OT tests to predict future success.....

[s1uggo72]

I once heard, the best predicter of mathematical success was not your math score on the SAT, but rather the verbal score. Perhaps because it measures you ability to read?, IDK

well with the NFL combine closing and many measurables what measurables are there that predict future success in the NFL?

With many teams needing OT in the NFL , including perhaps the Eagles, I heard Bill Pollen ( a former GM FWIW) say, they studied OT , and for the guys with the right dimensions, the biggest predictor of success seems to be.... their 40 time. I know they never run 40 yds, but they have studied the ones who have succeed and those that failed, and if you run below 5.2 that is indication of success in the NFL at OT. If you are above 5.2 you might have to move inside to OG.
I saw in a mock draft today, the Eagles taking the Big Guy from Alabama, so IDK. His listed 40 time is 5.2, he has weighed over 400# in the past. I think I'll look elsewhere.
But I found this 40 time thing interesting.

 

[psuro]

I saw in a mock draft today, the Eagles taking the Big Guy from Alabama, so IDK. His listed 40 time is 5.2, he has weighed over 400# in the past. I think I'll look elsewhere.
But I found this 40 time thing interesting.

Maybe he wanted to be first in line at the Old Country Buffet.

 

[Bison13]

I once heard, the best predicter of mathematical success was not your math score on the SAT, but rather the verbal score. Perhaps because it measures you ability to read?, IDK

well with the NFL combine closing and many measurables what measurables are there that predict future success in the NFL?

With many teams needing OT in the NFL , including perhaps the Eagles, I heard Bill Pollen ( a former GM FWIW) say, they studied OT , and for the guys with the right dimensions, the biggest predictor of success seems to be.... their 40 time. I know they never run 40 yds, but they have studied the ones who have succeed and those that failed, and if you run below 5.2 that is indication of success in the NFL at OT. If you are above 5.2 you might have to move inside to OG.
I saw in a mock draft today, the Eagles taking the Big Guy from Alabama, so IDK. His listed 40 time is 5.2, he has weighed over 400# in the past. I think I'll look elsewhere.
But I found this 40 time thing interesting.

In school, the best predictor for any success is being on grade level or higher in reading by 3rd grade. Doesnt matter what you use it for math, science, english, etc., just being on grade level vs not in 3rd grade has huge effects.

I dont know how that relates to football 40 times but thought I'd throw it in

 

[s1uggo72]

In school, the best predictor for any success is being on grade level or higher in reading by 3rd grade. Doesnt matter what you use it for math, science, english, etc., just being on grade level vs not in 3rd grade has huge effects.

I dont know how that relates to football 40 times but thought I'd throw it in

thanks that is good information to have. Do you have the number nationally for the number of 3rd graders that are on grade level for reading? TIA

 

[12bflying]

thanks that is good information to have. Do you have the number nationally for the number of 3rd graders that are on grade level for reading? TIA

(AI generated) Recent data indicates a concerning trend in reading proficiency among third graders in the United States:

Year	Percentage of Third Graders Proficient in Reading
2021	48.2%
2022	45.9%
2025	54% (not proficient)

 

[Bison13]

thanks that is good information to have. Do you have the number nationally for the number of 3rd graders that are on grade level for reading? TIA

That percentage varies based on who did the tallying and which test was used. Some of the tests use different scales and thus cut offs are slightly different. Some are as low as only 34% others are up to 50%. Though made fun of in the other thread, Mississippi has made some of the best gains in recent years and is now top ten overall in reading. They are one of the few states that actually are holding kids back if they do not get to basic levels of skill by the end of 3rd grade. The upper grade scores have not quite caught up yet, but it will be interesting to see in a couple years.

 

[Steve JG]

I once heard, the best predicter of mathematical success was not your math score on the SAT, but rather the verbal score. Perhaps because it measures you ability to read?, IDK

well with the NFL combine closing and many measurables what measurables are there that predict future success in the NFL?

With many teams needing OT in the NFL , including perhaps the Eagles, I heard Bill Pollen ( a former GM FWIW) say, they studied OT , and for the guys with the right dimensions, the biggest predictor of success seems to be.... their 40 time. I know they never run 40 yds, but they have studied the ones who have succeed and those that failed, and if you run below 5.2 that is indication of success in the NFL at OT. If you are above 5.2 you might have to move inside to OG.
I saw in a mock draft today, the Eagles taking the Big Guy from Alabama, so IDK. His listed 40 time is 5.2, he has weighed over 400# in the past. I think I'll look elsewhere.
But I found this 40 time thing interesting.

colleague of mine did a fairly comprehensive analysis of success of PhD and MD/ PhD students at very high end places (MIT, Stanford, etc) and by far and away the only predictor was score on verbal reasoning portion GRE or MCAT. Bison mentions reading at or above grade level in 3 grade as a more general predictor.

