6. He's also undefeated. You have said that you don't agree, so how would you have seeded it? If you've already answered this, sorry for missing it.
The conversation I'm more interested in having is what everyone thinks about all of the rematches we seem to get every year by using this seeding matrix? In this case, like I said, I have no problem with Jax getting the #1, it just stinks to have him on the same side as Seidel, while Davino and Blaze are on the other side. The brackets seems to be riddled with these types of scenarios every year.
Blaze is only 3 because... Davino beat him, who was #2 and beat #1. If the data doesn't spit out to reflect as much, with Davino going to #1, then it's not reflective of anything of value.
I think (and Pyles confirmed this- why I think it) that the coach rankers believe Jax is gonna win it all so they voted him #1.
The data there now was there last week. Either the data being used was wrong then or the data being used is wrong now. But it's really neither, because it never was about data. It's just Feels like I said a month ago.
I wouldve gone Davino #1 . 13 matches and #1 is telling guys wrestle less. Davino beat the guy who was #1 and he was #2 .
I say it's not just feels but we won't agree. So you want humans removed altogether we saw what happened with big 10 seeds without humans
No, what I want is consistency that makes sense at all.
I don't care the Jax is #1 to the coaches. My point at the beginning (and in our now-forever discussion) was that these are more Feels than data at the end of the day. I don't care for Jax or Davino. But one beat the #1 and got jumped having won the best conference tournament. There's no data in anything close when it matters.
Difficult rankings/seedings will come up again, we will get fed that XYZ are "data-driven", and it's all full of ****.
Personally, I like the algorithm system with a few tweaks. We can arrive at much more realistic seeds with very minor changes (let's be honest, if Levi doesn't come out behind Minto, how much issue do we really take with it?) I do believe, unlike Willie, that Willie's (and Corby's and throw in anyone who watches a lot of wrestling and is smart/unbiased) decision-making process can be replicated with AI, and I think we can leverage that so it is repeatable. Make a committee: Pyles/Corby/Willie/Earl Smith/Etc, throw them in a room with a reputable data science team, parse out what we want out of the seedings/rankings, and you get 99% of the way there.
My issue was not that it was used at Big Tens, rather, that it was used at Big Tens and not at nationals. This leads to weird situations where, for example, a wrestler could get the 8th seed at conferences then the 7th at nationals without even making the finals of the conference. I understand why this happened, one used a dataset comprised of one set of parameters while the other didn't.
I don't mind humans doing ALL of it, but again, we should be consistent: Committee at conferences and at nationals.
The problem with jax being the one is davino beat the guy ahead of him to win a conference championship. Jax beat somebody ranked below him and jumped davino in the rankings. When has that ever happened before
We agree. Wrestling minds should be doing this but the NCAA will never allow it. Not sure if I should be on it but Pyles, Willie and Earl would be a good crew I would add in Britt Malinsky aka Seton Hall Pirate on X. Those 4 would be able to nail it no doubt
Thought of Davis's seed. He's likely better off losing 1st round than advancing and losing to Hardy.
If Davis loses the opening round his path to AA is likely Lemus ---Tagg/Henson-Wells/simcox---Bailey/consiglio/basile
If Davis wins opening round and loses to Hardy his path is likely : Titus---cornella/composto/Manville---vombauer/olivieri to all American
Or if he pulled the upset over hardy that'd be best... obviously.
The top side of the consie bracket is going to be much tougher to navigate than the bottom. That seems evident.
If Davis loses the opening round his path to AA is likely Lemus ---Tagg/Henson-Wells/simcox---Bailey/consiglio/basile
If Davis wins opening round and loses to Hardy his path is likely : Titus---cornella/composto/Manville---vombauer/olivieri to all American
Or if he pulled the upset over hardy that'd be best... obviously.
The top side of the consie bracket is going to be much tougher to navigate than the bottom. That seems evident.
We could save a hundred posts by stating:
- There are arguments for seeding both Davino and Forrest #1 - this is unequivocally true
- Seeding a guy with only 13 matches #1 is suspect - especially given the history on this
- #2 above would give a logical person some thoughts that seeding Forrest #1 may have included some considerations that were not result driven.
Why are we trying to save posts thought we talked about wrestling here. Going back and forth saying the same stuff is definitely redundant. Maybe someone new will add something
You bored today man? The only thing I've been inundated with more today than your posts on here are these freaking mortgage refinance cold calls for my VA loan...No chance you could offer me a VA IRRRL???
I can't sorry. Not bored just sitting by the pool on the boards gonna be 90 here today it's about lunch time now gotta decide what to cook
3&4 are right ... 1&2 is a coin flip, can be argued (and is) both ways. Jax hasn't lost, Davino beat previous #1 ... it is what it is and this bracket will produce the best 133 I have no doubt about it
Agree it's ridiculous. We are gonna be 101-104 next week during NCAAs. Have a feeling we are gonna have 115-120 this summer a bunch
Next week, it is supposed to get up to 96 degrees where I live outside of San Diego. The San Diego region is beautiful, but I do prefer a more seasonal climate.
Good God where do you live? Generally speaking...I haven't experienced heat like that since I spent some time in Quatar at "the deed"
It's the best city I think. Beautiful and great weather compared to AZ
I was in Carlsbad for work last summer and my wife, who's from Oceanside, was bragging up the weather. It was pretty damn awesome. If I could magically make a bunch of people leave California and housing more affordable, I would move there in a heartbeat
Ahh. I spent time down at Davis-Monthan near tucson back in the day. Hot as hell but substantially better heat than Barksdale AFB in Louisiana.ha humidity is the killer
Yes thank god it's dry humidity is 9% so that saves us. I can't do humidity anymore. Some people here go to FL in the summer and do winters in AZ. My opinion Florida summers with humidity are worse then AZ summers
Coastal florida ain't bad. At least East coast. Never been to the Gulf Coast of Florida. Granted, orlando last year for work was brutal ha