As soon as you admit other reasons its no longer WHY you lost.
Refs
- Thread starter S_Janowski
- Start date
Again, when you’re up with seconds left and there are two blown calls it can be.
By your logic, all of those reason we lost suddenly and magically become reasons we won, if they make either of those calls?
Dumb logic.
People seem to forget that we did play well enough to be up 1 with 3 seconds to play at a 15th ranked team's home court and we were 10.5 dogs. So we were at point regardless of refs or anything else .Does anyone deny that at that point a refs bad call denied us the win.
I mean Christ this is a game we banked in not one but two 3s in the first half. Plenty of breaks both ways.
We had a backcourt violation they didn't call, and Somerville put his hands on a guy that could have very well been called And One in a big spot late.
Does banking two threes have anything to do with refs blowing calls with seconds left in the game?
Did the refs “open the bank” for us?
So nice of them to give us those two breaks.
This is what I don’t understand- why the complete inability to acknowledge that it was PART of the reason we lost
Someone else said above, in response to one of my posts, that the overall complaints about the officiating are overblown. Let’s assume that is true - we got away with an over-and-back and there was one late phantom call against UM.
So let’s assume the overall officiating evened out
So then we are only talking about the last possession where they looked the other way on TWO blatant violations -
which instead of giving us the ball (game over - we win) -
gave them an opportunity (they should NOT have had) to win the game
How can you say the officiating had “nothing to do” with the outcome ?!
A blown call (two actually) on the last possession directly resulted in giving them a chance they should not have had
Come on - just be honest
I am conceding everything - that there were MYRIAD reasons why UM got back in the game AND, for the sake of discussion, I’ll agree that overall the officiating evened .
But you can’t even agree that the no calls on the last possession gave UM possession that they should NOT have had - which resulted in the loss.
Last edited:
I don't think those calls, or any other calls play a role. We lost because we didn't make a stop. We lost because we forgot how to shoot for half the game. We lost because we couldn't rebound. We didn't lose because of things that weren't called.
But if the refs made either of those calls, we would have won for all the reasons you list above!
Are we giving back the JMIke basket that came after a no call walk he committed? Officiating has nothing to do with the outcome because it usually would have been a pretty even exchange over an entire game.
This is exactly what’s wrong with a segment of the population of this board (and society in general) - they don’t wish to have a discussion, they just want to push their narrative (and any thing that contradicts that narrative gets rejected, ignored or twisted).
Whatever - fine - officiating never affects the outcome of any game in any sport ever. Got it !
If we won it would have been because we shot so well in the first half and played just enough defense with a few timely hoops in the second half to hold on. But we didn't. One trip of defense short.
Correct, it does. That's why the woe is me, they are only out to get my team stuff is so tiresome, and lazy.
Read a game thread. Half the posts are complaining about refs. It's what fans do, fine, but it's irrelevant for the most part. VERY FEW game results are altered because of 40 minutes of refereeing.
Also, whining about refs isn't a discussion, it's an attempt to place blame anywhere but within.
You didn't see the traveling by the passer on that last play ?
Or the double dribble by the shooter ?
I don't understand some of you. It's as if you don't believe bad calls against the visiting team can't happen....especially in our league.
What exactly do you think home court advantage is ?
Do I really need to explain why a missed travel 9 minutes into the first half is different from a missed travel with 5 seconds left in a one point game?
Ok thanks for the life lesson
But honestly you’re not even reading what others (including me) are saying
Not a single person is putting blame solely on the refs. In fact most if not all (including me) acknowledged there were MYRIAD reasons “within” why we lost.
But you ignore that.
If you can’t admit that the non-calls at the end of the game directly affected the outcome then you clearly have no interest in an honest conversation
Got it
Last edited:
So if we made one additional three in the first half for a total of 60, this ending the game with 85, we wouldn’t have won because the three happened early in the game? Rethink your post.
Defense, shooting, rebounding. Those things are within a players’ control. The refs are not. Worry about the things you can control. Focus on those. Don’t play the victim and blame things you can’t control.