 

[Midnighter]

I once heard, the best predicter of mathematical success was not your math score on the SAT, but rather the verbal score. Perhaps because it measures you ability to read?, IDK

well with the NFL combine closing and many measurables what measurables are there that predict future success in the NFL?

With many teams needing OT in the NFL , including perhaps the Eagles, I heard Bill Pollen ( a former GM FWIW) say, they studied OT , and for the guys with the right dimensions, the biggest predictor of success seems to be.... their 40 time. I know they never run 40 yds, but they have studied the ones who have succeed and those that failed, and if you run below 5.2 that is indication of success in the NFL at OT. If you are above 5.2 you might have to move inside to OG.
I saw in a mock draft today, the Eagles taking the Big Guy from Alabama, so IDK. His listed 40 time is 5.2, he has weighed over 400# in the past. I think I'll look elsewhere.
But I found this 40 time thing interesting.

Funny thing about the 40 time; it was invented as a measurement of how well someone could cover a punt. Some coach back in the day estimated most punts went about 40 yards so they wanted to time how long it would take to get from the kickoff line to the ball carrier. It stuck around and is what it is today and really, in no manner, should be used to evaluate offensive linemen.

 

[rigi19040]

Clinton commissioned a study on success. Our poor pretty much do the exact opposite of most successful people.

 

[rigi19040]

colleague of mine did a fairly comprehensive analysis of success of PhD and MD/ PhD students at very high end places (MIT, Stanford, etc) and by far and away the only predictor was score on verbal reasoning portion GRE or MCAT. Bison mentions reading at or above grade level in 3 grade as a more general predictor.

Sounds racially biased.

 

[BobPSU92]

Success is overrated.

 

[s1uggo72]

Funny thing about the 40 time; it was invented as a measurement of how well someone could cover a punt. Some coach back in the day estimated most punts went about 40 yards so they wanted to time how long it would take to get from the kickoff line to the ball carrier. It stuck around and is what it is today and really, in no manner, should be used to evaluate offensive linemen.

evidently the data does not back up your claim, it seems there is a positive correlation between 40- times and success at OT. I will go with Pollen on this

 

[rigi19040]

evidently the data does not back up your claim, it seems there is a positive correlation between 40- times and success at OT. I will go with Pollen on this

Ethan Black and Kaden Saunders to OT?

 

[Big_O]

I once heard, the best predicter of mathematical success was not your math score on the SAT, but rather the verbal score. Perhaps because it measures you ability to read?, IDK

That is a ridiculous take on mathematical success with regard to the SAT from whatever source that proposed it. I had a slightly below average verbal but did really did well on math. I did well in math as well at Penn State, which was in
the engineering and science major level series in calculus (Math 61, 62 and 71 at the time).

l will say I was a voracious reader in grade school through high school, but I doubt it had any impact on my math abilities. Probably what helped me in math, was that in high school was one of my friends spurred me on to learn the material because if I got a 100 on a test, he would get a 110. Our teacher had to reward him somehow since he would prove all his answers on his tests.

He started working on his doctorate work in physics at MIT when I started junior year at Penn State. He wrote the software that runs the Harvard endowment investments. Most brilliant person I have ever met in my life, and inspired me to try and kick butt in math.

 

[Midnighter]

evidently the data does not back up your claim, it seems there is a positive correlation between 40- times and success at OT. I will go with Pollen on this

Meh - Terrell Suggs 4.84 40. Tom Brady 5.28.

 

[rigi19040]

I once heard, the best predicter of mathematical success was not your math score on the SAT, but rather the verbal score. Perhaps because it measures you ability to read?, IDK

well with the NFL combine closing and many measurables what measurables are there that predict future success in the NFL?

With many teams needing OT in the NFL , including perhaps the Eagles, I heard Bill Pollen ( a former GM FWIW) say, they studied OT , and for the guys with the right dimensions, the biggest predictor of success seems to be.... their 40 time. I know they never run 40 yds, but they have studied the ones who have succeed and those that failed, and if you run below 5.2 that is indication of success in the NFL at OT. If you are above 5.2 you might have to move inside to OG.
I saw in a mock draft today, the Eagles taking the Big Guy from Alabama, so IDK. His listed 40 time is 5.2, he has weighed over 400# in the past. I think I'll look elsewhere.
But I found this 40 time thing interesting.

