Perspective

[DudznSudz]

Last year, Notre Dame went 4-8.

Last year, Michigan State went 3-9.

This year, Notre Dame is 5-1. And they look dramatically better than last year.

This year, Michigan State is 4-1. They're not and never have been a great offensive team, but that mean D is back.


I know we all are suffering through a bad season, but I think firing Riley at the end of this year is extremely stupid. I think he gets 1 more year to either succeed or hang himself. 4 years, even 5 really, should be normal for a coaching tenure.

Don't be fooled by this "Look at how far we've fallen" crap. We haven't been a national championship caliber team in 15+ years, but we can be a "good," even "great" team again either with Riley and these assistant coaches, or with a new regime put in place after a fair amount of time has passed. Emphasis on fair.

Just my two cents.

 

[DudznSudz]

Oh and I would add that I don't think Cavanaugh should be our O-line coach after this year unless the O-line becomes amazing by the end of the season.

 

[Toms Wife]

Oh and I would add that I don't think Cavanaugh should be our O-line coach after this year unless the O-line becomes amazing by the end of the season.

Why is it only "fair" to give the head coach four or five years but also fair to fire the Reads, Bankers, Cavs, Hughes, after 1, 2, or 3 years?

 

[CDMXHusker]

Last year, Notre Dame went 4-8.

Last year, Michigan State went 3-9.

This year, Notre Dame is 5-1. And they look dramatically better than last year.

This year, Michigan State is 4-1. They're not and never have been a great offensive team, but that mean D is back.


I know we all are suffering through a bad season, but I think firing Riley at the end of this year is extremely stupid. I think he gets 1 more year to either succeed or hang himself. 4 years, even 5 really, should be normal for a coaching tenure.

Don't be fooled by this "Look at how far we've fallen" crap. We haven't been a national championship caliber team in 15+ years, but we can be a "good," even "great" team again either with Riley and these assistant coaches, or with a new regime put in place after a fair amount of time has passed. Emphasis on fair.

Just my two cents.

Just my two cents.....keeping Riley after this year would be extremely stupid. What, do you need more data points that Coach .500 is what he is?

 

[DudznSudz]

Why is it only "fair" to give the head coach four or five years but also fair to fire the Reads, Bankers, Cavs, Hughes, after 1, 2, or 3 years?

Cav's been here three. I think position coaches are just more expendable. They either are making an impact or they aren't. But, I could be wrong. Fair point.

 

[DudznSudz]

Just my two cents.....keeping Riley after this year would be extremely stupid. What, do you need more data points that Coach .500 is what he is?

Im taking about the overall success of the program and what it would DO to the program to fire a guy who is recruiting well before 4-5 years is up. I don't really care about his prior record at Oregon State as much as some might, I just want the recruiting to go well and to have a great season next year. If he sucks again next year, I think it's time to make a change. That very well might happen. I just think its extremely bad for the program to fire a guy after only three years. That is just another reason why the program would become radioactive to coaches.

 

[jlb321_rivals110621]

Last year, Notre Dame went 4-8.

Last year, Michigan State went 3-9.

This year, Notre Dame is 5-1. And they look dramatically better than last year.

This year, Michigan State is 4-1. They're not and never have been a great offensive team, but that mean D is back.

.

Good Grief

Brian Kelly played for a national championship in 2012 and was 10-3 in 2015 and played in a BCS bowl prior to the 2016 season.

Dantonio's seat was a little warm after a losing season in 2009. He promptly won 11 games in 2010 and 2011. He then won 13-11-11 with 2 conf titles and a college football playoff birth in the 3 years prior to going 3-9.

You can survive a losing season if you have built up some equity by actually accomplishing something on the field. Riley has zero equity in the bank either here or at OSU to weather another losing season should it occur.

 

[Huskercigar]

Im taking about the overall success of the program and what it would DO to the program to fire a guy who is recruiting well before 4-5 years is up. I don't really care about his prior record at Oregon State as much as some might, I just want the recruiting to go well and to have a great season next year. If he sucks again next year, I think it's time to make a change. That very well might happen. I just think its extremely bad for the program to fire a guy after only three years. That is just another reason why the program would become radioactive to coaches.