Somerville clearly shoved with two hands in lower back of Golden on his late dunk, I was shocked there was no foul called for the And 1 free throw. We had a clear back court violation when Acuff reached midcourt and threw it back over the line. In all honesty, Acuff was fouled for sure on his 3 point attempt to give us free throws and the lead on our last possession, but I was surprised we got the call being that it was late in the game and we were on the road, I figured refs would swallow the whistle and let that go. Turns out they swallowed the whistle on Michigan’s possession concerning the violations before the timeout with 3 seconds left.
OK, so I just went back and watched the end again. He did not travel, his right foot was in the same spot through the whole time he was in possession, including while his left was in the air as he made the pass back. No travel. Yes, I do think the PG touches the ball to create a double dribble, but think it was after May had asked for the TO.
Sure, it was a part of it. I just think you need to look inwards first before blaming others for your failures. When I view it thru that lens, it feels very petty to blame the refs when we couldnt stop them all game and couldnt hit a shot the entire second half. The refs were well down the list of things to complain about. Really just a larger microcosm of this entire season. People make excuses for it, but the reality is we are just not good. Whether its this game or this season, its still the same answer.
I have not looked for a replay so I could be wrong - but I thought Acuff still had one foot in the backcourt when he passed the ball. If so, even though the ball bounced across the line, that does not count as establishing a front court position and so there was no violation.
That’s how I saw that sequence too. The cylinder calls bothered me. Granted I didn’t see them but people are in the grill all the time in the big ten and the only team that gets called on is Rutgers and twice in the second half of Michigan is infuriating. Not saying that’s why we lost btw.
The entire endgame would play out differently, so while an extra three points obviously helps, you can’t just assume you win the game if you get it.
You want to look at something like win probability change. Getting another three at the end of the first half probably increases your win percentage from like 70% to 73%. Whereas getting a turnover with 5 seconds left increases it from 70% to 97%.
I made those numbers up but I think they are close enough to illustrate the point.
I’ve always taught my players EACH and EVERY possession matters. Equally. But I do understand what you’re saying about the timing, impact, and what has to unfold yet. And I also underhand the math and how it works, but imho the winning percentage is hogwash. I’ve seen Rutgers too many times into the 90s just to lose. Also happens to my fantasy football teams (but I whine and digress).
One could say that we aren't up 1 without that missed Davis travel.
Or the backcourt violation non-call (don't remember if we scored that possession).
We are actually down 1 potentially.
In which case then entire end of the game plays out differently.
Actually you're wrong. I ran the numbers.
It's been 2,835 straight Rutgers losses that coincided with "bias refs".
Clearly it's only a Rutgers thing.
Not saying bad calls weren't made/missed but literally every fanbase blames every loss on the refs.
Someone name one loss this year that didn't have "poor refs"?
Sports fans are "boy who cried wolf" at this point.
Last edited:
******** comment. Sure during the game there are always people complaining about calls as the game goes on.
But afterwards post-loss when people are evaluating the reasons for the loss - it is just NOT accurate to say that every loss is blamed on the refs . It’s just not accurate.
Maybe there are one or two fans that always blame the refs. There’s always a few of those. Can’t helped that
But I’m talking about the majority of the fans in their assessment of the reasons after the game is over
This year - very few games have involved officiating as one of the main reasons for the loss
This game happened to be one of them - where the refs were cited post game as ONE of the reasons for the loss by a larger number of the fans
Look we even got a shout out!
Does this make us part of the Big Ten Ref Illuminati?
https://www.uscbasketball.com/men/4...e-officials-have-a-thing-against-muss-and-usc
Does this make us part of the Big Ten Ref Illuminati?
https://www.uscbasketball.com/men/4...e-officials-have-a-thing-against-muss-and-usc
This is following some of the lame excuses to explain 30 years without one NCAA bid.Its always somebody else fault for losing,Since joining the B1G Ten Rutgers mens basketball team has a very poor league won/loss record.Without accountability mediocrity prevails.
OSU (yes that OSU) got a bad whistle is every Big Ten game (as of early February).
Even our game early in the season.
It'd almost as if the refs are somehow favoring "the other team" in every single game.
Even our game early in the season.
It'd almost as if the refs are somehow favoring "the other team" in every single game.
You can't control calls from refs. You can control protecting a 13 pt lead, time management, shot selections and players who shoot