HUH? You ignored the fact that Polian first looked at all the other measurables.

 

[Bison13]

Purely a guess but reasonably educated one, I think the reason the 40 yard dash has significance for offensive lineman is because it typically relates to stride length and flexibility. The greater hip flexibility that a lineman has the further they can get out from their stance and thus create better protection angle from pass rush.

Regarding the SAT verbal being a good description of SAT math performance, it could happen just because those kids can read and comprehend the questions better. But that also might be one of those things where if you swap the x and y axes, you could say that the math abilities are a good predictor of verbal abilities.

 

[PSUForever]

For QB, I would think exceptional leadership abilities/skills is one key factor besides the obvious physical traits.

 

[BobPSU92]

Regarding the SAT verbal being a good description of SAT math performance, it could happen just because those kids can read and comprehend. The questions asked better. But that also might be one of those things where if you swap the x and y axes, you could say that the math abilities are a good predictor of verbal abilities.

Word problems suck balls.

 

[Nitt1300]

 

[Woodpecker]

Word problems suck balls.

 

[s1uggo72]

Meh - Terrell Suggs 4.84 40. Tom Brady 5.28.

Neither of them played OT though

 

[s1uggo72]

HUH? You ignored the fact that Polian first looked at all the other measurables.

No I didn’t, i mentioned you have to have the right dimensions

 

[Chumboshifko1]

Success is overrated.

Success is studying zombies at SEC universities.

 

[rigi19040]

No I didn’t, i mentioned you have to have the right dimensions

But you attributed the succes to the 40 and not the size, strength, height, length or blocking ability.

If the biggest predictor of OT success was the 40 then Polian would not look at all the other variables FIRST. His actions basically imply the other measurables are more important. A good 40 is a bonus to him.

 

[s1uggo72]

But you attributed the succes to the 40 and not the size, strength, height, length or blocking ability.

If the biggest predictor of OT success was the 40 then Polian would not look at all the other variables FIRST. His actions basically imply the other measurables are more important. A good 40 is a bonus to him.

Duh you are picking fly shiat out pepper. Once you have all the other measurables how do you pick the 6’6 300# + guy with incredible strength from another They all look the same on the hoof so what is the test that best predicts their success?
You can poo poo the 40 all you want but that’s what the analysis shows.

 

[LionJim]

That is a ridiculous take on mathematical success with regard to the SAT from whatever source that proposed it. I had a slightly below average verbal but did really did well on math. I did well in math as well at Penn State, which was in
the engineering and science major level series in calculus (Math 61, 62 and 71 at the time).

l will say I was a voracious reader in grade school through high school, but I doubt it had any impact on my math abilities. Probably what helped me in math, was that in high school was one of my friends spurred me on to learn the material because if I got a 100 on a test, he would get a 110. Our teacher had to reward him somehow since he would prove all his answers on his tests.

He started working on his doctorate work in physics at MIT when I started junior year at Penn State. He wrote the software that runs the Harvard endowment investments. Most brilliant person I have ever met in my life, and inspired me to try and kick butt in math.

I love this post. My biggest regret is that I didn’t embrace my inner math nerd when I was a kid.

 

[ApexLion]

I love this post. My biggest regret is that I didn’t embrace my inner math nerd when I was a kid.

We like your maths on here @LionJim so you have that going for ya.

 

[LionJim]

We like your maths on here @LionJim so you have that going for ya.

It’s a privilege.

 

[manatree]

@LionJim As I always say, I like mathematicians, accountants, engineers, etc. The more numbers they crunch, the less I have to.

This was an interesting thread to read. Not that I agree, or understand all of it. I will contribute a personal antidote. When my parents could no longer afford to send us to private school, I started public in the fourth grade. I remember meeting with folks from the school district for various testing over two days during the summer. The only details that I remember of the testing was the two rounds of ink blot tests. It was frustrating for me because I didn't just want to tell them what I say, I wanted to tell them a story about what the blots were doing. The two adults kept interrupting me so they could show the next card.

Once school started, I struggled mightily in math. The class spent the first week or two reviewing multiplication before moving on to division. I had never seen multiplication before and was failing every daily review quiz. What made it frustrating was that I had the highest math grade in class the year before in my old school. My parents made up a set of flash cards and worked with me every day until I was allowed to proceed on to division with the rest of the class and eventually ended up with an A in math for all four quarters. After that, math was still my hardest class, but I always managed to get As until I hit calculus in twelfth grade. Then it was all I could do to get a C+.

I took the SATs twice in 1988 and my best scores were 660 English and 600 Math.

