The latest on UK football from Rivals.com
- Thread starter wildcatman26
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JR I listened to this interview and heard you say that Mark Stoops success could most likely follow the success of the 2014 recruiting class. I also remember that class as being a blockbuster class by UK standards so I went back and looked at it. I was a little bit surprised by what I found.
8 of the 28 recruits (Flannigan, Stamps, Tubman, Hendrix, Krok, Snodgrass, CJ Johnson, and Ricardson) have already used all their eligibility or left and the 9th Kobie Walker has career jeopardizing injury issues I believe. In that group are 2 four star recruits (Johnson and Richardson) while another 4 were high three star recruits. Did you take those losses into account when you place that much importance on them?
I'm not disagreeing with your assessment I'm just wondering if you took that list of players that has already come and gone into account when making your assessment of their value long term.
8 of the 28 recruits (Flannigan, Stamps, Tubman, Hendrix, Krok, Snodgrass, CJ Johnson, and Ricardson) have already used all their eligibility or left and the 9th Kobie Walker has career jeopardizing injury issues I believe. In that group are 2 four star recruits (Johnson and Richardson) while another 4 were high three star recruits. Did you take those losses into account when you place that much importance on them?
I'm not disagreeing with your assessment I'm just wondering if you took that list of players that has already come and gone into account when making your assessment of their value long term.
You still got close to 20 guys in that class who can make some noise. And some highly regarded guys like Boom, Barker, Baker, Bone, Elam, West, Randolph, Edwards, who can take this team to another level if they can reach their potential. That class had a lot of playmakers on it, I mean Stamps was one of our worst ranked recruits and he turned out to be pretty good. Elam was one of our lower ranked guys too and he will be starting this year. Be interesting to see how many of the 2014 guys end up on the 2 deep.
I don't think Kobie Walker's injury is career ending btw but i could be wrong on that.
I don't think Kobie Walker's injury is career ending btw but i could be wrong on that.
I haven't looked up Elams rankings or anything as it relates to stars, but was he not on the Army All American squads and pursued by Bama etc?
Elam was a 5.6 on rivals. He was a 5 star on 247 and high 4 star on ESPN and scout. Rivals did not particularly like Elam.
Walker was ready after week 4 injury wise. Walkers issue is he bacame academically ineligible once he was ready to play. All accounts are he straightened things out.
FWIW, the well respected Freddie Maggard has also opined that the 2014 class will be instrumental to CMS's success at UK. Very seldom do recruiting classes stick together for 4 years. As CatDaddy points out there are still 20 of 28 on the roster. That is pretty good retention. The 25/85 scholarship rules implicitly account for an average of 8 losses per class over a 5 year period.
Peace
Peace
It just like I have always said, out of each class you sign if you get more than half making a contribution you are lucky. Even following poor recruiting years by Joker you named off quite a few guys who won't because of various reasons, injury, transfers or just plain misses, every coaching staff misses on guys, ususally multiple coaching staffs because more than one is after him. Of course on signing day we see all of them as future All SEC or AA.
Rivals assessment of Elam has proven to be the most accurate to date.
8 Levibooty, Today at 9:53 AM
A DL prospect ranked a 5.6 or higher that actually played before Stoops era was a rarity, although we haven't had any 265# walkons starting at DT in SEC games since 2010. Since instate star Peters signed in 06 we have had TWO DL commits rated higher than a FIVE POINT FIVE that played, both JC transfers in Brooks 09 class.
Elam has two more years to live up to his considerable hype-----and potential.
8 Levibooty, Today at 9:53 AM
A DL prospect ranked a 5.6 or higher that actually played before Stoops era was a rarity, although we haven't had any 265# walkons starting at DT in SEC games since 2010. Since instate star Peters signed in 06 we have had TWO DL commits rated higher than a FIVE POINT FIVE that played, both JC transfers in Brooks 09 class.
Elam has two more years to live up to his considerable hype-----and potential.
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The 2014 class has played a ton of snaps in 2 years and is on par to account for over 1/3 of our starters the next 2 years.
Offense: Barker, Baker, Garret Johnson, Boom,have been starters for while and likely to be starting the last 2-3 years on offense. The OL has been largely a bust in 2014 class...but the WR/QB and RB have been really good so far.
Defense: Edwards, West, Elam, Ware are poised to start for the next 2-3 years. Stamps and CJ Johnson were starters all last year and did their sole purpose as 2 year JUCOs. The unit that maybe was a bit of bust were the LBers have never really materialized and appear are buried by newer guys going forward.
1. To me, Juice and Boom are already SEC impact production at their respective positions looking towards the last 2 years. They look just like guys on top of tier SEC teams which is a big lift over the Matt Roark's/Raymond Sanders types they replaced when they got here.
2. Elam, IMO, was very solid the last half of year in taking over for Lewis. There we no teams that hammered us on the ground in between the tackles when he was in there. In the next 2 years, I can see Elam morphing into the run killer along with Love up the gut and putting our guys on the edge in place to excel as teams will attack them. Hatcher/Ware/Bonner/Kenegra/Laster, etc.. should shine more due to Elam holding the inside up. I see a pretty big drop off when he's gone as we've mainly whiffed on big DL kids the last 2 years.