I know I'm beginning sound like a repeating commercial on this issue but signing recruits is not going that well. Our recruiting process is going great. Why with a process like this are we not getting exceptionally rated players/teams. Too many posters have the kool-aid glasses on about Mike Riley's recruiting. Its Andy Vaughns coordination that is making the recruiting program look great. Lets keep him. With a young dynamic coach and the recruiting program we have now really think recruiting could move to top 15

As another point. If Riley ends up here another year it will most likely be one of the worst rated classes we have had in 10 years. Even the better recruits we have now will bail knowing he is a lame duck.

 

[LZZOSO]

Good Grief

Brian Kelly played for a national championship in 2012 and was 10-3 in 2015 and played in a BCS bowl prior to the 2016 season.

Dantonio's seat was a little warm after a losing season in 2009. He promptly won 11 games in 2010 and 2011. He then won 13-11-11 with 2 conf titles and a college football playoff birth in the 3 years prior to going 3-9.

You can survive a losing season if you have built up some equity by actually accomplishing something on the field. Riley has zero equity in the bank either here or at OSU to weather another losing season should it occur.

Go look at Dantonio's seasons before his run.. I'll wait. If he were at Nebraska, we would have probably fired him. That is the point. It takes more than just 2.5 years. He's had essentially 2 recruiting class under his belt, as the first was a transition class. This roster was MAC level when he took over. In some ways, I wish we would just play all of the youngsters and take more lumps, so we are ready to go.

 

[LZZOSO]

I know I'm beginning sound like a repeating commercial on this issue but signing recruits is not going that well. Our recruiting process is going great. Why with a process like this are we not getting exceptionally rated players/teams. Too many posters have the kool-aid glasses on about Mike Riley's recruiting. Its Andy Vaughns coordination that is making the recruiting program look great. Lets keep him. With a young dynamic coach and the recruiting program we have now really think recruiting could move to top 15

As another point. If Riley ends up here another year it will most likely be one of the worst rated classes we have had in 10 years. Even the better recruits we have now will bail knowing he is a lame duck.

Oh it's Andy Vaughn? Not the relationships of these coaches and what they have with the kids? LOOOOOOOLLLLLLL. Come on. We get it. You don't like Riley, but this is just comical.

 

[Harry Caray]

Im taking about the overall success of the program and what it would DO to the program to fire a guy who is recruiting well before 4-5 years is up. I don't really care about his prior record at Oregon State as much as some might, I just want the recruiting to go well and to have a great season next year. If he sucks again next year, I think it's time to make a change. That very well might happen. I just think its extremely bad for the program to fire a guy after only three years. That is just another reason why the program would become radioactive to coaches.

By that logic, we should have given Bill Callahan a big extension in 2007. He we on the verge of signing his second Top 5 recruiting class.

You people act like no other coach would be able to recruit here. Pelini was the laziest recruiter ever and didn't fill recruiting classes, yet still pulled in some Top 20 classes. Riley hasn't pulled in higher than a 20th ranked class yet, and is sitting at 44th right now. You don't think a guy like Frost, with the exciting style he plays and the connections he has in Florida, wouldn't be able to recruit as good or better than a 65-year-old .500 coach?

And if we keep Riley another year, I'd also be surprised if our best recruiting assistants don't try to leave the sinking ship and pursue other jobs. They have to see next year's schedule and know that it's only a matter of time.

 

[Huskerfan2112]

IF Frost were not an ex Husker or a hot property, would people still be as anxious to fire Riley? I think a lot of people are more inclined to see Riley fired in hopes of getting Frost. Not saying I want Riley around next year but I dont think Frost is the next coach at NU.

 

[TarheelHuskerFan_rivals]

Just some more perspective:

Nebraska went 9-4 every year before Riley.
We are back peddling.
I don't like Bo, I'm glad he's gone but Riley isn't the answer.

To take over a 9 win team is not a rebuilding project. He was supposed to turn key and get us over the hill

 

[inWV]

I preface this with saying that Riley may not be the answer and the preponderance of evidence suggests that he is (at least at present) not a championship level HC.
But:
* he took over a roster with gaping holes in it.
* a team whose veteran players were very much allied with the prior HC
* at team who had only one quality QB who was not a fit for his offensive system.
Riley has worked to address roster holes. He let go coaches he brought when it became clear they weren't going to work going forward. The youth on the team looks good.
Does Riley deserve a chance to complete development of a team with his players?

