Without getting too political, can someone explain what Bevin is trying to accomplish with the new tax credits for donations to private schools?
Teacher Sick Out
- Thread starter Henogee1975
- Start date
So someone with a pic of Pelosi and Trump starts a thread about what Bevin is doing but doesnt want things to get too political? Dont think thats going to work.
This is not Bevin's bill although he says that he would sign it in a heartbeat. It allows for tax credits (better than a deduction) for donations to charities that provide scholarships to low income students to private schools. So you will have a bunch of would be public school kids now attending better/safer private schools. The public schools lose power/money in the deal and thus are very opposed. Public schools get money based on butts in seats. The teachers unions view this as a back door voucher plan.
Jefferson county teachers are leading the fight because there are a bunch of crappy high schools in Louisville. So a lot of students would love the chance to go to Trinity, St. X, Sacred Heart, Assumption, Christian Academy, Country Day, etc. if money was not part of the equation.
https://insiderlouisville.com/educa...es-fate-of-scholarship-tax-credits-uncertain/
Jefferson county teachers are leading the fight because there are a bunch of crappy high schools in Louisville. So a lot of students would love the chance to go to Trinity, St. X, Sacred Heart, Assumption, Christian Academy, Country Day, etc. if money was not part of the equation.
https://insiderlouisville.com/educa...es-fate-of-scholarship-tax-credits-uncertain/
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I don’t really disagree with the bill, I just question the timing of the bill considering all the turmoil with teachers right now.
They are also protesting a bill(may be part of the same one) that would allow superintendents to select principals. The JCTA claims they are against the sick out but who knows with them.
So one of the crappiest states for education keeps the students home. But it’s all about the kids, right?
So one of the crappiest states for education keeps the students home. But it’s all about the kids, right?
Jefferson is also protesting against another bill that would take some power from SBDM councils and give it solely to the superintendent in certain cases. Or something like that.
The other bill that is causing a ruckus is about the board of directors for the teacher retirement system. It's a struggle to make the KEA 'union' less of an influence on the board.
Personally, I think sick-outs are a waste of time and what's going to be voted in will be voted in, just like last year. Fortunately the GA did it in such a crappy way that there was no way it would hold up in court. Not sure how this will go. I'd love to go to bed each night not wondering if we are going to be out over something non-weather related, but that's just me.
I would love to hear how it is 'illegal' for teachers to strike in KY. How is that a thing?
The other bill that is causing a ruckus is about the board of directors for the teacher retirement system. It's a struggle to make the KEA 'union' less of an influence on the board.
Personally, I think sick-outs are a waste of time and what's going to be voted in will be voted in, just like last year. Fortunately the GA did it in such a crappy way that there was no way it would hold up in court. Not sure how this will go. I'd love to go to bed each night not wondering if we are going to be out over something non-weather related, but that's just me.
I would love to hear how it is 'illegal' for teachers to strike in KY. How is that a thing?
Then make the public schools better so those people don't feel the need to go private? We've considered private school in the future but not until middle school because we live in such a good elementary district.
I was fine with the sick out they did last year because it was a big bill that was getting rushed through but calling for a sick out every single time a bill comes up the KEA tells teachers not to like is going to lose a lot of good will.
The teacher's unions are being especially militant because they have a pretty sweet deal with their current pension plans. Half pay for life (if you spend a career as a teacher) is a hell of a deal which is almost unheard of in the private sector anymore.
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What if competition via vouchers or this bill is the cheapest way to make the public schools better? If the public schools have a monopoly on free education and the unions control the process, what incentive is there to improve.
So if the bill passes, I can voluntarily pay to send some poor kids to private school instead of paying taxes to this *** backwards state?
Who's going to pay for all the other ******** the state currently wastes money on if I'm sending all my taxes to private schools?
Who's going to pay for all the other ******** the state currently wastes money on if I'm sending all my taxes to private schools?
A lot of people severely overestimate the pull of the KEA on every day school issues. I appreciate them protecting the pension that I've had as my main retirement plan for the past 22 years, though.
The incentive is to teach children well, which is what 99% of teachers signed up for.
There are some poor (below average) teachers and the teacher's union protects them. That is one of the main problems that I have with the teacher's union. Also I blame the unions for the left wing politics that have been infused into the school system. Once upon a time, schools didn't inject so much politics into education.
As for the pensions, I am ok with most of it. However I think that it is perfectly reasonable to stop the practice of using +20 years of unused vacation to inflate the final year of pay and thus the pension calculation (which is only based on the last few years of salary). I had a teacher/neighbor that also never taught summer school until the last few years so that he could inflate the few years that were used to calculate his pension. Those type of things are just gaming the system. I think those should be fixed.
