Rich Brooks & Going Forward

[supernova0221]

We all wanted him fired too remember? Both coaches inherited a dumpster fire. Took Brooks 4 years to get the ship turned around and at that we were a 7-5 team. BTW he left with a LOSING record at UK and we celebrate him like he was the second coming of Bryant.

Anyone remember is losing to UF and they never covered the gunner...ever...and he NEVER called the fake? He made lots of boanheaded mistakes as well with more HC experience and got demolished by UF eve when we were "decent".

The point is the absolute lunacy going on here is outstandingly outlandish. Does ANYONE remember the terrible lack of talent Joker left us with? I get the fact Stoops is frustrating at best right now but let's not forget we have been down this road before. I'm just as mad as the rest if you but I refuse to lose all sense common sense.

I still really hope we go 6-6. That would still be a great thing in year 3. Just about everyone with real expectations knew next year was the make or break year for Stoops. I think he needs to fire Dawson. There is no wiggle room here he needs to go. Elliot needs to be labeled as an assistant HC and UK should go out and hire Randy Shannon as DC. He and Stoops worked together at Miami, he would be a HUGE upgrade in recruiting and his Defenses were top 10 in the nation consistently.

In closing, I get being pissed off. We can't and should not lose to a team that can't even put more fans then UK in their own stadium. With that said, we have 2 games left and need to win both. Stoops needs to get off his stubborn behind and bench Towles and play for the futre. If UK was losing with younger talented players I think it would be handled a little better.

GBB

 

[ukalumni00]

I agree with most of what you are saying but it is now 100% prove it to me now. Not buying into one more ounce of hype or excuses from this coach or administration. Call me bandwagon all you want but I have been as patient as anyone and I am done. I will watch games at home but UK is not getting another dollar from me in any form until this program is fixed.

 

[Robcatt24]

We all wanted him fired too remember? Both coaches inherited a dumpster fire. Took Brooks 4 years to get the ship turned around and at that we were a 7-5 team. BTW he left with a LOSING record at UK and we celebrate him like he was the second coming of Bryant.

Anyone remember is losing to UF and they never covered the gunner...ever...and he NEVER called the fake? He made lots of boanheaded mistakes as well with more HC experience and got demolished by UF eve when we were "decent".

The point is the absolute lunacy going on here is outstandingly outlandish. Does ANYONE remember the terrible lack of talent Joker left us with? I get the fact Stoops is frustrating at best right now but let's not forget we have been down this road before. I'm just as mad as the rest if you but I refuse to lose all sense common sense.

I still really hope we go 6-6. That would still be a great thing in year 3. Just about everyone with real expectations knew next year was the make or break year for Stoops. I think he needs to fire Dawson. There is no wiggle room here he needs to go. Elliot needs to be labeled as an assistant HC and UK should go out and hire Randy Shannon as DC. He and Stoops worked together at Miami, he would be a HUGE upgrade in recruiting and his Defenses were top 10 in the nation consistently.

In closing, I get being pissed off. We can't and should not lose to a team that can't even put more fans then UK in their own stadium. With that said, we have 2 games left and need to win both. Stoops needs to get off his stubborn behind and bench Towles and play for the futre. If UK was losing with younger talented players I think it would be handled a little better.

GBB

I agree with most of what you're saying.

But the moves you're talking about that need made, the vast majority of the fanbase don't believe Stoops will make those changes.

Just look at how he has handled the QB spot this season. What makes anyone think it'll be different next year?

Right now, there is very little reason to have confidence in Stoops.

 

[rmattox]

I'm still in Stoops' corner, though he has a ton of work to do and obvious changes to make. However, comparing him or jp to Coach Brooks is not a good comparison. Yes it took Coach Brooks 4 years, but Coach Brooks knew what he was doing. He was an NFL caliber coach. Coach Stoops does not have that experience, so saying or even thinking the fourth year will have the same results as Coach B is having hope based on a false foundation

 

[supernova0221]

I agree with the questioning as well. That's why he needs to do it. There is absolutely 0 leniency next year. This to me is the last year he can make an excuse. Next year is put up or shut up. Hell we may go 7-5 but of we do it better be a 7-5 taking teams to the wire and playing hard.

 

[UKUGA]

I'm not sure that firing CMS this year, really does us that much good.