 

[Mack In Motion]

Don't be fooled by this "Look at how far we've fallen" crap.

Who is being fooled?

We got teabagged by NIU this year. In our house. And very nearly lost to Arkansas State, that game went down to the wire.

We have played 6 games. 4 were against bad teams. 1 was against a mediocre unranked team. 1 was to a good top 10 team.

We are 3-3 going through that gauntlet and got woodshedded by the one good team we played so far.

Fooled? Where is the progress? This was a nine win program coming in the door. Which is the complete opposite of a rebuild.

 

[Buicklife]

I'm not totally sold on firing Riley but I just don't have faith in him.

If we give him next year then fine....but have you seen that schedule?

 

[jlb321_rivals110621]

Go look at Dantonio's seasons before his run.. I'll wait. If he were at Nebraska, we would have probably fired him. That is the point. It takes more than just 2.5 years. He's had essentially 2 recruiting class under his belt, as the first was a transition class. This roster was MAC level when he took over. In some ways, I wish we would just play all of the youngsters and take more lumps, so we are ready to go.

Dantonio won 11 games in his 4th year (2010) ... in the three prior years (his first three as head coach) he won a combined 22 games and went to three consecutive bowl games - something that hadn't been accomplished at Michigan State dating back 20 years (1988-1990). Nick Saban did not accomplish this at MSU. There was clear, irrefutable progress demonstrated by Dantonio from day one.

any other questions? .... I'll wait

 

[LZZOSO]

Dantonio Stat:

7-6 in 2007
9-4 in 2008
6-7 in 2009
11-2 in 2010 when he broke through. Our current fan logic would have have had him fired probably in year 3, but yet Riley needs to be gone in year 2.5? Isn't that right? I see nothing wrong with my stats. He would have been terminated this year if at Nebraska, yet we want to dog on Riley, and not give him a chance next year. So you can wait all you want. My stats are dead on. Valiant effort.

Dantonio won 11 games in his 4th year (2010) ... in the three prior years (his first three as head coach) he won a combined 22 games and went to three consecutive bowl games - something that hadn't been accomplished at Michigan State dating back 20 years (1988-1990). Nick Saban did not accomplish this at MSU. There was clear, irrefutable progress demonstrated by Dantonio from day one.

any other questions? .... I'll wait

 

[Harry Caray]

IF Frost were not an ex Husker or a hot property, would people still be as anxious to fire Riley? I think a lot of people are more inclined to see Riley fired in hopes of getting Frost. Not saying I want Riley around next year but I dont think Frost is the next coach at NU.

I'm not ready at anoint Frost as the savior but I'll say this: If Riley goes 6-6 this year, the new AD keeps him, and Frost goes to somewhere like Tennessee.....and Riley proceeds to have a losing season next year (very possible with that schedule)......that new AD is going to feel the heat pretty quickly.

 

[jlb321_rivals110621]

Dantonio Stat:

7-6 in 2007
9-4 in 2008
6-7 in 2009
11-2 in 2010 when he broke through. Our current fan logic would have have had him fired probably in year 3, but yet Riley needs to be gone in year 2.5? Isn't that right? I see nothing wrong with my stats. He would have been terminated this year if at Nebraska, yet we want to dog on Riley, and not give him a chance next year. So you can wait all you want. My stats are dead on. Valiant effort.

he wouldn't have taken over a 9 win team and had 2 losing seasons in his first three years - he didn't even do that at MSU where he took over a program that had losing seasons 4 of the last 5 years prior to his arrival. Dantonio was + 8 in wins in his first 3 years compared to the 3 years prior to his arrival.

As noted above Dantonio won 22 games his first 3 years - if Riley performs similarly he will keep his job - he needs 7 wins to get there. Which by the way would be -6 in wins compared to the 3 years prior to his arrival. No one is holding Riley to unreasonable standards in year 3. Win 7 (hell maybe even 6) and he will get another year.

 

[Mr.Scary13]

By that logic, we should have given Bill Callahan a big extension in 2007. He we on the verge of signing his second Top 5 recruiting class.