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The retirement plan aspect of what they got upset about last year was going to be an excellent deal for teachers - seeing a lot of plans, that was going to be a sweet deal....they will regret that one.
Sounds liberal and progressive as hell, so who exactly is mad about this?
I didn't know how many teacher's interest groups are out there. That new board structuring bill added representatives from a lot of different groups (who should be represented alongside KEA imo, but KEA was pissed about it).
I think there was a lot of value in the proposal for new or fairly new teachers. If you're not in the pension plan, you should be allowed to get Social Security, though.
Agreed, so long as they pay into the social security system like private sector workers.
Obviously there needed and potential was(?) some carve outs for people within 5-7 years of hitting their years of service needs for retirement...as far as SS, I have no idea on that subject...I just know of the er benefits calcs/hybrid annual funded CB plan they tried to get...and it was really good (and reasonable).
Parents making sacrifices regarding their child's education is the greatest indicator of success. That commitment might be monetary or time.
How do you know that a school is a crap school or not?
The test scores that everyone despises.
The public schools do not want to lose the student population(less teachers, less administrators needed) that the empire is built, but also do not want to lose their better scoring students that raise the schools scores.
As far as tax credits/deductions are concerned, my wife's hometown church runs a parochial grade school. The school is tuition free for members of the congregation. You are strongly encouraged to put your tuition in the offering plate to be able to have the tax deduction, but like any religious donation, it's up to the individual.
As with all human endeavors, some people will take advantage of a situation.
How do you know that a school is a crap school or not?
The test scores that everyone despises.
The public schools do not want to lose the student population(less teachers, less administrators needed) that the empire is built, but also do not want to lose their better scoring students that raise the schools scores.
As far as tax credits/deductions are concerned, my wife's hometown church runs a parochial grade school. The school is tuition free for members of the congregation. You are strongly encouraged to put your tuition in the offering plate to be able to have the tax deduction, but like any religious donation, it's up to the individual.
As with all human endeavors, some people will take advantage of a situation.
I know a teacher that worked in the private sector and paid into SS for 14 yrs before becoming a teacher. He is now retired and doesn't get a cent from SS.
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The problem is that it takes money away from public education. And what you call "a bunch of public school kids..." will almost without question be only the best athletes and best students that will actually benefit. The net result is that you end up with worse public schools because you skim off their best students leaving them all the problem kids. Now, agree that the public schools get to pick the kids that take those private school spots and they (public school teachers) will gladly jump on board... or tax credits for people that donate to their public schools?
Bottom line is that you don't improve public education by making it easier for kids to go elsewhere. You don't improve public education by cutting its funding. The aim of the STATE should be an advocate for the PUBLIC education in the state.
The state should advocate for its CITIZENS and their children rather than PUBLIC UNIONS. Creating some some competition for students, may be just the thing to get the public system to up its game. Creating scholarships at private schools for disadvantaged kids is a good thing. The only ones against it are the unions who are threatened by the loss of their monopoly power.
That stuff about only best students will benefit is B.S. The best students can already get scholarships directly from private schools. I would agree that the worst of the worst (gang members with criminal records) won't be admitted to private schools and will be stuck in public schools.
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This is such a BS take. What politics have teachers brought into the classroom? My mother was a teacher, my wife is a teacher and my daughter is a teacher...my sister-in-law is a teacher, about half of my nieces are teachers... needless to say I'm around a lot of teachers and 99% of them are about as apolitical as one can get. And of those that are political...they are pretty evenly split between left and right. It's amazing that we could live in such a red state with all the left-wing-pinko-commie teachers[eyeroll]
And I take it that you're not a mathematical genius...of course there are below average teachers. Unless all teachers are the same...average then anyone with a 3rd grade understanding of math would tell you that regardless of the set, some have to be below the line.
What we know is that for the most part bad teachers (as opposed to below average) don't last. 50% of new teachers don't last 5 years. It isn't an easy job and if you're not good at it, it will eat you alive. I suggest you sign up to be a substitute in your local school district. Chances are the kids there will chew you up and spit you out. We had a family friend who used to make similar comments to what you have made. My wife challenged them to sign up to substitute...after 3 days they had enough. Strangely they also stopped bitching about teachers.
Most school districts are begging for teachers and larger districts like JCPS will have 100+ open positions go unfilled.