He was, unlike most of our past hires, an exciting hire, and he showed some signs - primarily via recruiting - that he knows what he is doing.

I'm not accepting the losing. But, the losing isn't new. You can't name a UK coach (absent Bryant, I guess), that did not have a terrible season, or two, on the resume.

I don't count Stoops' first season. I just don't.

I'm completely dissatisfied with the lack of progress and the train wreck endings to each of these last two seasons.

That said, I don't see how you can be certain that anyone is a fix, just like you can't be certain that another year of Stoops is going to be bad. You can assume, and perhaps be right, but you don't know.

I'm going to look at the positives (recruiting, combined with a few good wins), and hope that with some changes made to the staff, next year will be better.

If not, then yes, I'm probably on board with cutting him loose.

However, having watched this pretty closely for well over 3 decades, I'm afraid that firing Stoops may be cutting off our nose to spite our face.

 

[trueblujr]

Rich Brooks and Stoops both inherited piles of dung. Rich Brooks finished his career at UK with a losing record, but his record in his last 4 seasons was 30-22. But also remember we were about to run him out of town on a rail after a 3-8 finish in his THIRD year.

See the parallels here?

 

[ukalumni00]

As another poster said you can't compare Brooks and Stoops. Brooks had a lifetime of head coaching experience and a proven successful building job at Oregon. Although it was very difficult, he had a proven and experienced plan he stuck to and got KY back to mediocrity. However, he could not take KY to the next level.

Stoops was hired to bring KY to a mediocre level and the next level. Nothing as of now has been proven that he has what it takes to do it. He can go and hire the best experienced minds in football but if he is going to continue to be a hothead control freak and be totally lost during games I am not sure it's going to matter. All of this is on his shoulders and the first person he has to evaluate is himself. I hope he is able to weather this storm because if not KY Football is in huge trouble.

 

[richbrookstomato]

Stoops is NOT going to be fired. Too much money tied up in his contract.

I loved Coach Brooks and appreciate all that he did to bring our football program out of probation. But to be satisfied with NEVER having an SEC record above .500 is the main reason our football program wallows in mediocrity.

I want a coach that pisses fire!! That has a burning desire to build a winning program here. That will not use the failures of the past as an excuse for his ability to build future success!!

He must be a coach that stresses discipline and attention to detail in EVERY aspect of the game!! We will never be able to recruit at a top 10 level, so we have got to utilize a system that stresses mistake free football.

Hopefully Coach Stoops will make the necessary changes to the staff and his program to make UK Football a success.

 

[TJS4UK]

We all know that it took Brooks 4 years. But, he led UK to 4 straight bowls (5 if you include Jokers first year). The truth is, almost nobody wanted him to return for year 4!

What many may not realize is that Frank Beamer only had 2 winning seasons (both 6 wins) during his first 6 years @ Virginia Tech before leading them to 22 straight bowls.

Many more may not realize that Jack Harbaugh only had 2 winning seasons out of his first 7 @ WKU. Harbaugh finally won 10 in year 9. He finally won 11 in year 12 as WKU reached the D1AA quarterfinals. WKU finally won 12 in year 14 also winning the D1AA National Championship under Harbaugh.

Even Nick Saban was pretty mediocre during his first 4 years @ Michigan State (three 6 win seasons & one 7 win season) before finally winning 9 in year 5.

Giving Stoops 4-5 years is not asking too much and enduring some growing pains along the way is not necessarily out of the ordinary either. However, I do think that next year will be critical for Stoops tenure @ UK, IMHO.

That said, I think that Stoops will likely fix the current problems but the biggest changes will likely occur during the offseason and others will only be fixed as the competition level increases (recruiting and depth).

 

[supernova0221]

We all know that it took Brooks 4 years. But, he led UK to 4 straight bowls (5 if you include Jokers first year). The truth is, almost nobody wanted him to return for year 4!

What many may not realize is that Frank Beamer only had 2 winning seasons (both 6 wins) during his first 6 years @ Virginia Tech before leading them to 22 straight bowls.

Many more may not realize that Jack Harbaugh only had 2 winning seasons out of his first 7 @ WKU. Harbaugh finally won 10 in year 9. He finally won 11 in year 12 as WKU reached the D1AA quarterfinals. WKU finally won 12 in year 14 also winning the D1AA National Championship under Harbaugh.