You people act like no other coach would be able to recruit here. Pelini was the laziest recruiter ever and didn't fill recruiting classes, yet still pulled in some Top 20 classes. Riley hasn't pulled in higher than a 20th ranked class yet, and is sitting at 44th right now. You don't think a guy like Frost, with the exciting style he plays and the connections he has in Florida, wouldn't be able to recruit as good or better than a 65-year-old .500 coach?

And if we keep Riley another year, I'd also be surprised if our best recruiting assistants don't try to leave the sinking ship and pursue other jobs. They have to see next year's schedule and know that it's only a matter of time.

And how good do you think that Nebraska team would have been with all that talent in Lincoln?

 

[ridge22]

Dantonio Stat:

7-6 in 2007
9-4 in 2008
6-7 in 2009
11-2 in 2010 when he broke through. Our current fan logic would have have had him fired probably in year 3, but yet Riley needs to be gone in year 2.5? Isn't that right? I see nothing wrong with my stats. He would have been terminated this year if at Nebraska, yet we want to dog on Riley, and not give him a chance next year. So you can wait all you want. My stats are dead on. Valiant effort.

There are a couple of things that Dantonio did that Riley hasn't in those first 3 years. Against MSU rivals Notre Dame and Michigan Dantonio was 2-1 vs both in the first 3 years. In looking at the Nebraska situation I would say Iowa and Wisconsin would be our main rivals. Riley is 0-3 vs Wisky and 0-2 vs Iowa so far.

For the most part years 1 & 2 were pretty similar for both coaches. First year for both have several close loses, Dantonio's all by 1 score eith 3 or seven point and 2 in OT of the 6 regular season losses 3 were to ranked teams, 2 of those on the road. Of Riley's losses only 1 to a ranked team. Thing is in year two Dantonio came back and beat ND and Mich, MR didn't do that to build any momentum. It would obviously make a difference in the record, but not getting over the hump in your first 3 years vs your rivals is a recipe the is tough to overcome. Also what is more concerning about that is the gap seems to be widening.

 

[St_Henry_Buckeye]

It is an insult to Dantonio to try to compare Riley to him.

 

[Toms Wife]

Dantonio Stat:

7-6 in 2007
9-4 in 2008
6-7 in 2009
11-2 in 2010 when he broke through. Our current fan logic would have have had him fired probably in year 3, but yet Riley needs to be gone in year 2.5? Isn't that right? I see nothing wrong with my stats. He would have been terminated this year if at Nebraska, yet we want to dog on Riley, and not give him a chance next year. So you can wait all you want. My stats are dead on. Valiant effort.

Stop...MSU won 3 out of 16 conference games before D'Antonio. In its previous 16 conference games before Riley, Nebraska won 10.

This twisting the facts stuff is getting bizarre.

 

[huskerbaseball13]

Dantonio Stat:

7-6 in 2007
9-4 in 2008
6-7 in 2009
11-2 in 2010 when he broke through. Our current fan logic would have have had him fired probably in year 3, but yet Riley needs to be gone in year 2.5? Isn't that right? I see nothing wrong with my stats. He would have been terminated this year if at Nebraska, yet we want to dog on Riley, and not give him a chance next year. So you can wait all you want. My stats are dead on. Valiant effort.

Nah, not if the previous coach went bowless in his last 3 years and 1-7 within the conference in 06'. Now that is a true rebuild and one where fans can see and point to tangible improvements. Riley in year 3? Not so much. I've said keep Riley if he can get to six wins this year. But, let's not act like you are comparing apples to apples here and act as if the fan base is the villains. Riley is slowly hanging himself due to the below average product he continues to put on the field.

 

[TwinsRRUs_rivals79748]

What if they retain Riley for 2018 (difficult schedule) and the season goes horrible, then Frost comes in for the easier 2019 schedule and has an easier time winning games.

3 losing seasons in 4 years makes sense for a coaching change and probably keeps the job more enticing to the next coach knowing he will get 4 years to turn things around.


If Riley leaves this year and Frost comes in for 2018, then has a horrible season installing his system... would Husker fans make excuses for the poor season like they did for Riley in his first year?

 

[dinglefritz]

What if they retain Riley for 2018 (difficult schedule) and the season goes horrible, then Frost comes in for the easier 2019 schedule and has an easier time winning games.

3 losing seasons in 4 years makes sense for a coaching change and probably keeps the job more enticing to the next coach knowing he will get 4 years to turn things around.