First semester of college, I took Math 110 because my advisor didn't know what he was talking about. I had KT Hahn. At the end of the semester I received a B-. Halfway through the next semester, I received a letter from the registrar informing me that they had made a mistake with their arithmetic and I was now receiving a C. In hindsight, I wish I had kept that letter. Definitely a frameable piece of my academic career.

But, wait, there's more!

I sold football programs for the first three years of college. During my second season selling, I run into Mrs Kopf, my fourth grade teacher at a tailgate. I remembered her and she remembered me even in her slightly tipsy state. She sits me down, makes me a plate and starts telling her friends stories about me. There were several, however the most relevant one was the results of my initial evaluations. While my reading level was at the eleventh grade level my math level was at the second grade level. The district shrinks had declared me to be partially mentally retarded and my acceptance into the regular fourth grade class was a temporary trial.

That night after the game, I go back to my dorm, dug out my long distance card and called home as I had a few questions for my parents. Why in the heck did they never tell me that the school district thought I was mentally deficient? Basically mom & dad had told the district that they were full of crap, and they knew if my brother had found out, he would have been busting my balls about it. Of course, once he did find out about it, the ball busting began.

 

[ApexLion]

@LionJim As I always say, I like mathematicians, accountants, engineers, etc. The more numbers they crunch, the less I have to.

This was an interesting thread to read. Not that I agree, or understand all of it. I will contribute a personal antidote. When my parents could no longer afford to send us to private school, I started public in the fourth grade. I remember meeting with folks from the school district for various testing over two days during the summer. The only details that I remember of the testing was the two rounds of ink blot tests. It was frustrating for me because I didn't just want to tell them what I say, I wanted to tell them a story about what the blots were doing. The two adults kept interrupting me so they could show the next card.

Once school started, I struggled mightily in math. The class spent the first week or two reviewing multiplication before moving on to division. I had never seen multiplication before and was failing every daily review quiz. What made it frustrating was that I had the highest math grade in class the year before in my old school. My parents made up a set of flash cards and worked with me every day until I was allowed to proceed on to division with the rest of the class and eventually ended up with an A in math for all four quarters. After that, math was still my hardest class, but I always managed to get As until I hit calculus in twelfth grade. Then it was all I could do to get a C+.

I took the SATs twice in 1988 and my best scores were 660 English and 600 Math.

First semester of college, I took Math 110 because my advisor didn't know what he was talking about. I had KT Hahn. At the end of the semester I received a B-. Halfway through the next semester, I received a letter from the registrar informing me that they had made a mistake with their arithmetic and I was now receiving a C. In hindsight, I wish I had kept that letter. Definitely a frameable piece of my academic career.

But, wait, there's more!

I sold football programs for the first three years of college. During my second season selling, I run into Mrs Kopf, my fourth grade teacher at a tailgate. I remembered her and she remembered me even in her slightly tipsy state. She sits me down, makes me a plate and starts telling her friends stories about me. There were several, however the most relevant one was the results of my initial evaluations. While my reading level was at the eleventh grade level my math level was at the second grade level. The district shrinks had declared me to be partially mentally retarded and my acceptance into the regular fourth grade class was a temporary trial.

That night after the game, I go back to my dorm, dug out my long distance card and called home as I had a few questions for my parents. Why in the heck did they never tell me that the school district thought I was mentally deficient? Basically mom & dad had told the district that they were full of crap, and they knew if my brother had found out, he would have been busting my balls about it. Of course, once he did find out about it, the ball busting began.

Fwiw @manatree Mrs. ApexLion was put in special ed classes in second grade. Her parents flipped out, pulled her from public school and put her in DC private school. She graduated as the valedictorian, obtained a perfect SAT, and obtained a perfect LSAT. Never paid a dime for her bachelors (UVA) and law degree (UNC). So special ed and public school assessments don’t mean much in my household.

 

[G3624]

Or special ed was really special, who knew!

 

[rigi19040]

It’s a privilege.

Two Parents That Give a Chit Privilege is a key to success.

 

[manatree]

Fwiw @manatree Mrs. ApexLion was put in special ed classes in second grade. Her parents flipped out, pulled her from public school and put her in DC private school. She graduated as the valedictorian, obtained a perfect SAT, and obtained a perfect LSAT. Never paid a dime for her bachelors (UVA) and law degree (UNC). So special ed and public school assessments don’t mean much in my household.

The short answer for my situation was that while the private school I attended K-3 was behind on their math track, having to read and memorize passages from the King James Bible contributed to my high reading level.