Even Nick Saban was pretty mediocre during his first 4 years @ Michigan State (three 6 win seasons & one 7 win season) before finally winning 9 in year 4.

Giving Stoops 4-5 years is not asking too much and enduring some growing pains along the way is not necessarily out of the ordinary either. However, I do think that next year will be critical for Stoops tenure @ UK, IMHO.

That said, I think that Stoops will likely fix the current problems but the biggest changes will likely occur during the offseason and others will only be fixed as the competition level increases (recruiting and depth).

Very well said!

 

[TJS4UK]

We all know that it took Brooks 4 years. But, he led UK to 4 straight bowls (5 if you include Jokers first year). The truth is, almost nobody wanted him to return for year 4!

What many may not realize is that Frank Beamer only had 2 winning seasons (both 6 wins) during his first 6 years @ Virginia Tech before leading them to 22 straight bowls.

Many more may not realize that Jack Harbaugh only had 2 winning seasons out of his first 7 @ WKU. Harbaugh finally won 10 in year 9. He finally won 11 in year 12 as WKU reached the D1AA quarterfinals. WKU finally won 12 in year 14 also winning the D1AA National Championship under Harbaugh.

Even Nick Saban was pretty mediocre during his first 4 years @ Michigan State (three 6 win seasons & one 7 win season) before finally winning 9 in year 5.

Giving Stoops 4-5 years is not asking too much and enduring some growing pains along the way is not necessarily out of the ordinary either. However, I do think that next year will be critical for Stoops tenure @ UK, IMHO.

That said, I think that Stoops will likely fix the current problems but the biggest changes will likely occur during the offseason and others will only be fixed as the competition level increases (recruiting and depth).

You could also add former Wildcat Howard Schnellenburger @ UL to that list of examples. He'd just won a NC @ Miami U only a couple of years prior, but he struggled to go 2-9, 3-8 & 3-7-1 before finally winning 8 games in season 4 & then he went 6-5 in year #5 at UL. It wasn't until year 6 that he got the Cardinals to 10-1-1 and a victory over Alabama in the Fiesta Bowl.

 

[BBBLazing]

Everyone that compares Stoops to Brooks as if Brooks was some great coach. He scheduled his way into bowl games. Other than 2007, his teams were never relevant. Remember that Stoops is playing an extra SEC game. We have sucked since I started watching UK football in the late 50s, except when we were cheating. I'm not sure how old you all are, but to say we are re-building is wrong. We are building. We have not been good is 60 years.

 

[UKUGA]

Everyone that compares Stoops to Brooks as if Brooks was some great coach. He scheduled his way into bowl games. Other than 2007, his teams were never relevant. Remember that Stoops is playing an extra SEC game. We have sucked since I started watching UK football in the late 50s, except when we were cheating. I'm not sure how old you all are, but to say we are re-building is wrong. We are building. We have not been good is 60 years.

I agree with your general sentiment; however, Brooks also had to play/coach 8 SEC games, per year. But, he never won more than 4, and won 2 or less half the time. Interestingly enough, the 4-win season was 2006, not 2007.

I always said that Brooks had one good year.

It began mid-way through the 2006 season and ended after we beat LSU in 2007.

It was fun while it lasted, though.

 

[rmattox]

Everyone that compares Stoops to Brooks as if Brooks was some great coach. He scheduled his way into bowl games. Other than 2007, his teams were never relevant. Remember that Stoops is playing an extra SEC game. We have sucked since I started watching UK football in the late 50s, except when we were cheating. I'm not sure how old you all are, but to say we are re-building is wrong. We are building. We have not been good is 60 years.

You have about 10 years on me...so both of us have been watching for a long time. IMO, I would rank Brooks the third best coach we've had in my lifetime, behind Collier and Curci. Was Brooks great by national or SEC standards? No , but he was good by Ky standards. Had he been given support he might have been even more successful. Who can you compare Stoops to? Maybe Curci? Both inherited messes. Both essentially inherited new facilities, though Stoops got and is getting his. Both have been able to recruit. The difference was that Curci had head coaching experience. Maybe our best hope is that Stoops learns from his mistakes...all of the best have learned that way.