If Riley leaves this year and Frost comes in for 2018, then has a horrible season installing his system... would Husker fans make excuses for the poor season like they did for Riley in his first year?

Frost would have a grace period no doubt. For one thing, Tom would be out front for him in support. He would maybe have to recruit different QBs although POB and Gebbia are more mobile than most think. The walk on QB is a true dual threat but I'm not sure how many years he has left. He's actually not a bad player. Frost has worked in systems using a pro-style QB and he's a bright guy so I don't think he would have a problem adjusting his system to the QB's skills. Hell he might come in and keep a pro-style offense. He ran the WCO under Bill Walsh at Stanford before getting switched to safety.

 

[LZZOSO]

Nah, not if the previous coach went bowless in his last 3 years and 1-7 within the conference in 06'. Now that is a true rebuild and one where fans can see and point to tangible improvements. Riley in year 3? Not so much. I've said keep Riley if he can get to six wins this year. But, let's not act like you are comparing apples to apples here and act as if the fan base is the villains. Riley is slowly hanging himself due to the below average product he continues to put on the field.

I don't 100% disagree, but I also think our fanbase is completely delusional, and no matter the coach if there is any season that is worse than 7-5 we are going to squawk, and even at 7-5 we are going to squawk. Hell 8 & 9 wins are deemed unacceptable.

 

[LZZOSO]

Stop...MSU won 3 out of 16 conference games before D'Antonio. In its previous 16 conference games before Riley, Nebraska won 10.

This twisting the facts stuff is getting bizarre.

It's not twisting facts whatsoever. Our fanbase is delusional as I stated before, and if that was any coaches record at NU we would be running them out of town. Recent history proves that.

 

[LZZOSO]

he wouldn't have taken over a 9 win team and had 2 losing seasons in his first three years - he didn't even do that at MSU where he took over a program that had losing seasons 4 of the last 5 years prior to his arrival. Dantonio was + 8 in wins in his first 3 years compared to the 3 years prior to his arrival.

As noted above Dantonio won 22 games his first 3 years - if Riley performs similarly he will keep his job - he needs 7 wins to get there. Which by the way would be -6 in wins compared to the 3 years prior to his arrival. No one is holding Riley to unreasonable standards in year 3. Win 7 (hell maybe even 6) and he will get another year.

As he should. It's illustrating the fact that our fanbase has this delusion that we are gods gift. We f'ed that up a long time ago, and instead of being rabid and trying to fire each guy that doesn't get it done right away, have some patience and realize all of the good that is going on in the program as well as give some time for those positives to develop. Instead we want to focus on every hsmall thing that goes on and jump off the edge.

Besides recruiting Riley is doing well with walkons, ex-players have as much access as they've ever had... List goes on. I'm fine if we don't look like any progress is being made after next year to get rid of him. He needs to remove assistants now as well, but lets give him one more year for the talent to develop and if next year is bad, can him and leave the next coach with a pretty good roster. Then there will be less excuses.

 

[Harry Caray]

What if they retain Riley for 2018 (difficult schedule) and the season goes horrible, then Frost comes in for the easier 2019 schedule and has an easier time winning games.

3 losing seasons in 4 years makes sense for a coaching change and probably keeps the job more enticing to the next coach knowing he will get 4 years to turn things around.


If Riley leaves this year and Frost comes in for 2018, then has a horrible season installing his system... would Husker fans make excuses for the poor season like they did for Riley in his first year?

I'd be surprised if Frost is still available in 2019. If he keeps winning he will be the hot name for any big jobs that open in the SEC this year or next, and there could be quite a few openings. They are taking notice down there:

https://www.saturdaydownsouth.com/sec-football/frost-vacancy-sec-coveted-herman-2017/

 

[ridge22]

As he should. It's illustrating the fact that our fanbase has this delusion that we are gods gift. We f'ed that up a long time ago, and instead of being rabid and trying to fire each guy that doesn't get it done right away, have some patience and realize all of the good that is going on in the program as well as give some time for those positives to develop. Instead we want to focus on every hsmall thing that goes on and jump off the edge.

Besides recruiting Riley is doing well with walkons, ex-players have as much access as they've ever had... List goes on. I'm fine if we don't look like any progress is being made after next year to get rid of him. He needs to remove assistants now as well, but lets give him one more year for the talent to develop and if next year is bad, can him and leave the next coach with a pretty good roster. Then there will be less excuses.

