Not tough enough…
- Thread starter MacNit
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He also had a winning record against Woody Hayes (4-2), Bobby Bowden (6-1), LaVell Edwards (2-1), and Lou Holtz (6-5).
Maybe Joe didn’t win all or even most of his big games. But at least he won some of them.
It’s completely called for. It’s everything that is called for. It matters so much more than wins or losses on a football field. If, years from now, we find out that Franklin was a serial killer (or any of his top lieutenants were same), I’m not going to look back fondly at those wins and losses, and hope the next coaching option can repeat that performance.
To compare Joe to Franklin is nonsensical. Paternity had multiple undefeated teams. 2 national titles. From 78 to 86 he played for 4 national titles winning 2 and losing 2 to Bama and Oklahoma. The 94 team was as good and fun to watch as any. Even in his later years when it was evident he wasn't his best he had 2 1 loss seasons in 05 and 08 Beat OSU in 05 at home and 08 on the road. The 2011 team actually beat osu on the road after the Sandusky mess. I dont think his later teams were the most talented yet he found ways to beat better higher ranked opponents. There's one issue with Franklin. His teams dont pull upsets and his offense against the best teams the last 7-8 years has been awful. He hasn't shown he's capable of changing that narrative. Everything else is fine. But Virginia has a better win than Franklin and PSU have in the last 8-9 years.
You’ll have to have this conversation with MacNit. He’s the one that brought the comparison, along with the thread titled, “What would Joe Do?” .
Nobody is arguing routinely. He did win 2 titles. Had 5 undefeated teams. Had an incredible bowl record. Won with less at times. Watch the 87 fiesta bowl. All things Franklin hasn't done. Nobody expects Franklin to have an 80% winning percentage against top 5 or top 10 teams. But you have to win a few of them over a 10 year period. That's all people are saying
I don't understand your point. Are you blaming Joe for Jerry. If you're you're obviously an ignorant *** but maybe your not doing that.
Move on.
I agree...Joe won some and that's all I ask for. 30% would be acceptable.
Using 6-1 against Bowden includes him beating him 6 times while he was at WVU. There's a huge difference between that Bowden and the FSU version which was 1-0 against him.
the problem is that those coaches also lose to teams they shouldn't lose to, which Franklin doesn't
JoPa beat Bowden in the Orange Bowl in 2005 (not sure about the year). Michael Robinson was the QB and the game was won in OT on a FG. Not sure what JoPa's record vs Bowden at FSU was but there was at least one win.
Then he's 7-1 against Bowden cause he Bowden was 0-6 against him while at WVU
Also we know my opinion of my bowl wins
I appreciate you pre-insulting before you have a clue what's being said. That's special. It's rare to get that kind of courtesy out of someone nowadays - now I don't have to wait with baited breath for your self-professed confused/ignorant attack. So, thanks.
No fault was attributed to anyone. The salient point is, everyone's fawning over the JoePa days of yore ... wishing we could go back there ... comparing his reign's success to the the current regime's success. Personally, I'd rather come up short of Nattys if the choice I have is win a Natty with a top lieutenant being a serial molesting pedo, or not win Nattys. So, there's only so much love I can give to the results during that time period. I don't long for those days. It's no one's fault but Sandusky's own that he was a serial molester. So if it's not enough to point out that we need to let go of the "but we used to be super awesome" stuff was nearly 50 years ago, so it's not that relevant ... it should be enough to point out that our super awesomeness was achieved with a vaunted defense that was helmed by a demon. Let's move on. There was no football Xanadu.
This took me by surprise to suggest Gruden, but I gotta say, I like it. I have been thinking about it all day. I picture Gruden in blue and white with a visor on snarling across the field at Day, Lanning, Riley, etc and I think it would bring a certain level of attitude that has been missing for awhile. I realize it’s a pipe dream and won’t happen but kudos to you for the suggestion.
Agree here. That’s the risk. You get a coach that may beat OSU, Michigan, or Oregon every now and then, but drops a game to Illinois, Nebraska, or Sparty every now and then too. That’s not ideal either.