 

[KyCatFan_rivals45723]

Coach Brooks spent his first couple years on probation. That combined with poor recruiting beforehand left us in a lot worse shape then what Coach Stoops took over. Things were rough the first couple years and fans weren't happy, but he did the right thing and made a change on his staff and things improved from there. Will Coach Stoops make some changes to try and improve the team or be stubborn and stick with who he brought here? That will likely determine his fate here.

 

[rjr]

We all wanted him fired too remember? Both coaches inherited a dumpster fire. Took Brooks 4 years to get the ship turned around and at that we were a 7-5 team. BTW he left with a LOSING record at UK and we celebrate him like he was the second coming of Bryant.

Anyone remember is losing to UF and they never covered the gunner...ever...and he NEVER called the fake? He made lots of boanheaded mistakes as well with more HC experience and got demolished by UF eve when we were "decent".

The point is the absolute lunacy going on here is outstandingly outlandish. Does ANYONE remember the terrible lack of talent Joker left us with? I get the fact Stoops is frustrating at best right now but let's not forget we have been down this road before. I'm just as mad as the rest if you but I refuse to lose all sense common sense.

I still really hope we go 6-6. That would still be a great thing in year 3. Just about everyone with real expectations knew next year was the make or break year for Stoops. I think he needs to fire Dawson. There is no wiggle room here he needs to go. Elliot needs to be labeled as an assistant HC and UK should go out and hire Randy Shannon as DC. He and Stoops worked together at Miami, he would be a HUGE upgrade in recruiting and his Defenses were top 10 in the nation consistently.

In closing, I get being pissed off. We can't and should not lose to a team that can't even put more fans then UK in their own stadium. With that said, we have 2 games left and need to win both. Stoops needs to get off his stubborn behind and bench Towles and play for the futre. If UK was losing with younger talented players I think it would be handled a little better.

GBB

Bad comparison. Brooks arrived with team on probation with no players and recruiting very difficult due to the probation. And yes, the cupboard was even more bare for Brooks. The other thing is Brooks was a known commodity - a proven head coach. Not all of us wanted him fired after three years because some of us knew we weren't going to get a better coach who had won big at the college level and coached in NFL.

I don't want Stoops fired either. We are invested and have to see this through. But unlike Brooks, I have no reason to believe based upon his history that he will right this ship. He is not a proven head coach. And based on what I've seen, I have BIG concerns about him.

 

[supernova0221]

Bad comparison. Brooks arrived with team on probation with no players and recruiting very difficult due to the probation. And yes, the cupboard was even more bare for Brooks. The other thing is Brooks was a known commodity - a proven head coach. Not all of us wanted him fired after three years because some of us knew we weren't going to get a better coach who had won big at the college level and coached in NFL.

I don't want Stoops fired either. We are invested and have to see this through. But unlike Brooks, I have no reason to believe based upon his history that he will right this ship. He is not a proven head coach. And based on what I've seen, I have BIG concerns about him.

It's not a bad comparison it's a fair one. They are very similar situations. Yes Brooks had sanctions but Stoops had a dumpster fire as well. If we somehow go 6-6 it's a step forward. Anything less then 6-6 is worth questioning the path the program is on

 

[TBCat]

Rich Brooks and Stoops both inherited piles of dung. Rich Brooks finished his career at UK with a losing record, but his record in his last 4 seasons was 30-22. But also remember we were about to run him out of town on a rail after a 3-8 finish in his THIRD year.

See the parallels here?

Yeah but I also see the parallels to the Curry staff. Also the Joker staff. Look just because a coach looks incompetent and doesn't even know how to line his players up in year 3 doesn't mean that he obviously compares to Brooks. It's far more likely that Stoops continues to look bad in years 4 and on. Not knowing how to organize a team is not something that gets better in most cases. Coaches that show that rapid improvement later on usually show signs of it early on. Or at least signs that they are capable of it. Brooks' long record of success as a head coach before the situation you described is hard to dismiss. There is no parallel with that and Stoops.

 

[Shavers48]

Ridiculous to compare Brooks and Stoops. Brooks had a track record as a head coach and even had NFL pedigree. Stoops has no head coach experience and didn't even become one until his mid 40's - much later than most successful HCs.

 

[LowCountryCat]

Brooks didn't take dumps on the field during games like Stoops does.