The roster question after next year will be filled with a lot of inexperience and question marks if you look at who is playing now. No QB with much playing experience since they have hitched their wagon to Lee. He will be a Sr next year. Tre Bryant at RB, sounds like his knee is not in great shape. Wilbon and DO are seniors next year. Morgan gone after next year, Lindsay and Speilman will still be around and the TE's will be a ?, Farmer Gate and Foster will be seniors next year. Younger guys getting some time, but have struggled as well.
A good portion of the defense is JR with Freedom, Stolt, Young, Gifford, Williams, Reed and Jones and Kalu are Sr this year. If there is talent there is should be getting a chance to get on the field this year and it just isn't so far. And if it is it is due to injury not beating anyone out of their position.

 

[jeans15]

I'd be surprised if Frost is still available in 2019. If he keeps winning he will be the hot name for any big jobs that open in the SEC this year or next, and there could be quite a few openings. They are taking notice down there:

https://www.saturdaydownsouth.com/sec-football/frost-vacancy-sec-coveted-herman-2017/

Timing is everything when hiring a coach.

 

[huskerfan1414]

Good Grief

Brian Kelly played for a national championship in 2012 and was 10-3 in 2015 and played in a BCS bowl prior to the 2016 season.

Dantonio's seat was a little warm after a losing season in 2009. He promptly won 11 games in 2010 and 2011. He then won 13-11-11 with 2 conf titles and a college football playoff birth in the 3 years prior to going 3-9.

You can survive a losing season if you have built up some equity by actually accomplishing something on the field. Riley has zero equity in the bank either here or at OSU to weather another losing season should it occur.

Thank goodness someone has some sense.

 

[huskerfan1414]

It is an insult to Dantonio to try to compare Riley to him.

X1000

 

[huskerfan1414]

he wouldn't have taken over a 9 win team and had 2 losing seasons in his first three years - he didn't even do that at MSU where he took over a program that had losing seasons 4 of the last 5 years prior to his arrival. Dantonio was + 8 in wins in his first 3 years compared to the 3 years prior to his arrival.

As noted above Dantonio won 22 games his first 3 years - if Riley performs similarly he will keep his job - he needs 7 wins to get there. Which by the way would be -6 in wins compared to the 3 years prior to his arrival. No one is holding Riley to unreasonable standards in year 3. Win 7 (hell maybe even 6) and he will get another year.

That's just it....nothing we are demanding is unreasonable.
People think we are expecting national titles by now...not the truth.

 

[daddy mack]

Why is it only "fair" to give the head coach four or five years but also fair to fire the Reads, Bankers, Cavs, Hughes, after 1, 2, or 3 years?

Oh I don't know maybe ask Bo the same questions. He got seven years by the way.

 

[huskerfan1414]

Dantonio Stat:

7-6 in 2007
9-4 in 2008
6-7 in 2009
11-2 in 2010 when he broke through. Our current fan logic would have have had him fired probably in year 3, but yet Riley needs to be gone in year 2.5? Isn't that right? I see nothing wrong with my stats. He would have been terminated this year if at Nebraska, yet we want to dog on Riley, and not give him a chance next year. So you can wait all you want. My stats are dead on. Valiant effort.

You people are really stretching.

 

[otismotis08]

I think we've seen enough already...

 

[LZZOSO]

The roster question after next year will be filled with a lot of inexperience and question marks if you look at who is playing now. No QB with much playing experience since they have hitched their wagon to Lee. He will be a Sr next year. Tre Bryant at RB, sounds like his knee is not in great shape. Wilbon and DO are seniors next year. Morgan gone after next year, Lindsay and Speilman will still be around and the TE's will be a ?, Farmer Gate and Foster will be seniors next year. Younger guys getting some time, but have struggled as well.
A good portion of the defense is JR with Freedom, Stolt, Young, Gifford, Williams, Reed and Jones and Kalu are Sr this year. If there is talent there is should be getting a chance to get on the field this year and it just isn't so far. And if it is it is due to injury not beating anyone out of their position.

There definitely could be some inexperience, but we are gaining some this year, and next year as well. The talent level coming in is much higher than in the past. If Riley can't get it done, at least there will be some pieces for the next person.