This doesn't create competition and make public schools better. Taking away funding from the schools, and giving tax credits (reducing state revenue) to allow people to send kids to a private school is ridiculous. Like other things in life, people have choices. Want a nicer car, then you need to personally pay for it. Want a nicer home, pay for it. If you think your kids can get a better education at a private school, then pay for it. The burden shouldn't be on other taxpayers for that.
We need to strengthen the public school system, not make it harder for teachers. Less funding (and it is much less, adjusted for inflation), less money for books, technology, supplies, etc makes it very difficult. Of course public schools will have more problems, and that will certainly be more true in urban areas.
We need to strengthen the public school system, not make it harder for teachers. Less funding (and it is much less, adjusted for inflation), less money for books, technology, supplies, etc makes it very difficult. Of course public schools will have more problems, and that will certainly be more true in urban areas.
If you are not willing to admit that teachers are injecting their liberal politics (Climate Change, Racial/White Privilege, Anti-Christian-Pro All Others, Gay Agenda, Revisionist History like Columbus was evil, etc.) into the classroom more than say 25 years ago, then you are blind or you are just a leftist that likes the indoctrination.
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Could have fooled me. They are in their cars to go home before the students are on the buses. I don't buy into the whole "we're trying ti make children better!". No Karen, you're trying to get summers off..
Get out of your state more. I've had problems with my teachers since the 6th grade trying to push agendas. We've had to go to administration about highschool teachers who tried to push leftist ideals when that wasn't what the class was designed for. My 300 series religion elective "Reformation and Counter-Reformation", taught in what many would say is a "conservative" college, had a daily "Did you see what our dumb President Bush did today?" bit.
If Kentucky, a red state, is what you describe as "neutral".. what do you think the education is like in New York? I'll tell you, it's horrific.
Do you read the news? Do you SEE what colleges have done against Conservative speakers? Or how about a minority group, speaking for the majority, to get Chick-Fil-A removed from campus this week? It's delicious chicken sandwiches!
Your comments demonstrate your ignorance of the problems.
"get the public system to up its game"? What do you suggest? What funding is going to be provided? What parental involvement will you dictate? What resources available to "successful" schools can you put in place?
It's amazing that public school systems in affluent neighborhoods/districts don't have any problems. My daughter who lives in Nashville took a $6000 pay cut to go from a public school in Nashville to a public school in Brentwood. She teaches kindergarten. In her Nashville school she had 31 kids (the state mandated max classroom size for K is 23) because they couldn't find another teacher to take an open position. She had 3 kids who could count to 10 on the first day of class...a similar number that knew their ABCs. She had 2 special needs kids who had no business being in the classroom but again, because they were unable to hire additional staff (money was there to hire, nobody to take the job) she had to deal with them without the help of any aides. When it was time for parent/teacher conferences she had 6 parents show up. Her entire classroom qualified for free lunch...
So she takes a pay cut and goes to a classroom of 20, has a full time teachers aide, EVERY child started the school year already knowing their ABCs and being able to count past 10. Every child had a parent or 2 attend parent/teacher conferences... While the two schools are only about 8 miles apart, they are in reality...worlds apart.
********.
Might I add...when do you think they grade papers, talk to parents, etc? I can tell you that both my mother and wife when our kids were young often left school as soon as they were free to go because someone needed to be home when the kids got home...only to go home and put in another 2+ hours of grading papers, calling parents and preparing for the next day's lesson.
You wouldn't last 2 days as a teacher. Guaranteed.
The way to make public schools would be to send disruptive kids to specially equipped private schools. As a parent I'd be all for this, as public schools if for no other reason than pay, are able to attract superior teachers.
Never mistake KEA's objectives as being in the best interests of children. They, like any other union-type organization, are interested solely in what benefits their paying members.
Do you think that the fact that climate change is an accepted scientific fact might have something to do with a science class covering that subject?
The rest of your rant is ignorance.
Darn, I generally hate to agree with Fuzz, but in this case, he speaks the truth.
If you’ve paid the required quarters into social security, why should you not be eligible to receive the benefit you’ve paid? More and more second career teachers are in the classroom. They don’t work enough years to receive their full teacher pension, yet their teacher pension reduces their social security they paid in their first career, as well as reduces any spousal benefit they may have from social security. How is that fair?
I have to respectfully disagree with this. It is different than any other union in that the 'product' of the profession is actual human beings. KEA supports teachers and tries to make public school teaching in Kentucky a marketable profession to new teachers by ensuring that benefits and conditions are at a point that would be attractive. If you attract good teachers, then good teaching (should) occur, and that helps kids. Some of the things KEA whines about is silly, but to say that they don't have kids' interest at heart is not true.