3. QB is biggest impact on UK. We'll see what Drew can do his last 3 years. If he's beaten out of Stephen Johnson, his impact at UK will be sparse barring Stephen getting injured. But if he wins the job, with the skill guys around him and more OL talent here the next fews years...he can really have a chance to show his talent and take UK to the next level.
Offense: Barker, Baker, Garret Johnson, Boom,have been starters for while and likely to be starting the last 2-3 years on offense. The OL has been largely a bust in 2014 class...but the WR/QB and RB have been really good so far.
Defense: Edwards, West, Elam, Ware are poised to start for the next 2-3 years. Stamps and CJ Johnson were starters all last year and did their sole purpose as 2 year JUCOs. The unit that maybe was a bit of bust were the LBers have never really materialized and appear are buried by newer guys going forward.
1. To me, Juice and Boom are already SEC impact production at their respective positions looking towards the last 2 years. They look just like guys on top of tier SEC teams which is a big lift over the Matt Roark's/Raymond Sanders types they replaced when they got here.
2. Elam, IMO, was very solid the last half of year in taking over for Lewis. There we no teams that hammered us on the ground in between the tackles when he was in there. In the next 2 years, I can see Elam morphing into the run killer along with Love up the gut and putting our guys on the edge in place to excel as teams will attack them. Hatcher/Ware/Bonner/Kenegra/Laster, etc.. should shine more due to Elam holding the inside up. I see a pretty big drop off when he's gone as we've mainly whiffed on big DL kids the last 2 years.
3. QB is biggest impact on UK. We'll see what Drew can do his last 3 years. If he's beaten out of Stephen Johnson, his impact at UK will be sparse barring Stephen getting injured. But if he wins the job, with the skill guys around him and more OL talent here the next fews years...he can really have a chance to show his talent and take UK to the next level.
Three of those eight were JCs that used up all their eligibility at UK.
Not only did attrition kill some of Joker's classes, in most cases we lost the higher ranked commits and the two stars played more than they did. In 2010 for instance Joker actually had a decent class on paper, because at the last minute he added three 5.7s (rare for UK then) AND a four star, Priester, Patterson, Gainer, and Smith did basically nothing at UK. We also lost three stars Delic, Gibbs, Henderson, Laughlin (thought he was going to be a 332# beast, no fat on him), McAdoo, and McDuffen. We were left with ONE 5.7, Sanders, that contributed and seven two stars (eight if you count Ratliff, who lost his offer when Joker noticed he was two inches shorter and 30# lighter than his recruiter advertised. Also only having seven was a GREAT improvement over his seniors class from 07, that had NINETEEN two stars) that turned out to be among our bigger contributors, Eatmon, Huguenin, Mansour, T Robinson, R Shields, M Bailey, and Simmons.
In fact UK has had a few star DL besides the few mentioned above, but none were 5.6s or above, V Jenkins was a 5.0, Jarmon and Pryor were 5.2s, B Kelly (committed as a DE) a 5.3, and Lumpkin a 5.4.
So a 5.6 for a DL at UK is pretty high on the totem pole.
Brooks followed up the good 06 DL class (Peters, Micah who committed as a DE, and 5.7 Paris that was injured) with DL commits in 07 that were rated a 5.0, two 5.3s, and a 5.5 in Glenn, that I don't remember, and in 08 ONE DL, another 5.3.
Since Stoops (and Marrow) has taken over a 5.6 commit is a ho hum recruit to many of our fans.
So a 5.6 for a DL at UK is pretty high on the totem pole.
Brooks followed up the good 06 DL class (Peters, Micah who committed as a DE, and 5.7 Paris that was injured) with DL commits in 07 that were rated a 5.0, two 5.3s, and a 5.5 in Glenn, that I don't remember, and in 08 ONE DL, another 5.3.
Since Stoops (and Marrow) has taken over a 5.6 commit is a ho hum recruit to many of our fans.
I don't disagree with this but I'm wanting Kentucky to exceed the normal performance throughout it's history and and construct a roster of highly regarded talent comparable to powerful SEC teams. That's my point, we are doing that very thing in almost every position other than DL. We are left wanting overachievers in that regard.
Jauk, thanks for this information. It really hits you when you see those names -- names that might (or might not) have gotten you excited in the past and realize that 1) they never did pan out / make it on the field or 2) they panned out just like the recruiting services expected them to, which in the case of the DL names (and stars) listed, was fairly average, at best. My best hope is that we continue to incrementally improve our DL recruiting for a another year or so and then hit it big with a big-time recruit that draws the attention of other big time recruits. Crawling before walking (with knees a little bloody, at this point.
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Late to this one but you're right Grump. I actually did a breakdown of this on the boards a couple years ago and in response to the probation excuse for a lack of players. It hurts sure but the reality is you only get about 14 to15 in each class that end up contributing as you say. And of that only a hand full are serious contributors and the rest here and there or fill in players. The key to getting better is getting a better crop of athlete in your top 14 or 15 in each class.